NOTE: Updated through Tempest Remastered (April 2015)
I posted a list of all rarity shifts in Magic here, and am wondering what people think about MTGO downshifted cards. Do you consider them playable in peasant cubes? Do you use any? Are any good enough, anyway?
This is a list of cards that have indeterminate legality in peasant formats. Magiccards.info displays them one way, while Gatherer displays them another:
'Rare' U2 Cards (according to magiccards.info):
As I haven't seen any other inconsistencies from magiccards.info, I'm fairly sure these are simply labeled incorrectly. They should be uncommons.
'Uncommon' U2 Cards (according to magiccards.info):
I presume these are listed as rare on Gatherer because otherwise, Arabian Nights wouldn't have any 'rare' cards.
I really like Aeolipile. haha. Colorless shock could be very useful! However, I don't consider cards downshifted by MTGO playable in peasant. However, I might make an exception for this card. I kind of like it. I just love flexible, colorless spells.!
i think if they were printed in an actual set (so the odds of this happening are very low), i'd pretty much cube most of the horsemanship guys. probably lu xun, maybe lu meng, zhang fei for sure, and sun ce would be a staple with utter ease. savannah lions obviously, and maybe thunder spirit since it wrecks a ton of fliers.
i'd only cube them if they were printed in an actual set, though.
I won't include them in my cube, but I wouldn't fault anyone for doing so. These feel about as uncommon as Sylvan Library or City of Brass, which are in my cube.
Now, which cards would I actually consider inlcuding, were I to change my position:
I played Telekinesis for awhile and it was decent and fun, but not good enough to survive at 360.
I don't care for the horsemanship creatures since they weren't really designed to be played outside of their own set, but I can understand their appeal.
Savannah Lions - currently run it, awesome obviously
Xiaho Dun, the One-Eyed - ran it, cut it, too durdly but he's only out for now and might be coming back in with Theros
Lu Xun, Scholar General - ran it, turns out not being able to block was kinda a thing
Roc of Kher Ridge - ran it, really bad
Nether Shadow - been thinking about running it but worried about triggering it, any experiences with it in cube?
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Sure but he is just a bad ground blocker as ground creatures tend to be larger whereas magpie blocks a decent chunk of things. I dunno, he just didn't end up working out around here. I don't really have a good explanation as to why magpie has always been a house and he was bad...maybe people just inherently dislike horsemanship for some reason? Could be.
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Because I was thinking: if one were to build a Peasant cube using only the MTGO pool, there would be some cards that one would be unable to use.
I don't see any reason for that person to limit themself to only MTGO c/u, so why should we do the same? Although I suppose for me, this is a debate of whether or not I want two Elite Vanguards or not.
Are there any significant cards that are common or uncommon in paper MTG but not (at those rarities) in MTGO?
MTGO has none of the cards released prior to Mirage, except for those available through the Masters Editions. I'd sort them by their Gatherer rating if there was a convenient way to do so, but for now they're just alphabetical:
This is just me... but in my Modern Pauper I only use cards with the modern frame AND a black mana symbol, so I dont consider Rancor because it was common in pre-modern times only. I aslo exclude time/color/future shifted cards for visual consistency.
Having the limitation obviously decreases the power level but I wanted to have a cube having a limited feel that is designed with NWO in mind.
There's not really a rarity conflict. U2 is just labeled uncommon in Arabian Nights and Antiquities and rare in The Dark. AFAIK, they are equivalent in terms of how often the cards showed up in packs.
Remember that early expansion packs only had 8 cards (I think that's right, it was fewer than 15 for sure) and I don't think you were guaranteed to get a "rare/U2" in them.
There's not really a rarity conflict. U2 is just labeled uncommon in Arabian Nights and Antiquities and rare in The Dark. AFAIK, they are equivalent in terms of how often the cards showed up in packs.
Remember that early expansion packs only had 8 cards (I think that's right, it was fewer than 15 for sure) and I don't think you were guaranteed to get a "rare/U2" in them.
Well, that's confusing. Regardless, Gatherer displays those U2 uncommons as rares and those U2 rares as uncommons. That's the conflict I was referring to. Old Man of the Sea is peasant cubeable if you look at magiccards.info, but not so if you look at gatherer.
Except for Arabian Nights, Antiquities, The Dark, Fallen Empires, Homelands, & Alliances all other boosters prior to the introduction of mythic rares (even Alpha, if my source is correct) contained 15 cards at a rarity breakdown of 11-3-1. (11 commons, 3 uncommons, & 1 rare per booster) Most of those exceptions, however, only contained 8 cards and had a rarity breakdown of 6-2. (6 commons & 2 uncommons per booster) Alliances had a breakdown of 8-3-1, while Chronicles had a breakdown of 9-3. Legends had a more normal breakdown of 11-3-1.
Because what we now consider rares from these early expansions were all printed on the 'uncommon' sheet, you were not guaranteed one per booster. When these sets were printed, there was no 'rare', only different levels of uncommon... with each booster containing 6 commons and 2 uncommons. Doing some research, here's how those cards were differentiated:
The terms U2, U3, C5 and such represent which sheet the cards were printed on (uncommon or common) and how many appeared on the sheet. (2, 3, or 5, respectively) For all of these sets, both the common and uncommon sheets contained 121 cards each, likely organized into 11 columns and 11 rows.
Arabian Nights (78 total cards) Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: December 1993
32 U2 (uncommons) ...each 3.31% chance per booster
19 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
1 C1 (basic Mountain - uncommon, as prevalent as U3 cards) ...4.96% chance per booster
16 C4 ...each 19.83% chance per booster
9 C5 ...each 24.8% chance per booster
1 C11 (Desert) ...54.55% chance per booster
Antiquities (100 total cards) Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: March 1994
26 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
4 U2 (uncommons)...each 3.31% chance per booster
29 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
11 C1 (uncommons, just as prevalent as U3 cards) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
5 C2 ...each 9.92% chance per booster
25 C4 ...each 19.83% chance per booster
Legends (310 total cards) Breakdown: 11-3-1 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: June 1994
121 R1 ...each 0.83% chance per booster
107 U1 ...each 2.48% chance per booster
7 U2 ...each 4.96% chance per booster
29 C1 ...each 9.09% chance per booster
46 C2 ...each 18.18% chance per booster
The Dark (119 total cards) Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: August 1994
35 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
43 U2 (uncommons) ...each 3.31% chance per booster
1 C1 (Maze of Ith - uncommon, though 50% more prevalent than U2s) ...4.96% chance per booster
40 C3 ...each 14.88% chance per booster
Fallen Empires (102 total cards) Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: November 1994
36 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
5 U2 (uncommons) ...each 3.31% chance per booster
25 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
1 C1 (Delif's Cone - just as prevalent as U3s) ...4.96% chance per booster
20 C3 ...each 14.88% chance per booster
15 C4 ...each 19.83% chance per booster
Ice Age (383 total cards) Breakdown: 11-3-1 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: June 1995
121 R1 ...each 0.83% chance per booster
121 U1 ...each 2.48% chance per booster
121 C1 ...each 9.09% chance per booster
Chronicles (116 total cards) Breakdown: 9-3 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: June 1995
46 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
25 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
5 C1 (uncommons) ...each 7.44% chance per booster
7 C2 ...each 14.88% chance per booster
30 C3 ...each 22.31% chance per booster
3 C4 ...each 29.75% chance per booster
Homelands (140 total cards) Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: October 1995
43 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
26 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
21 C1 (uncommons, just as prevalent as U3s) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
50 C2 ...each 9.92% chance per booster
Alliances (144 total cards) Breakdown: 8-3-1 | Cards per sheet: 110 | Released: 10 June 1996
46 R2 ...each 0.91% chance per booster
3 R6 (uncommons) ...each 2.73% chance per booster
40 U2 (uncommons) ...each 5.45% chance per booster
5 U6 (commons) ...each 16.36% chance per booster
40 C2 ...each 14.54% chance per booster
10 C3 ...each 21.82% chance per booster
EDIT: While Gatherer seems to display rarities based on which sheet cards were printed on, and ignoring how often they were printed on it, Magiccards.info displays rarities based on how rare the cards were, regardless of how they were printed. Makes a lot more sense to me! (the only exception I've found is that it displays The Dark U2 cards as rares) It seems the rarity breakdown is as follows:
<= 1.65%: Rare
2.48% - 7.44%: Uncommon
9.09%+: Common
If you follow this baseline for categorizing rarity, U2 cards (3.31%) are uncommon, even those from Arabian Nights.
Basically they just made a labelling mistake early on and it's stuck. U2s in the very early sets weren't called rares even though they probably should have been. Almost everyone here in peasant cubing (I know there are some exceptions) consider all the U2s to be rares, even if gatherer calls some of them uncommon.
At the end of the day, how you use cards from the very early expansions is super arbitrary since R&D had a very poor grasp on rarity and power level at the time and none of those sets were designed for limited play. I can't think of many U2/rares from Arabian Nights, Antiquites, The Dark, Fallen Empires, or Homelands that would be broken in peasant so if you feel like using them I certainly wouldn't complain.
I updated my last post with rarity info from a few other early sets. (Legends, Ice Age, Chronicles) I'd like to compare these expansion sets to core sets from the same time period, but wasn't able to find rarity info on them yet.
Basically they just made a labelling mistake early on and it's stuck. U2s in the very early sets weren't called rares even though they probably should have been. Almost everyone here in peasant cubing (I know there are some exceptions) consider all the U2s to be rares, even if gatherer calls some of them uncommon.
At the end of the day, how you use cards from the very early expansions is super arbitrary since R&D had a very poor grasp on rarity and power level at the time and none of those sets were designed for limited play. I can't think of many U2/rares from Arabian Nights, Antiquites, The Dark, Fallen Empires, or Homelands that would be broken in peasant so if you feel like using them I certainly wouldn't complain.
If using cards based on their rarity, and basing rarity on how frequently the cards appear, is arbitrary, I don't mind being arbitrary. That said, I'm definitely going to be testing Old Man of the Sea.
I posted a list of all rarity shifts in Magic here, and am wondering what people think about MTGO downshifted cards. Do you consider them playable in peasant cubes? Do you use any? Are any good enough, anyway?
(rare to common)
(uncommon to common)
see my post about pauper rarities
'Rare' U2 Cards (according to magiccards.info):
As I haven't seen any other inconsistencies from magiccards.info, I'm fairly sure these are simply labeled incorrectly. They should be uncommons.
Downshifted in MTGO:
Never Downshifted:
'Uncommon' U2 Cards (according to magiccards.info):
I presume these are listed as rare on Gatherer because otherwise, Arabian Nights wouldn't have any 'rare' cards.
MTGO Downshifted:
Never Downshifted:
My Peasant Cube thread !!! (380 cards)
Draft my Peasant Cube on Cube Cobra !!!
i think if they were printed in an actual set (so the odds of this happening are very low), i'd pretty much cube most of the horsemanship guys. probably lu xun, maybe lu meng, zhang fei for sure, and sun ce would be a staple with utter ease. savannah lions obviously, and maybe thunder spirit since it wrecks a ton of fliers.
i'd only cube them if they were printed in an actual set, though.
Now, which cards would I actually consider inlcuding, were I to change my position:
Zombie Master - Black has a lot of zombies.
Xiahou Dun, the One-Eyed -
Though, I don't think I'd ever spend that much money on a single card.Thunder Spirit
Savannah Lions
Lu Xun, Scholar General
Roc of Kher Ridges - Red might be interested in having evasive beaters.
Lu Meng, Wu General - Four unblockable power is a hell of a clock.
Zhang Fei, Fierce Warrior
Granite Gargoyle
Nether Shadow - It's like a weird Reassembling Skeleton.
Sun Ce, Young Conquerer
Forked Lightning - We probably have enough of this effect already.
Telekinesis - TWO untap steps.
My Type 4 stack (Cube Tutor link)
I don't care for the horsemanship creatures since they weren't really designed to be played outside of their own set, but I can understand their appeal.
Xiaho Dun, the One-Eyed - ran it, cut it, too durdly but he's only out for now and might be coming back in with Theros
Lu Xun, Scholar General - ran it, turns out not being able to block was kinda a thing
Roc of Kher Ridge - ran it, really bad
Nether Shadow - been thinking about running it but worried about triggering it, any experiences with it in cube?
peasantcube.blogspot.com
I'd run quite a few off the list were I more lax on what counts...
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicySure but he is just a bad ground blocker as ground creatures tend to be larger whereas magpie blocks a decent chunk of things. I dunno, he just didn't end up working out around here. I don't really have a good explanation as to why magpie has always been a house and he was bad...maybe people just inherently dislike horsemanship for some reason? Could be.
peasantcube.blogspot.com
My Peasant Cube thread !!! (380 cards)
Draft my Peasant Cube on Cube Cobra !!!
Force of Will is the first one that springs to mind.
peasantcube.blogspot.com
I don't see any reason for that person to limit themself to only MTGO c/u, so why should we do the same? Although I suppose for me, this is a debate of whether or not I want two Elite Vanguards or not.
MTGO has none of the cards released prior to Mirage, except for those available through the Masters Editions. I'd sort them by their Gatherer rating if there was a convenient way to do so, but for now they're just alphabetical:
Having the limitation obviously decreases the power level but I wanted to have a cube having a limited feel that is designed with NWO in mind.
Remember that early expansion packs only had 8 cards (I think that's right, it was fewer than 15 for sure) and I don't think you were guaranteed to get a "rare/U2" in them.
Well, that's confusing. Regardless, Gatherer displays those U2 uncommons as rares and those U2 rares as uncommons. That's the conflict I was referring to. Old Man of the Sea is peasant cubeable if you look at magiccards.info, but not so if you look at gatherer.
Because what we now consider rares from these early expansions were all printed on the 'uncommon' sheet, you were not guaranteed one per booster. When these sets were printed, there was no 'rare', only different levels of uncommon... with each booster containing 6 commons and 2 uncommons. Doing some research, here's how those cards were differentiated:
The terms U2, U3, C5 and such represent which sheet the cards were printed on (uncommon or common) and how many appeared on the sheet. (2, 3, or 5, respectively) For all of these sets, both the common and uncommon sheets contained 121 cards each, likely organized into 11 columns and 11 rows.
Arabian Nights (78 total cards)
Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: December 1993
32 U2 (uncommons) ...each 3.31% chance per booster
19 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
1 C1 (basic Mountain - uncommon, as prevalent as U3 cards) ...4.96% chance per booster
16 C4 ...each 19.83% chance per booster
9 C5 ...each 24.8% chance per booster
1 C11 (Desert) ...54.55% chance per booster
Antiquities (100 total cards)
Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: March 1994
26 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
4 U2 (uncommons)...each 3.31% chance per booster
29 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
11 C1 (uncommons, just as prevalent as U3 cards) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
5 C2 ...each 9.92% chance per booster
25 C4 ...each 19.83% chance per booster
Legends (310 total cards)
Breakdown: 11-3-1 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: June 1994
121 R1 ...each 0.83% chance per booster
107 U1 ...each 2.48% chance per booster
7 U2 ...each 4.96% chance per booster
29 C1 ...each 9.09% chance per booster
46 C2 ...each 18.18% chance per booster
The Dark (119 total cards)
Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: August 1994
35 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
43 U2 (uncommons) ...each 3.31% chance per booster
1 C1 (Maze of Ith - uncommon, though 50% more prevalent than U2s) ...4.96% chance per booster
40 C3 ...each 14.88% chance per booster
Fallen Empires (102 total cards)
Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: November 1994
36 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
5 U2 (uncommons) ...each 3.31% chance per booster
25 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
1 C1 (Delif's Cone - just as prevalent as U3s) ...4.96% chance per booster
20 C3 ...each 14.88% chance per booster
15 C4 ...each 19.83% chance per booster
Ice Age (383 total cards)
Breakdown: 11-3-1 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: June 1995
121 R1 ...each 0.83% chance per booster
121 U1 ...each 2.48% chance per booster
121 C1 ...each 9.09% chance per booster
Chronicles (116 total cards)
Breakdown: 9-3 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: June 1995
46 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
25 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
5 C1 (uncommons) ...each 7.44% chance per booster
7 C2 ...each 14.88% chance per booster
30 C3 ...each 22.31% chance per booster
3 C4 ...each 29.75% chance per booster
Homelands (140 total cards)
Breakdown: 6-2 | Cards per sheet: 121 | Released: October 1995
43 U1 (rares) ...each 1.65% chance per booster
26 U3 (uncommons) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
21 C1 (uncommons, just as prevalent as U3s) ...each 4.96% chance per booster
50 C2 ...each 9.92% chance per booster
Alliances (144 total cards)
Breakdown: 8-3-1 | Cards per sheet: 110 | Released: 10 June 1996
46 R2 ...each 0.91% chance per booster
3 R6 (uncommons) ...each 2.73% chance per booster
40 U2 (uncommons) ...each 5.45% chance per booster
5 U6 (commons) ...each 16.36% chance per booster
40 C2 ...each 14.54% chance per booster
10 C3 ...each 21.82% chance per booster
<= 1.65%: Rare
2.48% - 7.44%: Uncommon
9.09%+: Common
If you follow this baseline for categorizing rarity, U2 cards (3.31%) are uncommon, even those from Arabian Nights.
Notes:
Triskelion was apparently uncommon in the foreign-only Renaissance edition
Upcoming Vintage Masters Changes:
Goblin Goon
At the end of the day, how you use cards from the very early expansions is super arbitrary since R&D had a very poor grasp on rarity and power level at the time and none of those sets were designed for limited play. I can't think of many U2/rares from Arabian Nights, Antiquites, The Dark, Fallen Empires, or Homelands that would be broken in peasant so if you feel like using them I certainly wouldn't complain.
If using cards based on their rarity, and basing rarity on how frequently the cards appear, is arbitrary, I don't mind being arbitrary. That said, I'm definitely going to be testing Old Man of the Sea.