I might be playing this at the Jupiter invitational.
I played it at the last Jupiter event and narrowly missed top8.
I have been tinkering with the idea of nev disk. Has anyone tested with it?
I mean, I will still lose to painter grind, that just happens. But, I feel like disk gives a succinct simple answer to progen and other random. It's perfect. It hits everything but jace.
I am super stoked to play jace, force, clique and visions in my deck. They served me well at the GP, and I was rewarded with a PT invite. So i think I will continue to play them. Especially now that I have foils of all of the above (force excluded obv).
Spell pierce says U: counter anything in MUC. Clearly has some use resolving important spells like forcing through a hymn, show and tell, or a knight of the reliquary. But more importantly allows for merfolk and pro-bant to really punish MUC. It significantly impacts those matchups and gives your non-storm combos terrific tools.
I just don't feel that MUC has the tools to win 7-8 round tournaments.
So, I am somewhat curious how to change the spell composition to lessen the impact of spell pierce. Possibly front load low cc spells or use more creatures to evade spell pierce. For instance, I play 14 3 cc and higher spells (non-dudes). However, I often need to resolve 1-3 of them to win a given game. I cannot simply win by countering some ☺☺☺☺ and playing a single v clique. It takes a "bomb" too. (shackles, cryptic, fact, jace)
SB:
4 leyline of sanctity (for discard, combo, and burn)
2 b2b For lands and control decks
3 BEB (for goblins)
2 ratchet bomb (for merfolk)
2 pithing needle/spellpierce (cause random is random)
2 control magic
I play 4/1 split on keg/ratchet bomb because affinity is more popular than enchantress and i do not fear counterbalance.
The concept of a finisher has no place in legacy. Play only relevant cards.
Its a fun deck, but really can struggle with spell pierce. Daze, force, lackey, okay sure. These cards can be frustrating. But spell pierce is the bane of this deck and why I no longer play it in competitive events.
How do you beat double spell pierce + goyf?
@ dlite. other bad cards to consider:
guile (i won power with him in my deck :-P)
blue titan
wurmcoil engine
razorman masticore
tarmogoyf
clique.
factory
painter grind
I suppose offering advice where none was asked can be arrogant, but I think you are unreasonable in your distaste for regular traders.
Generally speaking, if I sit down to trade with someone I just ask them what they are looking for. For instance, the only cards I am actively looking for are Imperial recruiters- Plug plug. If I have, it I look for something to trade for of theirs. Getting what you want for something you don't want is a service. I personally find it very valuable to be able to sell/trade to other dealer and Mr Suitcase types.
Also, I would like to note that profit is not unethical. Your comments tend to center around the idea that backpack dealers are unethical because they consistently make a profit off of trading.
That is not an ethical claim. There is no harm being done there. Taking advantage of someone in a position of weakness- IE ripping little kids, that is unethical. But, trading cards for value is not in itself wrong at all.
I picked up an Alpha Mox Jet in trade recently. (Hi, Curtis)
I am having trouble finding appropriate pricing resources. It has some damage, most notably water damage to the back and cornerwear. But, it is flat and playable.
I will put up scans or cell phone pics when I get the chance.
Its condition is distinctly POOR or HP.
For reference:
MOTL 520ish
Starcity 550ish
ABU 600ish
When trading for cards that I do not need- I try for 25% profit.
When trading for cards I need, I shoot for even or up to 25% in their favor.
If someone needs something badly, I usually try to find a way to make it happen.
If someone is just trying to value out my binder and make a profit, I usually stop giving them prices all together and ask them to make the first offer.
If someone is my close friend, I always try to take a loss/ make an even trade and if a card jumps in price immediately after trading, I will split the increase with them.
If someone is a jerk, I push the 25% margin out to 100% margin.
Edit:
I would be one of the people you would see as a store wanna-be. I have more singles in my binder than most local stores have in stock. I keep a dollar box with me. If someone needs something I will take it out of my deck for them. I can understand your frustration/ feel taken advantage of when trading with a someone with much more resources than yourself.
A couple things to remember:
-Use your phone to check prices or get a few solid offers and come back.
-If someone is pushing you to trade now or never and you are uncomfortable take a pass.
-Some people do make their living trading cards. Unemployment has hurt a lot of people. Some people have turned to trading cards to make rent.
-Ask if they give back to the community in anyway. For instance, I subsidize weekly tournaments with free food and sometimes an 30-40 free packs. I run $8 drafts with full prizes (4-3-2-2). This is fueled by trading profits and tournament successes.
-If they are paying cash and buying cards that they don't need for decks, why would you complain about them giving you normal buy prices? Profit is not evil. You are upset because you were not able to realize the full value yourself. If that card never sells and just sits in his binder he payed you for nothing at all.
Here is my current legacy doran list:
We play it on modo due to the pricing. It was under $50 to build. Its quite good. I like it. Pro tech includes hide and seek in the sideboard. Doran is legit, ever seen a goblin player get flustered when their piledriver doesn't even trade with a 3/3?
Its super budget.
On the subject of bounce:
I really like submerge, echoing truth, seal of removal, and repeal for different reasons.
Repeal: XU non-land, cantrip
Against merfolk, goblins, TES, random non-black bad aggro, and zoo (on the play) repeal can reset their vial for cheap. Its remand for 1cc permanents and it can do terrible things to chrome moxen with infernal tutor on the stack. Or top with doomsday on the stack. What is lacks in versatility it makes up with being a cantrip. In an undeveloped meta, I might play this.
Submerge free, critter to top of library
Against new horizons, vengevival, zoo, probant, bantsur, goblins, big zoo, G/x random. This card is free, which is spectacular against zoo. MUC can lose to turn 1 steppe lynx. This really helps that problem. It goes to top of library, which allows you to ruin the tempo of a turn 1 hierarch or throw a knight into the library in response to his ability. I personally SB 3 of these due to the prevalence of burnsligh in the last 2-3 rds of tournaments.
Seal of removal U: target critter to hand.
This card is here for its ability to handle steppe lynx, iona, emrakul, and other cheaty into play critters. It was very useful about 5 months ago. If you live in a netdeck based area. This may still be relevant for you.
Echoing truth: 1U non-land (and all same named)
Good for: vengevival, dredge, tes, belcher,
Vengevival is not very good if you take away its explosiveness. by bouncing all of their vengevines or survival you do just that. Dredge, tes, and belcher make tokens. Echoing truth is busted versus tokens.
Thats about it.
My only current non-innovation is the MD 3x grave hate. take that new horizons, landstill, dredge, and vengevival.
B2B is only relevent in 3 matchups:
new horizons, 42 lands, and landstill.
All of these decks get crushed without b2b. Why then do you play it.
Do not meander aimlessly speculating on what a competitive meta looks like, look it up.
A rough estimation of *my local* current meta: (tiers measuring popularity not power level)
Tier 2:
MUC
Belcher
Stacks
Enchantress
Landstill
42 lands
New horizons (recently downgraded with the exodus to vengevival)
Eva Green
Team America
Total decks: 17
Total decks that lose to B2B: 3
Decks that ignore/will gain advantage from you playing B2B:
Zoo, Merfolk, Goblins, Dredge, TES, Belcher, The Gate
This is not '99, zoo can kill turn 3. When you are busy turning off 2ish dual lands they are busy killing you.
Also, MUC is not strictly inferior to UW landstill/control variants. MUC smashes control mirrors, plays faster, and is much easier for new players to play. Its a linear control deck. A new player cannot possibly play a top/brainstorm/fetch control deck efficiently. Its hard to identify the right line of play and do the associated maths starting from turn 1, which is what is needed without raw card advantage to just power through.
I am not sure I would go so far as to say it should count towards continuing education. But, TOing involves a very marketable set of skills between managing people, organizing events, and balancing budgets.
The MSIM program is interested in the competitive magic players. The ability to compete at a high level, travel often, think strategically, network, and put in long days of mentally tasking activities are all very valuable in competitive business environments.
(purposely left out jace here due to availability, but it takes advantage of fact or fiction very well)
classical
20 island
3 factory
4 vision
4 spell snare
3 relic of progen
4 counterspell
4 ratchet bomb
4 clique
4 shackles
3 jaces
3 cryptic command
4 force of will
Anyway, I thought I would share my updated lists. The high number of relic of progenitus is due to the high number of vengevival, new horizons, dredge, and 42 lands decks in my area. AKA- anywhere with a competitive scene. Having a couple of dead cards versus merfolk, goblins, and zoo is not a big deal cause I can instead bring in more focused hate such as BEB and seasinger/lawan/firespout/etc. Its okay to have a poor game 1 against a known quantity as long as you have a positive overall match win due to a better boarding plan.
I Don’t Play Magic Anymore: A report from a Tournament Organizer at RIT
Hello all, This is a report about not playing magic. A TO is a Tournament Organizer. We put together the space, prizes, and promotion that lead to successful and fun events for everyone. As James put it best: Running tournaments is the first step towards quitting magic. I am fairly new to being a TO, as I started a little over six months ago. I have been a long time magic player and an avid legacy player. I passed my judge test just a week before this tournament and the prizes came out of my own collection.
This is a tournament report from the TO of a medium sized event held at RIT with approximately 55 people. You can find the original posting here:http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?18351-North-American-Legacy-Championship-Qualifier-RIT-2-Moxes-2-Moats-Guaranteed and here: http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=259674 Thanks to everyone to came out to the tournament I ran at RIT on the 11th. I hope it was great fun for all involved. Hopefully we can run similar or larger tournaments in the future. Thanks especially to Eli from Jupiter Games, who sweetened the “Double Mox, Double Moat” with championship points for his excellent tournament series. Ryan, also of Jupiter Games stepped away from his dealer booth to help judge the tournament and make sure things ran smoothly. Your help was much appreciated.
The tournament on the 11th was my first midsize tournament as a TO. As such, there were a few hiccups in the event that were entirely preventable and my fault. I got into running tournaments because I was on the receiving end of a significant theft. Last December, I had the guts of pro-bant: duals, fetchs, forces, goyfs, etc stolen out of my deck box while at a local $5 tournament. It’s not an uncommon tale, but along with a few others we have created a safer place to play. We almost run weekly Legacy tournaments with guaranteed dual lands to first place. I also had 6 security cameras set up throughout the room at the tournament on the 11th. I am glad we did not need to use them.
Preparatory work: First: Finding players, making sure they know about your tournaments. I knew I was also limited to Rochester as my venue city. Rochester is not as centrally located for the East Coast as Syracuse or Bighampton. The sometimes attendees from NYC, Boston, Baltimore, Albany, etc are unlikely to be able to attend. No matter how much I promote, it’s unlikely that it will be worth the drive for these players. So, the target for this event is almost entirely upstate New York with a possible showing from PA, Ontario, and Ohio. We did in fact have a crew come down from Ontario. I saw forum posts from Cleveland players, but I am not sure I saw them in attendance. Correct me if I am wrong.
Second: A time and place. I found a venue- I have a relationship with RIT already. They provided a beautiful space for us and in fact even donated additional prize support to help boost visibility in target audiences (Magic Players are smarter people on average).
I selected the 11th, as there appeared to be no other major tourneys on the same day. Unfortunately, I was quite wrong as there were two other medium sized legacy tournaments this day and Waterbury, one of the largest vintage tournaments every year. Additionally to a GP in the US, attracting all the level 2s and pros in the area and a bachelor party in Syracuse. For the other mid-sized tourneys its hard to say who announced first or even if we should avoid having events on the same day.
PLUG: The MS in Innovation Management program at RIT is a tough program that puts a high value on strategic thinking, hence their support for Magic tournaments. The stats are silly high on the program with an average 6-Figure starting salary, required comparable test scores to Harvard, and scholarship money available. Scholarships for business/engineering graduate programs are nearly unheard of now-a-days.
Third: I started promoting. I used ad words and posted a semi-regular stream of bumps into appropriate forums. But, the entirety of internet posting is not going to compare to real buzz. So, I talked to people; a lot. I went to every major tournament for two months before mine and was sure to plug it in nearly every conversation I had. I am sure my friend’s (if I still have any :-P) were perturbed a little by my steering every trade conversation and every match I played against an opponent towards telling them about the upcoming RIT Event. I think there is probably a better way to promote. I picked Double Mox, Double Moat as the prizes, and I think it was catchy enough. Though, everyone took the buy-backs. So I kept the cards themselves. Thoughts on this matter would be appreciated greatly.
Site preparation: I knew the space fairly well already, so I came in the night before and set up the tables. I numbered them out for 120 players (just in case). This turned out to be unnecessary, so during round 1 we spaced out the numbering more, so that the players would have more room. I did not hear any specific complaints or thanks about this happening before or after- so I assume this was fine.
I utilized four projectors for pairings, standing, and round timer with a printer as backup. The projectors worked beautifully and did away with the clogging at pairings often seen at large events. I think this extreme level of visibility really smoothed things along and took the guessing game out of finding your seating. I will continue to use it in the future. For anyone interested, it was the same software used by Legion Events.
I was doubly-sure to check out local food options. We were directly adjacent to a cafeteria with an ATM and a food court. It was my impression that this made food highly accessible. Again I did not hear complaints or sighs of satisfaction, so I am unsure of the exact opinions of players.
Day Of: I showed up early, made sure everything got set up properly and started taking sign-ups. Thanks again to those local players that brought coffee, helped do some last minute tuning and arranging of table numbers.
Round 1: We got started on time. As a player I find it unmistakably rude for a TO to start late. I have been at events where the TO is not even on site til half-way through sign-ups and then the tournament runs slowly all day. Unless there are extenuating circumstances, certain, even marginal levels of professionalism can take 2-3 hours off of mid-size events.
The mispairing explained. Technically, it was not a mispairing per se. I entered the wrong information into the tournament projection software so it listed the wrong pairings. I did not actually re-pair every one; rather I just corrected my input mistake. This hiccup cost us about 7-10 minutes. It was my worst mistake of the day and one I will not repeat. Thanks for being patient with me on this one.
Round 2: Things went smoothly. People seem to be having fun. I answered some judge calls. They were nothing hard too hard. The most interesting was resolving a stack for a match in which there were a total of 13 effects currently waiting to resolve. We had a lunch break after round 2. Perhaps this added complacency lead to my mistake in round 3.
Round 3: An embarrassing but harmless mistake. I mistyped the number of rounds when beginning the tournament. For the life of me I could not remember where to change the number of rounds in the software. After 5-10 minutes of toying and a much needed assist, we got that fixed and on to round 4.
That’s two 10 minute delays in a tournament. As a player I might have been slightly annoyed. Nobody has expressed undue unhappiness about it to me, though.
Round 4-6 These rounds went smoothly, and quickly. We ended round 6 at 5:25. 6 Rounds + 30 minute lunch break in 6 and-a-half hours. Not too shabby considering with a mid-size tournament someone goes to time every round. I think the projectors helped immensely with this. Also, there was a very high level of play considering the size of the event with 5k winners and many competitive legacy regulars in attendance.
Running the top8: The top8 was smooth as butter. I gave 5 minutes to discuss a split and 75 minute rounds (we had a building time limit- or I would have gone with an un-timed top8). They self-paired before I even got the pairings up and the spectators were fine. There were no disruptions other than a well-deserved fit of laughter from a ridiculous EDH game.
I have been at tournaments when the store is trying to finish up and hurry out the top8, even resorting to throwing everyone that is not playing out of the store. From the perspective of having been that player stuck hanging around outside a store waiting to give your friend a ride home- that’s totally ridiculous. A TO should be able to accurately gauge how much time a tournament will take if the top8 plays out and account for it.
With that I gave out prizes, which were promptly sold back! It seems people prefer cash to Moxes and Moats. In future events, I will take this into consideration.
Also, if you received 13th-16th place prizes- thank the MSIM program, they paid for your prizes.
Future events: On December 3rd, RIT is hosting Rudicon, a yearly gaming and anime convention. The upstate convention scene has been dwindling some over the past few years and I think we can spice this one up a little with, at minimum, a Double 1k. $1,000 in prizes Saturday and Sunday. Saturday: Standard Sunday: Legacy. Much of this is still TBD
Ultimately, at a Convention we will need to provide as much value as possible to vendors and as much enjoyment as possible for attendees. If anyone has experience or advice, I want to read it. I suppose that also means I am about to get trolled.
Props: Chris who brought coffee Aaron and Jon who directed about 15 lost cars Josh, who taped down numbers while still drunk from the night before Ryan (who was also staffing a booth for Jupiter Games) for fielding judge calls and generally providing a helping hand. Chuck for proctoring my judge test Andrew for fixing the projectors Spencer for bringing 6 cases of arnold palmer James R for getting a late night 4 pack draft going The Innovation Center and MSIM programs for supporting competitive Magic. Everyone who turned out to help make the event such a success.
I played it at the last Jupiter event and narrowly missed top8.
I have been tinkering with the idea of nev disk. Has anyone tested with it?
I mean, I will still lose to painter grind, that just happens. But, I feel like disk gives a succinct simple answer to progen and other random. It's perfect. It hits everything but jace.
I am super stoked to play jace, force, clique and visions in my deck. They served me well at the GP, and I was rewarded with a PT invite. So i think I will continue to play them. Especially now that I have foils of all of the above (force excluded obv).
I just don't feel that MUC has the tools to win 7-8 round tournaments.
So, I am somewhat curious how to change the spell composition to lessen the impact of spell pierce. Possibly front load low cc spells or use more creatures to evade spell pierce. For instance, I play 14 3 cc and higher spells (non-dudes). However, I often need to resolve 1-3 of them to win a given game. I cannot simply win by countering some ☺☺☺☺ and playing a single v clique. It takes a "bomb" too. (shackles, cryptic, fact, jace)
4 vision
4 spell snare
4 keg
1 ratchet bomb
4 counterspell
4 clique
4 shackles
4jace
3 cryptic
2 fof
4 force
20 island
3 factory
SB:
4 leyline of sanctity (for discard, combo, and burn)
2 b2b For lands and control decks
3 BEB (for goblins)
2 ratchet bomb (for merfolk)
2 pithing needle/spellpierce (cause random is random)
2 control magic
I play 4/1 split on keg/ratchet bomb because affinity is more popular than enchantress and i do not fear counterbalance.
The concept of a finisher has no place in legacy. Play only relevant cards.
Its a fun deck, but really can struggle with spell pierce. Daze, force, lackey, okay sure. These cards can be frustrating. But spell pierce is the bane of this deck and why I no longer play it in competitive events.
How do you beat double spell pierce + goyf?
@ dlite. other bad cards to consider:
guile (i won power with him in my deck :-P)
blue titan
wurmcoil engine
razorman masticore
tarmogoyf
clique.
factory
painter grind
Generally speaking, if I sit down to trade with someone I just ask them what they are looking for. For instance, the only cards I am actively looking for are Imperial recruiters- Plug plug. If I have, it I look for something to trade for of theirs. Getting what you want for something you don't want is a service. I personally find it very valuable to be able to sell/trade to other dealer and Mr Suitcase types.
Also, I would like to note that profit is not unethical. Your comments tend to center around the idea that backpack dealers are unethical because they consistently make a profit off of trading.
That is not an ethical claim. There is no harm being done there. Taking advantage of someone in a position of weakness- IE ripping little kids, that is unethical. But, trading cards for value is not in itself wrong at all.
I am having trouble finding appropriate pricing resources. It has some damage, most notably water damage to the back and cornerwear. But, it is flat and playable.
I will put up scans or cell phone pics when I get the chance.
Its condition is distinctly POOR or HP.
For reference:
MOTL 520ish
Starcity 550ish
ABU 600ish
I am checking a few other places as well.
Thanks
When trading for cards I need, I shoot for even or up to 25% in their favor.
If someone needs something badly, I usually try to find a way to make it happen.
If someone is just trying to value out my binder and make a profit, I usually stop giving them prices all together and ask them to make the first offer.
If someone is my close friend, I always try to take a loss/ make an even trade and if a card jumps in price immediately after trading, I will split the increase with them.
If someone is a jerk, I push the 25% margin out to 100% margin.
Edit:
I would be one of the people you would see as a store wanna-be. I have more singles in my binder than most local stores have in stock. I keep a dollar box with me. If someone needs something I will take it out of my deck for them. I can understand your frustration/ feel taken advantage of when trading with a someone with much more resources than yourself.
A couple things to remember:
-Use your phone to check prices or get a few solid offers and come back.
-If someone is pushing you to trade now or never and you are uncomfortable take a pass.
-Some people do make their living trading cards. Unemployment has hurt a lot of people. Some people have turned to trading cards to make rent.
-Ask if they give back to the community in anyway. For instance, I subsidize weekly tournaments with free food and sometimes an 30-40 free packs. I run $8 drafts with full prizes (4-3-2-2). This is fueled by trading profits and tournament successes.
-If they are paying cash and buying cards that they don't need for decks, why would you complain about them giving you normal buy prices? Profit is not evil. You are upset because you were not able to realize the full value yourself. If that card never sells and just sits in his binder he payed you for nothing at all.
We play it on modo due to the pricing. It was under $50 to build. Its quite good. I like it. Pro tech includes hide and seek in the sideboard. Doran is legit, ever seen a goblin player get flustered when their piledriver doesn't even trade with a 3/3?
Its super budget.
2 bayou
1 savannah
1 GW rav dual
1 scrubland
1 GB rav dual
4 GB fetch
3 GW fetch
2 WG fetch
1 plains
1 forest
1 swamp
1 bojuko bog
1 murmoring bosk
4 birds of paradise
1 elves of deep shadow
4 bob
2 jotun grunt
2 qasali pridemage
4 knight of the reliquary
3 doran
2 stone forge mystic
3 thougthseize
4 path to exile
4 hymn to tourach
2 gerrard's verdict
2 jitte
1 sword of fire ice
2 sensei's divining top
I really like submerge, echoing truth, seal of removal, and repeal for different reasons.
Repeal: XU non-land, cantrip
Against merfolk, goblins, TES, random non-black bad aggro, and zoo (on the play) repeal can reset their vial for cheap. Its remand for 1cc permanents and it can do terrible things to chrome moxen with infernal tutor on the stack. Or top with doomsday on the stack. What is lacks in versatility it makes up with being a cantrip. In an undeveloped meta, I might play this.
Submerge free, critter to top of library
Against new horizons, vengevival, zoo, probant, bantsur, goblins, big zoo, G/x random. This card is free, which is spectacular against zoo. MUC can lose to turn 1 steppe lynx. This really helps that problem. It goes to top of library, which allows you to ruin the tempo of a turn 1 hierarch or throw a knight into the library in response to his ability. I personally SB 3 of these due to the prevalence of burnsligh in the last 2-3 rds of tournaments.
Seal of removal U: target critter to hand.
This card is here for its ability to handle steppe lynx, iona, emrakul, and other cheaty into play critters. It was very useful about 5 months ago. If you live in a netdeck based area. This may still be relevant for you.
Echoing truth: 1U non-land (and all same named)
Good for: vengevival, dredge, tes, belcher,
Vengevival is not very good if you take away its explosiveness. by bouncing all of their vengevines or survival you do just that. Dredge, tes, and belcher make tokens. Echoing truth is busted versus tokens.
Thats about it.
My only current non-innovation is the MD 3x grave hate. take that new horizons, landstill, dredge, and vengevival.
new horizons, 42 lands, and landstill.
All of these decks get crushed without b2b. Why then do you play it.
Do not meander aimlessly speculating on what a competitive meta looks like, look it up.
A rough estimation of *my local* current meta: (tiers measuring popularity not power level)
Tier 1:
Vengevival
Dredge
Merfolk
Goblins
Zoo
TES
Rochester Thresh
The Gate
Tier 2:
MUC
Belcher
Stacks
Enchantress
Landstill
42 lands
New horizons (recently downgraded with the exodus to vengevival)
Eva Green
Team America
Total decks: 17
Total decks that lose to B2B: 3
Decks that ignore/will gain advantage from you playing B2B:
Zoo, Merfolk, Goblins, Dredge, TES, Belcher, The Gate
This is not '99, zoo can kill turn 3. When you are busy turning off 2ish dual lands they are busy killing you.
Also, MUC is not strictly inferior to UW landstill/control variants. MUC smashes control mirrors, plays faster, and is much easier for new players to play. Its a linear control deck. A new player cannot possibly play a top/brainstorm/fetch control deck efficiently. Its hard to identify the right line of play and do the associated maths starting from turn 1, which is what is needed without raw card advantage to just power through.
The MSIM program is interested in the competitive magic players. The ability to compete at a high level, travel often, think strategically, network, and put in long days of mentally tasking activities are all very valuable in competitive business environments.
10 islands
7 fetches
2 academy ruins
3 ancient tomb
4 brainstorm
1 relic of progen
1 tormod's crypt
3 spell pierce
3 grindstone
2 top
4 painter
3 muddle the mixture
3 ratchet bomb
3 counterspell
3 trinket mage
2 shackles
4 fact or fiction
4 force of will
(purposely left out jace here due to availability, but it takes advantage of fact or fiction very well)
classical
20 island
3 factory
4 vision
4 spell snare
3 relic of progen
4 counterspell
4 ratchet bomb
4 clique
4 shackles
3 jaces
3 cryptic command
4 force of will
Anyway, I thought I would share my updated lists. The high number of relic of progenitus is due to the high number of vengevival, new horizons, dredge, and 42 lands decks in my area. AKA- anywhere with a competitive scene. Having a couple of dead cards versus merfolk, goblins, and zoo is not a big deal cause I can instead bring in more focused hate such as BEB and seasinger/lawan/firespout/etc. Its okay to have a poor game 1 against a known quantity as long as you have a positive overall match win due to a better boarding plan.
Would a 5k be big enough?
For smaller even- under 16 the HJ/TO may often play. But, events of that small size are not significantly common.
So if you are running tournaments regularly, it means that it is unlikely you are also competing in them regularly.
I Don’t Play Magic Anymore: A report from a Tournament Organizer at RIT
Hello all,
This is a report about not playing magic. A TO is a Tournament Organizer. We put together the space, prizes, and promotion that lead to successful and fun events for everyone. As James put it best: Running tournaments is the first step towards quitting magic. I am fairly new to being a TO, as I started a little over six months ago. I have been a long time magic player and an avid legacy player. I passed my judge test just a week before this tournament and the prizes came out of my own collection.
This is a tournament report from the TO of a medium sized event held at RIT with approximately 55 people. You can find the original posting here:http://www.mtgthesource.com/forums/showthread.php?18351-North-American-Legacy-Championship-Qualifier-RIT-2-Moxes-2-Moats-Guaranteed
and here:
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=259674
Thanks to everyone to came out to the tournament I ran at RIT on the 11th. I hope it was great fun for all involved. Hopefully we can run similar or larger tournaments in the future. Thanks especially to Eli from Jupiter Games, who sweetened the “Double Mox, Double Moat” with championship points for his excellent tournament series. Ryan, also of Jupiter Games stepped away from his dealer booth to help judge the tournament and make sure things ran smoothly. Your help was much appreciated.
The tournament on the 11th was my first midsize tournament as a TO. As such, there were a few hiccups in the event that were entirely preventable and my fault. I got into running tournaments because I was on the receiving end of a significant theft. Last December, I had the guts of pro-bant: duals, fetchs, forces, goyfs, etc stolen out of my deck box while at a local $5 tournament. It’s not an uncommon tale, but along with a few others we have created a safer place to play. We almost run weekly Legacy tournaments with guaranteed dual lands to first place. I also had 6 security cameras set up throughout the room at the tournament on the 11th. I am glad we did not need to use them.
Preparatory work:
First: Finding players, making sure they know about your tournaments. I knew I was also limited to Rochester as my venue city. Rochester is not as centrally located for the East Coast as Syracuse or Bighampton. The sometimes attendees from NYC, Boston, Baltimore, Albany, etc are unlikely to be able to attend. No matter how much I promote, it’s unlikely that it will be worth the drive for these players.
So, the target for this event is almost entirely upstate New York with a possible showing from PA, Ontario, and Ohio. We did in fact have a crew come down from Ontario. I saw forum posts from Cleveland players, but I am not sure I saw them in attendance. Correct me if I am wrong.
Second: A time and place. I found a venue- I have a relationship with RIT already. They provided a beautiful space for us and in fact even donated additional prize support to help boost visibility in target audiences (Magic Players are smarter people on average).
I selected the 11th, as there appeared to be no other major tourneys on the same day. Unfortunately, I was quite wrong as there were two other medium sized legacy tournaments this day and Waterbury, one of the largest vintage tournaments every year. Additionally to a GP in the US, attracting all the level 2s and pros in the area and a bachelor party in Syracuse. For the other mid-sized tourneys its hard to say who announced first or even if we should avoid having events on the same day.
PLUG: The MS in Innovation Management program at RIT is a tough program that puts a high value on strategic thinking, hence their support for Magic tournaments. The stats are silly high on the program with an average 6-Figure starting salary, required comparable test scores to Harvard, and scholarship money available. Scholarships for business/engineering graduate programs are nearly unheard of now-a-days.
Third: I started promoting. I used ad words and posted a semi-regular stream of bumps into appropriate forums. But, the entirety of internet posting is not going to compare to real buzz. So, I talked to people; a lot. I went to every major tournament for two months before mine and was sure to plug it in nearly every conversation I had. I am sure my friend’s (if I still have any :-P) were perturbed a little by my steering every trade conversation and every match I played against an opponent towards telling them about the upcoming RIT Event. I think there is probably a better way to promote. I picked Double Mox, Double Moat as the prizes, and I think it was catchy enough. Though, everyone took the buy-backs. So I kept the cards themselves. Thoughts on this matter would be appreciated greatly.
Site preparation:
I knew the space fairly well already, so I came in the night before and set up the tables. I numbered them out for 120 players (just in case). This turned out to be unnecessary, so during round 1 we spaced out the numbering more, so that the players would have more room. I did not hear any specific complaints or thanks about this happening before or after- so I assume this was fine.
I utilized four projectors for pairings, standing, and round timer with a printer as backup. The projectors worked beautifully and did away with the clogging at pairings often seen at large events. I think this extreme level of visibility really smoothed things along and took the guessing game out of finding your seating. I will continue to use it in the future. For anyone interested, it was the same software used by Legion Events.
I was doubly-sure to check out local food options. We were directly adjacent to a cafeteria with an ATM and a food court. It was my impression that this made food highly accessible. Again I did not hear complaints or sighs of satisfaction, so I am unsure of the exact opinions of players.
Day Of:
I showed up early, made sure everything got set up properly and started taking sign-ups. Thanks again to those local players that brought coffee, helped do some last minute tuning and arranging of table numbers.
Round 1: We got started on time. As a player I find it unmistakably rude for a TO to start late. I have been at events where the TO is not even on site til half-way through sign-ups and then the tournament runs slowly all day. Unless there are extenuating circumstances, certain, even marginal levels of professionalism can take 2-3 hours off of mid-size events.
The mispairing explained. Technically, it was not a mispairing per se. I entered the wrong information into the tournament projection software so it listed the wrong pairings. I did not actually re-pair every one; rather I just corrected my input mistake. This hiccup cost us about 7-10 minutes. It was my worst mistake of the day and one I will not repeat. Thanks for being patient with me on this one.
Round 2: Things went smoothly. People seem to be having fun. I answered some judge calls. They were nothing hard too hard. The most interesting was resolving a stack for a match in which there were a total of 13 effects currently waiting to resolve. We had a lunch break after round 2. Perhaps this added complacency lead to my mistake in round 3.
Round 3: An embarrassing but harmless mistake. I mistyped the number of rounds when beginning the tournament. For the life of me I could not remember where to change the number of rounds in the software. After 5-10 minutes of toying and a much needed assist, we got that fixed and on to round 4.
That’s two 10 minute delays in a tournament. As a player I might have been slightly annoyed. Nobody has expressed undue unhappiness about it to me, though.
Round 4-6 These rounds went smoothly, and quickly. We ended round 6 at 5:25. 6 Rounds + 30 minute lunch break in 6 and-a-half hours. Not too shabby considering with a mid-size tournament someone goes to time every round. I think the projectors helped immensely with this. Also, there was a very high level of play considering the size of the event with 5k winners and many competitive legacy regulars in attendance.
Running the top8:
The top8 was smooth as butter. I gave 5 minutes to discuss a split and 75 minute rounds (we had a building time limit- or I would have gone with an un-timed top8). They self-paired before I even got the pairings up and the spectators were fine. There were no disruptions other than a well-deserved fit of laughter from a ridiculous EDH game.
I have been at tournaments when the store is trying to finish up and hurry out the top8, even resorting to throwing everyone that is not playing out of the store. From the perspective of having been that player stuck hanging around outside a store waiting to give your friend a ride home- that’s totally ridiculous. A TO should be able to accurately gauge how much time a tournament will take if the top8 plays out and account for it.
With that I gave out prizes, which were promptly sold back! It seems people prefer cash to Moxes and Moats. In future events, I will take this into consideration.
Also, if you received 13th-16th place prizes- thank the MSIM program, they paid for your prizes.
Future events:
On December 3rd, RIT is hosting Rudicon, a yearly gaming and anime convention. The upstate convention scene has been dwindling some over the past few years and I think we can spice this one up a little with, at minimum, a Double 1k. $1,000 in prizes Saturday and Sunday. Saturday: Standard Sunday: Legacy. Much of this is still TBD
Ultimately, at a Convention we will need to provide as much value as possible to vendors and as much enjoyment as possible for attendees. If anyone has experience or advice, I want to read it. I suppose that also means I am about to get trolled.
Props:
Chris who brought coffee
Aaron and Jon who directed about 15 lost cars
Josh, who taped down numbers while still drunk from the night before
Ryan (who was also staffing a booth for Jupiter Games) for fielding judge calls and generally providing a helping hand.
Chuck for proctoring my judge test
Andrew for fixing the projectors
Spencer for bringing 6 cases of arnold palmer
James R for getting a late night 4 pack draft going
The Innovation Center and MSIM programs for supporting competitive Magic.
Everyone who turned out to help make the event such a success.
Slops:
RIT’s maze of roads delaying a few cars