2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
If dking ever flips town I think Iso has to be town. If dking is scum that doesn't necessarily mean that Iso is scum though.
I don't think even Iso would be ballsy enough to shove through that mislynch when the scum are down a man, but on the other hand scum!Iso is always willing to dig a grave for his buddies if he thinks he can endgame off of it.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
What Grinder - A while ago in pokemon mafia, you seemed confident that you had made somewhat of a science out of determining Iso's alignment -- if I'm not mistaken, you said that you used a chart of some sort. While his flip in that game proved that your method was not entirely accurate at that time, what does it tell you in this circumstance?
There are still several holes in my logic, but the hypothesis that currently seems the most plausible to me is that both Iso and dkings are scum. I have suspicions that Iso (shockwave, rather) claimed his true role, but his alignment is actually mafia. A scum watcher would not have targeted Rhand because they already would know who was going to kill him, so I believe that Iso, in targeting Tan last night, was scouting for JoaT's as soon as possible. Perhaps Iso was going to bus dkings into the ground to give credence to his claim in hopes that he would be able to coast until endgame. I know that this bussing both scummates in the first two days seems outrageous and uber risky, but once Iso used his watch, I don't think that anyone would question his alignment, at least not until it got down to near the end. And I believe that given Iso's skill level, he could easily manipulate the town and lead them astray for the rest of the game. I'm guessing that when I nudged Iso, he pled ignorance to use as an alibi because it is a potentially acceptable answer that would not jeopardize his entire operation.
*takes off conspiracy theorist hat*
After much contemplation, this is the only possible theory I can come up with as to why:
1) Iso did not watch the claimed doc
2) Iso knowingly lied about having evidence with strong intent to have somebody lynched
3) Iso would willingly throw away a valuable 1-shot watch on D1 on a seemingly random player. (the whole scenario would be completely different if this was a regular game in which Iso had an undefined number of watcher shots)
If anyone can think of a different explanation that involves Iso being town, please let me know.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I'm a compulsive liar no matter what team I play on, but I'm trying to get better about it."
dude I haven't even read the game. That would be akin to suicide.
OK, you claim not to have read the game just now, yet you claim to have enough damning evidence to call for a dking lynch despite misfiring your watch on me supposedly? On top of that, you also claim to not have any knowledge that Rhand had a protect ability, yet I am almost positive you had to have seen this post:
This is all mostly useless right now w/out an EtR flip, but I'll change it toMorrow.
Would it be a good idea for Iso to watch Rhand and Rhand to protect Iso? (Agatha Christie flashbacks, heh)
Iso should probably just WIFOM up the watch - it's a very strong role.
Note the bolded part of the statement.
The reason I point out this post is not only for the bolded, but also the fact that you would have seen the whole Rodemy/Rhand wagon was to claim range yet he was not lynched. Wouldn't that have also been a clue that Rhand was possibly a decent PR as well?
@Hans: I could easily see Iso pulling such a gambit, and I am starting to wonder if maybe you just caught him in the act.
Sorry guys, I had to have my appendix removed yesterday morning and have been resting and mostly out of it for the past two days. My company is closed for the holiday tomorrow, so I will try to read up and post at some point.
@Arnmod - If I have not posted by this time tomorrow night, replace me.
What Grinder - A while ago in pokemon mafia, you seemed confident that you had made somewhat of a science out of determining Iso's alignment -- if I'm not mistaken, you said that you used a chart of some sort. While his flip in that game proved that your method was not entirely accurate at that time, what does it tell you in this circumstance?
Not only is the chart useless in general, but it doesn't even cover the current case. This would be a case of 3.d but I've never experienced a 3.d so I don't know what it says. 2 and 4 have not come into play.
The only thing I can say with certainty is that Iso is not VT via section 0 (and section 1 is just a way to get to sections 2-4 if 0 is false)
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Ehhhhhh I really feel that Kosa's posting here is different than WWE. He had more of a cornered feel in WWE when he was getting pegged early.
Lay this out for me. Kosa doesn't feel as cornered here as he did in WWE, so he's not likely to be scum. Have you considered that he doesn't feel as cornered here because he's not as cornered?
Ehhhhhh I really feel that Kosa's posting here is different than WWE. He had more of a cornered feel in WWE when he was getting pegged early.
Lay this out for me. Kosa doesn't feel as cornered here as he did in WWE, so he's not likely to be scum. Have you considered that he doesn't feel as cornered here because he's not as cornered?
While it's true that he wasn't as cornered so early in this game as WWE (and it's the early game that I'm looking at, since Kosa disappeared in this game's midgame), he was still put on the spot. That didn't really deter him this game, while I feel that it did in WWE.
OK, you claim not to have read the game just now, yet you claim to have enough damning evidence to call for a dking lynch despite misfiring your watch on me supposedly? On top of that, you also claim to not have any knowledge that Rhand had a protect ability, yet I am almost positive you had to have seen this post:
Actually, I completely missed that post or I would've :hifive:d Proph for the suggestion because I would've known to target Rhand on Night 1.
dude I haven't even read the game. That would be akin to suicide.
Expound on this, please.
If I don't know the state of the game, then it would be absolutely stupid for me to throw my vote on a buddy Day 1 then try to get the other one lynched Day 2 through something based solely on the first page. Additionally, I'm a frequent victim of Cyanosis, wherein if I happen to live past a certain Day, I'm bound to be lynched out of paranoia anyway. If anything, supposing that dking and I are scum, the ideal play here would be to let him take me down or completely ignore each other until a bus was necessary - whatever the state of the game called for at the time. But given that I'm currently blind as a bat in terms of affairs for the game, it would be suicide to kill off both of my buddies within the first 2 Days and hope I could skate to endgame on that when you know just as well as I do that I'll probably be lynched before the game is over if I'm alive long enough to see that Day.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I was gonna be like ISO IS SCUM because when I was like "Iso wouldn't do that as scum" he was like "I would totally never do that as scum" and I had recently talked to Iso about how he would try to puff up his towniness.
But on the other hand that would be a mistake and as I recall he knows that's a mistake.
Anyway I feel convince enough that dking is scum, though I can't say I'm sure about Kosa since he saw dking do it.
I was gonna be like ISO IS SCUM because when I was like "Iso wouldn't do that as scum" he was like "I would totally never do that as scum" and I had recently talked to Iso about how he would try to puff up his towniness.
But on the other hand that would be a mistake and as I recall he knows that's a mistake.
Anyway I feel convince enough that dking is scum, though I can't say I'm sure about Kosa since he saw dking do it.
Unvote, Vote: dking
See, this is where I am hesitant. I mean Iso just made a case on the whole RVS post, but at the same time, I really wish the case had more to it than just one post.
On top of that, with Tare replacing in, I much rather give the guy a chance to catch up and defend himself before deciding anything.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Aside from Iso playing village idiot, I don't think that he's likely to be scum -- he claimed Watcher (at least 1 shot), and was/is confirmed by Hans claiming that he Tracked Iso. I don't think that I've ever seen a scum watcher (though I have seen scum trackers).
Also, I think that Kosa is likely to not be scum -- I've given some loose reasons beforehand, but I figure I'll come out and say this now: Kosa and I were masonized last night. From the way Arnmod worded the PM, I believe that this effect only lasts 1 night....it's not a permanent mason.
Sadly, neither Kosa nor I are terribly invested at the moment, so we haven't been able to really use it much. But, I can't come up with a reason why scum!Kosa or scum!Kosateammate would choose to use that shot on me -- I'm sure there are better targets this game. I believe Occam's points to town!Kosa, here.
I'll try to get a more thorough list of opinions up soon -- this game is really, really hard to get into with all the replacements =(
he claimed Watcher (at least 1 shot), and was/is confirmed by Hans claiming that he Tracked Iso. I don't think that I've ever seen a scum watcher (though I have seen scum trackers).
This part is false. I cannot confirm anything that Iso did last night.
Also, I believe Void was a scum watcher in WWII mafia.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"I'm a compulsive liar no matter what team I play on, but I'm trying to get better about it."
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@hans: I had an idea but I forgot what it was. I don't suppose you had a Watch shot, as well? If so, did you target Rhand? Who targeted him, if you did?
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
@hans: I had an idea but I forgot what it was. I don't suppose you had a Watch shot, as well? If so, did you target Rhand? Who targeted him, if you did?
o_O
I dunno where you are going with all this, but one would think if he watched Rhand, he would have been going off on whoever actually did target him as opposed to staying busy trying to call your bluff.
@Arian: I dunno where you got the idea that Hans was claiming tracker. I mean I guess you could take point #2 in his post #439 as a soft claim.
Also, is it a Mason chat or a neighborizing? There is a difference here.
It's called a mason chat, but I've PM'ed Arnmod to get confirmation that if by "mason" he was confirming us as town to each other. His answer was negative: our alignments are unknown.
Regardless, I pretty much doubt scum!Arian would choose to masonize me, of all people. And I doubt even more that scum did it and are listening in: it doesn't make sense.
If I'm allowed to make a wild guess, I'd say some smart townie did it and chose us because we would quickly confirm ourselves as town to each other, and by extent to the whole town. That's my opinion on it.
Also, I think that Kosa is likely to not be scum -- I've given some loose reasons beforehand, but I figure I'll come out and say this now: Kosa and I were masonized last night. From the way Arnmod worded the PM, I believe that this effect only lasts 1 night....it's not a permanent mason.
Sadly, neither Kosa nor I are terribly invested at the moment, so we haven't been able to really use it much. But, I can't come up with a reason why scum!Kosa or scum!Kosateammate would choose to use that shot on me -- I'm sure there are better targets this game. I believe Occam's points to town!Kosa, here.
It's called a mason chat, but I've PM'ed Arnmod to get confirmation that if by "mason" he was confirming us as town to each other. His answer was negative: our alignments are unknown.
Regardless, I pretty much doubt scum!Arian would choose to masonize me, of all people. And I doubt even more that scum did it and are listening in: it doesn't make sense.
If I'm allowed to make a wild guess, I'd say some smart townie did it and chose us because we would quickly confirm ourselves as town to each other, and by extent to the whole town. That's my opinion on it.
Also, I think that Kosa is likely to not be scum -- I've given some loose reasons beforehand, but I figure I'll come out and say this now: Kosa and I were masonized last night. From the way Arnmod worded the PM, I believe that this effect only lasts 1 night....it's not a permanent mason.
Sadly, neither Kosa nor I are terribly invested at the moment, so we haven't been able to really use it much. But, I can't come up with a reason why scum!Kosa or scum!Kosateammate would choose to use that shot on me -- I'm sure there are better targets this game. I believe Occam's points to town!Kosa, here.
It's called a mason chat, but I've PM'ed Arnmod to get confirmation that if by "mason" he was confirming us as town to each other. His answer was negative: our alignments are unknown.
Regardless, I pretty much doubt scum!Arian would choose to masonize me, of all people. And I doubt even more that scum did it and are listening in: it doesn't make sense.
If I'm allowed to make a wild guess, I'd say some smart townie did it and chose us because we would quickly confirm ourselves as town to each other, and by extent to the whole town. That's my opinion on it.
Ok, I've been out the past few days. I promised I'd dredge up my points against Kosa, and while I get Arian not understanding the motivation behind a scum masoning him, I don't like how Kosa takes that to "we would quickly confirm ourselves as town to each other", but at this point, it might just be confirmation bias. I'll get to actually digging stuff now.
Overall:
-His RVS stuff looks bad (specifically 20, 22, 23). I didn't really put much weight into it before, but I dislike that it took him three additional posts after his vote to actually unvote hansanator, and then only to attack the person who voted him afterwards. It looks opportunistic. On a related note, does anyone know ganderin_dan's stance/habits on bussing early?
-197 - Not bad on its own, but there are a few things I'm not sure he followed up on:
a) Shockwave's role "oozes townishness" and is "way too consistent to be a falseclaim" - I should have followed up on this before, but what here "oozed" townishness? The only shot that was specifically townish was the watch shot. The shot that makes abilities unable to fail and the shot that is a messenger are not town-specific - both of these things are viable as scum.
b) Have you had any chance to expound on your Tanarin read?
c) Did you ever actually go back and reread fulcrum? If so, can you provide your thoughts? I would have assumed this would be something you would have been interested in providing prior to hammering.
-309 - This just looks terrible. He asks who we're lynching, uses language like "avoid my snipe at you", and doesn't indicate that he's planning to circle back on anything outstanding. This is also 3.5 days after he posts here stating that he's catching up on recent events. Were you not able to figure out the current wagon during the 3 days after that post, where you indicated you were "updating yourself on the latest developments asap"? You're aware enough to try to push fulcrum again, but not anything else.
-I don't like the back and forth based on his question in 309. He asks a loaded question and then jumps on fulcrum for the response that didn't seem to correlate with the response itself.
-Hammering instead of following up on the questions he'd promised to get to. I'm not sure what questions were left, but he seems to gloss over any potential outstanding items for him (such as his reread of fulcrum/Tanarin?).
-Not a fan of the belligerence here. It seems unnecessary. That said, my primary issue here is that he viewed the game as stalled when he'd clearly indicated that there were items for him to follow up on yesterDay.
If I'm allowed to make a wild guess, I'd say some smart townie did it and chose us because we would quickly confirm ourselves as town to each other, and by extent to the whole town. That's my opinion on it.
2011: Best Mafia Performance (Individual) - Best Newcomer
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
- Wheat is town, based entirely off of Proph's play - Proph was active and invested here in a way I've never seen from Proph as scum.
- Iso is very likely town - he's tunnel-prone as town (see: Drury), gambitting to try to get a townie lynched would be suicidal as scum, and he's got an edge that I don't remember from Redux Mirror. Moreover, the way Iso's watch claim went down reminds me of the knife derp in Amistarian 3 - I'd be surprised if all the players pushing that are town. Iso's *wrong* about me, but that doesn't make him *scum*.
- I'll double-check toMorrow to be sure, but Arian is probably town. His tone reminds me of Apocalypse - more concise and with more of a point to his reads than in WWE/Ataghan.
- Hans is probably VI town. His play has a point here, unlike his play in Apocalypse (where he IIoAed to oblivion), and I don't see hans improving his tone control that dramatically in so little time.
- Kosa is likely town - he's got an aggressiveness here that I remember from facing it in Drury, and he's doing more than I remember from WWE. Less sure about him than the above four - Kosa might have just upped his scumgame since WWE.
That leaves four players who aren't strong town reads with two mislynches, which isn't quite enough mislynches to spare a PoE lynch on me (hopefully we have a vig or cop who will take care of that tonight).
Gut says Cythare and fulcrum are the scum. More sure on Cythare - he went much more in-depth on fulcrum than he has anywhere else (Fadeblue in Amistarian 3), he cleared shockwave immediately after he claimed wincon (which reminds me heavily of how I cleared Tanarin immediately after his claim in Drury - mods almost always tell the Mafia the town win condition in some way, shape or form, and yet Cythare didn't take this into account), and his post 28 looks like scum discrediting an attack to me. Fulcrum just reads... off, and his jump onto Iso right after Iso admitted his gambit looks fishy.
Need to look at Tanarin's completed games, and I have no idea what to make of rezombied - he didn't really do much of anything in Apocalypse.
Gut says Cythare and fulcrum are the scum. More sure on Cythare - he went much more in-depth on fulcrum than he has anywhere else (Fadeblue in Amistarian 3), he cleared shockwave immediately after he claimed wincon (which reminds me heavily of how I cleared Tanarin immediately after his claim in Drury - mods almost always tell the Mafia the town win condition in some way, shape or form, and yet Cythare didn't take this into account), and his post 28 looks like scum discrediting an attack to me. Fulcrum just reads... off, and his jump onto Iso right after Iso admitted his gambit looks fishy.
Need to look at Tanarin's completed games, and I have no idea what to make of rezombied - he didn't really do much of anything in Apocalypse.
Unvote if voting, Vote: Cythare
More soon.
OK, as for the bolded, how did you clear me in Drury? I pretty much self cleared myself when I claimed blocked doc, on top of the whole Day 2 Kosa mess. There is also the fact that you tried to set me up for my mislynch the entire game until I threw the wrench in that by self voting to force the town to have to vote you for the win.
Also I assume you want recent scum games for me, if so only one of any relevance I have is Homestruck mafia, where I replaced in Day 2 and was only PoE out the game by Iso. All my other games, I have been town. I do have 2 other scum games on site in FFVII mafia and ASOFAI Mafia, but those are like... 4-5 years out of date and I have had many, many games under my belt since then.
How much of the thread have you read?
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I don't think even Iso would be ballsy enough to shove through that mislynch when the scum are down a man, but on the other hand scum!Iso is always willing to dig a grave for his buddies if he thinks he can endgame off of it.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
There are still several holes in my logic, but the hypothesis that currently seems the most plausible to me is that both Iso and dkings are scum. I have suspicions that Iso (shockwave, rather) claimed his true role, but his alignment is actually mafia. A scum watcher would not have targeted Rhand because they already would know who was going to kill him, so I believe that Iso, in targeting Tan last night, was scouting for JoaT's as soon as possible. Perhaps Iso was going to bus dkings into the ground to give credence to his claim in hopes that he would be able to coast until endgame. I know that this bussing both scummates in the first two days seems outrageous and uber risky, but once Iso used his watch, I don't think that anyone would question his alignment, at least not until it got down to near the end. And I believe that given Iso's skill level, he could easily manipulate the town and lead them astray for the rest of the game. I'm guessing that when I nudged Iso, he pled ignorance to use as an alibi because it is a potentially acceptable answer that would not jeopardize his entire operation.
*takes off conspiracy theorist hat*
After much contemplation, this is the only possible theory I can come up with as to why:
1) Iso did not watch the claimed doc
2) Iso knowingly lied about having evidence with strong intent to have somebody lynched
3) Iso would willingly throw away a valuable 1-shot watch on D1 on a seemingly random player. (the whole scenario would be completely different if this was a regular game in which Iso had an undefined number of watcher shots)
If anyone can think of a different explanation that involves Iso being town, please let me know.
Previous Mafia Experience:
Mafia aligned: 2/0 -100%
Town aligned: 4/3 - 57%
Previous Mafia Experience:
Mafia aligned: 2/0 -100%
Town aligned: 4/3 - 57%
OK, you claim not to have read the game just now, yet you claim to have enough damning evidence to call for a dking lynch despite misfiring your watch on me supposedly? On top of that, you also claim to not have any knowledge that Rhand had a protect ability, yet I am almost positive you had to have seen this post:
Note the bolded part of the statement.
The reason I point out this post is not only for the bolded, but also the fact that you would have seen the whole Rodemy/Rhand wagon was to claim range yet he was not lynched. Wouldn't that have also been a clue that Rhand was possibly a decent PR as well?
@Hans: I could easily see Iso pulling such a gambit, and I am starting to wonder if maybe you just caught him in the act.
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands
Sorry guys, I had to have my appendix removed yesterday morning and have been resting and mostly out of it for the past two days. My company is closed for the holiday tomorrow, so I will try to read up and post at some point.
@Arnmod - If I have not posted by this time tomorrow night, replace me.
Expound on this, please.
Not only is the chart useless in general, but it doesn't even cover the current case. This would be a case of 3.d but I've never experienced a 3.d so I don't know what it says. 2 and 4 have not come into play.
The only thing I can say with certainty is that Iso is not VT via section 0 (and section 1 is just a way to get to sections 2-4 if 0 is false)
These are posts that Iso asserts that scum make.
Let's see if I can find any other examples and if it pins dking as scum.
Iso's Inflammable: None
Sesame Street: None
Crosstown #2: Only Iso, which was previously covered.
Drury Lane: None
Futurama: None
Apocalypse: None
Empire of Astarte: None
WWII: None
Majora's Mask is too weird about RVS
Crosstown #!: None
Smalltown Swap: Does Karn's 31 count?
I don't think it does but I'm desperate to find another post like dkings.
Karn was town.
Dr. P's Transcendental Orchestra: None
Mod Mafia 8: None
TMNT: None
Porn Star: None
Marvel Madness: None
Ultimate Showdown: None
C'mon just give me one good example.
Katawa Shoujo: None
WWE: Does Rhand's 7 count?
I feel that might actually count.
Rhand was town.
House: None
CCMVII: None
Battlestar Galactica: "Man, I read that as "Supple", and now I can never take him seriously again." - Cythare
But there was no outburst.
Disney Villains: None
I'm done looking
Iso's assertion either has too little evidence to uphold or is disproved by this search.
I'm looking into Kosa later today.
Unvote
Vote Iso
1. I thought Shockwave was scum.
2. Iso didn't watch the claimed doc.
3. He implied that he watched the doc to try to get dkings lynched.
I'll respond to other things later
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Also I'll look into Kosa now.
20 -> 22 -> 23 (Kosa): This has been gone over before but tbh it shows some amount of consistency of mindset.
33 (Kosa): The barn of rezombied does not make sense with Kosa calling it an RVS wagon.
38 (Dan): Dan votes Kosa really quickly. That's really damned early for a bus.
70 (Kosa): "Have you never seen scum early bussing buddies?" 38 no longer applies. Otherwise good big post, nothing really bad.
Around 120 he disappears until 300 with only "I'll catch up soon" posts.
And then he posts fairly regularly again.
I am sorta thinking about WWE in the back of my mind so let's compare!
First 90 posts seem different.
Ehhhhhh I really feel that Kosa's posting here is different than WWE. He had more of a cornered feel in WWE when he was getting pegged early.
No bones, I don't feel comfortable with a Kosa lynch.
Rhand
fulcrum
Hansanator
Arianrhod
Tanarin
Cythare
Wheat_Grinder
Taredas
Rezombied
Iso
Kosakosa
EtR
Lay this out for me. Kosa doesn't feel as cornered here as he did in WWE, so he's not likely to be scum. Have you considered that he doesn't feel as cornered here because he's not as cornered?
While it's true that he wasn't as cornered so early in this game as WWE (and it's the early game that I'm looking at, since Kosa disappeared in this game's midgame), he was still put on the spot. That didn't really deter him this game, while I feel that it did in WWE.
So, where are those reads?
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Actually, I completely missed that post or I would've :hifive:d Proph for the suggestion because I would've known to target Rhand on Night 1.
If I don't know the state of the game, then it would be absolutely stupid for me to throw my vote on a buddy Day 1 then try to get the other one lynched Day 2 through something based solely on the first page. Additionally, I'm a frequent victim of Cyanosis, wherein if I happen to live past a certain Day, I'm bound to be lynched out of paranoia anyway. If anything, supposing that dking and I are scum, the ideal play here would be to let him take me down or completely ignore each other until a bus was necessary - whatever the state of the game called for at the time. But given that I'm currently blind as a bat in terms of affairs for the game, it would be suicide to kill off both of my buddies within the first 2 Days and hope I could skate to endgame on that when you know just as well as I do that I'll probably be lynched before the game is over if I'm alive long enough to see that Day.
I coulda sworn there was more to support this theory.
I think I want to lynch Kosa for that post for the same reason I want to lynch dking.
Hold on. I need to check MY scumgames to see how often I've done this.
Looks like 3 times (at least on MTGS). Regardless, I get the same vibe from dkings's opening post. u_u
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Also thanks for answering my first question; once you reply to this post I will make use of it.
I'll be back in around 12 hours.
TMCT was scum.
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
I was gonna be like ISO IS SCUM because when I was like "Iso wouldn't do that as scum" he was like "I would totally never do that as scum" and I had recently talked to Iso about how he would try to puff up his towniness.
But on the other hand that would be a mistake and as I recall he knows that's a mistake.
Anyway I feel convince enough that dking is scum, though I can't say I'm sure about Kosa since he saw dking do it.
Unvote, Vote: dking
See, this is where I am hesitant. I mean Iso just made a case on the whole RVS post, but at the same time, I really wish the case had more to it than just one post.
On top of that, with Tare replacing in, I much rather give the guy a chance to catch up and defend himself before deciding anything.
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands
I really need to read this game
Maybe I could make more of a case then???
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Yes... please read the game already.
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Also, I think that Kosa is likely to not be scum -- I've given some loose reasons beforehand, but I figure I'll come out and say this now: Kosa and I were masonized last night. From the way Arnmod worded the PM, I believe that this effect only lasts 1 night....it's not a permanent mason.
Sadly, neither Kosa nor I are terribly invested at the moment, so we haven't been able to really use it much. But, I can't come up with a reason why scum!Kosa or scum!Kosateammate would choose to use that shot on me -- I'm sure there are better targets this game. I believe Occam's points to town!Kosa, here.
I'll try to get a more thorough list of opinions up soon -- this game is really, really hard to get into with all the replacements =(
Taredas (2): Iso; Wheat_Grinder
fulcrum (1): Kosakosa
Kosakosa (1): Cythare
Iso (3): Hansanator; fulcrum; Rezombied
Not Voting (3): Arianrhod; Taredas; Tanarin
With 10 alive, it's 6 to lynch!
inb4 wheat is arsonist
This part is false. I cannot confirm anything that Iso did last night.
Also, I believe Void was a scum watcher in WWII mafia.
Previous Mafia Experience:
Mafia aligned: 2/0 -100%
Town aligned: 4/3 - 57%
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Why do you think that I asked you who you targeted?
Previous Mafia Experience:
Mafia aligned: 2/0 -100%
Town aligned: 4/3 - 57%
Previous Mafia Experience:
Mafia aligned: 2/0 -100%
Town aligned: 4/3 - 57%
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
o_O
I dunno where you are going with all this, but one would think if he watched Rhand, he would have been going off on whoever actually did target him as opposed to staying busy trying to call your bluff.
@Arian: I dunno where you got the idea that Hans was claiming tracker. I mean I guess you could take point #2 in his post #439 as a soft claim.
Also, is it a Mason chat or a neighborizing? There is a difference here.
@Kosa: Can you confirm that you two are talking?
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It's called a mason chat, but I've PM'ed Arnmod to get confirmation that if by "mason" he was confirming us as town to each other. His answer was negative: our alignments are unknown.
Regardless, I pretty much doubt scum!Arian would choose to masonize me, of all people. And I doubt even more that scum did it and are listening in: it doesn't make sense.
If I'm allowed to make a wild guess, I'd say some smart townie did it and chose us because we would quickly confirm ourselves as town to each other, and by extent to the whole town. That's my opinion on it.
I don't understand the logic of these posts.
Elaborate, please.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
Overall:
-His RVS stuff looks bad (specifically 20, 22, 23). I didn't really put much weight into it before, but I dislike that it took him three additional posts after his vote to actually unvote hansanator, and then only to attack the person who voted him afterwards. It looks opportunistic. On a related note, does anyone know ganderin_dan's stance/habits on bussing early?
-197 - Not bad on its own, but there are a few things I'm not sure he followed up on:
a) Shockwave's role "oozes townishness" and is "way too consistent to be a falseclaim" - I should have followed up on this before, but what here "oozed" townishness? The only shot that was specifically townish was the watch shot. The shot that makes abilities unable to fail and the shot that is a messenger are not town-specific - both of these things are viable as scum.
b) Have you had any chance to expound on your Tanarin read?
c) Did you ever actually go back and reread fulcrum? If so, can you provide your thoughts? I would have assumed this would be something you would have been interested in providing prior to hammering.
-309 - This just looks terrible. He asks who we're lynching, uses language like "avoid my snipe at you", and doesn't indicate that he's planning to circle back on anything outstanding. This is also 3.5 days after he posts here stating that he's catching up on recent events. Were you not able to figure out the current wagon during the 3 days after that post, where you indicated you were "updating yourself on the latest developments asap"? You're aware enough to try to push fulcrum again, but not anything else.
-I don't like the back and forth based on his question in 309. He asks a loaded question and then jumps on fulcrum for the response that didn't seem to correlate with the response itself.
-Hammering instead of following up on the questions he'd promised to get to. I'm not sure what questions were left, but he seems to gloss over any potential outstanding items for him (such as his reread of fulcrum/Tanarin?).
-Not a fan of the belligerence here. It seems unnecessary. That said, my primary issue here is that he viewed the game as stalled when he'd clearly indicated that there were items for him to follow up on yesterDay.
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
what
how do you figure
{мы, тьма}
2012: Best (False?) Role Claim - Worst Town Performance (Group) - Best Mafia Performance (Group) - Best SK Performance - Best Overall Player
2013: Best Non-SK Neutral Performance
2014: Best Town Performance (Individual) - Best Town Performance (Group) - Most Interesting Role - Best Game - Best Overall Player
2015: Worst Mafia Performance (Group) - Best Read
2016: Best Town Performance (Group) - Best Town Player - Best Overall Player
Finished my reread. Quick notes:
- Wheat is town, based entirely off of Proph's play - Proph was active and invested here in a way I've never seen from Proph as scum.
- Iso is very likely town - he's tunnel-prone as town (see: Drury), gambitting to try to get a townie lynched would be suicidal as scum, and he's got an edge that I don't remember from Redux Mirror. Moreover, the way Iso's watch claim went down reminds me of the knife derp in Amistarian 3 - I'd be surprised if all the players pushing that are town. Iso's *wrong* about me, but that doesn't make him *scum*.
- I'll double-check toMorrow to be sure, but Arian is probably town. His tone reminds me of Apocalypse - more concise and with more of a point to his reads than in WWE/Ataghan.
- Hans is probably VI town. His play has a point here, unlike his play in Apocalypse (where he IIoAed to oblivion), and I don't see hans improving his tone control that dramatically in so little time.
- Kosa is likely town - he's got an aggressiveness here that I remember from facing it in Drury, and he's doing more than I remember from WWE. Less sure about him than the above four - Kosa might have just upped his scumgame since WWE.
That leaves four players who aren't strong town reads with two mislynches, which isn't quite enough mislynches to spare a PoE lynch on me (hopefully we have a vig or cop who will take care of that tonight).
Gut says Cythare and fulcrum are the scum. More sure on Cythare - he went much more in-depth on fulcrum than he has anywhere else (Fadeblue in Amistarian 3), he cleared shockwave immediately after he claimed wincon (which reminds me heavily of how I cleared Tanarin immediately after his claim in Drury - mods almost always tell the Mafia the town win condition in some way, shape or form, and yet Cythare didn't take this into account), and his post 28 looks like scum discrediting an attack to me. Fulcrum just reads... off, and his jump onto Iso right after Iso admitted his gambit looks fishy.
Need to look at Tanarin's completed games, and I have no idea what to make of rezombied - he didn't really do much of anything in Apocalypse.
Unvote if voting, Vote: Cythare
More soon.
It is too late for the pebbles to vote."
Draft my cube! (630 cards)
I'm fine leaving my vote on Iso.
And I am fine putting my vote on you
Vote rezombied
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OK, as for the bolded, how did you clear me in Drury? I pretty much self cleared myself when I claimed blocked doc, on top of the whole Day 2 Kosa mess. There is also the fact that you tried to set me up for my mislynch the entire game until I threw the wrench in that by self voting to force the town to have to vote you for the win.
Also I assume you want recent scum games for me, if so only one of any relevance I have is Homestruck mafia, where I replaced in Day 2 and was only PoE out the game by Iso. All my other games, I have been town. I do have 2 other scum games on site in FFVII mafia and ASOFAI Mafia, but those are like... 4-5 years out of date and I have had many, many games under my belt since then.
Come join us in the MTGSalvation chat ||| My trade thread. ||| My Personal Modern Blog: The Fetchlands