I'm more inclined to agree with Apok23 then Pint of Lager, our manabase is shaky at best - Experiment One is our best one drop (who not only grows with EVERYTHING it can also dodge sweepers) while Soldier of the Pantheon really only shines against mirror (which has pretty much been hated out of the meta).
@h4rr0d, I never expected to see ME since B/x kinda ruins its day - if you meta requires it cutting two B.P for Needle is a fine call.
- - - - - - - - -
Anyhows I went 3-1 the other day during Standard Daily Event 6118335
Spells: 16
4 Selesnya Charm
4 Advent of the Wurm
3 Unflinching Courage
2 Gods Willing
2 Call of the Conclave
1 Bow of Nylea
Plainswalkers: 2
2 Ajani, Caller of the Pride
Sideboard:
4 Glare of Heresy
3 Celestial Flare
2 Pithing Needle
2 Sundering Growth
2 Time to Feed
2 Rootborn Defence
Results:
Match 1: Red/Black land destruction (Win 2-0)
I could get a threat out before he detroyed my mana base each game.
A smiter or lion with courage could never be held in check by him.
Match 2: G/r devotion (Win 2-1)
A very scary deck if it gets the devotion out quick. Game 3 was won by using 2 charms and 2 Celestial Flares to remove 2 nylea and 2 polukranos. I had the answers when they were needed.
Match 3: Esper Control (Win 2-1)
Game 1: Couldn't get enough damage down before he played a Blood Baron and stabilized.
Game 2: Curved nicely to finish with Ajani using a -3. Felt like a goldfish almost.
Game 3: He stalled at 3 mana but I held back a couple of creatures in case of the board wipe. eventually made a lion monstrous which removed his chances of recovery.
I would like to point out at this point I really went downhill mentally after game 3. Only 3 people had gone 3-0 at that point and this was my first ever tournament outside FNM. I learnt there is a very human side of the game and for me that meant nerves and misplays beyond count after game 3.
Match 4: Golgari agro (Loss 0-2)
Game 1: Kept a stupid opening hand with Ajani, 2 Gods Willing and an Advent.
Sure enough a thoughtsieze on the advent removed any options for me.
Game 2: Lotleth Troll is a very tough card to deal with. It ran rampant and I had to answers. Advice here is apreciated.
Match 5: We drew the match and both made the top 8. Never saw his deck actually....
Top 8: G/r devotion (Loss 1-2)
Game 1: his devotion went unchecked and suddenly by turn 4 there is a garruk, polucranos and xenagos on the other side. Loss
Game 2: He mulled to 4 and I blew him away.
Game 3: The human aspect I mentioned came into play. Forgetting to play a land in my hand. missing a golden oportunity to charm a Polucranos. Forget to flash a Boon satyr to save a voice token. This caused him to stabilize and start to combo out his big creatures. I will not foget this match for a long time.
I hope this is usefull to you all. Upon watching MDU's matches I can see how great skylasher is and will be looking at how to include it.
Thoughts on my deck:
BtE seems particularly good but I will need to see how often I don't get a chance to play it (green creature)
Mistcutter will be going in the SB.
1 copy of Rogue's Passage looks tempting. Will test it out when I can.
Thoughts on my deck:
BtE seems particularly good but I will need to see how often I don't get a chance to play it (green creature)
Mistcutter will be going in the SB.
1 copy of Rogue's Passage looks tempting. Will test it out when I can.
I'm yet to face a situation where BtE would grant me a win. Save voice token, most of our heavy hitters aren't white and let's face it, double striking flying wurm supported by some kind of boost (be it counters, charm or an aura) has enough evasion and enough power to swing for the kill.
Same goes for Rogue's passage. Mutavault has plenty of utility (in both games where I drew it, it was huge help) and as stated before, our manabase is shaky at best as it is and 2 colorless lands would be stretching it too far. I'm contradicting my past self here, but as I get more games with the deck under my belt, I can clearly see the mana is nowhere as stable as we'd like it to be. We desperately need either avacyn's pilgrim or birds of paradise. Elvish mystic doesn't cut it and caryathid is more of a midrange/ramp thing.
Mistcutter is a sideboard card for the most part, in aggro/midrange matchups, it's not cost efficient enough. I could see it as a 1of in main deck, because being able to sink 6+ mana in it in those drawn out games where you keep drawing land after land could sway a stalemate on board in our favor.
I woudn't consider lotleth troll to be an issue unless opponent has some kind of drawing engine (underworld connections?). Once it grows beyond what we can block efficiently (5+ power), it's in selesnya charm range and honestly, spending charm to blow up creature that cost opponent 4+ cards, I'll take that trade any day of the week.
What cards arent really good against aggro? Im wanting to srop the hydra as it seems kinda meh against it compared to Trostani (whom I would board in)
Im mainly looking for ways to evaluate what to cut and when, general thinking process.
In most matches, the game will clearly have an aggressor and a defender. The defender usually takes position of control deck. The sideboarding then revolves around this.
Vs aggro like white weenies, we aren't fast enough to race them (ie. be the aggressor), which means that we are taking the position of control deck in that matchup. At the same time, our answers have to be fast enough to matter.
Example of bad card in aggro matchup is boon satyr. 4/2 for 3 is great, but too aggressive if you are to be the defender.
They can dispatch it easily with couple of tokens or a Soldier of the Panthenon, so it isn't good attacker and it isn't good blocker either, a 1 for 1 at best.
The bestow option for 5 would is great when we want to be control, but it's just too expensive with our manabase versus aggro. You don't want to be sitting with 5 open mana versus board full of enemy creatures (and besides, that just screams I got satyr in my hand)
Okay. I dont play Standard, but when you have the Gardens and Voices (Yay Pod), I thought I was close enough to try.
So something like:
-3 Boon Satyr
+1 Trostani
+2 Last Breath (the 4 life sucks, but nuking a solider which stops everything but hydra seems pretty good) i have glare.....derp.
How is the R/G Ramp(Monsters) match-up? Im planning on playing in a local tourney and considering my meta, cost is not a factor for people
Okay. I dont play Standard, but when you have the Gardens and Voices (Yay Pod), I thought I was close enough to try.
So something like:
-3 Boon Satyr
+1 Trostani
+2 Last Breath (the 4 life sucks, but nuking a solider which stops everything but hydra seems pretty good) i have glare.....derp.
How is the R/G Ramp(Monsters) match-up? Im planning on playing in a local tourney and considering my meta, cost is not a factor for people
Ajani, Caller of the Pride is your friend in this MU - barring God Hands I'll say the MU is good here are some examples:
Yeah, you race them and pray they don't get dragon out if you got worse than average hand. Dragon and stalemate on ground is game over.
I run a plummet in the SB just to deal with dragon. Its my flex slot, but if I the dragon angers me enough, it'll be bumped up more. Plummet also hits Desecration Demon as an added bonus if I bring it in.
I don't have any room in my sb for plummet and there's nothing I really want to take out for it just to deal with that one card. I'll probably just have to rely on skylasher to deal with him. Skylasher plus the bow or a charm should do it although it's not very efficient. At worst it's a fog for a turn allowing us to get another swing in before he starts doing damage. I've considered putting celestial flare back in the sb so that might be another option.
I really wish arbor colossus was 3GG but sadly this is not the case.
These are some of the flying threats I would expect to see on a more regular basis, especially those last two. You could try to use a fight of some sort, or, just kill it outright.
This is the decklist I've been running for a while now. So far it's been pretty solid vs. Midrange and Control. Vs. other aggro (RDW/Master), it can be somewhat touch and go, though it's still fairly solid.
The key against the decks that pack a lot of removal is to hold back excess threats. The magic number from other discussions Ive had with people and a few who won games days was 2. Holding up mana is ofc a wise idea and We all obviously should know that Advent'ing EOT is the most ideal play, especially post wrath.
There is a reason why I love Boon Satyr so much more in this deck as it sits at the 3 and 5 slot for EOT flash shenanigans.
2-for-1 can occur, but in the end, everything dies to removal. There are some recourses for this. Obviously Boon Satyr does what he does best. Voice of Resurgence also has its own built in punishments. If Fleecemane Lion makes it to monstrous, even better. Against removal heavy (especially wipe), it's important to not overextend.
While there is a lot more enchantment hate available, Blue still doesn't get the removal love as much as the counterspells (such as Swan Song), but with everyone still able to splash into 2 or 3 colors, it will be something to pay attention to. I've considered running Ranger's Guile SB to deal with it, but overall I haven't found it too necessary.
The one really great thing about decks like this, is that if people stick to the top top tier decks (my meta to a T.), then you can get wins via your opponent not knowing what to expect completely.
I'll play my list this week and then slink back and wait, maybe play a different deck in the same sleeves next week....
Went undefeated at Gameday with GW Aggro, but it was a smallish event (< 20 players).
Ajani, Caller of the Pride was a champ. I can post my list later today if anyone is interested.
I've been loving Ajani. Give X1 that extra counter to allow regen, check. Put a counter on 3/3's to push them over Anger of the Gods, check. Push Loxodon Smiter out of Mizzium Mortars Range? Check.
Also, the one game I had a Boon Satyr enchanted with 2x Ethereal Armor, and -3 Ajani... Fun times.
After playing the aggro variant for the past couple of weeks...I think this deck is very good, but I think main decking Trostani and Unflinching Courage feels right...
I felt like each game that those hit they allowed be to really build that board state that took over, whereas when they were in my sideboard i felt hamstringed...
Personally I wouldn't run Courage main, but that is because my meta is full of control and midrange packing lots of removal. I would much rather have Rootborn Defenses or Gods Willing (though I am not sure which I like more). With the advent of Master Of Babes, that might change.
So I think it is a meta call. They are good when they good; not so much when there is black-based eemoval flying around.
Each game at gameday that I played unflinching courage I won, rather easily too. But I also only played one control deck and I never even saw it that game. Against rdw I played a lion turn 2, followed by an unflinching courage and then another unflinching courage turn 4. Needless to say I didn't have to play anything else that game. Against Wr I managed an unflinching courage and a boon on a centaur token with trostani selesnya's voice out and got my life total to 57 before I won. This deck can be a life gaining machine if you get the right plays.
I have no plans to take out unflinching courage right now, but if the meta shifted to being control heavy then I would have no problem putting it in the sb.
@h4rr0d, I never expected to see ME since B/x kinda ruins its day - if you meta requires it cutting two B.P for Needle is a fine call.
- - - - - - - - -
Anyhows I went 3-1 the other day during Standard Daily Event 6118335
Running:
09x Forest
06x Plains
04x Temple Garden
04x Selesnya Guildgate
01x Mutavault
Creatures 24
04x Experiment One
04x Fleecemane Lion
04x Voice of Resurgence
03x Skylasher
04x Loxodon Smiter
03x Boon Satyr
02x Trostani Selesnya's Voice
04x Advent of the Wurm
03x Selesnya Charm
03x Call of the Conclave
Planeswalkers 02
02x Ajani, Caller of the Pride
01x Ajani, Caller of the Pride
01x Boon Satyr
02x Pacifism
02x Banisher Priest
02x Rachet Bomb
03x Unflinching Courage
04x Mistcutter Hydra
Here are the replays:
G1: MonoBlack Devotion
G2: Wr Weenies
G3: MonoBlack Devotion
G4: MonoBlue Devotion
No SBP this time round since I'll be redoing the main deck slightly.
Enjoy Standard, Modern and Music (also some Pauper, Momir, Gaming, Animations and Legacy)? Then visit my channel:Here
I have been using this thread as a great resource in the past couple of months but now I feel like I can contribute with my findings at least.
This is the deck I ran for game day. Went 3-1-1 which got my into top 8.
(I'm sorry I don't know the formatting required to post this as a table, help is appreciated.)
Lands: 24
4 Temple Garden
4 Selesnya Guildgate
8 Forest
8 Plains
Creatures: 18
4 Voice of Resurgence
4 Fleecemain Lion
4 Loxodon Smiter
3 Boon Satyr
3 Fiendslayer Paladin
Spells: 16
4 Selesnya Charm
4 Advent of the Wurm
3 Unflinching Courage
2 Gods Willing
2 Call of the Conclave
1 Bow of Nylea
Plainswalkers: 2
2 Ajani, Caller of the Pride
Sideboard:
4 Glare of Heresy
3 Celestial Flare
2 Pithing Needle
2 Sundering Growth
2 Time to Feed
2 Rootborn Defence
Results:
Match 1: Red/Black land destruction (Win 2-0)
I could get a threat out before he detroyed my mana base each game.
A smiter or lion with courage could never be held in check by him.
Match 2: G/r devotion (Win 2-1)
A very scary deck if it gets the devotion out quick. Game 3 was won by using 2 charms and 2 Celestial Flares to remove 2 nylea and 2 polukranos. I had the answers when they were needed.
Match 3: Esper Control (Win 2-1)
Game 1: Couldn't get enough damage down before he played a Blood Baron and stabilized.
Game 2: Curved nicely to finish with Ajani using a -3. Felt like a goldfish almost.
Game 3: He stalled at 3 mana but I held back a couple of creatures in case of the board wipe. eventually made a lion monstrous which removed his chances of recovery.
I would like to point out at this point I really went downhill mentally after game 3. Only 3 people had gone 3-0 at that point and this was my first ever tournament outside FNM. I learnt there is a very human side of the game and for me that meant nerves and misplays beyond count after game 3.
Match 4: Golgari agro (Loss 0-2)
Game 1: Kept a stupid opening hand with Ajani, 2 Gods Willing and an Advent.
Sure enough a thoughtsieze on the advent removed any options for me.
Game 2: Lotleth Troll is a very tough card to deal with. It ran rampant and I had to answers. Advice here is apreciated.
Match 5: We drew the match and both made the top 8. Never saw his deck actually....
Top 8: G/r devotion (Loss 1-2)
Game 1: his devotion went unchecked and suddenly by turn 4 there is a garruk, polucranos and xenagos on the other side. Loss
Game 2: He mulled to 4 and I blew him away.
Game 3: The human aspect I mentioned came into play. Forgetting to play a land in my hand. missing a golden oportunity to charm a Polucranos. Forget to flash a Boon satyr to save a voice token. This caused him to stabilize and start to combo out his big creatures. I will not foget this match for a long time.
I hope this is usefull to you all. Upon watching MDU's matches I can see how great skylasher is and will be looking at how to include it.
Thoughts on my deck:
BtE seems particularly good but I will need to see how often I don't get a chance to play it (green creature)
Mistcutter will be going in the SB.
1 copy of Rogue's Passage looks tempting. Will test it out when I can.
I'm yet to face a situation where BtE would grant me a win. Save voice token, most of our heavy hitters aren't white and let's face it, double striking flying wurm supported by some kind of boost (be it counters, charm or an aura) has enough evasion and enough power to swing for the kill.
Same goes for Rogue's passage. Mutavault has plenty of utility (in both games where I drew it, it was huge help) and as stated before, our manabase is shaky at best as it is and 2 colorless lands would be stretching it too far. I'm contradicting my past self here, but as I get more games with the deck under my belt, I can clearly see the mana is nowhere as stable as we'd like it to be. We desperately need either avacyn's pilgrim or birds of paradise. Elvish mystic doesn't cut it and caryathid is more of a midrange/ramp thing.
Mistcutter is a sideboard card for the most part, in aggro/midrange matchups, it's not cost efficient enough. I could see it as a 1of in main deck, because being able to sink 6+ mana in it in those drawn out games where you keep drawing land after land could sway a stalemate on board in our favor.
I woudn't consider lotleth troll to be an issue unless opponent has some kind of drawing engine (underworld connections?). Once it grows beyond what we can block efficiently (5+ power), it's in selesnya charm range and honestly, spending charm to blow up creature that cost opponent 4+ cards, I'll take that trade any day of the week.
Im mainly looking for ways to evaluate what to cut and when, general thinking process.
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyIn most matches, the game will clearly have an aggressor and a defender. The defender usually takes position of control deck. The sideboarding then revolves around this.
Vs aggro like white weenies, we aren't fast enough to race them (ie. be the aggressor), which means that we are taking the position of control deck in that matchup. At the same time, our answers have to be fast enough to matter.
Example of bad card in aggro matchup is boon satyr. 4/2 for 3 is great, but too aggressive if you are to be the defender.
They can dispatch it easily with couple of tokens or a Soldier of the Panthenon, so it isn't good attacker and it isn't good blocker either, a 1 for 1 at best.
The bestow option for 5 would is great when we want to be control, but it's just too expensive with our manabase versus aggro. You don't want to be sitting with 5 open mana versus board full of enemy creatures (and besides, that just screams I got satyr in my hand)
So something like:
-3 Boon Satyr
+1 Trostani
+2
Last Breath (the 4 life sucks, but nuking a solider which stops everything but hydra seems pretty good)i have glare.....derp.How is the R/G Ramp(Monsters) match-up? Im planning on playing in a local tourney and considering my meta, cost is not a factor for people
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyAjani, Caller of the Pride is your friend in this MU - barring God Hands I'll say the MU is good here are some examples:
RG Ramp
RG Ramp
RG Ramp
Enjoy Standard, Modern and Music (also some Pauper, Momir, Gaming, Animations and Legacy)? Then visit my channel:Here
It also looks like the key card in that match-up is Selesnya Charm as it can remove their threats and/or open a path for the alpha-strike.
Then again, this is only after watching the first two games on the first link.
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyYeah, you race them and pray they don't get dragon out if you got worse than average hand. Dragon and stalemate on ground is game over.
I run a plummet in the SB just to deal with dragon. Its my flex slot, but if I the dragon angers me enough, it'll be bumped up more. Plummet also hits Desecration Demon as an added bonus if I bring it in.
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyI really wish arbor colossus was 3GG but sadly this is not the case.
It's not just Stormbreath Dragon that Plummet hits...
Angel of Serenity
Archangel of Thune
Aurelia, the Warleader
Desecration Demon
Nightveil Specter
These are some of the flying threats I would expect to see on a more regular basis, especially those last two. You could try to use a fight of some sort, or, just kill it outright.
Avatar and Sig by Xen's Inkfox Aesthetics
GWLambs and LionsWG
GMono-Green BeatsG
Testing: BGRock VariantGB
GWBJanky JunkGWB
UWGMimic BantrolUWG
BWApostleypse NowBW
4x Experiment One
3x Soldier of the Pantheon
4x Fleecemane Lion
4x Voice of Resurgence
4x Boon Satyr
4x Loxodon Smiter
Spells (14)
3x Ethereal Armor
3x Selesnya Charm
2x Ajani, Caller of the Pride
3x Unflinching Courage
3x Advent of the Wurm
8x Forest
8x Plains
3x Selesnya Guildgate
4x Temple Garden
2x Gods Willing
2x Pithing Needle
3x Celestial Flare
2x Glare of Heresy
2x Plummet
2x Sundering Growth
2x Archangel of Thune
This is the decklist I've been running for a while now. So far it's been pretty solid vs. Midrange and Control. Vs. other aggro (RDW/Master), it can be somewhat touch and go, though it's still fairly solid.
Avatar and Sig by Xen's Inkfox Aesthetics
GWLambs and LionsWG
GMono-Green BeatsG
Testing: BGRock VariantGB
GWBJanky JunkGWB
UWGMimic BantrolUWG
BWApostleypse NowBW
It seems your deck screams two for one against an abundance of removals the format have now, but I'm glad it's doing good for you.
There is a reason why I love Boon Satyr so much more in this deck as it sits at the 3 and 5 slot for EOT flash shenanigans.
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyWhile there is a lot more enchantment hate available, Blue still doesn't get the removal love as much as the counterspells (such as Swan Song), but with everyone still able to splash into 2 or 3 colors, it will be something to pay attention to. I've considered running Ranger's Guile SB to deal with it, but overall I haven't found it too necessary.
Avatar and Sig by Xen's Inkfox Aesthetics
GWLambs and LionsWG
GMono-Green BeatsG
Testing: BGRock VariantGB
GWBJanky JunkGWB
UWGMimic BantrolUWG
BWApostleypse NowBW
Ajani, Caller of the Pride was a champ. I can post my list later today if anyone is interested.
Updated 11/01/13
-->Standard:
:symwg::symwg::symwg: Aggressive Midrange
:symu::symu::symu: Devotion
-->Modern:
:symwg::symrg::symug: Kiki-Jiki Pod
:0mana::symur::0mana: Affinity
Good stuff - Post your list anytime.
I'm glad not everybody has given up on GW, I should have my new list ready for tomorrow - I'm looking forward to giving it a test run.
Enjoy Standard, Modern and Music (also some Pauper, Momir, Gaming, Animations and Legacy)? Then visit my channel:Here
I'll play my list this week and then slink back and wait, maybe play a different deck in the same sleeves next week....
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyI've been loving Ajani. Give X1 that extra counter to allow regen, check. Put a counter on 3/3's to push them over Anger of the Gods, check. Push Loxodon Smiter out of Mizzium Mortars Range? Check.
Also, the one game I had a Boon Satyr enchanted with 2x Ethereal Armor, and -3 Ajani... Fun times.
Avatar and Sig by Xen's Inkfox Aesthetics
GWLambs and LionsWG
GMono-Green BeatsG
Testing: BGRock VariantGB
GWBJanky JunkGWB
UWGMimic BantrolUWG
BWApostleypse NowBW
I felt like each game that those hit they allowed be to really build that board state that took over, whereas when they were in my sideboard i felt hamstringed...
So I think it is a meta call. They are good when they good; not so much when there is black-based eemoval flying around.
I have no plans to take out unflinching courage right now, but if the meta shifted to being control heavy then I would have no problem putting it in the sb.
Modern:
Twinning End
Commander:
Mayael the Anema