@iRebel, DCIII, and Void: What are your thoughts on Meg at this point, and what do you think of his play right now compared to Futurama?
I had a lean Town read on him until your post but now you have me questioning that. My only experience playing with him is Futurama and I think he's playing differently this game, but that's to be expected given his circumstances in that game and the overlapping player pool.
I liked the way he approached the BE case initially and the way he engaged the Rez case. I didn't remember his threat to Rhand, so that's the thing that's most concerning to me now as that's a very similar parallel. From your experience with him do you think that's something he'd do as either alignment or just as scum? That question goes to anyone else who has experience playing with Meg as well.
OK, still reading through the B_E mess. First thoughts though are B_E is likely the town of his neighborhood, and one of his two buddies are scum (Has the other two buddies claimed yet? Only up to around his claim as of now.)
Also, can I get a recap on the current wagons as to speed up where to looking ATM?
@Mod Can I get a Vote count please
And Unvote in case my vote is still on whoever the person I replaced has it on.
@Proph: I was townreading Meg in Futurama pretty much the entire game up until the day we lynched Shockwave, where Meg had to be scum via POE. His play in this game is definitely different, but he hasn't done or said anything that triggers my scumdar. He has seemed relatively townie to me so far.
I didn't read much into the whole lynching BE if he double posted thing because BE has been somewhat annoying, and Megs reaction is what I would have expected.
@ Tanarin: Rez has claimed to be in the neighbourhood as well. We do not know the third yet.
Speaking of Rez. Hey Rez. Answer my question.
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EDH UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
I don't have any hard numbers on this, but I'm targeted more often than a black guy driving a beat-up sedan with a broken tail-light and no license plate, and Cy's well aware of that.
rezombied, please claim. If the mod counts the quote mangle you're at L-1.
You were voting B_E. You mentioned the possibility that your scumread was at L-1. You didn't unvote.
If "mods usually don't count quote mangles," why would you even mention it? If that was a possibility in your mind you should have unvoted to be 100% sure. you do know WHY we don't let people sit at L-1 before we're ready to end the day, right?
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Oh, let me address your meta point while I'm here.
I've done the "ultimatum" thing a few times. In Smalltown, I did it because I noticed a pretty strong meta tell from Sir Karn and I wanted to test him. To summarize: I picked up that in his scum games to date he over-relied on calling OMGUS on votes on him, where in his town games he did not do so. He was throwing OMGUS around a lot in that game, so I threw out an ultimatum: If he ever used OMGUS again I would get him lynched. The goal was to see if I could force him out of the OMGUS arguments. I ended up being wrong, but that was the reason behind it.
In Futurama I threw out a similar ultimatum because it was a "town meg" thing to do. I have a habit of asking replacements for T/S lists if they don't provide them on their own (:hi: Tanarin! Do this please.), and I thought that combining the two would feel like my town play.
Here though I had two goals with doing it. The first was to see who is paying attention. I intentionally chose similar language to Futurama (cf. Smalltown, where I did it in a much more entertaining manner). The fact that you noticed that is a + for you, Proph. Also, think about it: The issue here has very little gameplay importance. Double posting? Who cares. It's annoying but definitely not an exclusively scum trait.
What the post diarrhea does signify, however, is nervousness, and I wanted to feel that out. I offered a silly ultimatum. Stop double posting or I get you lynched. Let's see what his reactions were:
Double posting (and sometime triple posting) is allowed in the sub-forum at all time. You have nothing to worry about.
Except go Meggiddo day killing/lynching me which she/he has threatened to do multiple times if I double-post.
My expectation when I challenge somebody on something silly like their post rate is that they will either a) tell me I am an idiot; or b) ignore me.
Instead we see B_E asking how/why I will do it. Look at that and then look at the last post: He's got the fear of a day kill in him... but why? I never mentioned one.
Apologizing to me/explaining his double post is the other tip-off I have. This reminds me of a game from mafiascum a while back that I happened to read where somebody told another player to change their avatar... and they did change it. It's self-consciousness and a desire to avoid ruffling feathers. I see this as very similar: B_E wants to avoid angering me enough that he's apologizing and explaining a double post. Yes, I said that I would get him lynched if he did it. No, that's not a reasonable thing to believe for a townie.
I see this as a nervous scum mindset. So yes, I do actually want to lynch BE, but not because he double posted.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
OK, still reading through the B_E mess. First thoughts though are B_E is likely the town of his neighborhood, and one of his two buddies are scum (Has the other two buddies claimed yet? Only up to around his claim as of now.)
Also, can I get a recap on the current wagons as to speed up where to looking ATM?
@Mod Can I get a Vote count please
And Unvote in case my vote is still on whoever the person I replaced has it on.
There are significant wagons on myself and rezombied.
Sorry guys, I had my appendix removed yesterday morning and have been resting and pretty much out of it for the past two days. My company is closed for the holiday tomorrow, so I will try to catch up and post at some point.
@Arian - If I have not posted again by this time tomorrow, replace me.
OK, so I have done my first skim in order to sort out how I feel about the neighborhood and I think I can post a partial T/S list for Meggido
Current thoughts are in line with Proph when it comes to BE in that he is most likely just a VI town. This is mainly due to the fact that I feel that if he was really scum/a cult (As in the mafia term,) member, he would not be too open about it.
I am pretty confident that rezombied is not scum. First off, his flavor seems to match up with what BE has offered (A newbish member is in this group.) I think the fact that the third person has not at this point claimed they are the new member leads me to believe that said third person MAY be the scum.
So far that leaves me with this as my town column (Intentionally leaving myself out here):
Rezombied
Burning_Earth
So now let's look at the Rezombied Wagon and see why people are voting for him (Thanks Mod for the post numbers, makes finding votes a bit easier.) Remember, I am just looking at the post itself for the most part and trying to gleen what I can from it.
First vote was the person I replaced and an obv RVS vote.
Second was DCIII. His reasoning is legit and I have no problem with it, likely comes from town, but could easily be scum hitting low hanging fruit. Mainly null.
Third vote on is Proph. While I do agree with him on B_E being a VI, I don't feel too comfortable with his line of questioning as to DJ and Meggido asking for more info on a claim. On top of that, the info they were asking was not of any real consequence, but rather asking about the function of the role (How do you talk, when do you talk, do you know who you are talking to?) There is literally no reason as to even accuse them of fishing for info. Could Proph be the third member of the neighborhood? His reaction says possibly. Leaning scum pending a third member of the group claiming.
Next vote is iGem. Now my view of him may be tainted due to my current views on Proph, but I do like his response to Proph's line of questioning. Though having not delved further into why the questions were asked, I can not tell if it was warranted or not. [Note to Self: Make sure to take a look at this] As for the vote itself though, it is just a straight barn of DCIII. Mainly Null though leaning slight town.
Last vote down is iRebel. I am not quite following where he is coming from with his vote. While I understand the concept of what he is saying (rezombied not being productive,) I don't think a naked vote is necessarily an attempt to try and look productive. Naked votes, especially early on can be a decent gauge as to what is going on. Mainly Null
So with that the T/S list looks like this
Rezombied
Burning Earth
iGem
iRebel/DCIII
Proph
I'll take a look at the B_E wagon hopefully tomorrow, along with hopefully taking a deeper read into Proph's questioning of iGem.
Alright, I feel better about Meg again after that last post.
I can also finally reference why I think BE is Town. Look at his play in Walking Dead. He has the same self-conscious posting and the same periods of spamming the thread. His style here seems to be almost identical to in that game and I don't see him as likely able to fake that.
@Tanarin - Have you read through the full case on Rezombied or just the wagon votes?
Alright, I feel better about Meg again after that last post.
I can also finally reference why I think BE is Town. Look at his play in Walking Dead. He has the same self-conscious posting and the same periods of spamming the thread. His style here seems to be almost identical to in that game and I don't see him as likely able to fake that.
@Tanarin - Have you read through the full case on Rezombied or just the wagon votes?
So far, mainly the wagon votes. If there is a better case outside of what you said in your initial vote (Which is pretty much ALL I have seen for reasoning,) feel free to point me to it. As of now, I just don't believe the two claimed neighbors are the scum and the third unclaimed member is the actual scum.
So far, mainly the wagon votes. If there is a better case outside of what you said in your initial vote (Which is pretty much ALL I have seen for reasoning,) feel free to point me to it. As of now, I just don't believe the two claimed neighbors are the scum and the third unclaimed member is the actual scum.
Between #190 and #249, the discussion between Rez and myself.
So far, mainly the wagon votes. If there is a better case outside of what you said in your initial vote (Which is pretty much ALL I have seen for reasoning,) feel free to point me to it. As of now, I just don't believe the two claimed neighbors are the scum and the third unclaimed member is the actual scum.
Between #190 and #249, the discussion between Rez and myself.
OK, I'll take a look at it tomorrow at some point.
Then, you spend your claim post saying that you think BE is scum because of stuff he posted in your neighbor QT, but then you switch your vote to Proph. I think that you're trying to cover for the inconsistency of your stance on Proph now without backing down from your vote on BE.
Thought BE was scum, now I think he might be scum but that Proph is scum, reads can change.
You're confirmation biasing, go reread your case with the knowledge that I am in a neighborhood with b_e and then come back, unvote, and continue playing the game.
I don't like how you call out DC for confirmation bias, then turn around and tell him to re-read with a confirmation bias in mind.
I confirmed with the mod the other day that there are three neighbors including myself, all of whom have posted in the thread at least once.
I'm getting mixed messages from you and B_E.
I recall B_E stating earlier that you were using your MTGS usernames to communicate in thread, so why would you have to confirm with mod about this?
I don't like his first post (he calls for pressure but doesn't vote, beaten to death) and he does no analysis in that first post at all; just summarizes the events in a distant manner. ("Holy, what's happened here?")
Wait, so B_E's role says Neighbour, but flavour says Cult?
And he has a leader, but no information about him, or the other members of the group?
If you can communicate with them, what is stopping you from asking who each person is?
How do you even communicate without knowing who's who? Is it not obvious?
Also, neighbours are not confirmed town, just saying.
This makes me want to lynch him even more. He's trying to flavorgame/fearmonger the possibilty of a cult and it feels like he's tacking on that last sentence for a mislynch: "Neighbors are not confirmed town"
I was trying to clarify about the role. Usually flavor would not say something misleading like saying that they're part of a cult.
The last sentence was a reminder for those who were treating him as confirmed town after his claim.
There was some stuff that B_E posted in our qt that, in addition to things in the thread made me believe he was scum. That's why I said the case against me made sense, because I wasn't able to say "hey, b_e and I are neighbors and I think he might be scum because of some **** he said in our QT"
Why did you try and play it off your vote as not reading the thread if you actually thought he was scum?
@Megiddo
I agree with your assessment of B_E's verbal diarrhea as a sign of possible scum nervousness. However, I think rezombied is potentially scum, and I find it hard to believe that there would be 2/3 scum members in the neighbor group.
Which of the two (B_E / Rezombied) do you think is more likely to be scum and why?
Not Voting -- Dkingsland (115), Deathjoey (0), Tanarin (302)
With 12 players alive, it is 7 votes for a lynch.
V/LA Acknowledged@Dkings. I'll give you a few days before hunting for a replacement (partially because I feel bad and partially because I don't have another replacement handy :teach:)
Alright, I feel better about Meg again after that last post.
I can also finally reference why I think BE is Town. Look at his play in Walking Dead. He has the same self-conscious posting and the same periods of spamming the thread. His style here seems to be almost identical to in that game and I don't see him as likely able to fake that.
@Tanarin - Have you read through the full case on Rezombied or just the wagon votes?
So far, mainly the wagon votes. If there is a better case outside of what you said in your initial vote (Which is pretty much ALL I have seen for reasoning,) feel free to point me to it. As of now, I just don't believe the two claimed neighbors are the scum and the third unclaimed member is the actual scum.
I had an argument with Rez after his vote of proph. Read that too.
Ok, getting serious, I think that if anything my posting rate and paranoia is to do with me being nervous town; I want desperately to be a good player and am trying overheard.
but you stopped double posting when I told you to and apologized twice when you double posted (despite in one case only thinking that you had double posted).
kowtowing is not town behavior.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
I was kind of scared tbh. I didn't want to be the mislynch for something stupid like double-posting, so I tried not to do it. If you were joking, well no harm done, and if you were serious then I avoided a mislynch.
Ok, getting serious, I think that if anything my posting rate and paranoia is to do with me being nervous town; I want desperately to be a good player and am trying overheard.
One more thing.
Let me (once again) recall your initial reaction to my proclamation that I would get you lynched:
@ Meggiddo so if I double-post you are going to lynch me how exactly? Again, are you my boss now?
I'm reading a mindset mismatch. Exhibit A has you worried that I would get you lynched. Exhibit B is you saying that you want to be a good player.
A and B are clearly contradictory. If you were responding to my post with the newb town mindset of "I want to get better," I would expect you to ask me why I want you to stop double posting; focusing on the cause and not the effect, as you did.
EWP: For anybody following along BE just proved my point. Please lynch him now.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
Ok, getting serious, I think that if anything my posting rate and paranoia is to do with me being nervous town; I want desperately to be a good player and am trying overheard.
One more thing.
Let me (once again) recall your initial reaction to my proclamation that I would get you lynched:
@ Meggiddo so if I double-post you are going to lynch me how exactly? Again, are you my boss now?
I'm reading a mindset mismatch. Exhibit A has you worried that I would get you lynched. Exhibit B is you saying that you want to be a good player.
A and B are clearly contradictory. If you were responding to my post with the newb town mindset of "I want to get better," I would expect you to ask me why I want you to stop double posting; focusing on the cause and not the effect, as you did.
EWP: For anybody following along BE just proved my point. Please lynch him now.
A: you already explained why you would lynch me If I double posted, because I was nervously spamming the thread in your opinion.
B: you kept relentlessly pushing that you would get me lynched if I double-posted, at first I thought it was a joke, then I thought it might not be so I started trying not to double-post
so rather than ask me what a better posting rate would be, why I want to you stop double posting, or even challenge me on it (like, for instance, the part where I tell you that all of your posts are garbage), you... well, scroll up. I laid out your responses.
I also would like you to show me where I "relentlessly" pushed that I would get you lynched. I said that exactly once and we had a very simple exchange about it.
I'm not seeing what you're saying.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
so rather than ask me what a better posting rate would be, why I want to you stop double posting, or even challenge me on it (like, for instance, the part where I tell you that all of your posts are garbage), you... well, scroll up. I laid out your responses.
I also would like you to show me where I "relentlessly" pushed that I would get you lynched. I said that exactly once and we had a very simple exchange about it.
I'm not seeing what you're saying.
You were all like " I'm deadly serious" and stuff like that. Sure you didn't directly say you would lynch me more than once, but you did say things akin to that multiple times.
so rather than ask me what a better posting rate would be, why I want to you stop double posting, or even challenge me on it (like, for instance, the part where I tell you that all of your posts are garbage), you... well, scroll up. I laid out your responses.
I also would like you to show me where I "relentlessly" pushed that I would get you lynched. I said that exactly once and we had a very simple exchange about it.
I'm not seeing what you're saying.
I had forgotten about that.
But yeah, this doesn't change anything from my perspective. Rather than focus on why I was asking you not to double post, you focused on what would happen if you did.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
Sure, you did ask once. But that was hardly your focus. The fact that I didn't even remember that should be a clue for you.
So yes, you asked why. I told you why. I see no follow up from you on it (I would expect to see you questioning a reason that, to you, should have been bs). Still not convinced.
*the answer to both "how" and "why" was "big dick."
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
OK, did a re-read of the rezombied/DCIII argument, and I am almost completely convinced it is town on town at this point. Just like with BE, he has not really toned down his posting in game, and has done his best to answer questions towards him.
There was an interesting tidbit I did not catch on the original re-read. I was looking back at the initial case on BE (As that is part of the reason that Rezombied was voted for,) when I noticed this:
He's voting him for a different reason rather than barning the reasoning already presented against Burning_Earth, which I find scummy.
Well correct me if I am wrong here, but isn't what proph did the EXACT same thing he is accusing rezombied of?
Also to everyone out there: Why exactly do we not want the third neighbor to claim again? The way I see it, we are already assuming one of the three are scum. What is the point of protecting the ID of who it is when the scum already KNOW who is in said neighborhood? Wouldn't it be better to have all three out there in case we happen to lynch the scum in the group today? That way we go into Day 2 with one conf town and possibly 2 depending on night actions? (As Scum/Scum/Town neighborhood would be very powerful IMO, especially if the town member is lynched.)
Also to everyone out there: Why exactly do we not want the third neighbor to claim again? The way I see it, we are already assuming one of the three are scum. What is the point of protecting the ID of who it is when the scum already KNOW who is in said neighborhood? Wouldn't it be better to have all three out there in case we happen to lynch the scum in the group today? That way we go into Day 2 with one conf town and possibly 2 depending on night actions? (As Scum/Scum/Town neighborhood would be very powerful IMO, especially if the town member is lynched.)
Purely speculation, but note how neither of the claimed neighbor had their partners' names in their role PMs. This is because it's assumed that one of the three is scum. I would expect that the scum would be able to talk during night0, but the neighbours wouldn't be able to post until the game actually started, preventing the scum neighbour from revealing his partners pregame.
Also to everyone out there: Why exactly do we not want the third neighbor to claim again? The way I see it, we are already assuming one of the three are scum. What is the point of protecting the ID of who it is when the scum already KNOW who is in said neighborhood? Wouldn't it be better to have all three out there in case we happen to lynch the scum in the group today? That way we go into Day 2 with one conf town and possibly 2 depending on night actions? (As Scum/Scum/Town neighborhood would be very powerful IMO, especially if the town member is lynched.)
Purely speculation, but note how neither of the claimed neighbor had their partners' names in their role PMs. This is because it's assumed that one of the three is scum. I would expect that the scum would be able to talk during night0, but the neighbours wouldn't be able to post until the game actually started, preventing the scum neighbour from revealing his partners pregame.
Or maybe it is because of the fact that the neighbors are for some reason trying to hide each others IDs?
Also to everyone out there: Why exactly do we not want the third neighbor to claim again? The way I see it, we are already assuming one of the three are scum. What is the point of protecting the ID of who it is when the scum already KNOW who is in said neighborhood? Wouldn't it be better to have all three out there in case we happen to lynch the scum in the group today? That way we go into Day 2 with one conf town and possibly 2 depending on night actions? (As Scum/Scum/Town neighborhood would be very powerful IMO, especially if the town member is lynched.)
Purely speculation, but note how neither of the claimed neighbor had their partners' names in their role PMs. This is because it's assumed that one of the three is scum. I would expect that the scum would be able to talk during night0, but the neighbours wouldn't be able to post until the game actually started, preventing the scum neighbour from revealing his partners pregame.
We were able to talk during pregame (Rez can confirm this)
Also to everyone out there: Why exactly do we not want the third neighbor to claim again? The way I see it, we are already assuming one of the three are scum. What is the point of protecting the ID of who it is when the scum already KNOW who is in said neighborhood? Wouldn't it be better to have all three out there in case we happen to lynch the scum in the group today? That way we go into Day 2 with one conf town and possibly 2 depending on night actions? (As Scum/Scum/Town neighborhood would be very powerful IMO, especially if the town member is lynched.)
Purely speculation, but note how neither of the claimed neighbor had their partners' names in their role PMs. This is because it's assumed that one of the three is scum. I would expect that the scum would be able to talk during night0, but the neighbours wouldn't be able to post until the game actually started, preventing the scum neighbour from revealing his partners pregame.
We were able to talk during pregame (Rez can confirm this)
OK, which again raises the question, why are we hiding the ID of the third member at this point if scum most likely already know who it is? (Assuming the missing third member is not scum him/herself.)
Still reading through; just wanted to quickly say that if the third person isn't scum, the scum don't know who the third person is. He didn't post until day1 had begun. I checked with the mod that there were 3 neighbors because I wanted to eliminate the possibility of 4 neighbors with one just not posting in the qt since my pm does not mention how many other people there are in our neighborhood.
Still reading through; just wanted to quickly say that if the third person isn't scum, the scum don't know who the third person is. He didn't post until day1 had begun. I checked with the mod that there were 3 neighbors because I wanted to eliminate the possibility of 4 neighbors with one just not posting in the qt since my pm does not mention how many other people there are in our neighborhood.
So are you saying that you DON'T think B-E is scum now? Because it sounds like that is what you are saying.
No, my statement operates under the assumption that the scum don't have daychat. If b_e is scum and the third person is not also scum, their identity will remain safe.
No, my statement operates under the assumption that the scum don't have daychat. If b_e is scum and the third person is not also scum, their identity will remain safe.
He's voting him for a different reason rather than barning the reasoning already presented against Burning_Earth, which I find scummy.
so there was this, which makes zero sense.
Proph labeling b_e as town. when most people had b_e as at least somewhat scummy pings me.
When meg says he doesn't understand the case against me, proph says:
"Well, the Burning_Earth wagon is bad too." And then returns the focus to me by posting: "Read [rezombied's] inconsistent stance on naked voting RVS votes.
when proph tells b_e to find the scum on his wagon he specifically mentions me:
"If you're town, then there must be scum on your wagon. You should take a look at who's pushing you and build a case around that. (see: rezombied)"#174
Why did you try and play it off your vote as not reading the thread if you actually thought he was scum?
I don't understand your question.
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@Mod: I voted Proph in 242, but I'm going to Unvote Vote Burning_Earth
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I think the scumteam is:
Burning_Earth
Tanarin
Prophylaxis
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qt:
N3 asks me about tubehunters meta, because tubes rvs vote pinged him a bit.
b_e says that it is normal rvs.
I ask b_e to clarify his post, because it was oddly worded.
b_e says that he was saying his opinion of tubes rvs vote.
I say that N3 asked me, specifically, about tube hunter's meta.
b_e replies that he was giving his opinion.
I ask b_e when he managed to form an opinion of tubehunter, who aside from this game only plays on DTR.
b_e says that he does not have an opinion of tubehunter
When I point out that b_e responded to a question that he wasn't asked about someone he has no experience with, he fails to see any problem with his post.
When I pressed him further and asked why he thought it was normal rvs from someone he had no experience with, b_e said that his reply seemed okay at the time.
Yep.
****, I went and checked and N3 and I were chatting before the game started, it was b_e that didn't come in until later.
I guess he should come out, but I think b_e should be the lynch. If he's not scum, go ahead and lynch the rest of us, I'll even self vote tomorrow if I live.
b_e also asked N3 in our qt if he could out him a few hours ago.
I suspect that Tanarin wants to create a counterwagon onto n3 to deflect focus away from b_e, first by getting his identity revealed and then convincing void (and perhaps others)to vote him. Or maybe I'm just being too clever.
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@Void: I'm going to be pissed if I'm in a neighborhood with two scum.
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If I missed something,yell at me and I'll respond to it.
b_e also asked N3 in our qt if he could out him a few hours ago.
I suspect that Tanarin wants to create a counterwagon onto n3 to deflect focus away from b_e, first by getting his identity revealed and then convincing void (and perhaps others)to vote him. Or maybe I'm just being too clever.
OK, I am going to ask you this. If I was scum like you postulate, why would I bother to go through the fuss of outting N3 just to form a counterwagon when there is a perfectly viable wagon going on you? A wagon, that mind you, I was already technically on due to my predecessor's RVS vote on you. Wouldn't it just be easier for me to pile on to you today and get you lynched, then bus my partner Day 2 and then kill N3 Night 2? Occam's says that would be the easier and cleaner path than what you suggest.
I had a lean Town read on him until your post but now you have me questioning that. My only experience playing with him is Futurama and I think he's playing differently this game, but that's to be expected given his circumstances in that game and the overlapping player pool.
I liked the way he approached the BE case initially and the way he engaged the Rez case. I didn't remember his threat to Rhand, so that's the thing that's most concerning to me now as that's a very similar parallel. From your experience with him do you think that's something he'd do as either alignment or just as scum? That question goes to anyone else who has experience playing with Meg as well.
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@Void - What did you think of Kosa's response to you about why he thinks Rez is Town?
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Also, can I get a recap on the current wagons as to speed up where to looking ATM?
@Mod Can I get a Vote count please
And Unvote in case my vote is still on whoever the person I replaced has it on.
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I didn't read much into the whole lynching BE if he double posted thing because BE has been somewhat annoying, and Megs reaction is what I would have expected.
@ Tanarin: Rez has claimed to be in the neighbourhood as well. We do not know the third yet.
Speaking of Rez. Hey Rez. Answer my question.
UUU Azami, Lady of Scrolls
RRR Diaochan, Artful Beauty
UR(U/R) Tibor, Lumia, & Melek (WIP)
Mafia Stats
You were voting B_E. You mentioned the possibility that your scumread was at L-1. You didn't unvote.
If "mods usually don't count quote mangles," why would you even mention it? If that was a possibility in your mind you should have unvoted to be 100% sure. you do know WHY we don't let people sit at L-1 before we're ready to end the day, right?
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Oh, let me address your meta point while I'm here.
I've done the "ultimatum" thing a few times. In Smalltown, I did it because I noticed a pretty strong meta tell from Sir Karn and I wanted to test him. To summarize: I picked up that in his scum games to date he over-relied on calling OMGUS on votes on him, where in his town games he did not do so. He was throwing OMGUS around a lot in that game, so I threw out an ultimatum: If he ever used OMGUS again I would get him lynched. The goal was to see if I could force him out of the OMGUS arguments. I ended up being wrong, but that was the reason behind it.
In Futurama I threw out a similar ultimatum because it was a "town meg" thing to do. I have a habit of asking replacements for T/S lists if they don't provide them on their own (:hi: Tanarin! Do this please.), and I thought that combining the two would feel like my town play.
Here though I had two goals with doing it. The first was to see who is paying attention. I intentionally chose similar language to Futurama (cf. Smalltown, where I did it in a much more entertaining manner). The fact that you noticed that is a + for you, Proph. Also, think about it: The issue here has very little gameplay importance. Double posting? Who cares. It's annoying but definitely not an exclusively scum trait.
What the post diarrhea does signify, however, is nervousness, and I wanted to feel that out. I offered a silly ultimatum. Stop double posting or I get you lynched. Let's see what his reactions were:
My expectation when I challenge somebody on something silly like their post rate is that they will either a) tell me I am an idiot; or b) ignore me.
Instead we see B_E asking how/why I will do it. Look at that and then look at the last post: He's got the fear of a day kill in him... but why? I never mentioned one.
Apologizing to me/explaining his double post is the other tip-off I have. This reminds me of a game from mafiascum a while back that I happened to read where somebody told another player to change their avatar... and they did change it. It's self-consciousness and a desire to avoid ruffling feathers. I see this as very similar: B_E wants to avoid angering me enough that he's apologizing and explaining a double post. Yes, I said that I would get him lynched if he did it. No, that's not a reasonable thing to believe for a townie.
I see this as a nervous scum mindset. So yes, I do actually want to lynch BE, but not because he double posted.
There are significant wagons on myself and rezombied.
@Arian - If I have not posted again by this time tomorrow, replace me.
Current thoughts are in line with Proph when it comes to BE in that he is most likely just a VI town. This is mainly due to the fact that I feel that if he was really scum/a cult (As in the mafia term,) member, he would not be too open about it.
I am pretty confident that rezombied is not scum. First off, his flavor seems to match up with what BE has offered (A newbish member is in this group.) I think the fact that the third person has not at this point claimed they are the new member leads me to believe that said third person MAY be the scum.
So far that leaves me with this as my town column (Intentionally leaving myself out here):
Rezombied
Burning_Earth
So now let's look at the Rezombied Wagon and see why people are voting for him (Thanks Mod for the post numbers, makes finding votes a bit easier.) Remember, I am just looking at the post itself for the most part and trying to gleen what I can from it.
First vote was the person I replaced and an obv RVS vote.
Second was DCIII. His reasoning is legit and I have no problem with it, likely comes from town, but could easily be scum hitting low hanging fruit. Mainly null.
Third vote on is Proph. While I do agree with him on B_E being a VI, I don't feel too comfortable with his line of questioning as to DJ and Meggido asking for more info on a claim. On top of that, the info they were asking was not of any real consequence, but rather asking about the function of the role (How do you talk, when do you talk, do you know who you are talking to?) There is literally no reason as to even accuse them of fishing for info. Could Proph be the third member of the neighborhood? His reaction says possibly. Leaning scum pending a third member of the group claiming.
Next vote is iGem. Now my view of him may be tainted due to my current views on Proph, but I do like his response to Proph's line of questioning. Though having not delved further into why the questions were asked, I can not tell if it was warranted or not. [Note to Self: Make sure to take a look at this] As for the vote itself though, it is just a straight barn of DCIII. Mainly Null though leaning slight town.
Last vote down is iRebel. I am not quite following where he is coming from with his vote. While I understand the concept of what he is saying (rezombied not being productive,) I don't think a naked vote is necessarily an attempt to try and look productive. Naked votes, especially early on can be a decent gauge as to what is going on. Mainly Null
So with that the T/S list looks like this
Rezombied
Burning Earth
iGem
iRebel/DCIII
Proph
I'll take a look at the B_E wagon hopefully tomorrow, along with hopefully taking a deeper read into Proph's questioning of iGem.
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I can also finally reference why I think BE is Town. Look at his play in Walking Dead. He has the same self-conscious posting and the same periods of spamming the thread. His style here seems to be almost identical to in that game and I don't see him as likely able to fake that.
@Tanarin - Have you read through the full case on Rezombied or just the wagon votes?
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
So far, mainly the wagon votes. If there is a better case outside of what you said in your initial vote (Which is pretty much ALL I have seen for reasoning,) feel free to point me to it. As of now, I just don't believe the two claimed neighbors are the scum and the third unclaimed member is the actual scum.
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Between #190 and #249, the discussion between Rez and myself.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
OK, I'll take a look at it tomorrow at some point.
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Actually goes through #257.
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
Still haven't responded to the case...
I don't like how you call out DC for confirmation bias, then turn around and tell him to re-read with a confirmation bias in mind.
I'm getting mixed messages from you and B_E.
I recall B_E stating earlier that you were using your MTGS usernames to communicate in thread, so why would you have to confirm with mod about this?
Fair.
I was trying to clarify about the role. Usually flavor would not say something misleading like saying that they're part of a cult.
The last sentence was a reminder for those who were treating him as confirmed town after his claim.
Why did you try and play it off your vote as not reading the thread if you actually thought he was scum?
@Megiddo
I agree with your assessment of B_E's verbal diarrhea as a sign of possible scum nervousness. However, I think rezombied is potentially scum, and I find it hard to believe that there would be 2/3 scum members in the neighbor group.
Which of the two (B_E / Rezombied) do you think is more likely to be scum and why?
Please show me the language you are talking about regarding Zed and my read on him.
@DCIII:
I don't like it. I will get into this more later when I have more time.
Not Voting -- Dkingsland (115), Deathjoey (0), Tanarin (302)
With 12 players alive, it is 7 votes for a lynch.
V/LA Acknowledged@Dkings. I'll give you a few days before hunting for a replacement (partially because I feel bad and partially because I don't have another replacement handy :teach:)
I need to reread because I've changed my mind a few times so far Today.
I had an argument with Rez after his vote of proph. Read that too.
@everyone who likes bananas?
Ok, getting serious, I think that if anything my posting rate and paranoia is to do with me being nervous town; I want desperately to be a good player and am trying overheard.
kowtowing is not town behavior.
Let me (once again) recall your initial reaction to my proclamation that I would get you lynched:
I'm reading a mindset mismatch. Exhibit A has you worried that I would get you lynched. Exhibit B is you saying that you want to be a good player.
A and B are clearly contradictory. If you were responding to my post with the newb town mindset of "I want to get better," I would expect you to ask me why I want you to stop double posting; focusing on the cause and not the effect, as you did.
EWP: For anybody following along BE just proved my point. Please lynch him now.
A: you already explained why you would lynch me If I double posted, because I was nervously spamming the thread in your opinion.
B: you kept relentlessly pushing that you would get me lynched if I double-posted, at first I thought it was a joke, then I thought it might not be so I started trying not to double-post
so rather than ask me what a better posting rate would be, why I want to you stop double posting, or even challenge me on it (like, for instance, the part where I tell you that all of your posts are garbage), you... well, scroll up. I laid out your responses.
I also would like you to show me where I "relentlessly" pushed that I would get you lynched. I said that exactly once and we had a very simple exchange about it.
I'm not seeing what you're saying.
You were all like " I'm deadly serious" and stuff like that. Sure you didn't directly say you would lynch me more than once, but you did say things akin to that multiple times.
That actually rebuts the bolded: I had forgotten about that.
But yeah, this doesn't change anything from my perspective. Rather than focus on why I was asking you not to double post, you focused on what would happen if you did.
For the record, when I say "big dick," I'm referring to my own. I wasn't calling you a dick.
You were reffering to a completely different post and said I didn't ask why. I did ask "how and why" thus your argument is incorrect
This argumnent needs to stop, other people ne ed to post too
So yes, you asked why. I told you why. I see no follow up from you on it (I would expect to see you questioning a reason that, to you, should have been bs). Still not convinced.
*the answer to both "how" and "why" was "big dick."
There was an interesting tidbit I did not catch on the original re-read. I was looking back at the initial case on BE (As that is part of the reason that Rezombied was voted for,) when I noticed this:
Well correct me if I am wrong here, but isn't what proph did the EXACT same thing he is accusing rezombied of?
Also to everyone out there: Why exactly do we not want the third neighbor to claim again? The way I see it, we are already assuming one of the three are scum. What is the point of protecting the ID of who it is when the scum already KNOW who is in said neighborhood? Wouldn't it be better to have all three out there in case we happen to lynch the scum in the group today? That way we go into Day 2 with one conf town and possibly 2 depending on night actions? (As Scum/Scum/Town neighborhood would be very powerful IMO, especially if the town member is lynched.)
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Purely speculation, but note how neither of the claimed neighbor had their partners' names in their role PMs. This is because it's assumed that one of the three is scum. I would expect that the scum would be able to talk during night0, but the neighbours wouldn't be able to post until the game actually started, preventing the scum neighbour from revealing his partners pregame.
Or maybe it is because of the fact that the neighbors are for some reason trying to hide each others IDs?
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We were able to talk during pregame (Rez can confirm this)
OK, which again raises the question, why are we hiding the ID of the third member at this point if scum most likely already know who it is? (Assuming the missing third member is not scum him/herself.)
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So are you saying that you DON'T think B-E is scum now? Because it sounds like that is what you are saying.
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This statement assumes a BE lynch Today, correct?
Town Win % = 75%
Mafia Win % = 75%
Overall Win % = 75%
Completed Game Log
2014: Best Mafia Performance (Group)
2014: Most Improved Player
2014: Best Town Player
2014: Best Overall Player
so there was this, which makes zero sense.
Proph labeling b_e as town. when most people had b_e as at least somewhat scummy pings me.
When meg says he doesn't understand the case against me, proph says:
"Well, the Burning_Earth wagon is bad too." And then returns the focus to me by posting: "Read [rezombied's] inconsistent stance on naked voting RVS votes.
when proph tells b_e to find the scum on his wagon he specifically mentions me:
"If you're town, then there must be scum on your wagon. You should take a look at who's pushing you and build a case around that. (see: rezombied)"#174
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gut feelins. Dc3 makes sense to me. proph seems opportunistic.
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That language does not suggest something different
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I'm not Seppel and I'm not Cythare.
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I don't understand your question.
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@Mod: I voted Proph in 242, but I'm going to
Unvote
Vote Burning_Earth
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I think the scumteam is:
Burning_Earth
Tanarin
Prophylaxis
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qt:
N3 asks me about tubehunters meta, because tubes rvs vote pinged him a bit.
b_e says that it is normal rvs.
I ask b_e to clarify his post, because it was oddly worded.
b_e says that he was saying his opinion of tubes rvs vote.
I say that N3 asked me, specifically, about tube hunter's meta.
b_e replies that he was giving his opinion.
I ask b_e when he managed to form an opinion of tubehunter, who aside from this game only plays on DTR.
b_e says that he does not have an opinion of tubehunter
When I point out that b_e responded to a question that he wasn't asked about someone he has no experience with, he fails to see any problem with his post.
When I pressed him further and asked why he thought it was normal rvs from someone he had no experience with, b_e said that his reply seemed okay at the time.
n3= neighbor 3
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Yep.
****, I went and checked and N3 and I were chatting before the game started, it was b_e that didn't come in until later.
I guess he should come out, but I think b_e should be the lynch. If he's not scum, go ahead and lynch the rest of us, I'll even self vote tomorrow if I live.
b_e also asked N3 in our qt if he could out him a few hours ago.
I suspect that Tanarin wants to create a counterwagon onto n3 to deflect focus away from b_e, first by getting his identity revealed and then convincing void (and perhaps others)to vote him. Or maybe I'm just being too clever.
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@Void: I'm going to be pissed if I'm in a neighborhood with two scum.
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If I missed something,yell at me and I'll respond to it.
OK, I am going to ask you this. If I was scum like you postulate, why would I bother to go through the fuss of outting N3 just to form a counterwagon when there is a perfectly viable wagon going on you? A wagon, that mind you, I was already technically on due to my predecessor's RVS vote on you. Wouldn't it just be easier for me to pile on to you today and get you lynched, then bus my partner Day 2 and then kill N3 Night 2? Occam's says that would be the easier and cleaner path than what you suggest.
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113 was horrible and the explanation in 216 is also horrible.
I believe 113 was a horrible bus, but it still looks suspicious if Rez is town (attacking Rez but not committing to the vote)