Denizen of the Deep? Really? All the blue rares they could have picked and they picked Denizen of the Deep? Do players even like that card? It couldn't have been, say, a Time Stretch or something?
And Counterbore? That just seems kind of disappointing. I'd almost always have another Mind Control or something.
Id just like to point out that this is Wizard's excuse for every failed product decision (Kamigawa, 40 Card Decks, The Extra-Land In A Booster), but never have we heard it of a successfull product...
Funny that.
Kamigawa failed because Mirrodin was too powerful. The zubera being 1/2 for 2 instead of 1/1 for 1 is the most publically admitted example of a "nerf" Wizards gave Kamigawa (as 1/1 for 1 with the same abilities they were "too easy to abuse with Skull Clamp". Remember that sets are designed before they are released so Kamigawa would have been completed before the skull clamp banning).
Kamigawa had the same fate as the Masques block: being wedged between a super broken artifact centric block (Urzas and Mirrodin) and the "super-balanced multicolored matters everyone loves to draft this format" block (Invasion and Ravnica). It was meant to bring Magic out of combo/aggro and back into aggro. And I think it did it well in terms of ramping up the strength of the average creature.
The 40 card decks are a huge success in my opinion. How many times have you bought a preconstructed deck and been happy with it? The only precons I can remember loving was Call of the Kor, Slivers and Fun with Fungus and only because I'm a fan of odd creature types. Rat's Nest was a notable exception for Jitte. But these 40 card decks I see being released are actually really good and even experienced players love to purchase at least one. Each set has 1-2 with very good cards (Master of Etherium in Shards; Path in Conflux; Path and Dauntless Escort in Alara Reborn; Honor of the Pure in M10; Sphinx and Bloodwitch in Zendikar; Anthem in Worldwake; Awakening Zone in Eldrazi). The fact you get a pack instead of 15 worthless commons/uncommons means more incentive for the old players and the chance to experience the fun of opening a pack for the first time for the new players.
The only reason I'm no longer mad about the extra land in the booster is the full-art land in Zendikar. And the fact its nothing new. The fact it was zendikar exclusive, while flavorful, is disheartening. But its better than 9 or 5 card boosters. Although I wouldn't mind how some Japanese games pack their boosters (1 guaranteed rare + five 100% random cards; around 1 in 6 chance of double rares).
Also, Wizards has said "The Fans Wanted It!" for successful products as well. Ravnica was said to be developed with the fan reaction to Invasion-Block in mind.
In fact, the WORST decisions Wizards make are when they don't go by fan results. Chronicles is the king of bad decisions.
But it is up to *us* to tell Wizards what we want. Fill out those customer surveys and click on the polls on their page! Send e-mails and post your opinion in *their* forums! Wizards listens to their fans more than most videogame companies I can list..
What? Kamigawa was made because people on the Gamefaqs message board? I was not aware of their conspiracy to make product decisions fail. Those guys must be worse than reverse vampires and the Rand Corporation.
Simpsons did it!!!
But seriously people wake up and realize this wasnt made a a 'cash grab', it was made cause the people playing the video game wanted it.
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Where is the Tidings? The only reason I liked this deck in game was because of Tidings. You cast tidings on a remotely stable board position and you win.
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A card game about Presidents. Stabbing each other. With knives.
Well, all I can say is when I first took a look at the decklist my first thought was "Oh look, its a blue deck."
Plain and simply this deck covers what blue is. And for a new player I think the deck is perfect.
Now then, these deck if anything are comparable to the modern era into-decks, which include the deck and a pack. It is rather rare that an intro-deck will have enough value to compensate for the $12 price tag, and those are for 41 card decks, not 60 card decks like these are.
These decks fill the role they were intended to fill. Give people who played the xbox game a similar paper version to get an introduction to the paper game with.
So, if you want to compare these for value, compare them against intro-decks (shards of alara to now). Comparing them to ANYTHING else, is wrong. These are meant to be a starter point for someone. From there they can build upon them and expand their gameplay and knowledge (and collection) as they go.
If I was first getting started into the game I could honestly say I would love these decks. And I dont know about you, but the foil for this deck was the most iconic creature for blue for a LONG time.
Anyhow, Im done. If you all still dont get the premise for these decks, then there is likely nothing I could say to convince you otherwise anyway.
I find hilarious to imagine a powerful planeswalker such as Jace using cancel.
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Why are these decks not a direct port from the 360 decks? They're so close anyway it baffles me as to why minor changes were made (and, apparently, for the worse).
Why are these decks not a direct port from the 360 decks? They're so close anyway it baffles me as to why minor changes were made (and, apparently, for the worse).
Probably because the 360 decks were way over 60 cards.
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A card game about Presidents. Stabbing each other. With knives.
Why are these decks not a direct port from the 360 decks? They're so close anyway it baffles me as to why minor changes were made (and, apparently, for the worse).
Um cause the 360 decks have like 80+ cards? Plus alot of times they have multiples of the rares (theyre not gonna give you a 80 card deck with 12 rares).
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I'm not sure why everyone is complaining. If you or I, being seasoned Magic players, had a legitimate reason to want to buy these decks for ourselves, they would fly off the shelves before the new, inexperienced players (the target audience for these decks) even found out that they existed.
This is a product that can stick around long enough for new players, especially those that were introduced to the game through the Xbox 360, to get their hands on it.
Evac and Mind Spring are pretty neat, but I honestly would wish the foil was one of the two. Also, a more iconic rare would be something like Djinn of Wishes, possibly replacing Denizen of the Deep.
My local store is having a bargain where all 5 planeswalker decks bundled together cost 50 euros. Separately, they are sold 15 euros each. Do you think it is worth buying all 5 of them?
I am a purely casual player (I play with my family and friends) and we mostly play with precons (duel decks, theme decks or other special edition decks). We have been playing for a while now and we can be considered as experienced players. However, I am the one providing the decks (and improving them if needed). I usually don't go to stores to buy singles, so are these planeswalker decks worth buying for the rares they provide? I plan on breaking them apart and put the best cards in my other decks. Given they have a M10 booster pack (with some chase rare potentially), I think the price of 50 euros for all 5 decks to be ok, no?
Assuming that the relative prices are similar ...
I picked them up for $45 total. I figure it's worth it for the 2 new art cards, a Troll Ascetic, an Ascendant Evincar, and five tickets to the Baneslayer Lottery. And if you don't have Verdant Forces coming out your ears like I do (I traded very aggressively for them back in the day), then that's another great card for casual.
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Lol, 45 USD is equivalent to 37 euros. Everything is much more expensive here in Europe, even the price of singles, it's crazy! Anyway, even if ordered from the US, the shipping costs would be so high that it wouldn't be worth it.
Does anyone else agree that it's still a bargain at 50 bucks for someone such as me who doesn't have that much of a collection (just my theme decks, Planechase decks and Duel decks) and can't bother buying singles?
True enough. But you said that they're being marketed for 15 euros each, so relatively, we're looking at the same discount.
I'm not sure what the singles market is like in Europe, so I'm assuming that since the numbers are the same for the sealed product (even if the units aren't), then the numbers are the same for singles as well.
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You will hardly find a shop selling commons for less than 20 euro cents (0.25 USD), uncommons for less than 50 euro cents (0.60 USD) and rares for less than 1 euro (1.20 USD).
When I do a quick price out at StrikeZone of singles to build these decks (rares and nice UCs), I get about $40. As I go through the decklists, I see that there might be suboptimal cards in there, but a lot of the cards do make me go "Hey, I love that card," from Imperious Perfect to Ascendant Evincar to Verdant Force. It's not worth paying MSRP, but if you can get a deal, I'd say go for it.
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And Counterbore? That just seems kind of disappointing. I'd almost always have another Mind Control or something.
Garruk's deck is the best so far.
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Kamigawa failed because Mirrodin was too powerful. The zubera being 1/2 for 2 instead of 1/1 for 1 is the most publically admitted example of a "nerf" Wizards gave Kamigawa (as 1/1 for 1 with the same abilities they were "too easy to abuse with Skull Clamp". Remember that sets are designed before they are released so Kamigawa would have been completed before the skull clamp banning).
Kamigawa had the same fate as the Masques block: being wedged between a super broken artifact centric block (Urzas and Mirrodin) and the "super-balanced multicolored matters everyone loves to draft this format" block (Invasion and Ravnica). It was meant to bring Magic out of combo/aggro and back into aggro. And I think it did it well in terms of ramping up the strength of the average creature.
The 40 card decks are a huge success in my opinion. How many times have you bought a preconstructed deck and been happy with it? The only precons I can remember loving was Call of the Kor, Slivers and Fun with Fungus and only because I'm a fan of odd creature types. Rat's Nest was a notable exception for Jitte. But these 40 card decks I see being released are actually really good and even experienced players love to purchase at least one. Each set has 1-2 with very good cards (Master of Etherium in Shards; Path in Conflux; Path and Dauntless Escort in Alara Reborn; Honor of the Pure in M10; Sphinx and Bloodwitch in Zendikar; Anthem in Worldwake; Awakening Zone in Eldrazi). The fact you get a pack instead of 15 worthless commons/uncommons means more incentive for the old players and the chance to experience the fun of opening a pack for the first time for the new players.
The only reason I'm no longer mad about the extra land in the booster is the full-art land in Zendikar. And the fact its nothing new. The fact it was zendikar exclusive, while flavorful, is disheartening. But its better than 9 or 5 card boosters. Although I wouldn't mind how some Japanese games pack their boosters (1 guaranteed rare + five 100% random cards; around 1 in 6 chance of double rares).
Also, Wizards has said "The Fans Wanted It!" for successful products as well. Ravnica was said to be developed with the fan reaction to Invasion-Block in mind.
In fact, the WORST decisions Wizards make are when they don't go by fan results. Chronicles is the king of bad decisions.
But it is up to *us* to tell Wizards what we want. Fill out those customer surveys and click on the polls on their page! Send e-mails and post your opinion in *their* forums! Wizards listens to their fans more than most videogame companies I can list..
Custom Set: Pokemon: Generation 1
My mind numbing DC-10 stack!
Simpsons did it!!!
But seriously people wake up and realize this wasnt made a a 'cash grab', it was made cause the people playing the video game wanted it.
A card game about Presidents. Stabbing each other. With knives.
Plain and simply this deck covers what blue is. And for a new player I think the deck is perfect.
Now then, these deck if anything are comparable to the modern era into-decks, which include the deck and a pack. It is rather rare that an intro-deck will have enough value to compensate for the $12 price tag, and those are for 41 card decks, not 60 card decks like these are.
These decks fill the role they were intended to fill. Give people who played the xbox game a similar paper version to get an introduction to the paper game with.
So, if you want to compare these for value, compare them against intro-decks (shards of alara to now). Comparing them to ANYTHING else, is wrong. These are meant to be a starter point for someone. From there they can build upon them and expand their gameplay and knowledge (and collection) as they go.
If I was first getting started into the game I could honestly say I would love these decks. And I dont know about you, but the foil for this deck was the most iconic creature for blue for a LONG time.
Anyhow, Im done. If you all still dont get the premise for these decks, then there is likely nothing I could say to convince you otherwise anyway.
Why are these decks not a direct port from the 360 decks? They're so close anyway it baffles me as to why minor changes were made (and, apparently, for the worse).
Probably because the 360 decks were way over 60 cards.
A card game about Presidents. Stabbing each other. With knives.
Um cause the 360 decks have like 80+ cards? Plus alot of times they have multiples of the rares (theyre not gonna give you a 80 card deck with 12 rares).
Trades
UBRTezzUBR
UMono-Blue-ControlU
RUGRiku of Two ReflectionsRUG
This is a product that can stick around long enough for new players, especially those that were introduced to the game through the Xbox 360, to get their hands on it.
My LinkedIn profile... thing (I have one of those now!).
My research team's webpage.
The mtg-rnn repo and the mtg-encode repo.
But seriously, this deck is awful. They wan't people to pay money for that?
That's new art no?
None of the other decks have new art (besides the Rack in Lillianas) - I can't figure out the thought process here.
Honestly we didnt even know this one was going to have new art so maybe the others will also?
No - I've opened all 5. Mind Control and The Rack are only new ones. I thought a couple might have been - but I looked them up to confirm.
Am I the only person suprised theres no white deck?
I wonder what the thought process was on that??
Hmmm that IS strange... and yea i dont understand why they did one GB instead of making the fifth a white deck.
Commander:
R Daretti, Scrap Savant
BR Olivia Voldaren
BRG Shattergang Brothers
GUR Riku of Two Reflections
WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain
Did you see a picture of the rack from the actual DOTP game? Because that has a different expansion symbol than the decks.
Commander:
R Daretti, Scrap Savant
BR Olivia Voldaren
BRG Shattergang Brothers
GUR Riku of Two Reflections
WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain
Assuming that the relative prices are similar ...
I picked them up for $45 total. I figure it's worth it for the 2 new art cards, a Troll Ascetic, an Ascendant Evincar, and five tickets to the Baneslayer Lottery. And if you don't have Verdant Forces coming out your ears like I do (I traded very aggressively for them back in the day), then that's another great card for casual.
They all have the 'M' expansion symbol. All the cards do, not just the two alt art ones.
that one is, but I posted posted the actual card later in the same thread.
True enough. But you said that they're being marketed for 15 euros each, so relatively, we're looking at the same discount.
I'm not sure what the singles market is like in Europe, so I'm assuming that since the numbers are the same for the sealed product (even if the units aren't), then the numbers are the same for singles as well.
Commander: *Five Color Fun-Stuff *Grixis Artifacts *Beast Tribal
Brawl: To Be Decided At Eldraine Release!
When I do a quick price out at StrikeZone of singles to build these decks (rares and nice UCs), I get about $40. As I go through the decklists, I see that there might be suboptimal cards in there, but a lot of the cards do make me go "Hey, I love that card," from Imperious Perfect to Ascendant Evincar to Verdant Force. It's not worth paying MSRP, but if you can get a deal, I'd say go for it.