Ok, so officially, all living people are denying being forced to roleplay?
Two conclusions:
1) Someone is lying. Who is that someone? The person most likely targeted by Alx, obv.
2) Alx was roleblocked or did not submit an aciton
I don't think we can lynch based on any of this... but man.. we are at the point in the game where we have a dozen theories that could turn out to be true, and NOTHING to tell us that one of them is better than the other. They are all equally insane. They all have holes in them. We just have to pick one and go with it.
ebwop: sarnath'd by ZDS, but it's good to see we are thinking along the same lines. If you and Vamp are scum together, you deserve to win at this point... so I'm not gonna be upset if that happens. Both of you have just been too "honest" with your posting and the way Vamp claimed back when he did (what, day 2?) was really genuine.
He heard about the flowers going around and said that the role PM mentions liking flowers,
Yes, the PM does say that the roles likes flowers. Specifically roses, also, I like candy, sunbathing, and long walks in the park. Oh, and watching TV in the nude. The PM simply does not give the impression that the casual mention of roses has anything to do with anything game-related. In that same part, it says that if I can stop the people who are tampering with the source [the Merovingian], I can get them to fix the bug that's changing me around. Well, the first part happened and the second part didn't, so again, not really much game related in that part.
Sorry I'm not paying attention. What scum was caught thanks to Dagger's ability ? Xyre gets the credit for Atlseal, C_M for Spoon and the SK for CP (Loran wasn't caught thanks to an ability or a counter-claim). Where does Dagger fit in ?
I'm saying that directly because of Dagger's ability to night-talk, a scum got caught. I'm NOT saying this clears him. It's very possible that he's scum. I'm just trying to put pieces together and use the information that we have to figure this out. Thus, I was putting out what I thought were important pieces.
Also, if I'm not the one lynched today, I will be donning the smith avatar (one more attempt to stop the player-change from happening).
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Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
Well, I was referring to Spoon. C_M told the people in Dagger's group that he was Morpheus, right? And then Spoon came out and claimed Morpheus? If Dagger was scum, why wouldn't he have told the other scum everything that was said at night?
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Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
Ah... well that makes a lot more sense then. In that case, I have no reason not to vote for Dagger, whereas I have at least a couple reasons not to vote for Grakthis. Unvote, Vote Dagger
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Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
I am coming around to the idea of a Dagger lynch, for various reasons. But I'm not nearly ready to vote anyone. My big fear is that, if Dagger's not scum and the game's not over, the revolving role rotates and Raf. jumps back in for tomorrow. What the heck do we do then?
Raf.: if you are reading this, assuming you have some kind of choice in the matter (as CM indicated) and if you were town. DON'T COME BACK.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
That's a lot of assumptions... but yeah, if we don't lynch scum and Raf comes back in... well, I'd say you lynch Raf right away. After that, you'll have more information on who to lynch based on who dies.
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Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
I am coming around to the idea of a Dagger lynch, for various reasons. But I'm not nearly ready to vote anyone. My big fear is that, if Dagger's not scum and the game's not over, the revolving role rotates and Raf. jumps back in for tomorrow. What the heck do we do then?
Raf.: if you are reading this, assuming you have some kind of choice in the matter (as CM indicated) and if you were town. DON'T COME BACK.
I don't think it matters. If we lynch Dagger today and the game is still ongoing, we lynch the Oracle tomorrow and the game ends.
I still think Sutherlands is the right lynch. Think about which one is more harmful? The one with the ability that god only ****ing knows what it does, or the one who just makes people talk at night?
I don't think it matters. If we lynch Dagger today and the game is still ongoing, we lynch the Oracle tomorrow and the game ends.
I still think Sutherlands is the right lynch. Think about which one is more harmful? The one with the ability that god only ****ing knows what it does, or the one who just makes people talk at night?
Your overconfidence does not make me more confident.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Your overconfidence does not make me more confident.
If you think I am scum, you just lynch me the day after that! I showed you the math.
7 alive today. Lynch 1 (Dagger/Sutherlands), makes it 6. NK on a mason makes it 5. Lynch 1 (remainder of Dagger/Sutherlands), makes it 4. NK on other mason makes it 3. Lynch me, boom. Game over. The only two left are you and Cyan and you win no matter what your alignments.
The only way that doesn't work is if the masons actually keep their -2 to lynch (and I somehow speed lynch them) OR I am both a day doc for the mafia and have an extra kill. Does anyone here think that this is plausible? Seems like a stretch to me.
I mean, ****, what do I care? Lynch me tomorrow then. It doesn't matter. The only thing we need to decide RIGHT NOW; Do we think there's 1 left or 2? If there's one left, then it SHOULD not matter who we lynch first! I mean, obv, I want Sutherlands to go first because he is the only one who can mess with the math (if he brought back Raf and Raf is the DKer), but we have 3 kills and 3 suspects. Flip a coin.
If we think there are 2 mafia, well, we're basically risking the whole game on an all or nothing gambit to test it. I'd rather lose to a 2 man scum team that made the right roleclaims than lose because we lynched townies who confirmed eachother. Call it ego if you want, but losing because we failed to be prescient is better than losing because we made a collosal mistake.
If we kill sutherlands and you guys want to lych me tomorrow, I'll self-vote. That way, the masons never have to unmask to get the lynch done. I'm totally fine with that.
Only if you're putting in some thought as to whether Grakthis' theory is true. If I revolve into Raf, you'll get to kill 2 birds with one stone - kill the revolving role and get rid of Raf once and for all.
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Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
Please explain to me, if I were mafia, how it's better to rush a lynch on a townie than to let the SK kill one for me? P.S. You might not be a townie.
Because you might be the target of the kill instead, considering your claim? Lynching someone without any defense on his or her part is scummy as hell nonetheless.
It was 80% claimed before that. You just didn't put the pieces together. Let's see, what did I say about the ability before I claimed it?
It's easy to give a bigger picture and then slot in the pieces afterward. Like you know, I claimed a head, a pair of feet, mouth, etc. etc. A human has them. So does a chicken, or an orang-utan, or etc. etc.
Given Az's other Mafia game, is there any reason to be certain that we don't have a 6 Man Mafia group? I'm thinking we almost have to assume there are six Mafia when planning what to do, because how many times has the town got screwed by making plans under the assumption "well, there can't be (X) Mafia left now...."
I'll note here Grak kept trying to leave himself last.
Right about now, I'm fascinated by how Dagger and Sutherlands just became best buddies. Right when everyone think they are the three best targets (third being Grakthis, who they are both attacking) for the next three lynches. What does "coincidence" mean already ? It's not in my dictionary.
I am pretty sure you are very much comfortable being a mason and being "confirmed".
There's something I'm curious about, Dagger, why did you not bring either ZDS or myself into your group before ability was made public?
Night 1, I targeted Cyan since I assumed he can't be a scum with that type of claim. At this point, you haven't claim mason yet, and I wasn't about to trust ZDS is really one without his mason partner revealing himself first.
Night 2, I targeted Axel as a direct result of wishing to confirm Xyre's claim, after consultation with Cyan.
Night 3, I targeted Spoon after deliberation with both Axel and Cyan (He seemed very townie at that time). You were part of the consideration, but I wasn't sure whether my nighttalk will somehow affect your daytalk or not, and in the end, somehow Spoon were chosen over either of you since you both can already communicate with each other.
Night 4, I targeted the Oracle role. There was some questions raised over who will be speaking with us after the role was switched but Puzzle, who was the Oracle at that time, was vanillafied, so it wasn't really pursued on whether I should target Puzzle directly or the Oracle herself. To be honest, the masons weren't really considered by this point. Also, there wasn't really any suggestion by the others from this point onward.
Night 5, I targeted CM to clarify on the Morpheus issue? I think it was requested of me by the town.
Night 6, I targeted Xyre because of the hoo-haa the day before. It was Axel's suggestion that we independently verify what happened between CM and Xyre so that a repeat of the day before doesn't occur.
Night 7, I targeted Rafk. Again, this was also requested of me by the town.
Night 8, feel free to suggest anyone you want IF I survive to the night.
Did you? About Xyre, that reminds me you also supported both of HE and Xyre's wagon while blasting the very supporters about it the very next day.
I did not "support" either of those wagons. I conceeded them. There's a huge difference.
Quote from Dagger »
Because you might be the target of the kill instead, considering your claim? Lynching someone without any defense on his or her part is scummy as hell nonetheless.
This is so silly. I've been calling you scum for 3 game days now. I saw a chance to get you lynched AND avoid a daykill so I pushed for the idea. It really is THAT simple. If it were someone who I hadn't previously been after, you might have a point.
Quote from Dagger »
And why would the SK need to be able to protect other people? Mafia, on the other hand, have their own members to think about.
Way to take what was an obviously rhetorical point and respond to it.
Quote from Dagger »
It's easy to give a bigger picture and then slot in the pieces afterward. Like you know, I claimed a head, a pair of feet, mouth, etc. etc. A human has them. So does a chicken, or an orang-utan, or etc. etc.
Plz inform me of some other ability that fits the list of requirements I provided for my night ability.
Quote from Dagger »
The SK was busy knocking off other people, I assume?
The hell if I know! Like, the SK was killing almost at random at various points. Once he wiffed on Axelrod, he should have killed me. The only thing I can figure is that if Raf was the SK then he knew I would defend him till the end so he kept me around for that.
Quote from DAgger »
Because you are mafia? That will detract from my point how exactly?
That should have said SK, obv.
Quote from Dagger »
Alx have targeted me before. Obviously it's not me.
Which is actually a huge point in your favor. Why kill the guy who makes you roleplay if you're not scared of being forced to roleplay?
If you were mafia, then that would be a TERRIBLE target for you to pick. You should have killed a mason or me.
Hello, and welcome to another good reason why Sutherlands needs to die first.
Actually, Sutherlands and the 2 masons are the only 3 roles that should fear being targeted with Alx's ability.
Alx was killed because he was a cop, and able to clear us. If anyone's having a good reason to kill him, it's you (or someone trying to frame you or us).
Uh... my role is known. Like, myself, axelrod, cyan and dagger could theoretically all be scum, but out ROLES are publicly known at this point.
You, Vamp and Sutherlands could by lying about your roles. Like, obv, Sutherlands is the Oracle... but what ELSE is he? Or more importantly, what else COULD he be tomorrow?
You and Vamp could easily be lying about your roles. But you make a good point... Alx would have been worth killing to stop him from CONFIRMING you and Vamp as your roles as much as to stop him from catching you in a lie. So there's not much we can really do with that.
Except we're still left wondering why no one is roleplaying today.
I think we should kill Sutherlands and get it over with. I would say that he and Dagger are equally likely to be scum, but we know very little about Sutherlands role. The last thing we need is for the SK to rotate back in and kill somebody else. If Sutherlands dies, that can't happen. If he's town, then Dagger is virtually guaranteed to be scum, and can be dealt with tomorrow.
I've been plenty vocal in my willingness to lynch Sutherlands, and plenty vocal of Dagger's possibly scumminess as well. I'm not voting because there is no reason to. Whenever everyone is ready, I'm fully willing to place my vote on Sutherlands. There is no 'rooting from the sidelines'.
Cleaning up the revolving role wouldn't be a bad play here as hopefully it would clear up a lot of the confusion that people have around it. That seems to be the overwhelming topic of conversation now, more than anything else.
I would rather see Grak swing after that and finally Dagger. I still don't have a good feeling about him.
Cleaning up the revolving role wouldn't be a bad play here as hopefully it would clear up a lot of the confusion that people have around it. That seems to be the overwhelming topic of conversation now, more than anything else.
I would rather see Grak swing after that and finally Dagger. I still don't have a good feeling about him.
While I really don't care if I die next, I am curious why you think I'm scummier than Dagger.
I've still got this idea that I'm going to, you know, review stuff, and come up with some brilliant insight nobody's thought of yet. But I haven't and I haven't.
I don't feel like I'm ready to end the day yet though. Sorry if people are getting impatient.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I've still got this idea that I'm going to, you know, review stuff, and come up with some brilliant insight nobody's thought of yet. But I haven't and I haven't.
I don't feel like I'm ready to end the day yet though. Sorry if people are getting impatient.
Ok, well, why don't you let me know when you've decided to unpause the game. Because frankly, I'm sick of coming back here to check and finding that no one else has the balls to take a position.
With any luck, even if this is wrong, it will clear up a lot of uncertainty. I somehow doubt that this is the end though.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
There wasn't any way anyone but you was getting lynched without some kind of massive effort on *someone's* part to persuade everyone else to vote someone else.
It was pretty clear no one else was going to be making said effort, and once I decided I was not going to be able to make said effort myself for at least some significant period of time, and everyone else was just waiting for me at this point, that was pretty much that.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Sutherlands stands with her hands on her hips, an ironic smile on her face. She sighs. With a sad smile, she withdraws a piece of candy from her apron, and pops it into her mouth. She sits and waits. Within a few minutes, her body is cold and lifeless.
You search her body, but find no signs of hostile intent. She appears to have been nothing more than a harmless old woman. You do, however, find a baggy of crumbling chocolate chip cookies. They taste positively scrumptious.
Sutherlands, The Oracle, Townie Shapeshifter, has been killed.
It is now Night 8.
Deadline is set for Thursday, November 1st, at 11:00 PM EST.
Another morning, another splitting headache. Those cookies and the pastries from yesterday just aren't sitting right with you either; Axelrod likely didn't leave them in the oven long enough. You check your weapon once more, and head out.
But as you slip under the security mesh and out onto the mall promenade, a bellowing scream, immediately punctuated by a giant crash, breaks the unnatural stillness of the mall. It's coming from below, once again.
The minutes pass, but only five of you congregate near the bathroom doors. After a few moments, Vampyr steps inside to investigate. The rest of you trail close behind.
As you step inside the bathrooms, you hear the sound of gushing water, and see it sloshing across the tile. Vampyr peers around the corner cautiously. You take a few more steps. You see a stall door hanging half open, a section of the wall still stained with blood from yesterday's slaying of Alx, and a row of urinals, one of which appears to be missing, the pipes spewing water in a steady stream.
You walk through the puddle toward the half-open stall door. Vampyr turns and leaves. You swing the door the rest of the way open. Zedorkslipeur lies sprawled across the toilet, his arms raised as if to ward off a blow. The remains of the urinal lie strewn around him, and his skull has been split wide open, splinters of shattered porcelain embedded into his brain. You leave him behind.
Zedorkslipeur, Dujour, Townie Mason, has been killed.
The five survivors regroup, this time remaining on the bottom level. Vampyr is in constant motion, eyes darting wildly. Axelrod lets out a long, weary sigh. Grakthis strokes his chin, thoughtfully. Cyan is silent and alert. Dagger is poised but tense. The suspicion hanging in the air is palpable. You brace for the fight of your life.
I cannot express how happy I am that a Mason got killed. Now we've really got only Dagger and Grakthis to deal with, and assuming just one scum we may actually be okay.
Grakthis: I don't recall and I am not looking it up, but is your "make a Doc" ability mandatory?
Dagger: did you tell Azrael that you weren't picking anyone, or did he just end the Night before you had a chance to?
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
There, that should answer any questions about me for today and sign my death warrant for tomorrow, assuming there is a tomorrow.
And I will Vote: Cyan. The last two day death scenes required brute force that his character is the only one that would fit it. I severely dislike how both he and Axel ended up voting yesterday and the missing kill that supposedly hit Cyan could easily be explained by them not firing and Cyan just saying he lost a life.
And I got flowers last night. Considering they were of a specific kind, I think Axel's call on Suth and Grak for lying is bogus.
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Current Soul Collector count: 184
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
There, that should answer any questions about me for today and sign my death warrant for tomorrow, assuming there is a tomorrow.
And I will Vote: Cyan. The last two day death scenes required brute force that his character is the only one that would fit it. I severely dislike how both he and Axel ended up voting yesterday and the missing kill that supposedly hit Cyan could easily be explained by them not firing and Cyan just saying he lost a life.
And I got flowers last night. Considering they were of a specific kind, I think Axel's call on Suth and Grak for lying is bogus.
Oh for heaven's sake.
Cyan was targeted by the day-killer, remember that? (or rather, I was targeted by the daykiller and Cyan intercepted) Unless you think Cyan was allowed to try and day-kill someone that he was obligated to protect, eliminating one of his own lives, and also making the scene that Az wrote impossible, he's not day-killing.
As far as Night-killing - the only way - only way you could think Cyan was Night-killing scum would be if I was scum with him. Yes? Because I am supporting his claim that he got targeted for death on Night 5 (or whenever it was). I do not believe that the scum would have been allowed to "fake" a Night-kill on one of their own and that I would also then receive a PM about it. So you basically would be saying you don't believe me.
Which I suppose you could do, but then what, are you speculating that there's a 6 Man Mafia? And that 2 of the Mafia are linked as Cyan and I are? And that I would come out on Day 1 to "protect" him if I was scumbuddies with him - fully knowing that there was a day-killer running around who could shoot us down if he so chose.
If there's a 6 man scum group, then Grakthis and Dagger are the last 2 and you are throwing the game to them by voting Cyan.
Are you speculating that Cyan and I are an independant 2-man Night-killing scum group? Who just wasn't killing at all while the Mafia were killing?
Using the "flavor" of a brute force attack is really, really sketchy.
I can sort of understand where you are coming from on the Sutherlands lynch, because I did throw in ther towel there, and it happened kind of abruptly. But it's not like it was really a "speed" lynch either. The town was going round and round for days on it for quite a while. And frankly, if the day-killer is in limbo, it still might turn out to have been the correct call.
The flowers just make no sense at all. I will be really annoyed if they do something that turns out to be important and we actually lose as a result of whatever it is they do.
Please unvote. Casting a quick vote does not help us right now.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I think it's awesome how first, Vampyr tried to call out Axel and myself yesterday for not voting. And then when we did vote? Now he's calling us out for that as well. Nice double standard, buddy. Axelrod already debunked everything else in admirable fashion, so no need to repeat there.
And also, the notion that we, as scum, 'skipped' a kill so that I could 'fake' having been NKed(nevermind that this wouldn't actually accomplish anything) is pretty silly. Especially since, for all anyone knew at that point, ZDS could still watch people, and could have confirmed/denied my having been targeted. Also, the SK had already targeted me once at that point, meaning that I was putting myself at risk of him killing me. Certainly would have looked suspect if I had claimed to have lost a life, then gotten targeted by the SK again and still been alive afterwards. What you're attesting would have me taking a *colossal* amount of risk, for essentially *zero* gain. It's just impossible, in any practical sense.
Dagger is, almost surely, scum. I highly doubt that there is any scum left,other than him. Let's just lynch him and get this game over with already.
I cannot express how happy I am that a Mason got killed. Now we've really got only Dagger and Grakthis to deal with, and assuming just one scum we may actually be okay.
Agreed, though it was the obvious kill.
If you're mafia with a bodyguard AND you can give a day kill to the town, well, as I said yesterday, we're ****ed anyways. I mean, the mod couldn't possibly expect us to actually figure that out?
So, for me this one is easy. We lynch Dagger.
Quote from Axelrod »
Grakthis: I don't recall and I am not looking it up, but is your "make a Doc" ability mandatory?
There, that should answer any questions about me for today and sign my death warrant for tomorrow, assuming there is a tomorrow.
And I will Vote: Cyan. The last two day death scenes required brute force that his character is the only one that would fit it. I severely dislike how both he and Axel ended up voting yesterday and the missing kill that supposedly hit Cyan could easily be explained by them not firing and Cyan just saying he lost a life.
And I got flowers last night. Considering they were of a specific kind, I think Axel's call on Suth and Grak for lying is bogus.
First of all, we know Cyan has 2 lives. We know this because we already had a scene where Cyan got shot up, and then the mod reposted to fix it. He got a PM telling him he had a life back BEFORE the mod posted the correction or sent me a PM telling me he fixed it. So doubting that aspect of Cyan's role is wrong.
Your intentions are good, and I understand your doubts, but we have to play the odds here. So let's work it out....
If we lynch Cyan and we're wrong, the mafia kills you tonight and tomorrow it's me + axelrod + dagger. And if it shows up that Cyan was town then obv Axelrod finds himself having to decide between me and Dagger.
If we lynch Dagger and we're wrong, they kill you tonight and the game is over immediatly because Cyan and Axelrod are scum together.
Now, purely looking at odds, what is more likely... Dagger is the Merovingian's wife, with the ability to bring people into a talking circle and is the last remaining scum OR Cyan and Axelrod are a two man nightkilling team where Axelrod can give a kill to the town and Cyan takes two kills to remove.
As far as play style goes, I'd put Cyan and Dagger as equally scummy. That being, Cyan is only alive because of his roleclaim and Dagger is only alive because I could not get anyone to agree with me.
To me, all of this STILL points to a Dagger lynch except that if we are wrong about Dagger we can still lynch him the next day but if we are wrong about Cyan we lose the game immediatly.
Heh. You don't know how much doubt I was actually having about the Masons just surviving as long as they had already. In thread I wasn't expressing doubts specifically with the hope that (if said claimed Masons were not scum) the scum would deduce that he had to NK them to have any chance at all. But in fact, had Cyan bit the dust last Night (which was my biggest fear), I would have seriously been questioning how they could be town and still alive. Even though it didn't make sense. But few things in this game have made sense. [/quote]
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Heh. You don't know how much doubt I was actually having about the Masons just surviving as long as they had already. In thread I wasn't expressing doubts specifically with the hope that (if said claimed Masons were not scum) the scum would deduce that he had to NK them to have any chance at all. But in fact, had Cyan bit the dust last Night (which was my biggest fear), I would have seriously been questioning how they could be town and still alive. Even though it didn't make sense. But few things in this game have made sense.
I would argue that nothing in this game makes sense.
We apparently have a dead SK who wasn't revealed on death. We have completely unaccounted for missing kills, we have townies abilities that their owners couldn't figure out, we have people getting targeted with abilities that we can't figure out....
Cyan was targeted by the day-killer, remember that? (or rather, I was targeted by the daykiller and Cyan intercepted) Unless you think Cyan was allowed to try and day-kill someone that he was obligated to protect, eliminating one of his own lives, and also making the scene that Az wrote impossible, he's not day-killing.
I don't believe that Cyan is day killing. But here Cyan claims he lost a life during night 5. That's what I was referring to. Not the day kill scene.
As far as Night-killing - the only way - only way you could think Cyan was Night-killing scum would be if I was scum with him. Yes? Because I am supporting his claim that he got targeted for death on Night 5 (or whenever it was). I do not believe that the scum would have been allowed to "fake" a Night-kill on one of their own and that I would also then receive a PM about it. So you basically would be saying you don't believe me.
Yes, I am starting to believe that there are 2 scum left and it's the two of you. Who says they have to "fake" a kill. All Cyan has to do is make up a story and pass it along. Az isn't going to come out and verify whether Cyan is being truthful about it. The rest of us have no idea. Same goes for you supposed receiving or not receiving a message.
Which I suppose you could do, but then what, are you speculating that there's a 6 Man Mafia? And that 2 of the Mafia are linked as Cyan and I are? And that I would come out on Day 1 to "protect" him if I was scumbuddies with him - fully knowing that there was a day-killer running around who could shoot us down if he so chose.
Exactly what are you protecting. Your roles could very well be Connor and the T-800 and you're scum rather than the townies you've been pawning yourselves off as. And why would the daykiller want to have to waste three shots to eliminate two people, assuming both of you are telling the truth. Maybe Cyan having two lives was a way to keep the daykiller off of the two of you for a while.
Using the "flavor" of a brute force attack is really, really sketchy.
LJustus, Sati, Townie Sacrificial Lamb. Bitten and drained, night one.
No kill night two
Pod, Private Detective Ash, Townie Cop. Bitten and drained, night 3.
-Hey look atlseal the Cat dies day 4 and no more draining.
Fadeblue, Veil, Townie Nullifier. Two bullets to the chest, night four.
-Why two bullets? Maybe because of the Twins killed him?
Night 5 Cyan supposedly absorbs a kill
No kill night six
Alx2, Tyler Durden, Townie Revealer. Lost his last fight, night seven.
-"Alx2 is a bleeding, oozing pulp"
Zedorkslipeur, Dujour, Townie Mason. Splitting headache, night eight.
-ZDS killed by a urinal? A freakin' urinal.
What more evidence does anyone need that the kill scenes are tied to roles and that Alx and ZDS's death's were done by someone with enormous strength. Who is that? Persephone? Dr. Morneau? Choi? Right. Next you'll try to see me ocean front property in Michigan.
I can sort of understand where you are coming from on the Sutherlands lynch, because I did throw in ther towel there, and it happened kind of abruptly. But it's not like it was really a "speed" lynch either. The town was going round and round for days on it for quite a while. And frankly, if the day-killer is in limbo, it still might turn out to have been the correct call.
And here is you taking it upon yourself for being responsible for the lynching. Because if you admit your mistake enough the rest of us will believe you and not blame you?
The flowers just make no sense at all. I will be really annoyed if they do something that turns out to be important and we actually lose as a result of whatever it is they do.
Please unvote. Casting a quick vote does not help us right now.
And here is more mock despair at thinking the game is lost. I don't buy it.
I think it's awesome how first, Vampyr tried to call out Axel and myself yesterday for not voting. And then when we did vote? Now he's calling us out for that as well. Nice double standard, buddy. Axelrod already debunked everything else in admirable fashion, so no need to repeat there.
I did not call the two of you out for just voting. It was the way the two of you voted. How long did you two go without placing a vote on anyone. Then all of a sudden it's bang, bang. That's what I found interesting.
And also, the notion that we, as scum, 'skipped' a kill so that I could 'fake' having been NKed(nevermind that this wouldn't actually accomplish anything) is pretty silly. Especially since, for all anyone knew at that point, ZDS could still watch people, and could have confirmed/denied my having been targeted.
Only problem is ZDS said that it was J Effe giving him the ability after J Effe showed up in the kill list on night 4. So yes, it was known that ZDS couldn't watch anymore.
Also, the SK had already targeted me once at that point, meaning that I was putting myself at risk of him killing me. Certainly would have looked suspect if I had claimed to have lost a life, then gotten targeted by the SK again and still been alive afterwards. What you're attesting would have me taking a *colossal* amount of risk, for essentially *zero* gain. It's just impossible, in any practical sense.
I'm not focusing on the SK right now. What I can see is the day scenes after night and the manner people were killed in. I firmly believe that it makes you the likely killer and that's where I'm voting.
Dagger is, almost surely, scum. I highly doubt that there is any scum left,other than him. Let's just lynch him and get this game over with already.
"hey guys, get him, he has to be it. Don't worry about anything else." This comes across as such a false sense of assuredness. So bogus, it's scum like.
@Grak: I understand what you're saying, but right now I'm going this route. Everything Cyan and Axel have done so far today sounds, looks and tastes fishy. Both have come across as too eager to end the game.
I just went looking for something about John Connor having something to do with flowers. I found something, but it's about the T-800 and the flowers he has in a box that he pulls a shotgun out of the box of flowers and tosses it all to the floor. What if the T-800 is the flower giver?
This cinches it for me, Cyan has got to be scum. I'm positive that ZDS received flowers at some point. I need to search through our PMs to find it.
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PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
This cinches it for me, Cyan has got to be scum. I'm positive that ZDS received flowers at some point. I need to search through our PMs to find it.
I trust you more than Cyan and Axelrod. You're a confirmed mason.
That said... if you ARE right, and we lynch Cyan, and he shows up scum, Axelrod kills you tonight and tomorrow Dagger and I cannot even attempt to lynch ....
Wait...
What happens if we lynch Cyan, we no lynch, Axelrod kills Dagger, we lock, Axelrod kills me, I kill axelrod and the game draws?
****. I forgot about my ability. I guess there ARE ways that a scum axelrod can lose.
If this were LOL, I'd be voting for Dagger. But since if we mislynch Cyan we still get another day, I am willing to go with whatever you decide.
Seriously, I don't mean to be rude, but you are not thinking straight.
(1) You've got this idea in your head that Cyan and myself "speedylynched" Sutherlands and, man, wasn't that just so scummy. Have you actually looked back at how the last game day went? Grakthis voted Sutherlands (#4384 10/25/07). Nobody else voted him for four days. Then Cyan vote Sutherlands (#4442 10/29/07). And I voted Sutherlands (#4443 10/30/07).
Sutherlands wasn't even lynched at that point. He hammered himself in post #4444. We did not "speedy-lynch" him. Sheesh.
Which is completely aside from the fact that (1) Dagger had said he supported a Sutherlands lynch. (2) Abbey had said he agreed cleaning up the revolving role was a good idea. (3) Your mason partner said he supported either a Sutherlands or Dagger lynch. (4) Grakthis was moaning like a child that something needed to happen. That would be eveyone left in the game but you. You kind of sat back and chastised Cyan and myself for not voting. Is that irony?
You think Cyan and Myself are both scum, correct? This means you think either (1) we are Mafia members #5 and #6, or (2) we are an independant 2-man group.
(1) You think Cyan and myself are Mafia #5 and #6. This means you think the Mafia chose not to kill on Night 5, specifically so Cyan could claim they went after him. And I just made up the stuff about receiving a PM from Az.
Do you see where this is completely stupid for the Mafia to do? To skip a kill they don't have to skip, in order to try and make Cyan even more clear looking (which the town only has his and my word on anyway), and also brilliantly making Cyan totally exposable by the day-killer?
You know, the Day-killer could easily have chosen to go after Cyan that day. Especially after Cyan admitted he had lost a life. That would have been an ideal time for the Day-killer to strike. I rather think the Mafia was hoping that he would. But instead, the town got extremely lucky and the day-killer popped Carrion Pigeons.
Is this really what you think was going on? I'm insulted that you think any Mafia I was a part of would come up with such a retarded plan.
(2) Or is it that you think Cyan and Myself are an independant 2-man scum team. Separate from the Mafia and the day-killer, not to mention the Cult. And we are a 2-man team that has just not been killing at all for the whole game until the Mafia was eliminated. That sure was clever of us, wasn't it. And you also think we tied ourselves together from Day 1, which would have been an extremmly poor decision on our part, by the way.
But then, as soon as the Mafia is gone we coincidentally started up bludgening people. And you think Cyan is doing the bludgening because he's the T-800 (which he claimed).
I mean, if the kill method was so horribly incriminating, wouldn't I have done the kill instead of Cyan? Your logic makes no sense and, does not fit what happened in the game so far, and also requires us to be stupid (or is it just incredibly lucky? Or both).
Plus, I have this nifty little extra ability to just give away a day-kill. Does that fit in anywhere in this theory?
You are the one who is making a huge deal out of the flowers now. Certainly not me. You think Cyan is the one giving away flowers, as the T-800 (and also bludgening, of course).
Yesterday, after Grak and Sutherlands both claimed something different from my experience, I pretty much threw up my hands at the whole affair. Why on earth would we then give them to you? Specifically so we could try and make me look worse? Yes, yes I see it now.
Seriously, what are you thinking? The (presumably) last scum kind of has to be Grakthis or Dagger.
Now I wonder if Grakthis just tipped his hat by actually going for this idea.
@Grakthis: Also, what means this:
Quote from Grakthis »
Axelrod kills me, I kill axelrod and the game draws?
Are you equating your "cloning" power with a kill here? And speculating that, if the game got down to just you and the last scum, it would be a draw?
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Dagger: did you tell Azrael that you weren't picking anyone, or did he just end the Night before you had a chance to?
He ended the night before I had a chance to. By the time I woke up and logged into MTGS, all I have are messages from the others and it's already Day. I thought we have until Thursday?
I have read everything, and so far I must say I am persuaded by Vampyr somewhat, considering he's the most confirmed person we have right now.
The only fear I have is that if Cyan is not scum and Grak is, and I am lynched next, then there'll be no second chance for the town to rectify that mistake.
Now I wonder if Grakthis just tipped his hat by actually going for this idea.
This is simple: I'm going to support the confirmed mason because I know his motives are honest and his idea is not mutually exclusive to killing Dagger. Technically, his idea gives us 2 chances to win, killing Dagger today gives us 1 (from my POV, obv). Even though I still believe Dagger has a higher chance of being scum, if we lynch Cyan first, it means instead of having X% (where X is the chance of Dagger being scum) chance of winning we have X% - A% (where A is the chance the scum have another trick we aren't expecting) + Y% (where Y is the chance of CYan being scum). So as long as the odds of the scum having a trick are lower than the odds of Cyan being scum, it's the right odds play.
If our mason decides this is the right play, i'll back him. If he doesn't, I'll put my vote on Dagger.
Quote from Axelrod »
Are you equating your "cloning" power with a kill here? And speculating that, if the game got down to just you and the last scum, it would be a draw?
As I have said several times now, the person I target DIES. But instead of going to the dead list and having their role revealed, they go to the replacement list.
But they will NEVER come back because the game will end with 0 players alive.
Actually, the town MIGHT win, depending on how Azrael rules. Because our win conditions says the scum must die, and there's probably says the town must die AND one of them must be alive. That's normally how it works. So if everyone dies, the town wins.
Also, my ability triggers on being TARGETED not on being killed. So it is also possible that Az would rule that my ability happens first and therefore the town wins.
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Two conclusions:
1) Someone is lying. Who is that someone? The person most likely targeted by Alx, obv.
2) Alx was roleblocked or did not submit an aciton
I don't think we can lynch based on any of this... but man.. we are at the point in the game where we have a dozen theories that could turn out to be true, and NOTHING to tell us that one of them is better than the other. They are all equally insane. They all have holes in them. We just have to pick one and go with it.
I'm saying that directly because of Dagger's ability to night-talk, a scum got caught. I'm NOT saying this clears him. It's very possible that he's scum. I'm just trying to put pieces together and use the information that we have to figure this out. Thus, I was putting out what I thought were important pieces.
Also, if I'm not the one lynched today, I will be donning the smith avatar (one more attempt to stop the player-change from happening).
Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
America == Velociraptor
Play IRC mafia. (/join #mafia)
Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
America == Velociraptor
Play IRC mafia. (/join #mafia)
Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
America == Velociraptor
Play IRC mafia. (/join #mafia)
Raf.: if you are reading this, assuming you have some kind of choice in the matter (as CM indicated) and if you were town. DON'T COME BACK.
Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
America == Velociraptor
Play IRC mafia. (/join #mafia)
I don't think it matters. If we lynch Dagger today and the game is still ongoing, we lynch the Oracle tomorrow and the game ends.
I still think Sutherlands is the right lynch. Think about which one is more harmful? The one with the ability that god only ****ing knows what it does, or the one who just makes people talk at night?
Your overconfidence does not make me more confident.
If you think I am scum, you just lynch me the day after that! I showed you the math.
7 alive today. Lynch 1 (Dagger/Sutherlands), makes it 6. NK on a mason makes it 5. Lynch 1 (remainder of Dagger/Sutherlands), makes it 4. NK on other mason makes it 3. Lynch me, boom. Game over. The only two left are you and Cyan and you win no matter what your alignments.
The only way that doesn't work is if the masons actually keep their -2 to lynch (and I somehow speed lynch them) OR I am both a day doc for the mafia and have an extra kill. Does anyone here think that this is plausible? Seems like a stretch to me.
I mean, ****, what do I care? Lynch me tomorrow then. It doesn't matter. The only thing we need to decide RIGHT NOW; Do we think there's 1 left or 2? If there's one left, then it SHOULD not matter who we lynch first! I mean, obv, I want Sutherlands to go first because he is the only one who can mess with the math (if he brought back Raf and Raf is the DKer), but we have 3 kills and 3 suspects. Flip a coin.
If we think there are 2 mafia, well, we're basically risking the whole game on an all or nothing gambit to test it. I'd rather lose to a 2 man scum team that made the right roleclaims than lose because we lynched townies who confirmed eachother. Call it ego if you want, but losing because we failed to be prescient is better than losing because we made a collosal mistake.
If we kill sutherlands and you guys want to lych me tomorrow, I'll self-vote. That way, the masons never have to unmask to get the lynch done. I'm totally fine with that.
2 Dagger-ZDS, Sutherlands
1 Sutherlands-Grakthis
Not Voting-Axelrod, Vampyr, Cyan, Dagger
With 7 alive, it's 4 to lynch.
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
America == Velociraptor
Play IRC mafia. (/join #mafia)
Did you? About Xyre, that reminds me you also supported both of HE and Xyre's wagon while blasting the very supporters about it the very next day.
Because you might be the target of the kill instead, considering your claim? Lynching someone without any defense on his or her part is scummy as hell nonetheless.
And why would the SK need to be able to protect other people? Mafia, on the other hand, have their own members to think about.
It's easy to give a bigger picture and then slot in the pieces afterward. Like you know, I claimed a head, a pair of feet, mouth, etc. etc. A human has them. So does a chicken, or an orang-utan, or etc. etc.
The SK was busy knocking off other people, I assume?
Because you are mafia? That will detract from my point how exactly?
I was stating my opinion. As usual, your insightful thinking is appreciated, as are both your reasoning and response.
I'll note here Grak kept trying to leave himself last.
Alx have targeted me before. Obviously it's not me.
I am pretty sure you are very much comfortable being a mason and being "confirmed".
Night 1, I targeted Cyan since I assumed he can't be a scum with that type of claim. At this point, you haven't claim mason yet, and I wasn't about to trust ZDS is really one without his mason partner revealing himself first.
Night 2, I targeted Axel as a direct result of wishing to confirm Xyre's claim, after consultation with Cyan.
Night 3, I targeted Spoon after deliberation with both Axel and Cyan (He seemed very townie at that time). You were part of the consideration, but I wasn't sure whether my nighttalk will somehow affect your daytalk or not, and in the end, somehow Spoon were chosen over either of you since you both can already communicate with each other.
Night 4, I targeted the Oracle role. There was some questions raised over who will be speaking with us after the role was switched but Puzzle, who was the Oracle at that time, was vanillafied, so it wasn't really pursued on whether I should target Puzzle directly or the Oracle herself. To be honest, the masons weren't really considered by this point. Also, there wasn't really any suggestion by the others from this point onward.
Night 5, I targeted CM to clarify on the Morpheus issue? I think it was requested of me by the town.
Night 6, I targeted Xyre because of the hoo-haa the day before. It was Axel's suggestion that we independently verify what happened between CM and Xyre so that a repeat of the day before doesn't occur.
Night 7, I targeted Rafk. Again, this was also requested of me by the town.
Night 8, feel free to suggest anyone you want IF I survive to the night.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
I did not "support" either of those wagons. I conceeded them. There's a huge difference.
This is so silly. I've been calling you scum for 3 game days now. I saw a chance to get you lynched AND avoid a daykill so I pushed for the idea. It really is THAT simple. If it were someone who I hadn't previously been after, you might have a point.
Way to take what was an obviously rhetorical point and respond to it.
Plz inform me of some other ability that fits the list of requirements I provided for my night ability.
The hell if I know! Like, the SK was killing almost at random at various points. Once he wiffed on Axelrod, he should have killed me. The only thing I can figure is that if Raf was the SK then he knew I would defend him till the end so he kept me around for that.
That should have said SK, obv.
Which is actually a huge point in your favor. Why kill the guy who makes you roleplay if you're not scared of being forced to roleplay?
If you were mafia, then that would be a TERRIBLE target for you to pick. You should have killed a mason or me.
Hello, and welcome to another good reason why Sutherlands needs to die first.
Actually, Sutherlands and the 2 masons are the only 3 roles that should fear being targeted with Alx's ability.
That is worth considering tomorrow.
If you're lying about your roles, obv.
Uh... my role is known. Like, myself, axelrod, cyan and dagger could theoretically all be scum, but out ROLES are publicly known at this point.
You, Vamp and Sutherlands could by lying about your roles. Like, obv, Sutherlands is the Oracle... but what ELSE is he? Or more importantly, what else COULD he be tomorrow?
You and Vamp could easily be lying about your roles. But you make a good point... Alx would have been worth killing to stop him from CONFIRMING you and Vamp as your roles as much as to stop him from catching you in a lie. So there's not much we can really do with that.
Except we're still left wondering why no one is roleplaying today.
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
No more suspicious than I am of this "rooting from the sideline" feeling I'm getting from both you and Axel.
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
I would rather see Grak swing after that and finally Dagger. I still don't have a good feeling about him.
While I really don't care if I die next, I am curious why you think I'm scummier than Dagger.
I don't feel like I'm ready to end the day yet though. Sorry if people are getting impatient.
I am willing to support a Suth's lynch.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
Ok, well, why don't you let me know when you've decided to unpause the game. Because frankly, I'm sick of coming back here to check and finding that no one else has the balls to take a position.
This is pointless, let's just keep going.
Vote: Sutherlands
With any luck, even if this is wrong, it will clear up a lot of uncertainty. I somehow doubt that this is the end though.
*sigh*
Unvote, Vote Sutherlands
Hey, you! Yeah, you behind the computer screen! You're unconstitutional.
America == Velociraptor
Play IRC mafia. (/join #mafia)
It was pretty clear no one else was going to be making said effort, and once I decided I was not going to be able to make said effort myself for at least some significant period of time, and everyone else was just waiting for me at this point, that was pretty much that.
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
1 Dagger-ZDS
4 Sutherlands-Grakthis, Axelrod, Cyan, Sutherlands
Not Voting-Vampyr, Dagger
---
Sutherlands stands with her hands on her hips, an ironic smile on her face. She sighs. With a sad smile, she withdraws a piece of candy from her apron, and pops it into her mouth. She sits and waits. Within a few minutes, her body is cold and lifeless.
You search her body, but find no signs of hostile intent. She appears to have been nothing more than a harmless old woman. You do, however, find a baggy of crumbling chocolate chip cookies. They taste positively scrumptious.
Sutherlands, The Oracle, Townie Shapeshifter, has been killed.
It is now Night 8.
Deadline is set for Thursday, November 1st, at 11:00 PM EST.
But as you slip under the security mesh and out onto the mall promenade, a bellowing scream, immediately punctuated by a giant crash, breaks the unnatural stillness of the mall. It's coming from below, once again.
The minutes pass, but only five of you congregate near the bathroom doors. After a few moments, Vampyr steps inside to investigate. The rest of you trail close behind.
As you step inside the bathrooms, you hear the sound of gushing water, and see it sloshing across the tile. Vampyr peers around the corner cautiously. You take a few more steps. You see a stall door hanging half open, a section of the wall still stained with blood from yesterday's slaying of Alx, and a row of urinals, one of which appears to be missing, the pipes spewing water in a steady stream.
You walk through the puddle toward the half-open stall door. Vampyr turns and leaves. You swing the door the rest of the way open. Zedorkslipeur lies sprawled across the toilet, his arms raised as if to ward off a blow. The remains of the urinal lie strewn around him, and his skull has been split wide open, splinters of shattered porcelain embedded into his brain. You leave him behind.
Zedorkslipeur, Dujour, Townie Mason, has been killed.
The five survivors regroup, this time remaining on the bottom level. Vampyr is in constant motion, eyes darting wildly. Axelrod lets out a long, weary sigh. Grakthis strokes his chin, thoughtfully. Cyan is silent and alert. Dagger is poised but tense. The suspicion hanging in the air is palpable. You brace for the fight of your life.
The ninth day has begun.
Three votes will kill.
Grakthis: I don't recall and I am not looking it up, but is your "make a Doc" ability mandatory?
Dagger: did you tell Azrael that you weren't picking anyone, or did he just end the Night before you had a chance to?
And I will Vote: Cyan. The last two day death scenes required brute force that his character is the only one that would fit it. I severely dislike how both he and Axel ended up voting yesterday and the missing kill that supposedly hit Cyan could easily be explained by them not firing and Cyan just saying he lost a life.
And I got flowers last night. Considering they were of a specific kind, I think Axel's call on Suth and Grak for lying is bogus.
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
Oh for heaven's sake.
Cyan was targeted by the day-killer, remember that? (or rather, I was targeted by the daykiller and Cyan intercepted) Unless you think Cyan was allowed to try and day-kill someone that he was obligated to protect, eliminating one of his own lives, and also making the scene that Az wrote impossible, he's not day-killing.
As far as Night-killing - the only way - only way you could think Cyan was Night-killing scum would be if I was scum with him. Yes? Because I am supporting his claim that he got targeted for death on Night 5 (or whenever it was). I do not believe that the scum would have been allowed to "fake" a Night-kill on one of their own and that I would also then receive a PM about it. So you basically would be saying you don't believe me.
Which I suppose you could do, but then what, are you speculating that there's a 6 Man Mafia? And that 2 of the Mafia are linked as Cyan and I are? And that I would come out on Day 1 to "protect" him if I was scumbuddies with him - fully knowing that there was a day-killer running around who could shoot us down if he so chose.
If there's a 6 man scum group, then Grakthis and Dagger are the last 2 and you are throwing the game to them by voting Cyan.
Are you speculating that Cyan and I are an independant 2-man Night-killing scum group? Who just wasn't killing at all while the Mafia were killing?
Using the "flavor" of a brute force attack is really, really sketchy.
I can sort of understand where you are coming from on the Sutherlands lynch, because I did throw in ther towel there, and it happened kind of abruptly. But it's not like it was really a "speed" lynch either. The town was going round and round for days on it for quite a while. And frankly, if the day-killer is in limbo, it still might turn out to have been the correct call.
The flowers just make no sense at all. I will be really annoyed if they do something that turns out to be important and we actually lose as a result of whatever it is they do.
Please unvote. Casting a quick vote does not help us right now.
And also, the notion that we, as scum, 'skipped' a kill so that I could 'fake' having been NKed(nevermind that this wouldn't actually accomplish anything) is pretty silly. Especially since, for all anyone knew at that point, ZDS could still watch people, and could have confirmed/denied my having been targeted. Also, the SK had already targeted me once at that point, meaning that I was putting myself at risk of him killing me. Certainly would have looked suspect if I had claimed to have lost a life, then gotten targeted by the SK again and still been alive afterwards. What you're attesting would have me taking a *colossal* amount of risk, for essentially *zero* gain. It's just impossible, in any practical sense.
Dagger is, almost surely, scum. I highly doubt that there is any scum left,other than him. Let's just lynch him and get this game over with already.
Agreed, though it was the obvious kill.
If you're mafia with a bodyguard AND you can give a day kill to the town, well, as I said yesterday, we're ****ed anyways. I mean, the mod couldn't possibly expect us to actually figure that out?
So, for me this one is easy. We lynch Dagger.
Optional.
First of all, we know Cyan has 2 lives. We know this because we already had a scene where Cyan got shot up, and then the mod reposted to fix it. He got a PM telling him he had a life back BEFORE the mod posted the correction or sent me a PM telling me he fixed it. So doubting that aspect of Cyan's role is wrong.
Your intentions are good, and I understand your doubts, but we have to play the odds here. So let's work it out....
If we lynch Cyan and we're wrong, the mafia kills you tonight and tomorrow it's me + axelrod + dagger. And if it shows up that Cyan was town then obv Axelrod finds himself having to decide between me and Dagger.
If we lynch Dagger and we're wrong, they kill you tonight and the game is over immediatly because Cyan and Axelrod are scum together.
Now, purely looking at odds, what is more likely... Dagger is the Merovingian's wife, with the ability to bring people into a talking circle and is the last remaining scum OR Cyan and Axelrod are a two man nightkilling team where Axelrod can give a kill to the town and Cyan takes two kills to remove.
As far as play style goes, I'd put Cyan and Dagger as equally scummy. That being, Cyan is only alive because of his roleclaim and Dagger is only alive because I could not get anyone to agree with me.
To me, all of this STILL points to a Dagger lynch except that if we are wrong about Dagger we can still lynch him the next day but if we are wrong about Cyan we lose the game immediatly.
Which means the game would be over already and we wouldn't even be discussing this, right?
Like, if we lynched Cyan and he came up scum, it would be 3 left the next day and axelrod would be 4 to lynch and we'd lose.
Therefore, Axelrod cannot be scum, because if he were, the game would already be over.
Someone tell me how my logic is wrong here?
Heh. You don't know how much doubt I was actually having about the Masons just surviving as long as they had already. In thread I wasn't expressing doubts specifically with the hope that (if said claimed Masons were not scum) the scum would deduce that he had to NK them to have any chance at all. But in fact, had Cyan bit the dust last Night (which was my biggest fear), I would have seriously been questioning how they could be town and still alive. Even though it didn't make sense. But few things in this game have made sense. [/quote]
I would argue that nothing in this game makes sense.
We apparently have a dead SK who wasn't revealed on death. We have completely unaccounted for missing kills, we have townies abilities that their owners couldn't figure out, we have people getting targeted with abilities that we can't figure out....
Seriously. Makes. No. Sense.
I don't believe that Cyan is day killing. But here Cyan claims he lost a life during night 5. That's what I was referring to. Not the day kill scene.
Yes, I am starting to believe that there are 2 scum left and it's the two of you. Who says they have to "fake" a kill. All Cyan has to do is make up a story and pass it along. Az isn't going to come out and verify whether Cyan is being truthful about it. The rest of us have no idea. Same goes for you supposed receiving or not receiving a message.
Exactly what are you protecting. Your roles could very well be Connor and the T-800 and you're scum rather than the townies you've been pawning yourselves off as. And why would the daykiller want to have to waste three shots to eliminate two people, assuming both of you are telling the truth. Maybe Cyan having two lives was a way to keep the daykiller off of the two of you for a while.
This smacks so much of "Sheep, vote for someone else so that Cyan and I can speed lynch and win."
I'm not speculating anything past the possibility of there being two mafioso remaining and the two of you being them.
LJustus, Sati, Townie Sacrificial Lamb. Bitten and drained, night one.
No kill night two
Pod, Private Detective Ash, Townie Cop. Bitten and drained, night 3.
-Hey look atlseal the Cat dies day 4 and no more draining.
Fadeblue, Veil, Townie Nullifier. Two bullets to the chest, night four.
-Why two bullets? Maybe because of the Twins killed him?
Night 5 Cyan supposedly absorbs a kill
No kill night six
Alx2, Tyler Durden, Townie Revealer. Lost his last fight, night seven.
-"Alx2 is a bleeding, oozing pulp"
Zedorkslipeur, Dujour, Townie Mason. Splitting headache, night eight.
-ZDS killed by a urinal? A freakin' urinal.
What more evidence does anyone need that the kill scenes are tied to roles and that Alx and ZDS's death's were done by someone with enormous strength. Who is that? Persephone? Dr. Morneau? Choi? Right. Next you'll try to see me ocean front property in Michigan.
And here is you taking it upon yourself for being responsible for the lynching. Because if you admit your mistake enough the rest of us will believe you and not blame you?
And here is more mock despair at thinking the game is lost. I don't buy it.
I did not call the two of you out for just voting. It was the way the two of you voted. How long did you two go without placing a vote on anyone. Then all of a sudden it's bang, bang. That's what I found interesting.
Only problem is ZDS said that it was J Effe giving him the ability after J Effe showed up in the kill list on night 4. So yes, it was known that ZDS couldn't watch anymore.
I'm not focusing on the SK right now. What I can see is the day scenes after night and the manner people were killed in. I firmly believe that it makes you the likely killer and that's where I'm voting.
"hey guys, get him, he has to be it. Don't worry about anything else." This comes across as such a false sense of assuredness. So bogus, it's scum like.
@Grak: I understand what you're saying, but right now I'm going this route. Everything Cyan and Axel have done so far today sounds, looks and tastes fishy. Both have come across as too eager to end the game.
I just went looking for something about John Connor having something to do with flowers. I found something, but it's about the T-800 and the flowers he has in a box that he pulls a shotgun out of the box of flowers and tosses it all to the floor. What if the T-800 is the flower giver?
This cinches it for me, Cyan has got to be scum. I'm positive that ZDS received flowers at some point. I need to search through our PMs to find it.
PM me if you have any to trade or sell.
Games finished:17
Games ongoing:1
Town/Mafia/Other - 13/2/2
Won/Lost/replaced/modkilled- 4/13/3/1
NK'ed(vig'ed)/Lynched/Endgamed(Survived) - 7(2)/5/5(1)
Matrix Mafia Town MVP
Medieval Mafia Mafia MVP
Ye have enemies? Good, good - it means ye've stood up for something, sometime in thy life. - Elminster of Shadowdale
I trust you more than Cyan and Axelrod. You're a confirmed mason.
That said... if you ARE right, and we lynch Cyan, and he shows up scum, Axelrod kills you tonight and tomorrow Dagger and I cannot even attempt to lynch ....
Wait...
What happens if we lynch Cyan, we no lynch, Axelrod kills Dagger, we lock, Axelrod kills me, I kill axelrod and the game draws?
****. I forgot about my ability. I guess there ARE ways that a scum axelrod can lose.
If this were LOL, I'd be voting for Dagger. But since if we mislynch Cyan we still get another day, I am willing to go with whatever you decide.
Seriously, I don't mean to be rude, but you are not thinking straight.
(1) You've got this idea in your head that Cyan and myself "speedylynched" Sutherlands and, man, wasn't that just so scummy. Have you actually looked back at how the last game day went? Grakthis voted Sutherlands (#4384 10/25/07). Nobody else voted him for four days. Then Cyan vote Sutherlands (#4442 10/29/07). And I voted Sutherlands (#4443 10/30/07).
Sutherlands wasn't even lynched at that point. He hammered himself in post #4444. We did not "speedy-lynch" him. Sheesh.
Which is completely aside from the fact that (1) Dagger had said he supported a Sutherlands lynch. (2) Abbey had said he agreed cleaning up the revolving role was a good idea. (3) Your mason partner said he supported either a Sutherlands or Dagger lynch. (4) Grakthis was moaning like a child that something needed to happen. That would be eveyone left in the game but you. You kind of sat back and chastised Cyan and myself for not voting. Is that irony?
You think Cyan and Myself are both scum, correct? This means you think either (1) we are Mafia members #5 and #6, or (2) we are an independant 2-man group.
(1) You think Cyan and myself are Mafia #5 and #6. This means you think the Mafia chose not to kill on Night 5, specifically so Cyan could claim they went after him. And I just made up the stuff about receiving a PM from Az.
Do you see where this is completely stupid for the Mafia to do? To skip a kill they don't have to skip, in order to try and make Cyan even more clear looking (which the town only has his and my word on anyway), and also brilliantly making Cyan totally exposable by the day-killer?
You know, the Day-killer could easily have chosen to go after Cyan that day. Especially after Cyan admitted he had lost a life. That would have been an ideal time for the Day-killer to strike. I rather think the Mafia was hoping that he would. But instead, the town got extremely lucky and the day-killer popped Carrion Pigeons.
Is this really what you think was going on? I'm insulted that you think any Mafia I was a part of would come up with such a retarded plan.
(2) Or is it that you think Cyan and Myself are an independant 2-man scum team. Separate from the Mafia and the day-killer, not to mention the Cult. And we are a 2-man team that has just not been killing at all for the whole game until the Mafia was eliminated. That sure was clever of us, wasn't it. And you also think we tied ourselves together from Day 1, which would have been an extremmly poor decision on our part, by the way.
But then, as soon as the Mafia is gone we coincidentally started up bludgening people. And you think Cyan is doing the bludgening because he's the T-800 (which he claimed).
I mean, if the kill method was so horribly incriminating, wouldn't I have done the kill instead of Cyan? Your logic makes no sense and, does not fit what happened in the game so far, and also requires us to be stupid (or is it just incredibly lucky? Or both).
Plus, I have this nifty little extra ability to just give away a day-kill. Does that fit in anywhere in this theory?
You are the one who is making a huge deal out of the flowers now. Certainly not me. You think Cyan is the one giving away flowers, as the T-800 (and also bludgening, of course).
Yesterday, after Grak and Sutherlands both claimed something different from my experience, I pretty much threw up my hands at the whole affair. Why on earth would we then give them to you? Specifically so we could try and make me look worse? Yes, yes I see it now.
Seriously, what are you thinking? The (presumably) last scum kind of has to be Grakthis or Dagger.
Now I wonder if Grakthis just tipped his hat by actually going for this idea.
@Grakthis: Also, what means this:
Are you equating your "cloning" power with a kill here? And speculating that, if the game got down to just you and the last scum, it would be a draw?
He ended the night before I had a chance to. By the time I woke up and logged into MTGS, all I have are messages from the others and it's already Day. I thought we have until Thursday?
I have read everything, and so far I must say I am persuaded by Vampyr somewhat, considering he's the most confirmed person we have right now.
The only fear I have is that if Cyan is not scum and Grak is, and I am lynched next, then there'll be no second chance for the town to rectify that mistake.
We'll make you an offer you can't refuse.
Hosting: Vista Mafia
Hosted: Intrigue Mafia (Mini), Seance #43 (Basic), Conflux Mafia (Normal), Goo Mafia (FTQ), Experiment #26 (Basic)
Ongoing/Completed - 0/41
Town/Mafia/SK/Survivor - 30/6/4/1
NKed/Lynched/Survived - 15/11/15
This is simple: I'm going to support the confirmed mason because I know his motives are honest and his idea is not mutually exclusive to killing Dagger. Technically, his idea gives us 2 chances to win, killing Dagger today gives us 1 (from my POV, obv). Even though I still believe Dagger has a higher chance of being scum, if we lynch Cyan first, it means instead of having X% (where X is the chance of Dagger being scum) chance of winning we have X% - A% (where A is the chance the scum have another trick we aren't expecting) + Y% (where Y is the chance of CYan being scum). So as long as the odds of the scum having a trick are lower than the odds of Cyan being scum, it's the right odds play.
If our mason decides this is the right play, i'll back him. If he doesn't, I'll put my vote on Dagger.
As I have said several times now, the person I target DIES. But instead of going to the dead list and having their role revealed, they go to the replacement list.
But they will NEVER come back because the game will end with 0 players alive.
Actually, the town MIGHT win, depending on how Azrael rules. Because our win conditions says the scum must die, and there's probably says the town must die AND one of them must be alive. That's normally how it works. So if everyone dies, the town wins.
Also, my ability triggers on being TARGETED not on being killed. So it is also possible that Az would rule that my ability happens first and therefore the town wins.