Im sure its been said allready but since we got conformation from our distributors I figured I would share.
It was confirmed that only the initial print run of packs will have the treasure cards in them. So whatever product is out there right now will be the only ones to have the treasure cards, so supplementary shipments will have them.
When will they begin shipping the non-treasure prints? In other words, what is the deadline for being guaranteed a treasure print booster box? Is that known yet or is it all just hearsay still?
Yes, but product is not short because WotC "short printed" the set. Product is not short because WotC is in financial trouble. Product is not shore because WotC is holding product back to artificially increase the value of MTG.
WotC printed lots of this set. Demand for MTG over the past 18-24 has gone through the roof. This can be attributed to many different things. But, any current shortages a store is experiencing has nothing to do with WotC not printing lots.
There is already a restock on the way and most distributors should begin seeing that wave around the 20th.
WOTC can't be in financial trouble, they're a subsidiary. OTOH, Hasbro can be disappointed in the revenues, but that's different.
There are likely a number of factors that went into this shortage, I don't think it was to artificially increase price though, because they don't see any of the extra money, distributers and retailers are getting all of the extra.
I should buy stock in Hasbro... Then at least I will get a chance to feast off of this treasure bonanza too... Honestly, Unless you are willing to do what Wizards wants you to do, which is spend a ton of money on overpriced boxes of cards then by all means you are welcome to...
For anybody who thinks that wizards actually cares about the gamer having enough money to feed himself... I mean, who cares if they do not get money from us in the future because we all died of starvation trying to eat our magic cards instead of food... I hear Cockatrice tastes like chicken... Yes I went there...
Wizards does not care about anything right now but the almighty dollar of the present... By the way... Just thought I would mention this to everyone... Mythic rares were not all timmy cards were they??? Hmmm, Baneslayer Angel... What is that going for? 30-40$$$!!! I think I just told everyone soo... And please do not give me this... "well they had to print a few decent ones" excuse, because all that is nonsense.... Sure a few were what they said they were, but they just love to sneak Lotus Cobra's under the table now and then... Health of the game (Laughs)... I suppose the one thing I have to give way on is the rares... They did come down in price, but not enough when somebody has to spend 5-10 on a good rare, and 20-40 on a good playset or two of Mythics... In the past you spent 30-40 on a couple good rares, and 2-6 tops on a decent common or two to round out your deck. Again successful marketing that everyone here just eats up without question. Do not even get me started on all this From the Vault/Duel deck nonsense, or Planechase???
And about the supply and demand thing... Umm, did you guys happen to actually look around the thread, or in your own card shops this weekend? Magic is like Crack right now... Everybody needs their dose, but there is not enough to go around... So what do all the nerds do? They pay more for their addiction, and whats more that addiction could come with a "Black Lotus", or a "Mox" so they buy the places out to ensure that might happen at like $400-$600... Please people, do not try to say that Wizards is not playing on the fact that most people who play magic do not have much else outside of magic... They are a company too, and companies know how to make a profit, especially with a now officially captive audience...
And, before I forget... Wizards will probably not tell anybody about the Treasures for another month or two... Why? Because it is in their best interests to keep the set selling for high profits as more product becomes available to a "Treasure" starved market... Simple college business really...
Just be warned everyone, a flame burns brightest just before it goes out... So spend your money while you can...LOL
Rancor, I'm curious where you're looking. I'm also in Vancouver area and most of the shops I've visited have had enough product to cover their pre-orders and a little bit more. Not huge amounts, and they're definitely husbanding it a bit, but I haven't seen anyone out yet. I didn't go checking today, but I had yesterday off and the couple stores I went by had some.
This is also in the Vancouver area.
In my immediate play group I bought 3 boxes, another of my friends has 3. Another has bought 4 so far. We've each bought a couple of fat packs (those lands, so precious!)
I'm not sure what sort of discount you're getting at a half case off of retail, but you might have to pay closer to retail to satisfy your customers. I know that the boxes I've opened would easily pay for themselves retail. How I wish I could sell some of these cards... I never play red, what am I going to do with Warren Instigators and Goblin Guides? I probably opened $200 worth of cards that will never see play! At least that's what trading is for.
Our playgroup is actually doing a draft tomorrow, I'm sure we have enough packs to handle it, but I was planning on picking up a few more packs just for that. I'll let you know if I fail to find any.
As for the perceived shortage. While they might have estimated on the low side, it doesn't look like they were so far off that anybody would get fired over it. Perhaps they're leery of over-printing due to the sets that don't sell well in which case they lose on every additional box they pump out? I still remember seeing a full box of Homelands for I think $10 at Save-on. We just bought 2es box of Guildpact for sealed at $75 each, so I guess they'd rather be close than to print too much.
i'm still really lost on how people are not getting what they ordered. if your store is smart they order when they first can. and more after that if they feel they need to. too many store are feeling the hurt from the economy. so they are less likly to go and buy product when they first can.(in fear of it not selling) so when you say your store didn't get what they ordered. you need to ask yourself these question. how much do you think they ordered? when did they ordered it? how much extra money they can sink into something they don't even have yet?
... they most liely are at the end of the first print run when they roll in and use that number if they should stop. so if more early preorder go in more product will be printed in time.
This isn't happening just to owners who didn't order enough. My local store ordered 40 cases of Zendikar from one distributor (as soon as they could place orders) and only got in 21. They ordered $23,000 of Zendikar from another distributor (as soon as they could place orders), and won't know till Friday how much (if any) they'll get in. This store goes through 4 cases of M10 and 4 cases of whatever set is current a week in drafts alone, and it's not that much different from a lot of brick-and-mortar stores where Magic is the bulk of their sales.
Your theory might make sense if all stores just sold a few packs a day, but the demand (and money) was there from all the big stores. This wasn't caused by poor planning on the part of store owners. They predicted the demand; it's just not being supplied.
And one case a week? My local store drafts a case in a day. Wizards needs to get more realistic with how they support their customers.
I should buy stock in Hasbro... Then at least I will get a chance to feast off of this treasure bonanza too... Honestly, Unless you are willing to do what Wizards wants you to do, which is spend a ton of money on overpriced boxes of cards then by all means you are welcome to...
For anybody who thinks that wizards actually cares about the gamer having enough money to feed himself... I mean, who cares if they do not get money from us in the future because we all died of starvation trying to eat our magic cards...
Wizards does not care about anything right now but the almighty dollar of the present... By the way... Just thought I would mention this to everyone... Mythic rares were not all timmy cards were they??? Hmmm, Baneslayer Angel... What is that going for? 30-40$$$!!! I think I just told everyone soo... And please do not give me this... "well they had to print a few decent ones" excuse, because all that is nonsense.... Sure a few were what they said they were, but they just love to sneak Lotus Cobra's under the table now and then... Health of the game (Laughs)... I suppose the one thing I have to give way on is the rares... They did come down in price, but not enough when somebody has to spend 5-10 on a good rare, and 20-40 on a good playset or two of Mythics... In the past you spent 30-40 on a couple good rares, and 2-6 tops on a decent common or two to round out your deck. Again successful marketing that everyone here just eats up without question. Do not even get me started on all this From the Vault/Duel deck nonsense, or Planechase???
And about the supply and demand thing... Umm, did you guys happen to actually look around the thread, or in your own card shops this weekend? Magic is like Crack right now... Everybody needs their dose, but there is not enough to go around... So what do all the nerds do? They pay more for their addiction, and whats more that addiction could come with a "Black Lotus", or a "Mox" so they buy the places out to ensure that might happen at like $400-$600... Please people, do not try to say that Wizards is not playing on the fact that most people who play magic do not have much else outside of magic... They are a company too, and companies know how to make a profit, especially with a now officially captive audience...
Just be warned everyone, a flame burns brightest just before it goes out... So spend your money while you can...LOL
Wizards is making good sets, which is creating much higher than normal demand, which as a result is causing issues with there not being enough supply all at once around release days to be able to equal demand which is causing the price on the SECONDARY MARKET to go up. Wizards is still getting the same amount of money per box that they have been for any of the last few sets. If the price is getting closer to retail at shops and other places because of the high demand then thats just the way things work. Wizards is putting out the product as quickly as they can. There is no benefit to them to under-print normal magic sets if the demand is high because they only get the normal amount per box from selling to shops/distributors as they usually do. Its in their best interests to sell as much product as they have demand for. So would you rather have wizards make crappy sets that wouldnt have high demand that would sell at the normal lower prices? Thats what it comes down to these days. Good sets sell quickly, worse sets dont. Good sets can cause supply/demand issues causing their prices on the secondary market (not prices from wizards) to increase.
Also, whether some may believe it or not, magic is a luxury/entertainment item. If you dont have the money to afford to buy a box or such, then just buy the singles you need. If you cannot afford to buy new singles, then just play with what you have. If that means you cannot play competitively then just play casually with the cards you do have. And wizards never said that mythic rares could not be good cards. How about focusing on the much lower prices of all of the normal rares rather than the 2 or 3 expensive mythics that exist at this point. And right now Baneslayer can be had for around $25 on ebay, same with lotus cobra and Elspeth, the only three mythics even close to that high.
Products like from the vaults, planechase and others were made for the groups of magic players that enjoy being able to have such products. These are not products you need to play normally, but they are available if people want to purchase them.
Also there is no evidence in the slightest that wizards and relatedly magic is having any issues. If you are going to make such a claim at least try to show some proof rather than just making inflamitory remarks.
In conclusion you are wrong on far too many levels, please see above for the explanation as to why.
I suspect the shortage is one which is artificially induced by WotC to drive up demand. They did it with M10 by "not printing enough", and they certainly should have foreseen the demand for Zen. They've never had such shortages in the past.
What I predict happened was that they saw how demand for the very limited FTV: Dragons drove up price, demand and interest, and they decided to try it out with everything else too.
ohh the newbies out there. Magic was founded on "not printing enough".
At least now they are big enough to afford multiple printings of a run. In the days of Antiquities or Legends you got one run and they couldn't afford to do another run because it got in the way of the print schedule for the next set. I remember the first time they "printed enough" was Fallen Empires and stores were finally stocked regularly. All the "collectors" hated it because kid's toys stopped being worth gold bricks.
I wouldn't worry about getting Zendikar anyway. It's the head of a block set, that means they'll print enough to be around for drafts when the block is done next May. They're not "starving artists" anymore and can print however many they want.
Frankly, with the recession, short printing sets is a great idea. They know they'll need more in 6 months anyway so they'll get at least one more printing... why take the risk of over printing when they can sell out? Selling out also helps sell more as the stupid people with-more-money-than-brains hoard them all "to have them first". Pre-releases and sealed openers are the real product driver right now and most places have been selling out of their tournaments... that eats up cards from the pool before they "go on sale".
The idea of an artificial shortage (i.e. one planned on purpose by WotC to increase interest in the product) is ridiculous. The only way that greater demand benefits a business is when they sell supply to satiate that demand. Magic set sales are frontloaded, so even if demand is high now, people aren't just going to hold off and satisfy that demand on shipments that come out a month or two later; they just won't buy as much as they might've otherwise.
It's arguably fair to blame some form of incompetence (that WotC should've foreseen the demand for this set and been able to print enough to satisfy it) but the idea that there's a shortage because they want there to be one doesn't make any sense.
What is perfectly possible, on the other hand, is to create an artificial shortage to generate a lot of demand, while still printing at a normal rate. Then, when demand is high, they could sell the "extra" they printed during the artificial shortage, as well as what they were printing at that time, and there would be demand for it.
Not saying I agree with that, just saying it might work.
Cards with the post 8th Edition, color shifted and future shifted templates as well as the timeshifted and Coldsnap reprint ones tastes a little sweeter. Any gold cards with the old faces are a little saltier. European foreign (except Russian) cards with the mentioned templates above are not as sweet as their English counterparts and has a wierd after taste. All taste tests were done from fresh packs and all cards tasted are not foil cards. I have yet to taste Asian and Russian cards.
The thing is, to me this sounds a whole lot more like an international distribution problem than anything to do with how much wotc is printing. We got plenty of product here in the US.
I'd certainly second this.
I was able to get 13 cases. Yeah, 13. My left thumb and forefinger are rather sore now...:P
Anyway, I have a longterm relationship (since Lorwyn) with a really good vendor, so that factor (and planning ahead/asking them more than a couple weeks ahead) has enabled me to get the quantity I need at prices that are somewhat sane.
(These guys also came through on getting me my 7 M10 cases quickly, when we were hit by that crunch)
I would not be surprised by this being at least somewhat on purpose, either. It's hard to change practices this quickly and to enough of a degree; that's also an issue in play, and not specifically under the heading of incompetence
I live in Taiwan (where we get limited stock) and yet I found it extremely easy to get booster boxes... (All English, First printing, the same with US version)
Our LFGS got in 300 booster boxes on day 1 of Zendikar release, they opened 200 boxes so they could sell playsets overseas, however they only pulled 4 revised dual lands, so they were extremely unlucky with the treasures :P, and I was able to pick up 2 cases for $80USD each box.. this was on Release date.
I saw how many people said that it was difficult for them to obtain boxes.. so 2 days ago I asked if they had anymore in stock, and they did. So I bought another half a case from them for the same price ($80).. so I dont think we are affected in Taiwan...
However, Fatpacks on the other hand, are extremely hard to get, they arent sold to the public, if you wanted a fat pack, you had to buy a booster box (which I'm not complaining)
I feel bad for some of you guys especially in Canada. I purchased 3 boxes at $82 a pop. ALthough the area in allentown PA is shorted now and not a single store can run a Zendikar draft from lack of product.
But, as I will repeat again, this SHOULD NOT affect buying boxes of this set, because it is so incredibly unlikely to pull a treasure that the existence or nonexistence of them shouldn't dissuade one from buying boxes.
If it's 1 in 20 boxes that have a treasure as suspected, and most treasures are worth an average of about US$30 (seems pretty plausible as there's a lot of dual lands being pulled and small numbers of very high value cards), that adds US$1.5 to the average value of a box.
Yeah, the store I go to for FNM in Fort Collins is doing an ACR draft tonight because they apparently cannot get any Zendikar product right now. So annoying.
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"For the first time in his life, Grakk felt a little warm and fuzzy inside."
What is perfectly possible, on the other hand, is to create an artificial shortage to generate a lot of demand, while still printing at a normal rate. Then, when demand is high, they could sell the "extra" they printed during the artificial shortage, as well as what they were printing at that time, and there would be demand for it.
Not saying I agree with that, just saying it might work.
restricting supply does NOT generate demand. That isn't the way supply and demand works. It raises the price, sure, but it does nothing to the demand (and since WotC didn't raise their prices to retailers, a shortage, artificial or otherwise, is a net loss for WotC)
My view: We all complain too much. Hasbro likes profit, and if the upped prices are intentional, oh well. I find it funny that we all are complaining about the cost of cards and packs, yet we still purchase the product. Companies will continue to use these tactics, like it or not, because they work.
Just so people know... Tons of the bigger distributers have caught on that if they create a shortage the price goes up and then they can sell boxes for more. They tell retailers they are out and then try to fill orders on DealerNet where private retailers try to buy secondary market product... The big distro's are going to kill it for everyone.. They did it to sports cards and now they are doing it to CCG's
Please wizards deal with your distributors. It does not make you more money... it makes them more money. Them holding product for even 2 weeks on a set causes the price of boxes to sky rocket.
Then on top of that you have huge companies like Starcity and Coolstuff and others that crack open all of thier product just so they can sell over priced singles online... this causes the price of boxes to go up.. (what i dont understand is why everyone follows suite and prices according to these big companies... i mean damn... they are setting thier own price on cards)
all of these shenanigans are going to cause hurt to the game. It makes Box prices go up, Singles go up and Availability go down. Also.. dont forget people... most play Standard... your cards are only usable for so long.. and distributors are holding back... just so you can pay more.
IT'S NOT WIZARDS IT'S DISTROS!
beside.. this thread was about figuring out how to identify 2nd print run boxes.... can we tell 1st print from 2nd?
This is important for finding the remaining treasure.
Triadx is right. A friend of mine works in a store and he said that they're getting fewer copies of the Garruk vs. Liliana decks than they did of the FTV: Exiled. One of the distributors, instead of selling boxes like they're supposed to, is selling each account 2 individual deck boxes at the price the stores could preorder them at. He said the distributor basically said "Yeah, they're really limited so each account can only get two, but if you want you can buy as many as you want at an inflated price". Everyone should e-mail WotC customer service and tell them that the distributors are trying to ruin Magic!
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"Rage is the only freedom left me"
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
I'm going on record right now and stating that before the end of 2012 we will see foil dual lands in booster packs (The real, Alpha dual lands). You can quote me on that.
Triadx is right. A friend of mine works in a store and he said that they're getting fewer copies of the Garruk vs. Liliana decks than they did of the FTV: Exiled. One of the distributors, instead of selling boxes like they're supposed to, is selling each account 2 individual deck boxes at the price the stores could preorder them at. He said the distributor basically said "Yeah, they're really limited so each account can only get two, but if you want you can buy as many as you want at an inflated price". Everyone should e-mail WotC customer service and tell them that the distributors are trying to ruin Magic!
What should also happen is that this store and other stores that have something similar going should go tell WotC the situation. There is no way that the duel decks are more rare than the Exiled set. The Exile set was intentionally short printed. This is not.
What should also happen is that this store and other stores that have something similar going should go tell WotC the situation. There is no way that the duel decks are more rare than the Exiled set. The Exile set was intentionally short printed. This is not.
I know he's contacting WotC about it. He did the same thing when the distributors did this for FTV: Dragons. From what I hear, FTV:E was handled much better (Like a prerelease) and that's probably how everything needs to be handled if the distributors are going to get so greedy.
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"Rage is the only freedom left me"
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
I'm going on record right now and stating that before the end of 2012 we will see foil dual lands in booster packs (The real, Alpha dual lands). You can quote me on that.
I know he's contacting WotC about it. He did the same thing when the distributors did this for FTV: Dragons. From what I hear, FTV:E was handled much better (Like a prerelease) and that's probably how everything needs to be handled if the distributors are going to get so greedy.
I can tell you from our experience (running magic tournaments since 2002) that we order from 4 distributors including WOTC directly for our Premier store, and allocations depend upon each distributor. What it boiled down into is WOTC shipped us our maximum allocation (18 units altogether) and each other distributor based it upon how much M10 and Zendikar we ordered from them in advance. One Distributor who we don't order a lot of magic product from (due to their much higher prices than other distributors) saved us 1 Garruk/Liliana deck instead of the 24 I ordered 2 MONTHS IN ADVANCE to get. The other distributors shipped us the basic allotment of 1 Garruk/Liliana deck for every 3 boosters of M10 and Zendikar we ordered. To the distributor in Chicago who we ordered 96 boosters and received 1st Wave Zendikar booster boxes, thank you for the many Garruk/Liliana decks you sent us.
To those that haven't gotten a Garruk/Liliana deck yet, don't postpone on getting one if you need or plan on getting one. They're going to be MUCH HARDER to get than the Jace/Chandra decks, and the Jace/Chandra decks now go regularly on ebay for $35-$40:o before shipping.
Thanks,
John C. Kula:)
SW Michigan store, Grand Rapids, MI
Garruk/Liliana was allocated to the same numbers as FtV:E. It seems like people are getting different numbers because distributors started to change the allocations on their own.
As far as people thinking it is useless to complain, it's not. If enough people get upset, companies have to change what they are doing if they believe there will be a consequence. Shops especially should be complaining about the short printing of M:10 and ZEN. While everybody else plays cards for fun, shop owners have to pay bills and eat. If we get shorted of the hottest product available, customers will simply go elsewhere.
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RG Playing undercosted burn and over-powered creatures since 1994. RG
"I finally figured out what One With Nothing is good for!" says Paul. "Oh yeah? What?" comes the reply. "It comboes with Tarmogoyf!"
True story...
To those that haven't gotten a Garruk/Liliana deck yet, don't postpone on getting one if you need or plan on getting one. They're going to be MUCH HARDER to get than the Jace/Chandra decks, and the Jace/Chandra decks now go regularly on ebay for $35-$40:o before shipping.
And yet, you can go out and buy older dual decks at Target and WalMart for sticker price if you just look. I find it sad that Target can get GvC and a game shop can't...
It was confirmed that only the initial print run of packs will have the treasure cards in them. So whatever product is out there right now will be the only ones to have the treasure cards, so supplementary shipments will have them.
Anyhow thats what I heard today.
WOTC can't be in financial trouble, they're a subsidiary. OTOH, Hasbro can be disappointed in the revenues, but that's different.
There are likely a number of factors that went into this shortage, I don't think it was to artificially increase price though, because they don't see any of the extra money, distributers and retailers are getting all of the extra.
For anybody who thinks that wizards actually cares about the gamer having enough money to feed himself... I mean, who cares if they do not get money from us in the future because we all died of starvation trying to eat our magic cards instead of food... I hear Cockatrice tastes like chicken... Yes I went there...
Wizards does not care about anything right now but the almighty dollar of the present... By the way... Just thought I would mention this to everyone... Mythic rares were not all timmy cards were they??? Hmmm, Baneslayer Angel... What is that going for? 30-40$$$!!! I think I just told everyone soo... And please do not give me this... "well they had to print a few decent ones" excuse, because all that is nonsense.... Sure a few were what they said they were, but they just love to sneak Lotus Cobra's under the table now and then... Health of the game (Laughs)... I suppose the one thing I have to give way on is the rares... They did come down in price, but not enough when somebody has to spend 5-10 on a good rare, and 20-40 on a good playset or two of Mythics... In the past you spent 30-40 on a couple good rares, and 2-6 tops on a decent common or two to round out your deck. Again successful marketing that everyone here just eats up without question. Do not even get me started on all this From the Vault/Duel deck nonsense, or Planechase???
And about the supply and demand thing... Umm, did you guys happen to actually look around the thread, or in your own card shops this weekend? Magic is like Crack right now... Everybody needs their dose, but there is not enough to go around... So what do all the nerds do? They pay more for their addiction, and whats more that addiction could come with a "Black Lotus", or a "Mox" so they buy the places out to ensure that might happen at like $400-$600... Please people, do not try to say that Wizards is not playing on the fact that most people who play magic do not have much else outside of magic... They are a company too, and companies know how to make a profit, especially with a now officially captive audience...
And, before I forget... Wizards will probably not tell anybody about the Treasures for another month or two... Why? Because it is in their best interests to keep the set selling for high profits as more product becomes available to a "Treasure" starved market... Simple college business really...
Just be warned everyone, a flame burns brightest just before it goes out... So spend your money while you can...LOL
This is also in the Vancouver area.
In my immediate play group I bought 3 boxes, another of my friends has 3. Another has bought 4 so far. We've each bought a couple of fat packs (those lands, so precious!)
I'm not sure what sort of discount you're getting at a half case off of retail, but you might have to pay closer to retail to satisfy your customers. I know that the boxes I've opened would easily pay for themselves retail. How I wish I could sell some of these cards... I never play red, what am I going to do with Warren Instigators and Goblin Guides? I probably opened $200 worth of cards that will never see play! At least that's what trading is for.
Our playgroup is actually doing a draft tomorrow, I'm sure we have enough packs to handle it, but I was planning on picking up a few more packs just for that. I'll let you know if I fail to find any.
As for the perceived shortage. While they might have estimated on the low side, it doesn't look like they were so far off that anybody would get fired over it. Perhaps they're leery of over-printing due to the sets that don't sell well in which case they lose on every additional box they pump out? I still remember seeing a full box of Homelands for I think $10 at Save-on. We just bought 2es box of Guildpact for sealed at $75 each, so I guess they'd rather be close than to print too much.
This isn't happening just to owners who didn't order enough. My local store ordered 40 cases of Zendikar from one distributor (as soon as they could place orders) and only got in 21. They ordered $23,000 of Zendikar from another distributor (as soon as they could place orders), and won't know till Friday how much (if any) they'll get in. This store goes through 4 cases of M10 and 4 cases of whatever set is current a week in drafts alone, and it's not that much different from a lot of brick-and-mortar stores where Magic is the bulk of their sales.
Your theory might make sense if all stores just sold a few packs a day, but the demand (and money) was there from all the big stores. This wasn't caused by poor planning on the part of store owners. They predicted the demand; it's just not being supplied.
And one case a week? My local store drafts a case in a day. Wizards needs to get more realistic with how they support their customers.
Wizards is making good sets, which is creating much higher than normal demand, which as a result is causing issues with there not being enough supply all at once around release days to be able to equal demand which is causing the price on the SECONDARY MARKET to go up. Wizards is still getting the same amount of money per box that they have been for any of the last few sets. If the price is getting closer to retail at shops and other places because of the high demand then thats just the way things work. Wizards is putting out the product as quickly as they can. There is no benefit to them to under-print normal magic sets if the demand is high because they only get the normal amount per box from selling to shops/distributors as they usually do. Its in their best interests to sell as much product as they have demand for. So would you rather have wizards make crappy sets that wouldnt have high demand that would sell at the normal lower prices? Thats what it comes down to these days. Good sets sell quickly, worse sets dont. Good sets can cause supply/demand issues causing their prices on the secondary market (not prices from wizards) to increase.
Also, whether some may believe it or not, magic is a luxury/entertainment item. If you dont have the money to afford to buy a box or such, then just buy the singles you need. If you cannot afford to buy new singles, then just play with what you have. If that means you cannot play competitively then just play casually with the cards you do have. And wizards never said that mythic rares could not be good cards. How about focusing on the much lower prices of all of the normal rares rather than the 2 or 3 expensive mythics that exist at this point. And right now Baneslayer can be had for around $25 on ebay, same with lotus cobra and Elspeth, the only three mythics even close to that high.
Products like from the vaults, planechase and others were made for the groups of magic players that enjoy being able to have such products. These are not products you need to play normally, but they are available if people want to purchase them.
Also there is no evidence in the slightest that wizards and relatedly magic is having any issues. If you are going to make such a claim at least try to show some proof rather than just making inflamitory remarks.
In conclusion you are wrong on far too many levels, please see above for the explanation as to why.
From the back of a box:
ohh the newbies out there. Magic was founded on "not printing enough".
At least now they are big enough to afford multiple printings of a run. In the days of Antiquities or Legends you got one run and they couldn't afford to do another run because it got in the way of the print schedule for the next set. I remember the first time they "printed enough" was Fallen Empires and stores were finally stocked regularly. All the "collectors" hated it because kid's toys stopped being worth gold bricks.
I wouldn't worry about getting Zendikar anyway. It's the head of a block set, that means they'll print enough to be around for drafts when the block is done next May. They're not "starving artists" anymore and can print however many they want.
Frankly, with the recession, short printing sets is a great idea. They know they'll need more in 6 months anyway so they'll get at least one more printing... why take the risk of over printing when they can sell out? Selling out also helps sell more as the stupid people with-more-money-than-brains hoard them all "to have them first". Pre-releases and sealed openers are the real product driver right now and most places have been selling out of their tournaments... that eats up cards from the pool before they "go on sale".
What is perfectly possible, on the other hand, is to create an artificial shortage to generate a lot of demand, while still printing at a normal rate. Then, when demand is high, they could sell the "extra" they printed during the artificial shortage, as well as what they were printing at that time, and there would be demand for it.
Not saying I agree with that, just saying it might work.
I'd certainly second this.
I was able to get 13 cases. Yeah, 13. My left thumb and forefinger are rather sore now...:P
Anyway, I have a longterm relationship (since Lorwyn) with a really good vendor, so that factor (and planning ahead/asking them more than a couple weeks ahead) has enabled me to get the quantity I need at prices that are somewhat sane.
(These guys also came through on getting me my 7 M10 cases quickly, when we were hit by that crunch)
I would not be surprised by this being at least somewhat on purpose, either. It's hard to change practices this quickly and to enough of a degree; that's also an issue in play, and not specifically under the heading of incompetence
Vintage: Dredge | Legacy: Burn, Goblins, Soldier | Standard: Mono-Red Aggro
Commander: Nicol Bolas, Sliver Overlord, Rafiq
Casual: Selesnya Saproling Smackdown, Izzet Labs, Rebel
Played since June 2004, mostly inactive June 2011 to March 2018
Other usernames include AlanFromRochester, homerthebeerbaron
MTG checklists from Alpha to Ravnica Allegiance - https://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/other-magic-products/third-party-products/805324-checklists-for-everything-from-alpha-to-ravnica
Our LFGS got in 300 booster boxes on day 1 of Zendikar release, they opened 200 boxes so they could sell playsets overseas, however they only pulled 4 revised dual lands, so they were extremely unlucky with the treasures :P, and I was able to pick up 2 cases for $80USD each box.. this was on Release date.
I saw how many people said that it was difficult for them to obtain boxes.. so 2 days ago I asked if they had anymore in stock, and they did. So I bought another half a case from them for the same price ($80).. so I dont think we are affected in Taiwan...
However, Fatpacks on the other hand, are extremely hard to get, they arent sold to the public, if you wanted a fat pack, you had to buy a booster box (which I'm not complaining)
If it's 1 in 20 boxes that have a treasure as suspected, and most treasures are worth an average of about US$30 (seems pretty plausible as there's a lot of dual lands being pulled and small numbers of very high value cards), that adds US$1.5 to the average value of a box.
restricting supply does NOT generate demand. That isn't the way supply and demand works. It raises the price, sure, but it does nothing to the demand (and since WotC didn't raise their prices to retailers, a shortage, artificial or otherwise, is a net loss for WotC)
Sets completed in the "Vale" Block
Vale: The Shadowlands
More sets to come
My Have/Want List
Please wizards deal with your distributors. It does not make you more money... it makes them more money. Them holding product for even 2 weeks on a set causes the price of boxes to sky rocket.
Then on top of that you have huge companies like Starcity and Coolstuff and others that crack open all of thier product just so they can sell over priced singles online... this causes the price of boxes to go up.. (what i dont understand is why everyone follows suite and prices according to these big companies... i mean damn... they are setting thier own price on cards)
all of these shenanigans are going to cause hurt to the game. It makes Box prices go up, Singles go up and Availability go down. Also.. dont forget people... most play Standard... your cards are only usable for so long.. and distributors are holding back... just so you can pay more.
IT'S NOT WIZARDS IT'S DISTROS!
beside.. this thread was about figuring out how to identify 2nd print run boxes.... can we tell 1st print from 2nd?
This is important for finding the remaining treasure.
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
What should also happen is that this store and other stores that have something similar going should go tell WotC the situation. There is no way that the duel decks are more rare than the Exiled set. The Exile set was intentionally short printed. This is not.
I know he's contacting WotC about it. He did the same thing when the distributors did this for FTV: Dragons. From what I hear, FTV:E was handled much better (Like a prerelease) and that's probably how everything needs to be handled if the distributors are going to get so greedy.
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
I can tell you from our experience (running magic tournaments since 2002) that we order from 4 distributors including WOTC directly for our Premier store, and allocations depend upon each distributor. What it boiled down into is WOTC shipped us our maximum allocation (18 units altogether) and each other distributor based it upon how much M10 and Zendikar we ordered from them in advance. One Distributor who we don't order a lot of magic product from (due to their much higher prices than other distributors) saved us 1 Garruk/Liliana deck instead of the 24 I ordered 2 MONTHS IN ADVANCE to get. The other distributors shipped us the basic allotment of 1 Garruk/Liliana deck for every 3 boosters of M10 and Zendikar we ordered. To the distributor in Chicago who we ordered 96 boosters and received 1st Wave Zendikar booster boxes, thank you for the many Garruk/Liliana decks you sent us.
To those that haven't gotten a Garruk/Liliana deck yet, don't postpone on getting one if you need or plan on getting one. They're going to be MUCH HARDER to get than the Jace/Chandra decks, and the Jace/Chandra decks now go regularly on ebay for $35-$40:o before shipping.
Thanks,
John C. Kula:)
SW Michigan store, Grand Rapids, MI
As far as people thinking it is useless to complain, it's not. If enough people get upset, companies have to change what they are doing if they believe there will be a consequence. Shops especially should be complaining about the short printing of M:10 and ZEN. While everybody else plays cards for fun, shop owners have to pay bills and eat. If we get shorted of the hottest product available, customers will simply go elsewhere.
RG Playing undercosted burn and over-powered creatures since 1994. RG
"I finally figured out what One With Nothing is good for!" says Paul. "Oh yeah? What?" comes the reply. "It comboes with Tarmogoyf!"
True story...
And yet, you can go out and buy older dual decks at Target and WalMart for sticker price if you just look. I find it sad that Target can get GvC and a game shop can't...