I do not think that I will have time to fully reread and digest the influx of recent posts coming in before the deadline. This work project is killing me, but I think I will be able to post in a week.
As it is, I feel like it comes down to a few simple dichotomies.
Incognito
I am confirmed town.
MTG~DDS
Interactions with Annorax have him as very townie. If you're scum, good game, and I will forever be paranoid of you.
Cantripmancer
Cantripmancer's posts have been fairly townie for me from what I can recall. I haven't seen any blaring scumtells coming from him, and I don't see how Magenta is scum. If you're scum, then you've played a fine game.
That leaves us with four options: Wheat, Nyxu, Taredas, and swishh.
Wheat_Grinder
Ugh, Wheat. Wheat is the person I want to think as town, but every time I reread him he comes up red every time. You said that you would hammer yourself, which is a townie mindset for me, but Voxxicus did that in FHF and he spewed wine all over the table. I can't shake the distancing from Annorax at the beginning of Day 2. Also, if I suspected you, I think you would have killed me long ago, which makes my being alive here a bit more telling.
I am fine with a Wheat_Grinder lynch.
Nyxu
I'm not sure if I had more stranger reads on you. When Day 3 started, I thought for sure you were scum. You reeked scum for your vote on Annorax, and my pbpa of you left me wanting you as a lynch. And neutral hunting in a basic as well?
However, I have reflected on my stance of you, and here's the thing I have been hiding from you: While my brain says that you are scum, my gut says that you are town. I don't see much maliciousness coming out from your posts, and your "pulling threads" on swishh seems to have blossomed into a full out scumhunt. So, for now, I am willing to accept Nyxu as being town.
swishh
Oh, how have the mighty have fallen. You were a strong town read for most of the game, but lately I've been getting increasingly paranoid of you, and Nyxu sniping at you + your lurking earlier in the Day have made me come around. I do think you are scum, and your vote on Annorax was an attempt to "jump the gun" and have people dismiss you as town. You did come around on that read, and you did bring Annorax to L-1. I was blinded by the fact that you voted Annorax Day 1, but it's not as big as I thought it would be.
I am fine with a swishh lynch.
And now, for our most enigmatic figure:
Taredas
I will need to read more of your posts to get a clearer read on you, but the point of Annorax not mentioning MRH at all has me a bit suspicious. I have been getting a townie feel from the posts I have seen you make. Obviously, you're probably the hardest player to read currently, but my gut read on MRH + your good replace in posts make you pending, but leaning town. The pinkys_brain kill has me a bit nervous, but I'm willing to chalk it up to a "pinkys_brain was probably the most experienced player in the game" kill.
tl;dr: I think that swishh and Wheat_Grinder, and I am perfectly fine on voting whoever MTG~DDS votes.
I will be checking this thread probably.. once a day? To try to read some stuff and hammer.
If anyone has any problems with my logic, then feel free to call me out on it. But at this point, I am willing to throw out logic completely and focus on my gut, so I will most likely not have good answers/handwave your rebuttal.
Explain why what you've identified in Swishh's post is an "obvious problem" and your "aha!" isn't rife with WIFOM.
Uh, I already explained the obvious problem: Swishh is trying to avoid responsibility for the lynch, and that's not something town should be thinking about. And I fail to see how WIFOM has anything to do with it. (Unless you're talking about your ignoring aforementioned big problem with swishh's post - yes, that *could* come from town, but I think it's more likely that it comes from a scumbuddy.)
If anyone is wondering why I'm voting Taredas: Were I to vote Wheat, he would pretty much be the decided lynch today. This way, we get to see how Nyxu uses his vote to decide the lynch.
I'm still certain our two scum are in Nyxu/Wheat/Taredas.
*perks up from reread*
Hey wait a minute.
Take a look at the underlined section.. Swishh doesn't just refuse to take responsibility for the lynch - he's specifically pushing it off on Nyxu. I see absolutely NO motivation for doing that as town. I mean, town should WANT to take responsibility for their role on a lynch wagon - even if they are wrong, they are HONESTLY wrong.
The bolded is what I saw as you promoting WIFOM. You're saying that Swishh isn't taking responsibility, which makes him scum; I saw it as something town could do: Swishh seeing three suspects (Nyxu/Wheat/Taredas) and seeing an opportunity to test one of those three. I think he's right: Had he voted Wheat, Wheat would have been at L-1 and likely would have been lynched. But he's not sure which one he finds more scummy, so by putting two of his suspects at L-2, he has an opportunity to get a reaction out of his third suspect.
That said...I see your point. My initial reaction was a gut response of "good idea, but why would you ruin it by spelling it out for Nyxu"? Looking back at it, though, the act of explaining does feel a little self-conscious.
This is unreal. I've stated multiple times I am fine with any of you, Wheat, or Nyxu being lynched today while we still have a mislynch.
Wait, is it just me, or is this a slip?
Swishh is fine with lynching Wheat, Nyxu, or myself today... "while we still have a mislynch"? Maybe I'm just reading too much, but that looks to me like swishh knows that all three of the players he just listed are town.
There have been several discussions toDay about how if toDay's lynch is a mislynch, we'll likely be at lylo. Have you not gotten to any of them in your read?
Of COURSE we are in LyLo if we don't hit scum today. That's not even in question - I'm new *here*, but I've playing on 'Scum on and off since '07.
But that's not the point. The point is that I think swishh *knows* that the three players he listed are all mislynches.
I still think this is a reach. I could see that being a slip, but I don't see how it's more likely a slip.
Also, let's point out the obvious here. When I attack Wheat, he explains the error in my logic - he's either town or scum doing a good job of faking a town defense (I'd guess the former, but I've been fooled enough times by scum doing a good job of faking that I'm not sure). When I attack swishh, he explodes and stoops to discrediting his attacker.
This is the kind of reversal that makes me leery. You seemed to have come to the conclusion that Wheat was scum, to the point of PBPA-ing and voting him. But one vote from Swishh and your perspective changes 100% (well...70%-ish?, given that you weren't sure the first time and you're disavowing any surety now). How can you be so sure that Swishh is scum (and therefore, Wheat town)?
Why swishh? Because he made it extremely obvious he's not town - switches over to me as soon as it looks like he might get the mislynch, specifically tries to avoid being assigned responsibility for the lynch. The latter in particular is not town behavior.
If you really believe the bolded, then you believe that Wheat is likely scum, correct?
Quote from Taredas »
But, of course, what *actually* happened is that I attacked Wheat, reconsidered based on defense, and then you dropped a post that almost certainly comes from scum so I reprioritized.
Wait...didn't you say that the element that pushed you to reassess Wheat as town was Swishh's avoiding-responsibility post?
Case on Swishh: I need to look back at these recent interactions. Some of it looks heavily reactionary. Some does, at best, look like poor wording (on both sides of the case). @Cantrip and WG: what are your thoughts on this case, and Swishh's counter case?
A lot of Taredas's accusations feel like they could be misinterpretations of Swishh's posts. I don't know if Taredas is purposefully misinterpreting Swishh, but his points aren't strong enough to sway me from Wheat.
As far as a Wheat lynch goes, I'm a little disconcerted because there does seem to be a general consensus that Wheat and I are a dichotomy, so if he flips town, I'm going to be under a lot of scrutiny. But no matter how many times I look at it, it feels to me that Wheat was pushing a case on MRH based on bad data. So I say we lynch Wheat. If he comes up scum, MRH/Taredas is pretty close to confirmed town. If Wheat comes up town...well, I guess I'll have my work cut out for me, won't I?
Don't have time for a detailed post, but I will say this: If you're going to lynch me based on the actions of my predecessor, just go ahead and do it. Now.
I don't know what my predecessor was thinking, so I can't explain his? actions - and it's a hell of a lot better if you lynch me today rather than tomorrow.
Now, if you think that I'm scum based on my own play, then tell me why and I'll address it (no Wheat, I haven't forgotten about your response to my case). But if nothing I say can sway you because of what my predecessor did, then just get it over with before it costs us the game.
Ugh. I've explained so many times why I was unable to post at the beginning of the day. I didn't think I would need to claim V/LA since I could always make short posts from my phone and keep an eye on posts, but I've delivered on any content I said I would. I feel like I've sort of been on tilt with this whole Nyxu thing and not playing my best. I'm still sure he's scum, and I think Taredas is his partner. The coordinated attack on Wheat by MRH and Annorax is too strong of evidence to dismiss, further helping Wheat's town case.
@Incognito: Really the night kills each night were fairly obvious. When would you have been better a NK? What I'm saying is that it seems like you're just going on gut regarding Wheat and not looking at the real evidence today: Taredas's vote on Wheat and the immediate change to me for one post I made. Nyxu has almost completely ignored every player but me and Taredas today, and I've laid out what I think is a fairly explanatory theory for the scums' actions today. Is there any part of it you disagree with?
Before I made this post it wasn't making sense to me why Nyxu would attack me and Wheat would defend me while they attack each other. But I think I know what's going on: After realizing a Cantrip lynch wasn't possible, they resorted to bussing each other but disagreed about whether it was possible to get me lynched. This explains their surprising number of posts about why I'm town/maybe not town.
I think because you and Nyxu are scum, you've seen that Nyxu has been hounding me all day, didn't want to be too obvious by replacing in and immediately jumping on me, so you waited until I posted something you felt like you could use to justify an immediate 180 in whom you wanted to lynch. It's an entirely scum-motivated vote.
And one final thing. I know this is sort of WIFOM + circular reasoning, but assuming Wheat is town, wouldn't it make the most sense from a scum standpoint for me to vote him while he already had 2 votes on him, especially since there was interest among the unvoting players to lynch him? On top of that, if we were both scum, wouldn't a bus have made the most sense at that point? I honestly think Wheat is town.
I feel like I've sort of been on tilt with this whole Nyxu thing and not playing my best. I'm still sure he's scum, and I think Taredas is his partner. The coordinated attack on Wheat by MRH and Annorax is too strong of evidence to dismiss, further helping Wheat's town case.
By "coordinated attack", are you talking about MRH putting his vote on Wheat when Annorax did? Because that's a pretty weak "coordinated attack".
As for Wheat, his condemnation of MRH was pretty total, and I feel like I've shown that Wheat's reasoning was faulty. His ongoing persistence in saying there was a "pattern" to MRH's votes continues to confound me, as does his "no bussing" theory (of course, he's since dropped that since he wasn't getting anywhere with it, since it limited his mislynch targets). Do you feel like it's more likely that an experienced player like Wheat would glance at a votecount tally and identify a player as "definitely scum" on that basis, or that, in a basic, he could see potential in pushing a mislynch on bad data, believing that he could talk his way out of it if confronted by it?
Quote from swishh »
Taredas's vote on Wheat and the immediate change to me for one post I made.
How is it more likely that this is scum-motivated rather than town-motivated?
I think there's a difference between playing scummy and playing sloppy, and it's important to distinguish. By "coordinated attack" I meant the way both Annorax and MRH went into day 2 with their eyes on Wheat. I've already pointed out how they were both the only ones to vote him, at least early in the day.
Taredas's change in vote made very little sense at the time. He still thought both Wheat and I were scum, yet he felt compelled to switch from one to other. He justified this by changing his opinion of Wheat's defense: suddenly he thought it was legitimate when he said it was null earlier. It's possible Wheat is scum too and Taredas just decided the bus wasn't worth it if a mislynch was possible, but what's more likely is that Taredas and Nyxu are converging on a single target. Note that Nyxu didn't vote me until Taredas did even though he's been calling me scum all day.
I think there's a difference between playing scummy and playing sloppy, and it's important to distinguish. By "coordinated attack" I meant the way both Annorax and MRH went into day 2 with their eyes on Wheat. I've already pointed out how they were both the only ones to vote him, at least early in the day.
I guess I should reread; I don't remember MRH pushing Wheat very hard.
Quote from swishh »
Taredas's change in vote made very little sense at the time. He still thought both Wheat and I were scum, yet he felt compelled to switch from one to other. He justified this by changing his opinion of Wheat's defense: suddenly he thought it was legitimate when he said it was null earlier. It's possible Wheat is scum too and Taredas just decided the bus wasn't worth it if a mislynch was possible, but what's more likely is that Taredas and Nyxu are converging on a single target. Note that Nyxu didn't vote me until Taredas did even though he's been calling me scum all day.
I can see most of where you're coming from, but do you believe that Wheat and Taredas can be scumbuddies after the way Wheat went after MRH with the votecount "analysis"?
Will you also respond to my other question, please?
As for Wheat, his condemnation of MRH was pretty total, and I feel like I've shown that Wheat's reasoning was faulty. His ongoing persistence in saying there was a "pattern" to MRH's votes continues to confound me, as does his "no bussing" theory (of course, he's since dropped that since he wasn't getting anywhere with it, since it limited his mislynch targets). Do you feel like it's more likely that an experienced player like Wheat would glance at a votecount tally and identify a player as "definitely scum" on that basis, or that, in a basic, he could see potential in pushing a mislynch on bad data, believing that he could talk his way out of it if confronted by it?
So hey, if I'm lynched, remember that Cantripmancer and I ARE NOT A DICHOTOMY, yeah?
Think about it closely, he initiated the argument with me, and stayed with it for a long time. He was taking a big risk on thinking I was scum, and he wouldn't take that risk as scum because he'd KNOW I'd flip town.
You don't need to take my word for it now, but if I'm the lynch, somebody please come back to this post and DON'T LYNCH CANTRIPMANCER.
So hey, if I'm lynched, remember that Cantripmancer and I ARE NOT A DICHOTOMY, yeah?
Think about it closely, he initiated the argument with me, and stayed with it for a long time. He was taking a big risk on thinking I was scum, and he wouldn't take that risk as scum because he'd KNOW I'd flip town.
You don't need to take my word for it now, but if I'm the lynch, somebody please come back to this post and DON'T LYNCH CANTRIPMANCER.
Lynch Taredas and Nyxu instead.
One of the reasons that this post and its sibling where your stance is reversed ping my scumdar is because they sound so certain. The previous one was "Remember the pattern! When I flip town, lynch Cantrip!!!" And there was fearmongering, and there was smearing. This one is "When I flip town, don't lynch Cantrip!" And there's still fearmongering, and there's buddying.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I couldn't understand your extremist position before, and now you've presented an extremist position in the exact opposite direction, and you argued both vehemently...it just doesn't feel like it could come from town.
But, of course, what *actually* happened is that I attacked Wheat, reconsidered based on defense, and then you dropped a post that almost certainly comes from scum so I reprioritized.
Wheat's defense to my initial case could easily come from town. Yours not so much. (So yes, I need to recalibrate, especially given that the biggest point in Cantrip's favor was that I thought Wheat was more likely to be scum than him.)
(emphasis added)
I don't believe you actually think that for a second, considering you yourself called his defense null.
What part of "null" don't you understand? It means I could see Wheat's defense come from either aligment (i.e, null tell).
I'm willing to consolidate onto Nyxu if I have to, but I'd much rather lynch Taredas.
Make your decision.
In fact. All of you, make your decisions. This endless back and forth is tiring. Swishh has made it clear he is willing to change up who he votes for. Wheat makes his duplicity apparent.
Vote for a lynch and be done with it.
The only change I'm willing to make is you vs. Taredas. Sounds like you're getting anxious while there are no votes on you for us to decide a lynch. I'm not willing to let you off the hook that easily or lynch someone else just out of convenience.
Vote: Nyxu
Wait. Why are you saying that you'd rather lynch me IN THE SAME POST THAT YOU VOTE NYXU?
That makes no sense. I could see it if there was a delay between the first post and the second, but this is the same post! I could see it if we were a couple of days away from deadline and Nyxu had more votes, but last I checked Nyxu wasn't being voted at all!
I think there's a difference between playing scummy and playing sloppy, and it's important to distinguish. By "coordinated attack" I meant the way both Annorax and MRH went into day 2 with their eyes on Wheat. I've already pointed out how they were both the only ones to vote him, at least early in the day.
Taredas's change in vote made very little sense at the time. He still thought both Wheat and I were scum, yet he felt compelled to switch from one to other. He justified this by changing his opinion of Wheat's defense: suddenly he thought it was legitimate when he said it was null earlier. It's possible Wheat is scum too and Taredas just decided the bus wasn't worth it if a mislynch was possible, but what's more likely is that Taredas and Nyxu are converging on a single target. Note that Nyxu didn't vote me until Taredas did even though he's been calling me scum all day.
Again, what part of "null = could come from town or scum" do you not understand? Unlike your defense, which almost certainly comes from scum.
Also, I just told you that if you are going to hang me based on the actions of my predecessor you should do it TODAY... and you keep pushing a "Annorax and MRH pushed for a Wheat lynch D2" theory... but you hop onto Nyxu? Bull. You're scum trying to avoid a confrontation.
So hey, if I'm lynched, remember that Cantripmancer and I ARE NOT A DICHOTOMY, yeah?
Think about it closely, he initiated the argument with me, and stayed with it for a long time. He was taking a big risk on thinking I was scum, and he wouldn't take that risk as scum because he'd KNOW I'd flip town.
You don't need to take my word for it now, but if I'm the lynch, somebody please come back to this post and DON'T LYNCH CANTRIPMANCER.
Lynch Taredas and Nyxu instead.
Whether WG is town or scum, I actually agree with the logic here. Not sure if it is a buddying attempt or true sentiment, but the logic is sound. I also do not see this as distancing, bussing, or anything other interaction between scum team. As originally outlined, I do not see the possibility that WG and Cantrip are scum together. Cantrip has been very strong town since he has entered. When he first presented the case on WG, there was no heat on WG...at all. Scum can bus, but if they were teammates, there was no need to at that time. Cantrip wasn't under suspicion, other than predecessor being lurky. WG wasn't under fire either. Cantrip bussing WG doesn't seem logical at all the way the game was headed. WG flipping scum still seems to clear Cantrip for reasons outlined. Case against WG still looks solid.
3 quick points for WG lynch:
1: Faulty logic proved on MRH pattern. Not a complete deal breaker, but this was presented as a main focus for WG's case on MRH...and proven wrong.
2: Huge turnaround on stance on Cantrip (Absolutely lynch to definitely don't). This change in opinion or tunnel vision can happen from either town or scum, but if he had been lynched before the turnaround...his finger would be pointing at Cantrip. Was the original accusation at Cantrip OMGUS, or what?
3: If town, seems like when Cantrip, MRH, DDS, Incognito, and even WG (anyone else?) were expressing interest in his lynch, why would scum have not joined in to make it happen? The lack of interest or action following a very solid presentation by Cantrip, comes across as psuedo-confirmation. At the peak of the WG hunt, it would not have been as suspicious if scum had joined in. There was a good case to hide behind. It would not have been hard to throw blame back on Cantrip at that point.
Not ready to vote yet, still need to look more into the other cases.
Swishh: Post 705 Seems very odd. Following context of the quote wall, I have to agree with Nyxu most of the quotes being contextually innaccurate or at least a stretch. Weird way to present a case on someone. His followup to Nyxu was much better though.
Swishh's Vote is logically sound from a town perspective. At least if consideration of the explanation is taken at face value. However, I have to agree with Cantrip about his immediate justification and explanation. The justification for it, although also logical, does seem defensive before the fact. Even as a townie, for the plan to actually work correctly, you can't set a trap and warn the prey. Knowing what is being watched, it is not as hard to construct a desired outcome. Taredas' response drives home why the immediate justification was bad. If town setting a trap, there would not be instant guilt and necessity of justification. If correct, Taredas shows good reasoning why post 725 came so quick. Nyxu/Taredas attacking Swishh does make me a touch uneasy about calling Swishh scum. It seems a bit coordinated, and to top that Taredas jumped off the WG wagon to join in. This is one of the sections I need to dive into a bit more before any decisions on my part are made.
- I don't think Nyxu and swishh are scum together - Nyxu's attack doesn't look like distancing to me. Again, town vs. town is possible but I think there's probably one scum in {Nyxu/swishh}.
- I think Wheat is the play today - the most likely scumteams are Wheat/swishh and Wheat/Nyxu, and Wheat is scum in either of those scenarios.
My immediate thought is /barn this. Interestingly enough, Taredas no longer seems to /barn the last statement though...These two statements are a good summation of my current feelings on gamestate. Between WG strongly defending Swishh, actively wanting Taredas lynch, and calling Nyxu town, there are some strong interactions with WG alignment being revealed. Other strong interactions have also come out into the open as well.
tl;dr: I think that swishh and Wheat_Grinder, and I am perfectly fine on voting whoever MTG~DDS votes.
Helluva lot of responsibility thrown on me here. Please make a choice for yourself and don't blindly follow me. If you disagree with my lynch choice, say so.
I guess a T/S list would be appropriate at this point. Town
DDS -
Incognito -
Cantrip -
Taredas -
Nyxu -
Swishh -
WG - Scum
WG Town flip: Taredas/Nyxu look bad, Cantrip not as bad due to reasoning previously outlined here and by WG himself. WG's heavy suspects Taredas and Nyxu...mainly Taredas. WG defends Swishh multiple times, he looks better.
As mentioned previously, I want to follow the Nyxu/Taredas vs Swishh development a little closer before voting. I still feel WG is the best vote today though. Best chance of catching scum IMHO, however, his alignment revealed will shed some major light on this game either way. If that opinion changes, I'll drop some logic on why.
Going to finish following the Nyxu/Taredas/Swishh Saga tomorrow.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Thanks to Ace of Spades for the Sig and avatar!! My Decks
Legacy BSpanish InquisitionB UWU/W StoneBladeWU WUGBant NOGUW BWDeadguy AleWB Modern WDeath and TaxesW EDH BBBalthor ReanimatorBB GBWThe Rock / TenebWBG BBMaralen ANT EDHBB UUHeidar, Winter Is ComingUU
If the AC repair dude doesn't show up bright and early tomorrow, I'm gonna borrow some of DDS' dental tools to carve out his eye sockets like jack o lanterns.
WG Town flip: Taredas/Nyxu look bad, Cantrip not as bad due to reasoning previously outlined here and by WG himself. WG's heavy suspects Taredas and Nyxu...mainly Taredas. WG defends Swishh multiple times, he looks better.
I agree with pretty much everything you've said in this post. One minor area of disagreement is the bolded. Taredas and Nyxu may look bad for their actions regarding Wheat, but they don't look worse because town!Wheat suspected them, nor does Swishh look better because town!Wheat defended him. If Wheat's town, we can't look at Wheat's actions to drive conclusions, because Wheat doesn't know who's town and who's scum.
Like I said, minor.
Quote from MTG~DDS »
As mentioned previously, I want to follow the Nyxu/Taredas vs Swishh development a little closer before voting. I still feel WG is the best vote today though. Best chance of catching scum IMHO, however, his alignment revealed will shed some major light on this game either way. If that opinion changes, I'll drop some logic on why.
Going to finish following the Nyxu/Taredas/Swishh Saga tomorrow.
As someone who doesn't have the time to do this right now, I'm perfectly fine with waiting a bit longer if you still want to scumhunt.
There seems to be a bandwagon going on. Interesting!
Not sure if serious-wagon or RVS-wagon
We have some pro scumhunters here for sure.
(Note: Grimnar = Polski, Lord McDonald = Pinky. Both have flipped town.)
Don't like this post at all. That "interesting" on Grimnar looks like a mudsling rather than genuine suspicion - note that swishh doesn't explain why it's interesting, just that he doesn't think there's a bandwagon. He also doesn't comment on the wagon itself.
More importantly, look at the second part. This is in the early part of the game, but swishh calls Grimnar and Lord McDonald "pro scumhunters". Why is this important? Because he's calling Grimnar and Lord McDonald scumhunters. I.e, they're scumhunting. I.e, they're town.
How does he know this in RVS? (Because they weren't listed as his buddies in his role PM?) And why does swishh then jump on Lord McDonalds later?
Thanks for confirmation, we'll lynch you on day three for the win
Hang on. How do you know there are 3 scum?
Unless I am mistaken (and I usually am), if there are 12 people, it would make sense to assume 3 scum (all two of the games I have participated in on this site, excluding this one have been 12 people with 3 scum)
True story...or covering for a buddy?
Possibly both
but just like the amount of licks it takes to get to the center of a tootsie roll
the world may never know.
You're awfully quick to be making posts that I don't like at all. Unvote
Vote: Lord_McDonalds
What exactly are you playing at with the insinuation that you may be a buddy?
This
Look at swishh's vote on Lord McDonald. His reasoning consists of a /barn and an "I don't like your posts" with no explanation of why. That's as close to a naked wagon hop as it gets.
There's one way I could see this coming from town, but given the way swishh does this and the way he defends it later I doubt it applies.
More importantly, look at swishh's response to trabant = iRebel (regarding an earlier comment to Sixed = Nyxu, which I could see coming from either alignment on its own). He doesn't explain his reasoning, just brushes off trabant (note the dismissive rhetoric - "going to assume", "merely guessing" - and also the deflection towards Lord McDonalds). That's not town defense. That's a guilty conscience.
Thanks for confirmation, we'll lynch you on day three for the win
Hang on. How do you know there are 3 scum?
Unless I am mistaken (and I usually am), if there are 12 people, it would make sense to assume 3 scum (all two of the games I have participated in on this site, excluding this one have been 12 people with 3 scum)
True story...or covering for a buddy?
Possibly both
but just like the amount of licks it takes to get to the center of a tootsie roll
the world may never know.
It's not so much that he was confident in a 3-man scum squad but his response seemed odd.
The day is too early for anyone to be claiming, or really for any votes to be of significant merit.
Couple this explanation with the original /barn on TK, and swishh's vote on Lord McD's early is fishy as hell. No request for explanation... and yet the core of his reasoning was that "LMcD's response seemed odd"? Just odd? No explanation for *why* it's odd?
See, that would make sense considering swishh's "pro scumhunters" comment earlier and the general scum tendency (at least on 'Scum) not to attack their targets as strongly as townies do (okay, WIFOM, but still).
Also note that swishh's desire to not be held responsible for his votes/the results of his votes started very early in the game ("any votes to be of significant merit" = "don't look at my vote on LMcD, move along, move along").
The day is too early for anyone to be claiming, or really for any votes to be of significant merit.
When do votes gain significant merit?
I'm not going to humor this question with an exact answer, but certainly we would need more than 10 posts to deem someone worthy of a lynch, don't you think?
To take it a step further, a lot of your posts aren't lining up.
I don't think its worse than Lord McD trying so hard to joke about bring scum.
Why not?
I believe is was when I posted that, but it may have ended in the responses since my post.
I did not ask if, I asked why. Please answer again.
Unvote, Vote Lord McD
Why?
You may not be defending LMcD yet, but you're questioning MRH's reasoning for voting him. Why exactly do you want to hear from at least 3 of the people voting? Most, if not all, of us had linked to a post or explained our vote when we did so.
I want to hear that from at least 3 of you before he claims.
Yet again you question the votes on LMcD. And why on earth would you suggest that his claiming is imminent?
My thoughts on the above: if LMcD is scum, then it wouldn't shock me if Wheat_Grinder is as well. This defending by proxy is strange. I don't see how this is town behavior.
This post is important.
First, after Wheat calls out swishh on his "too early for votes of significant merit comment", swishh... dismisses the question ("not going to humor this question with an answer". That's twice this game, and this is the early game. That's not town defense.
Second, that attack on Wheat is very bad. He's attacking Wheat... for asking for explanations of votes on a bandwagon (i.e, existing explanations are insufficient). That's behavior that comes from town or from scum trying to fake town motivation - and swishh doesn't give any indication that he thinks it's the latter.
Uncertain about one point. Swishh - why didn't you consider the possibility that Wheat was scum defending town for towncred?
Note to self: Post 82 has a town/scum list. Might be useful later.
Post 86... is not adding up right now. I need some sleep, will finish tomorrow.
As for Wheat, his condemnation of MRH was pretty total, and I feel like I've shown that Wheat's reasoning was faulty. His ongoing persistence in saying there was a "pattern" to MRH's votes continues to confound me, as does his "no bussing" theory (of course, he's since dropped that since he wasn't getting anywhere with it, since it limited his mislynch targets). Do you feel like it's more likely that an experienced player like Wheat would glance at a votecount tally and identify a player as "definitely scum" on that basis, or that, in a basic, he could see potential in pushing a mislynch on bad data, believing that he could talk his way out of it if confronted by it?
I've seen experienced players get cocky and make bad plays. It's not enough to convince me Wheat is a good lynch today. There was a lot of interaction with Nyxu earlier about my alignment, but I don't think they would be so open about their discussion if they were both scum. And yeah, he also made an odd flip on his Cantrip read, but again I think if he were scum he would be playing better.
Wait. Why are you saying that you'd rather lynch me IN THE SAME POST THAT YOU VOTE NYXU?
No. You're just intentionally misinterpreting my posts at this point. I'm equally fine with lynching you or Nyxu today because I think both of you are scum. There is no preference.
Also, I just told you that if you are going to hang me based on the actions of my predecessor you should do it TODAY... and you keep pushing a "Annorax and MRH pushed for a Wheat lynch D2" theory... but you hop onto Nyxu? Bull. You're scum trying to avoid a confrontation.
Why "TODAY?" Why would it matter to you at all? Obvious provocation. How much more confrontational can I be than both of you are scum.
Don't like this post at all. That "interesting" on Grimnar looks like a mudsling rather than genuine suspicion - note that swishh doesn't explain why it's interesting, just that he doesn't think there's a bandwagon. He also doesn't comment on the wagon itself.
More importantly, look at the second part. This is in the early part of the game, but swishh calls Grimnar and Lord McDonald "pro scumhunters". Why is this important? Because he's calling Grimnar and Lord McDonald scumhunters. I.e, they're scumhunting. I.e, they're town.
How does he know this in RVS? (Because they weren't listed as his buddies in his role PM?) And why does swishh then jump on Lord McDonalds later?
It was RVS. It was a sarcastic comment. You're really digging deep for some ammunition. You are scum.
Look at swishh's vote on Lord McDonald. His reasoning consists of a /barn and an "I don't like your posts" with no explanation of why. That's as close to a naked wagon hop as it gets.
There's one way I could see this coming from town, but given the way swishh does this and the way he defends it later I doubt it applies.
More importantly, look at swishh's response to trabant = iRebel (regarding an earlier comment to Sixed = Nyxu, which I could see coming from either alignment on its own). He doesn't explain his reasoning, just brushes off trabant (note the dismissive rhetoric - "going to assume", "merely guessing" - and also the deflection towards Lord McDonalds). That's not town defense. That's a guilty conscience.
Wasn't this like the very beginning of day 1? Does anyone ever have decent reads then? You vote people to get reactions, see how others respond.
Couple this explanation with the original /barn on TK, and swishh's vote on Lord McD's early is fishy as hell. No request for explanation... and yet the core of his reasoning was that "LMcD's response seemed odd"? Just odd? No explanation for *why* it's odd?
See, that would make sense considering swishh's "pro scumhunters" comment earlier and the general scum tendency (at least on 'Scum) not to attack their targets as strongly as townies do (okay, WIFOM, but still).
Also note that swishh's desire to not be held responsible for his votes/the results of his votes started very early in the game ("any votes to be of significant merit" = "don't look at my vote on LMcD, move along, move along").
Do you really need it spelled out to you why his comment was odd? You're not even paying attention to what was going on at that point. Everyone thought it was a scummy comment, and it got L_McD a lot of heat.
I'll say it again. It's impossible to have decent reads that early.
First, after Wheat calls out swishh on his "too early for votes of significant merit comment", swishh... dismisses the question ("not going to humor this question with an answer". That's twice this game, and this is the early game. That's not town defense.
Second, that attack on Wheat is very bad. He's attacking Wheat... for asking for explanations of votes on a bandwagon (i.e, existing explanations are insufficient). That's behavior that comes from town or from scum trying to fake town motivation - and swishh doesn't give any indication that he thinks it's the latter.
Uncertain about one point. Swishh - why didn't you consider the possibility that Wheat was scum defending town for towncred?
Note to self: Post 82 has a town/scum list. Might be useful later.
Post 86... is not adding up right now. I need some sleep, will finish tomorrow.
I can link you to many games where town players have dismissed questions that seemed rhetorical or pointed. And no, you CONTINUE to gloss over the content of my posts. I attacked Wheat for his inconsistency and what looked like opportunism.
Regarding my scum list: Interesting that of the two players I said needed to post more, one has flipped scum and the other is blowing up my scum radar.
There's nothing hard to understand about post 86. I'm calling Wheat out for inconsistent reasoning (again). You weren't in the game at this point, so maybe you're not fully understanding what happened with L_McD.
Taredas, who else is scum? I'm much more interested in that read than your BS case on me.
Deadline: June 12, 2013 @ 17:00 Pacific [20:00 Eastern]
If the deadline hits without a lynch, the person with the most votes will be lynched.
I have been asked as to what the protocol would be if two players are tied in votes when the deadline hits. In this case, the second line of this statement holds that the person with the most votes will be lynched. If a situation arrives where one or more players are tied for the most votes, the day will be ended in a "no lynch" since no single person has the most votes.
If the AC repair dude doesn't show up bright and early tomorrow, I'm gonna borrow some of DDS' dental tools to carve out his eye sockets like jack o lanterns.
If the AC repair dude doesn't show up bright and early tomorrow, I'm gonna borrow some of DDS' dental tools to carve out his eye sockets like jack o lanterns.
MTG~DDS, anything you want to say before we hammer? Pretty sure that one of us is dying toNight.
EBWODP: One of my last big posts, I threw out a T/S list and likely scumteams regarding alignment. Cantrip brought up a possible flaw in my logic, run over it if you have time and see what you think. also throw out your reads if you have time before nightfall.
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If the AC repair dude doesn't show up bright and early tomorrow, I'm gonna borrow some of DDS' dental tools to carve out his eye sockets like jack o lanterns.
The arguments continued into the early morning. It felt like mere minutes ago that they were filing into the room to decide which of them would die next. But the sun peaking through the windows from a rising sun hinted otherwise. There were many suspects throughout the night. It seemed as if the evidence pointed to all of them; that everyone had acted like a traitor in some way since the ordeal had begun. And frankly, that wasn’t surprising. These people were the worst of the worst. Pure evil flowed through their veins and the mentality of such vile and wickedness would revolt any outsider watching what was going on.
As the fingers pointed and the voices became raspy from arguing all night, there seemed to be a consensus forming. Wheat Grinder was the next person on the chopping block; the Villains had surrounded Wheat into a half circle with his back into a corner of the room. There was no way around this: they were out for blood. The other Villains believed the evidence was damning and that whoever was under Wheat’s mask was a traitor just as Jafar had turned out to be.
“Reveal yourself,” shouted someone from the circle.
“Very well….” Wheat took off his mask and revealed…
Maleficent, Power Hungry Priestess
Movie: Sleeping Beauty
Vanilla Town
There was a gasp amongst the crowd. Maleficient was one of the most powerful Villains that had ever walked this earth. Her powers of manipulation and transformation were renowned. She began to mutter something as if casting some sort of incantation or spell. But one of the Villains held her, and another threw a chair at the window. A beam of the rising dawn entered the hall and struck Maleficient. There was a muffled scream and the priestess instantaneously turned into ash. But something here was stranger. Mere sunlight should not have killed such a powerful sorceress. The traitors must have known that she was using some spell for obfuscation whose foil was sunlight. But, as they looked around, there had been such a commotion that no one could remember which one of them threw the chair.
The Villains looked around at each other. It took a minute to sink in that Maleficient was not a traitor. It took another minute to realize that the true traitors had manipulated them to sacrifice one of the most cunning and powerful allies they could have. Pete, exasperated, didn’t have to say a word. The Villains filed out of the hall toward their personal chambers. They didn’t know how many times they could sacrifice each other in a search for the traitors; they didn’t know how many times they could be wrong.
It is now Night Three and will last 60 hours. Do not post until I have announced it is Day again. Please send your Night Actions into me as soon as possible. Day will not start any earlier than 60 hours from now.
The sun had already risen before the Villains retired the previous day. And when the sun reached its apex in the sky, Pete made the decision to rouse the Villains from their beds. He did so with extreme trepidation; there was not a particularly awesome track record when it came to nighttime in this cursed castle. Pete went from room to room. Knocking on the door. Wondering which one of the Villains wouldn’t respond. Wondering which one of the Villains he’d find massacred, mutilated, and murdered.
He came to the last room. He knocked on the door. No answer. He knocked again and still no answer. He reached for the door handle without thinking and quickly recoiled his hand. The metallic handle was so hot it was glowing. “This is the one. This was tonight’s kill,” he thought to himself. He lined up his shoulder and smashed into the door to pry it open. No luck. He had to call the Villains; he had to let them know he had failed once again in protecting them whilst they were sleeping. He hollered for the masked men and women to join him in the hallway. They filed in. He could not see the look on their faces, but he didn’t need to. Their body language conveyed everything. Cautious and afraid. Not every day you see the cabal of evil beings cowering in the shadows.
One of the Villains pushed Pete aside and rammed into the door. It quickly opened as if mocking Pete. As the portal opened, smoke began to escape the room and the smell of burnt flesh rose up to their noses. There was a body. Another body. The lower half of the body had been charred beyond recognition. However, Pete knew which alias had occupied this room. Pete knew it was the one who addressed himself as Incognito. Someone had immolated this Villain; and whoever it was had left the mask on as if mocking the person who had to pull off the mask. Pete, grabbing the mask, lifted and saw who Incognito really was underneath. It was…
Ursula, Cephalopod Sorceress
Movie: The Little Mermaid
Town One-Shot Vig
The Villains didn’t gasp, didn’t show any signs of shock. Perhaps there was a slight revulsion to this charred body which reeked of a mixture of salt water and sulfur. But it had become so routine that there was no point in being shocked at this point. Pete turned around to the Villains and gave them a look. No words needed to be spoken anymore. They know what they had to do. And Pete knew he had another body to dispose of.
It is now Day Four! With 5 alive, it’s 3 to lynch!
Deadline for the Day has been set to June 27, 2013 at 17:00 Pacific / 20:00 Eastern. If no consensus has been reached by the deadline, the person with the most number of votes will be lynched. If the vote is tied, then the day will end in a “no lynch.”
Regardless if Wheat flips town or not, I think we can accurately lynch scum tomorrow.
My gut is screaming really loud for a Cantrip/swishh team, but that's not based on much.
Please reconsider that team upon my flip.
/barn this to eternity. I feel OK calling Cantrip town, mostly because I'm more sure that Taredas and Nyxu are scum. Coming up soon: vote count analysis.
Yeah, swishh is still scum - no way in hell does post 724 come from town, and 776 is scum defense through and through, and 779 looks a lot like the classic "call the townie who is going to be lynched town for towncred" that scum pull, and I'd be astounded if there wasn't a scum on the early Lord McDonalds wagon and that means him.
HoS: swishh, and if this wasn't LyLo I'd be voting for him.
More interesting question: Who's swishh's partner? Wheat's flipped town, so that's out. I don't see Nyxu and swishh being scum together, the way swishh attacked Nyxu D3 doesn't look like a bus. I need to check DDS to be sure, but I'm pretty sure he's town.
That leaves Cantripmancer by POE. I need to double-check that. (Also guard against the outside cases of "DDS is scum" and "swishh decided to bus Nyxu D3".)
The first major Annorax wagon, heavily filled with players who have since flipped town. Sixed/Nyxu switches to me. MRH/Taredas and Annorax are still pushing on L_McD.
Talk about a case of friendly fire. We literally handed that mislynch to scum. Important note: The scum team didn't join a bandwagon on what they knew would be a mislynch.
General comments:
1. Not once until Taredas voted me had MRH/Taredas ever voted someone who hasn't since flipped town. No votes on Annorax, no votes on Nyxu/Sixed, no votes on MTG~DDS, and no votes on Cantrip/Magenta.
2. MTG~DDS and Cantrip never seemed to vote together, but they often were unvoted at the same time. I do not see a Cantrip/MTG~DDS scum team.
3. Out of 8 vote counts where both Annorax and MRH were voting, they were voting together in 4.
4. Nyxu has been mostly reluctant to vote, as has MTG~DDS.
5. Magenta (Cantrip) only voted for MTG~DDS, and Cantrip (Magenta) only voted for Wheat.
6. Except for MTG~DDS, Annorax (just like MRH) never voted for someone who hasn't flipped town. MTG~DDS is basically clear.
This actually looks much better for Nyxu than for Taredas and in some ways better for Nyxu than for Cantrip. I feel like I could have been counter-tunneling Nyxu yesterday. This is rife with WIFOM, but would scum really want to be seen voting together on what easily could have turned out to be swishh-mislynch?
So far Taredas looks the worst (mostly due to bad play by MRH), but I'll have to rethink Cantrip vs. Nyxu. MTG~DDS is definitely* town.
and I'd be astounded if there wasn't a scum on the early Lord McDonalds wagon and that means him.
It means you, too. I unvoted once I realized he was at L-2. MRH did not. But Annorax came along later and joined you. You have plenty more in my previous post to answer to. I realize you are not MRH, but perhaps you could help explain how what he was doing was town motivated.
If the AC repair dude doesn't show up bright and early tomorrow, I'm gonna borrow some of DDS' dental tools to carve out his eye sockets like jack o lanterns.
Three of the players alive now have replaced in. You'll find questions about your predecessors in the spoilers. Again, I realize you are different human beings, but your alignments are the same and this might help connect reads.
Regarding my Swishh vote, it was partially that he was trying far too hard to seem town, rather than simply scumhunting and being town. So I throw an accusation and vote at him to see how he responds, and how other people respond to it
I'd call it inconclusive for now, but I like having reactions to look back on after a few flips are generated
Swishh spearheading the Annorax lynch makes me feel a bit better about him, at least
I'm interested in who avoided both of the wagons actually
How do you feel about me spearheading the Annorax lynch? And how do feel about the fact that MRH constantly avoided voting Annorax?
He seems scummy as hell but I'm not ready to lynch him just yet. I want to see him post moar & claim before I start non-RVS voting. He looks scummy as hell, but I'm not willing to vote him yet.
Trabant seems like another possibility but I'm not sure enough to throw a vote at him yet either.
MegaFoS Lord McD's FoS Trabant777
This is just waffling. If you think hes scummy post the reason and vote him. A claim does not help us now, especially if he is a PR. Pressure does help identify if he is scum. Multiple FOS just makes us look at you.
Does the bolded part sound like coaching to you? And on that note:
Trabant is iffy, but at that point Annorax's teammates are almost certain to bus
Annorax's constant fearmongering of mislynches sounds like he knows what wagons will be mislynches - I'd be okay with that lynch
Regarding my Swishh vote, it was partially that he was trying far too hard to seem town, rather than simply scumhunting and being town. So I throw an accusation and vote at him to see how he responds, and how other people respond to it
I'd call it inconclusive for now, but I like having reactions to look back on after a few flips are generated
Swishh spearheading the Annorax lynch makes me feel a bit better about him, at least
I'm interested in who avoided both of the wagons actually
Newb scum in particular tend to be afraid to use their vote
Magenta?
Magenta hasn't placed a non-rvs vote yet this game, and hasn't done anything other than wave at posts and call them "bad"
She's scum
MTG, Wheat, Incognito, LMD are all pretty solidly town
I'm cool with lynching Annorax or Magenta
Annorax is at L-2, and I'm fine with having him claim. My vote is there in spirit
Going to Vote: Magenta for now though, since don't really see a use for keeping it on Swishh
TK and Grimnar make me a little uneasy at the front of the LMD wagon - although they could be RVS votes, I need to go back and look at how that unfolded again. Am just looking at the wagons Wheat posted
So we have a mudsling and voting for someone other than the current wagon to avoid looking like bussing? Could you fence sit more?
@W_G why would you buddy up to Polski when he had a slight scum read on you?
I wasn't buddying, I was stating the gamestate as I saw it.
Then he happens to get night killed. Do you have a reaction to his dying post?
My reason that I believed I might die is because I have the most experience on this site of any players here, and was one of the leaders. Polski was the other big leader, so I expected it would be either him or me.
Why did you skip over the fact that he said if he was killed, people should suspect you?
MRH was drinking the Polski-kill wifom pretty hard. Do you think it was reason enough to suspect Wheat?
That seems pretty dismissive. He was one of our leaders, you proclaim him town, then he gets night killed. He warns of that exact thing, and you just say "WIFOM" and it all goes away?
I'm sorry guys, I'm having little to no time these days.
Even if I don't really agree with general opinions about iRebel, I do agree that we need more info to go on. As I can be wrong, and haven't seen enough on him to be alarmed of an obvious mislynch, I won't oppose to the lynch.
Don't have time for a detailed post, but I will say this: If you're going to lynch me based on the actions of my predecessor, just go ahead and do it. Now.
I don't know what my predecessor was thinking, so I can't explain his? actions - and it's a hell of a lot better if you lynch me today rather than tomorrow.
Now, if you think that I'm scum based on my own play, then tell me why and I'll address it (no Wheat, I haven't forgotten about your response to my case). But if nothing I say can sway you because of what my predecessor did, then just get it over with before it costs us the game.
Note: That was yesterday, aka "before LyLo".
I mean, I don't understand what the hell my predecessor was playing at. But it must have made some sense to MRH to act that way as town.
Instead of half finished content, I am electing to finish a complete thought in my next real post. That said, it is taking me much longer than expected to get through all of this thread and follow quotewalls back and forth. Will have something worthwhile soon.
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Legacy BSpanish InquisitionB UWU/W StoneBladeWU WUGBant NOGUW BWDeadguy AleWB Modern WDeath and TaxesW EDH BBBalthor ReanimatorBB GBWThe Rock / TenebWBG BBMaralen ANT EDHBB UUHeidar, Winter Is ComingUU
If the AC repair dude doesn't show up bright and early tomorrow, I'm gonna borrow some of DDS' dental tools to carve out his eye sockets like jack o lanterns.
Regarding my Swishh vote, it was partially that he was trying far too hard to seem town, rather than simply scumhunting and being town. So I throw an accusation and vote at him to see how he responds, and how other people respond to it
I'd call it inconclusive for now, but I like having reactions to look back on after a few flips are generated
Swishh spearheading the Annorax lynch makes me feel a bit better about him, at least
I'm interested in who avoided both of the wagons actually
How do you feel about me spearheading the Annorax lynch? And how do feel about the fact that MRH constantly avoided voting Annorax?
Newb scum in particular tend to be afraid to use their vote
Magenta?
Magenta hasn't placed a non-rvs vote yet this game, and hasn't done anything other than wave at posts and call them "bad"
She's scum
MTG~DDS was just as reserved about voting as Magenta. Do you agree with Sixed's theory about new scum?
Let's break this one down...
Part the first:
You've quoted a votecount that was Not a Lynch, made a note that, on that votecount, you're the only one not confirmed town via flip, and then asked, what, if I agree with Sixed that he was being bussed at that point? That he was bussed at all? I don't really have Sixed's notes or thoughts to work off of. What really irks me about this question is how loaded it is. An answer of yes can be painted as me calling you scum, or used to bring up later votecounts and ask where the "bussing" happens. An answer of no can be painted as me calling you town. I don't like the question. Nor do I have a concrete answer for it because I don't know why Sixed thought bus. Hell, I don't know if Sixed would agree with his own statement at this point.
Part the Second:
Okay and? Maybe he just had a gut feeling? What's even funnier is that Annorax was talking about his own growing wagon.
This is a good point. I'm getting severe noob-vibes from almost everyone, and these bandwagons are growing really fast. I was like literally sheeped. I'm going to be kind of busy this weekend, so hopefully I can review the game tomorrow and make sense of things.
Then you joined the iRebel Wagon after returning from V/LA
MRH I'll have to look at later.
Part the Sixed:
See Part the First about not knowing what Sixed was thinking.
See Part the First about how I don't like your questions.
I'll have more to say about your post when your other targets answer.
As it is, I feel like it comes down to a few simple dichotomies.
Incognito
I am confirmed town.
MTG~DDS
Interactions with Annorax have him as very townie. If you're scum, good game, and I will forever be paranoid of you.
Cantripmancer
Cantripmancer's posts have been fairly townie for me from what I can recall. I haven't seen any blaring scumtells coming from him, and I don't see how Magenta is scum. If you're scum, then you've played a fine game.
That leaves us with four options: Wheat, Nyxu, Taredas, and swishh.
Wheat_Grinder
Ugh, Wheat. Wheat is the person I want to think as town, but every time I reread him he comes up red every time. You said that you would hammer yourself, which is a townie mindset for me, but Voxxicus did that in FHF and he spewed wine all over the table. I can't shake the distancing from Annorax at the beginning of Day 2. Also, if I suspected you, I think you would have killed me long ago, which makes my being alive here a bit more telling.
I am fine with a Wheat_Grinder lynch.
Nyxu
I'm not sure if I had more stranger reads on you. When Day 3 started, I thought for sure you were scum. You reeked scum for your vote on Annorax, and my pbpa of you left me wanting you as a lynch. And neutral hunting in a basic as well?
However, I have reflected on my stance of you, and here's the thing I have been hiding from you: While my brain says that you are scum, my gut says that you are town. I don't see much maliciousness coming out from your posts, and your "pulling threads" on swishh seems to have blossomed into a full out scumhunt. So, for now, I am willing to accept Nyxu as being town.
swishh
Oh, how have the mighty have fallen. You were a strong town read for most of the game, but lately I've been getting increasingly paranoid of you, and Nyxu sniping at you + your lurking earlier in the Day have made me come around. I do think you are scum, and your vote on Annorax was an attempt to "jump the gun" and have people dismiss you as town. You did come around on that read, and you did bring Annorax to L-1. I was blinded by the fact that you voted Annorax Day 1, but it's not as big as I thought it would be.
I am fine with a swishh lynch.
And now, for our most enigmatic figure:
Taredas
I will need to read more of your posts to get a clearer read on you, but the point of Annorax not mentioning MRH at all has me a bit suspicious. I have been getting a townie feel from the posts I have seen you make. Obviously, you're probably the hardest player to read currently, but my gut read on MRH + your good replace in posts make you pending, but leaning town. The pinkys_brain kill has me a bit nervous, but I'm willing to chalk it up to a "pinkys_brain was probably the most experienced player in the game" kill.
tl;dr: I think that swishh and Wheat_Grinder, and I am perfectly fine on voting whoever MTG~DDS votes.
I will be checking this thread probably.. once a day? To try to read some stuff and hammer.
If anyone has any problems with my logic, then feel free to call me out on it. But at this point, I am willing to throw out logic completely and focus on my gut, so I will most likely not have good answers/handwave your rebuttal.
Here's the post you made:
The bolded is what I saw as you promoting WIFOM. You're saying that Swishh isn't taking responsibility, which makes him scum; I saw it as something town could do: Swishh seeing three suspects (Nyxu/Wheat/Taredas) and seeing an opportunity to test one of those three. I think he's right: Had he voted Wheat, Wheat would have been at L-1 and likely would have been lynched. But he's not sure which one he finds more scummy, so by putting two of his suspects at L-2, he has an opportunity to get a reaction out of his third suspect.
That said...I see your point. My initial reaction was a gut response of "good idea, but why would you ruin it by spelling it out for Nyxu"? Looking back at it, though, the act of explaining does feel a little self-conscious.
I still think this is a reach. I could see that being a slip, but I don't see how it's more likely a slip.
If you really believe the bolded, then you believe that Wheat is likely scum, correct?
Wait...didn't you say that the element that pushed you to reassess Wheat as town was Swishh's avoiding-responsibility post?
A lot of Taredas's accusations feel like they could be misinterpretations of Swishh's posts. I don't know if Taredas is purposefully misinterpreting Swishh, but his points aren't strong enough to sway me from Wheat.
As far as a Wheat lynch goes, I'm a little disconcerted because there does seem to be a general consensus that Wheat and I are a dichotomy, so if he flips town, I'm going to be under a lot of scrutiny. But no matter how many times I look at it, it feels to me that Wheat was pushing a case on MRH based on bad data. So I say we lynch Wheat. If he comes up scum, MRH/Taredas is pretty close to confirmed town. If Wheat comes up town...well, I guess I'll have my work cut out for me, won't I?
I don't know what my predecessor was thinking, so I can't explain his? actions - and it's a hell of a lot better if you lynch me today rather than tomorrow.
Now, if you think that I'm scum based on my own play, then tell me why and I'll address it (no Wheat, I haven't forgotten about your response to my case). But if nothing I say can sway you because of what my predecessor did, then just get it over with before it costs us the game.
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
@Incognito: Really the night kills each night were fairly obvious. When would you have been better a NK? What I'm saying is that it seems like you're just going on gut regarding Wheat and not looking at the real evidence today: Taredas's vote on Wheat and the immediate change to me for one post I made. Nyxu has almost completely ignored every player but me and Taredas today, and I've laid out what I think is a fairly explanatory theory for the scums' actions today. Is there any part of it you disagree with?
And one final thing. I know this is sort of WIFOM + circular reasoning, but assuming Wheat is town, wouldn't it make the most sense from a scum standpoint for me to vote him while he already had 2 votes on him, especially since there was interest among the unvoting players to lynch him? On top of that, if we were both scum, wouldn't a bus have made the most sense at that point? I honestly think Wheat is town.
By "coordinated attack", are you talking about MRH putting his vote on Wheat when Annorax did? Because that's a pretty weak "coordinated attack".
As for Wheat, his condemnation of MRH was pretty total, and I feel like I've shown that Wheat's reasoning was faulty. His ongoing persistence in saying there was a "pattern" to MRH's votes continues to confound me, as does his "no bussing" theory (of course, he's since dropped that since he wasn't getting anywhere with it, since it limited his mislynch targets). Do you feel like it's more likely that an experienced player like Wheat would glance at a votecount tally and identify a player as "definitely scum" on that basis, or that, in a basic, he could see potential in pushing a mislynch on bad data, believing that he could talk his way out of it if confronted by it?
How is it more likely that this is scum-motivated rather than town-motivated?
Taredas's change in vote made very little sense at the time. He still thought both Wheat and I were scum, yet he felt compelled to switch from one to other. He justified this by changing his opinion of Wheat's defense: suddenly he thought it was legitimate when he said it was null earlier. It's possible Wheat is scum too and Taredas just decided the bus wasn't worth it if a mislynch was possible, but what's more likely is that Taredas and Nyxu are converging on a single target. Note that Nyxu didn't vote me until Taredas did even though he's been calling me scum all day.
I guess I should reread; I don't remember MRH pushing Wheat very hard.
I can see most of where you're coming from, but do you believe that Wheat and Taredas can be scumbuddies after the way Wheat went after MRH with the votecount "analysis"?
Will you also respond to my other question, please?
Think about it closely, he initiated the argument with me, and stayed with it for a long time. He was taking a big risk on thinking I was scum, and he wouldn't take that risk as scum because he'd KNOW I'd flip town.
You don't need to take my word for it now, but if I'm the lynch, somebody please come back to this post and DON'T LYNCH CANTRIPMANCER.
Lynch Taredas and Nyxu instead.
One of the reasons that this post and its sibling where your stance is reversed ping my scumdar is because they sound so certain. The previous one was "Remember the pattern! When I flip town, lynch Cantrip!!!" And there was fearmongering, and there was smearing. This one is "When I flip town, don't lynch Cantrip!" And there's still fearmongering, and there's buddying.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that I couldn't understand your extremist position before, and now you've presented an extremist position in the exact opposite direction, and you argued both vehemently...it just doesn't feel like it could come from town.
If you're town, I guess I'll owe you an apology.
What part of "null" don't you understand? It means I could see Wheat's defense come from either aligment (i.e, null tell).
Wait. Why are you saying that you'd rather lynch me IN THE SAME POST THAT YOU VOTE NYXU?
That makes no sense. I could see it if there was a delay between the first post and the second, but this is the same post! I could see it if we were a couple of days away from deadline and Nyxu had more votes, but last I checked Nyxu wasn't being voted at all!
Again, what part of "null = could come from town or scum" do you not understand? Unlike your defense, which almost certainly comes from scum.
Also, I just told you that if you are going to hang me based on the actions of my predecessor you should do it TODAY... and you keep pushing a "Annorax and MRH pushed for a Wheat lynch D2" theory... but you hop onto Nyxu? Bull. You're scum trying to avoid a confrontation.
More soon.
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
Can this become a thing, forever? Because I really think this needs to be a thing.
I hope you don't think I want you lynched blindly, because I've shared my reasoning.
No, I mean that in general, that needs to be a thing.
Whether WG is town or scum, I actually agree with the logic here. Not sure if it is a buddying attempt or true sentiment, but the logic is sound. I also do not see this as distancing, bussing, or anything other interaction between scum team. As originally outlined, I do not see the possibility that WG and Cantrip are scum together. Cantrip has been very strong town since he has entered. When he first presented the case on WG, there was no heat on WG...at all. Scum can bus, but if they were teammates, there was no need to at that time. Cantrip wasn't under suspicion, other than predecessor being lurky. WG wasn't under fire either. Cantrip bussing WG doesn't seem logical at all the way the game was headed. WG flipping scum still seems to clear Cantrip for reasons outlined. Case against WG still looks solid.
3 quick points for WG lynch:
1: Faulty logic proved on MRH pattern. Not a complete deal breaker, but this was presented as a main focus for WG's case on MRH...and proven wrong.
2: Huge turnaround on stance on Cantrip (Absolutely lynch to definitely don't). This change in opinion or tunnel vision can happen from either town or scum, but if he had been lynched before the turnaround...his finger would be pointing at Cantrip. Was the original accusation at Cantrip OMGUS, or what?
3: If town, seems like when Cantrip, MRH, DDS, Incognito, and even WG (anyone else?) were expressing interest in his lynch, why would scum have not joined in to make it happen? The lack of interest or action following a very solid presentation by Cantrip, comes across as psuedo-confirmation. At the peak of the WG hunt, it would not have been as suspicious if scum had joined in. There was a good case to hide behind. It would not have been hard to throw blame back on Cantrip at that point.
Not ready to vote yet, still need to look more into the other cases.
Swishh: Post 705 Seems very odd. Following context of the quote wall, I have to agree with Nyxu most of the quotes being contextually innaccurate or at least a stretch. Weird way to present a case on someone. His followup to Nyxu was much better though.
Swishh's Vote is logically sound from a town perspective. At least if consideration of the explanation is taken at face value. However, I have to agree with Cantrip about his immediate justification and explanation. The justification for it, although also logical, does seem defensive before the fact. Even as a townie, for the plan to actually work correctly, you can't set a trap and warn the prey. Knowing what is being watched, it is not as hard to construct a desired outcome. Taredas' response drives home why the immediate justification was bad. If town setting a trap, there would not be instant guilt and necessity of justification. If correct, Taredas shows good reasoning why post 725 came so quick. Nyxu/Taredas attacking Swishh does make me a touch uneasy about calling Swishh scum. It seems a bit coordinated, and to top that Taredas jumped off the WG wagon to join in. This is one of the sections I need to dive into a bit more before any decisions on my part are made.
My immediate thought is /barn this. Interestingly enough, Taredas no longer seems to /barn the last statement though...These two statements are a good summation of my current feelings on gamestate. Between WG strongly defending Swishh, actively wanting Taredas lynch, and calling Nyxu town, there are some strong interactions with WG alignment being revealed. Other strong interactions have also come out into the open as well.
Helluva lot of responsibility thrown on me here. Please make a choice for yourself and don't blindly follow me. If you disagree with my lynch choice, say so.
I guess a T/S list would be appropriate at this point.
Town
DDS -
Incognito -
Cantrip -
Taredas -
Nyxu -
Swishh -
WG -
Scum
WG Scum flip: Clears
MRHTaredas, Swishh looks bad, Nyxu looks better, Cantrip cleared.WG Town flip: Taredas/Nyxu look bad, Cantrip not as bad due to reasoning previously outlined here and by WG himself. WG's heavy suspects Taredas and Nyxu...mainly Taredas. WG defends Swishh multiple times, he looks better.
As mentioned previously, I want to follow the Nyxu/Taredas vs Swishh development a little closer before voting. I still feel WG is the best vote today though. Best chance of catching scum IMHO, however, his alignment revealed will shed some major light on this game either way. If that opinion changes, I'll drop some logic on why.
Going to finish following the Nyxu/Taredas/Swishh Saga tomorrow.
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I am on board with this being a Thing(tm).
I agree with pretty much everything you've said in this post. One minor area of disagreement is the bolded. Taredas and Nyxu may look bad for their actions regarding Wheat, but they don't look worse because town!Wheat suspected them, nor does Swishh look better because town!Wheat defended him. If Wheat's town, we can't look at Wheat's actions to drive conclusions, because Wheat doesn't know who's town and who's scum.
Like I said, minor.
As someone who doesn't have the time to do this right now, I'm perfectly fine with waiting a bit longer if you still want to scumhunt.
(Note: Grimnar = Polski, Lord McDonald = Pinky. Both have flipped town.)
Don't like this post at all. That "interesting" on Grimnar looks like a mudsling rather than genuine suspicion - note that swishh doesn't explain why it's interesting, just that he doesn't think there's a bandwagon. He also doesn't comment on the wagon itself.
More importantly, look at the second part. This is in the early part of the game, but swishh calls Grimnar and Lord McDonald "pro scumhunters". Why is this important? Because he's calling Grimnar and Lord McDonald scumhunters. I.e, they're scumhunting. I.e, they're town.
How does he know this in RVS? (Because they weren't listed as his buddies in his role PM?) And why does swishh then jump on Lord McDonalds later?
Look at swishh's vote on Lord McDonald. His reasoning consists of a /barn and an "I don't like your posts" with no explanation of why. That's as close to a naked wagon hop as it gets.
There's one way I could see this coming from town, but given the way swishh does this and the way he defends it later I doubt it applies.
More importantly, look at swishh's response to trabant = iRebel (regarding an earlier comment to Sixed = Nyxu, which I could see coming from either alignment on its own). He doesn't explain his reasoning, just brushes off trabant (note the dismissive rhetoric - "going to assume", "merely guessing" - and also the deflection towards Lord McDonalds). That's not town defense. That's a guilty conscience.
Couple this explanation with the original /barn on TK, and swishh's vote on Lord McD's early is fishy as hell. No request for explanation... and yet the core of his reasoning was that "LMcD's response seemed odd"? Just odd? No explanation for *why* it's odd?
See, that would make sense considering swishh's "pro scumhunters" comment earlier and the general scum tendency (at least on 'Scum) not to attack their targets as strongly as townies do (okay, WIFOM, but still).
Also note that swishh's desire to not be held responsible for his votes/the results of his votes started very early in the game ("any votes to be of significant merit" = "don't look at my vote on LMcD, move along, move along").
This post is important.
First, after Wheat calls out swishh on his "too early for votes of significant merit comment", swishh... dismisses the question ("not going to humor this question with an answer". That's twice this game, and this is the early game. That's not town defense.
Second, that attack on Wheat is very bad. He's attacking Wheat... for asking for explanations of votes on a bandwagon (i.e, existing explanations are insufficient). That's behavior that comes from town or from scum trying to fake town motivation - and swishh doesn't give any indication that he thinks it's the latter.
Uncertain about one point. Swishh - why didn't you consider the possibility that Wheat was scum defending town for towncred?
Note to self: Post 82 has a town/scum list. Might be useful later.
Post 86... is not adding up right now. I need some sleep, will finish tomorrow.
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
I've seen experienced players get cocky and make bad plays. It's not enough to convince me Wheat is a good lynch today. There was a lot of interaction with Nyxu earlier about my alignment, but I don't think they would be so open about their discussion if they were both scum. And yeah, he also made an odd flip on his Cantrip read, but again I think if he were scum he would be playing better.
My point is that you switched from null to "worth considering" when it was convenient for you. I.e. when you decided to go after me instead of Wheat.
No. You're just intentionally misinterpreting my posts at this point. I'm equally fine with lynching you or Nyxu today because I think both of you are scum. There is no preference.
Why "TODAY?" Why would it matter to you at all? Obvious provocation. How much more confrontational can I be than both of you are scum.
It was RVS. It was a sarcastic comment. You're really digging deep for some ammunition. You are scum.
Wasn't this like the very beginning of day 1? Does anyone ever have decent reads then? You vote people to get reactions, see how others respond.
Do you really need it spelled out to you why his comment was odd? You're not even paying attention to what was going on at that point. Everyone thought it was a scummy comment, and it got L_McD a lot of heat.
I'll say it again. It's impossible to have decent reads that early.
I can link you to many games where town players have dismissed questions that seemed rhetorical or pointed. And no, you CONTINUE to gloss over the content of my posts. I attacked Wheat for his inconsistency and what looked like opportunism.
Regarding my scum list: Interesting that of the two players I said needed to post more, one has flipped scum and the other is blowing up my scum radar.
There's nothing hard to understand about post 86. I'm calling Wheat out for inconsistent reasoning (again). You weren't in the game at this point, so maybe you're not fully understanding what happened with L_McD.
Taredas, who else is scum? I'm much more interested in that read than your BS case on me.
Unvote, Vote: Wheat_Grinder
Wheat_Grinder (2): Cantripmancer, Wheat_Grinder
Swishh (2): Taredas; Nyxu
Nxyu (1): Swishh
Not Voting: MTG~DDS; Incognito
With 7 alive, it's 4 to lynch!
Deadline: June 12, 2013 @ 17:00 Pacific [20:00 Eastern]
If the deadline hits without a lynch, the person with the most votes will be lynched.
/barn
I have been asked as to what the protocol would be if two players are tied in votes when the deadline hits. In this case, the second line of this statement holds that the person with the most votes will be lynched. If a situation arrives where one or more players are tied for the most votes, the day will be ended in a "no lynch" since no single person has the most votes.
I would be more comfortable with a Wheat lynch.
MTG~DDS, anything you want to say before we hammer? Pretty sure that one of us is dying toNight.
Vote Wheat_Grinder
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If I die, one more post from me won't really help more than analysis I tried to get out already today.
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So, were you scum?
Or town?
Who should we lynch tomorrow?
EBWODP: One of my last big posts, I threw out a T/S list and likely scumteams regarding alignment. Cantrip brought up a possible flaw in my logic, run over it if you have time and see what you think. also throw out your reads if you have time before nightfall.
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Regardless if Wheat flips town or not, I think we can accurately lynch scum tomorrow.
My gut is screaming really loud for a Cantrip/swishh team, but that's not based on much.
Please reconsider that team upon my flip.
You're town then. Ugh.
Will have to reread, but looking in the Taredas/Nyxu/swishh pile will help.
Blegh.
Wheat_Grinder (4): Cantripmancer; Wheat_Grinder; Incognito; MTG~DDS
Swishh (2): Taredas; Nyxu
Nyxu (1): swishh
That's a lynch!
***
The arguments continued into the early morning. It felt like mere minutes ago that they were filing into the room to decide which of them would die next. But the sun peaking through the windows from a rising sun hinted otherwise. There were many suspects throughout the night. It seemed as if the evidence pointed to all of them; that everyone had acted like a traitor in some way since the ordeal had begun. And frankly, that wasn’t surprising. These people were the worst of the worst. Pure evil flowed through their veins and the mentality of such vile and wickedness would revolt any outsider watching what was going on.
As the fingers pointed and the voices became raspy from arguing all night, there seemed to be a consensus forming. Wheat Grinder was the next person on the chopping block; the Villains had surrounded Wheat into a half circle with his back into a corner of the room. There was no way around this: they were out for blood. The other Villains believed the evidence was damning and that whoever was under Wheat’s mask was a traitor just as Jafar had turned out to be.
“Reveal yourself,” shouted someone from the circle.
“Very well….” Wheat took off his mask and revealed…
There was a gasp amongst the crowd. Maleficient was one of the most powerful Villains that had ever walked this earth. Her powers of manipulation and transformation were renowned. She began to mutter something as if casting some sort of incantation or spell. But one of the Villains held her, and another threw a chair at the window. A beam of the rising dawn entered the hall and struck Maleficient. There was a muffled scream and the priestess instantaneously turned into ash. But something here was stranger. Mere sunlight should not have killed such a powerful sorceress. The traitors must have known that she was using some spell for obfuscation whose foil was sunlight. But, as they looked around, there had been such a commotion that no one could remember which one of them threw the chair.
The Villains looked around at each other. It took a minute to sink in that Maleficient was not a traitor. It took another minute to realize that the true traitors had manipulated them to sacrifice one of the most cunning and powerful allies they could have. Pete, exasperated, didn’t have to say a word. The Villains filed out of the hall toward their personal chambers. They didn’t know how many times they could sacrifice each other in a search for the traitors; they didn’t know how many times they could be wrong.
It is now Night Three and will last 60 hours. Do not post until I have announced it is Day again. Please send your Night Actions into me as soon as possible. Day will not start any earlier than 60 hours from now.
He came to the last room. He knocked on the door. No answer. He knocked again and still no answer. He reached for the door handle without thinking and quickly recoiled his hand. The metallic handle was so hot it was glowing. “This is the one. This was tonight’s kill,” he thought to himself. He lined up his shoulder and smashed into the door to pry it open. No luck. He had to call the Villains; he had to let them know he had failed once again in protecting them whilst they were sleeping. He hollered for the masked men and women to join him in the hallway. They filed in. He could not see the look on their faces, but he didn’t need to. Their body language conveyed everything. Cautious and afraid. Not every day you see the cabal of evil beings cowering in the shadows.
One of the Villains pushed Pete aside and rammed into the door. It quickly opened as if mocking Pete. As the portal opened, smoke began to escape the room and the smell of burnt flesh rose up to their noses. There was a body. Another body. The lower half of the body had been charred beyond recognition. However, Pete knew which alias had occupied this room. Pete knew it was the one who addressed himself as Incognito. Someone had immolated this Villain; and whoever it was had left the mask on as if mocking the person who had to pull off the mask. Pete, grabbing the mask, lifted and saw who Incognito really was underneath. It was…
The Villains didn’t gasp, didn’t show any signs of shock. Perhaps there was a slight revulsion to this charred body which reeked of a mixture of salt water and sulfur. But it had become so routine that there was no point in being shocked at this point. Pete turned around to the Villains and gave them a look. No words needed to be spoken anymore. They know what they had to do. And Pete knew he had another body to dispose of.
It is now Day Four! With 5 alive, it’s 3 to lynch!
Deadline for the Day has been set to June 27, 2013 at 17:00 Pacific / 20:00 Eastern. If no consensus has been reached by the deadline, the person with the most number of votes will be lynched. If the vote is tied, then the day will end in a “no lynch.”
Still feel like MTG is town, but I won't give him auto-town status when I do my reread, which will happen over the next few days.
/barn this to eternity. I feel OK calling Cantrip town, mostly because I'm more sure that Taredas and Nyxu are scum. Coming up soon: vote count analysis.
Yeah, swishh is still scum - no way in hell does post 724 come from town, and 776 is scum defense through and through, and 779 looks a lot like the classic "call the townie who is going to be lynched town for towncred" that scum pull, and I'd be astounded if there wasn't a scum on the early Lord McDonalds wagon and that means him.
HoS: swishh, and if this wasn't LyLo I'd be voting for him.
More interesting question: Who's swishh's partner? Wheat's flipped town, so that's out. I don't see Nyxu and swishh being scum together, the way swishh attacked Nyxu D3 doesn't look like a bus. I need to check DDS to be sure, but I'm pretty sure he's town.
That leaves Cantripmancer by POE. I need to double-check that. (Also guard against the outside cases of "DDS is scum" and "swishh decided to bus Nyxu D3".)
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
5. Cantripmancer* (r. Magenta [Mentor: Cantripmancer])
6. Taredas (r. MRHblue**)
7. MTG~DDS [Mentor: Void]
8. Swishh*
9. Nyxu (r. Sixed)
Notice how many towns were on the L_McD wagon. MRH/Taredas came along to try to seal the lynch. Unvotes ensued once we realized we had put him at L-2.
Most towns unvoted L_McD. MRH/Taredas stayed on.
The first major Annorax wagon, heavily filled with players who have since flipped town. Sixed/Nyxu switches to me. MRH/Taredas and Annorax are still pushing on L_McD.
I had unvoted Annorax at this point.
Day drawing to a close, major switch to an iRebel lynch.
Talk about a case of friendly fire. We literally handed that mislynch to scum. Important note: The scum team didn't join a bandwagon on what they knew would be a mislynch.
Nyxu hammers iRebel.
MRH is voting with Annorax here, as I've stated their strategy was apparent to get him lynched that day.
Heavy town bandwagon on Annorax here.
MRH wasn't voting Annorax. Then again neither were Cantrip nor MRH.
General comments:
1. Not once until Taredas voted me had MRH/Taredas ever voted someone who hasn't since flipped town. No votes on Annorax, no votes on Nyxu/Sixed, no votes on MTG~DDS, and no votes on Cantrip/Magenta.
2. MTG~DDS and Cantrip never seemed to vote together, but they often were unvoted at the same time. I do not see a Cantrip/MTG~DDS scum team.
3. Out of 8 vote counts where both Annorax and MRH were voting, they were voting together in 4.
4. Nyxu has been mostly reluctant to vote, as has MTG~DDS.
5. Magenta (Cantrip) only voted for MTG~DDS, and Cantrip (Magenta) only voted for Wheat.
6. Except for MTG~DDS, Annorax (just like MRH) never voted for someone who hasn't flipped town. MTG~DDS is basically clear.
This actually looks much better for Nyxu than for Taredas and in some ways better for Nyxu than for Cantrip. I feel like I could have been counter-tunneling Nyxu yesterday. This is rife with WIFOM, but would scum really want to be seen voting together on what easily could have turned out to be swishh-mislynch?
So far Taredas looks the worst (mostly due to bad play by MRH), but I'll have to rethink Cantrip vs. Nyxu. MTG~DDS is definitely* town.
It means you, too. I unvoted once I realized he was at L-2. MRH did not. But Annorax came along later and joined you. You have plenty more in my previous post to answer to. I realize you are not MRH, but perhaps you could help explain how what he was doing was town motivated.
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I'm the only non-confirmed town player voting Annorax here. Do you agree with Sixed that Annorax was likely bussed?
This is actually a really good point, and something that has since proven true. But it sounds like Sixed was privy to information town doesn't have.
How do you feel about me spearheading the Annorax lynch? And how do feel about the fact that MRH constantly avoided voting Annorax?
MTG~DDS was just as reserved about voting as Magenta. Do you agree with Sixed's theory about new scum?
Does the bolded part sound like coaching to you? And on that note:
Does the bolded part sound like coaching to you?
MRH was drinking the Polski-kill wifom pretty hard. Do you think it was reason enough to suspect Wheat?
Case in point.
Linking to post 126 would be easier than quoting it. Here Magenta calls out Annorax for bad posting, as well as Sixed. Do you agree?
This sounds like Magenta was aware iRebel would be a mislynch and didn't want to contribute to it. MTG eventually called Magenta out for this, in fact. Then it was byebye, Magenta.
Magenta never was that involved in the game. There was a lot of phone posting and IRL distractions, but do you see Magenta's play as lurky?
Note: That was yesterday, aka "before LyLo".
I mean, I don't understand what the hell my predecessor was playing at. But it must have made some sense to MRH to act that way as town.
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
Just now seeing the start of day information
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Let's break this one down...
Part the first:
You've quoted a votecount that was Not a Lynch, made a note that, on that votecount, you're the only one not confirmed town via flip, and then asked, what, if I agree with Sixed that he was being bussed at that point? That he was bussed at all? I don't really have Sixed's notes or thoughts to work off of. What really irks me about this question is how loaded it is. An answer of yes can be painted as me calling you scum, or used to bring up later votecounts and ask where the "bussing" happens. An answer of no can be painted as me calling you town. I don't like the question. Nor do I have a concrete answer for it because I don't know why Sixed thought bus. Hell, I don't know if Sixed would agree with his own statement at this point.
Part the Second:
Okay and? Maybe he just had a gut feeling? What's even funnier is that Annorax was talking about his own growing wagon.
Part the Third:
You also hopped off first.
Then you joined the iRebel Wagon after returning from V/LA
MRH I'll have to look at later.
Part the Sixed:
See Part the First about not knowing what Sixed was thinking.
See Part the First about how I don't like your questions.
I'll have more to say about your post when your other targets answer.