If the store owner says that I can't trade in the premises, I'll just go outside. If he says that I can't trade within 10m of his premises, I'll go to 11 meters. If he says that he doesn't want to see me trading, I will put a basket over his head and continue trading.
Yes, he's a local legend. He's only known to take his clothes off before he goes into the Ladies' Lockerroom. Nobody knows what he does in there because he's invisible, but it's almost certainly tons of masturbating.
JTMS price could easily doubled if unbanned in modern.
you're right which is why I believe when it will be unbanned it will be reprinted in a non-standard legal set such as MM but not this years MM (although I can hope:tongue:) almost immediately
Legacy is in a growth phase right now, that is very real.
This. I have this conversation often, and everything boils down to:
Magic in general is getting a lot more popular.
As a result, so is legacy (People are still buying into it.)
And everyone wishes they jumped on the boat when they started rather than put off duals.
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Quote from EX33396948 »
If your deck is 60 cards then you're playing with the best possible odds. 61? Probably won't alter your odds too much but we all know that 96% pure meth won't cut it next to Heisenberg's 99%.
This. I have this conversation often, and everything boils down to:
Magic in general is getting a lot more popular.
As a result, so is legacy (People are still buying into it.)
And everyone wishes they jumped on the boat when they started rather than put off duals.
I totally agree with this statement. I remember back in HS and sitting around watching my friends play MTG...multiple moxes and lotus's on the table...:p yet ten years later I get into it:p
Edit: I will go on record saying I like the original duals text box color design:tongue:
This. I have this conversation often, and everything boils down to:
Magic in general is getting a lot more popular.
As a result, so is legacy (People are still buying into it.)
And everyone wishes they jumped on the boat when they started rather than put off duals.
Have to agree here. I got back into MTG after a long hiatus in summer 2010 and immediately bought back into dual lands, picking them up from eBay, anything the LGS picked up from collections, any GP vendors where I saw them at a good price, whether I needed them or not for a deck. Didn't end up with a full 40 but did get 2-3 of each so I don't feel any mana-base is totally out of my budget at this point. Would it have been better to have bought back in during summer 2009? Sure. 2008? Yep. With the exception of a few cards in the Spring 2011 legacy panic brought on by SCG's buylist hikes, you mostly couldn't have gone wrong buying into legacy at any point in the last few years.
There are a lot of people that, like myself, got back into the game later in life and with much more disposable income than when we were younger. Some of us might just sell off at some point, but a lot will stay in eternal magic off and on for as long as it's played, or at least sit the duals in a binder somewhere so we don't get locked out of the format if we have another hiatus.
Heck, a few weeks ago I saw two of the standard players at my store, who had never shown much legacy interest, proxying up legacy decks and playing RUG delver vs Smallpox. Now they're miles away from having legacy collections, but something has to be driving this sudden interest in people that never had it before. And the folks with modern Jund decks who are like 7 cheap dual lands away from a legacy deck have to be wondering about jumping in too.
I saw on my facebook LGS group guys asking if FNM standard was going to fire or not, so I asked them whats going on are people not playing Standard anymore?
Apparently, players have started to abandon standard... maybe not abandon, but not getting enough players for Standard FNM to fire. Some players have switched to Modern and are going to FNM Modern events. But it seems like standard seems to be on the decline at my LGS.
Meanwhile Legacy has been firing consistently for the last 2+years. There's a 1K Legacy event at the beginning of February and it looks like at least 8 guys from my LGS plan to attend.
What does this mean?
It seems that Modern might be displacing Standard in my area, mean while Legacy seems to be getting more popular. I don't see any risk of Legacy bottoming out soon and any notions of Legacy failing couldn't be farther from the truth.
I saw on my facebook LGS group guys asking if FNM standard was going to fire or not, so I asked them whats going on are people not playing Standard anymore?
Apparently, players have started to abandon standard... maybe not abandon, but not getting enough players for Standard FNM to fire. Some players have switched to Modern and are going to FNM Modern events. But it seems like standard seems to be on the decline at my LGS.
Meanwhile Legacy has been firing consistently for the last 2+years. There's a 1K Legacy event at the beginning of February and it looks like at least 8 guys from my LGS plan to attend.
What does this mean?
It seems that Modern might be displacing Standard in my area, mean while Legacy seems to be getting more popular. I don't see any risk of Legacy bottoming out soon and any notions of Legacy failing couldn't be farther from the truth.
It's not strange, because in reality Legacy has not been dropping much in attendance anywhere. It's stable and even seeing growth in a lot of markets still.
The problem here, on MTGS, is perception... perception created by a lot of people on this forum that dislike Legacy and want to see it go away, so they keep posting like it will be going away, hoping to catch the attention of others and create heresay to reaffirm their self-created propaganda.
It's not strange, because in reality Legacy has not been dropping much in attendance anywhere. It's stable and even seeing growth in a lot of markets still.
Is that why SCG is dropping Legacy for its day 2's in several locations?
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WoTC, thank you for finally announcing the Modern format, an eternal format where everyone can participate.
That's a reason for him NOT to be unbanned in Modern, however. WOTC wants to keep the prices in Modern low and affordable.
I don't think affordability is one of their explicit goals. I do think it is part of their goal, but it isn't the driving force that some make it out to be. We're already seeing fairly large price increases on Modern staples (which crossover into Legacy territory, like the fetchlands, Thoughtseize, V Clique, etc.). Price shouldn't really be a factor in bannings/unbannings. Tarmogoyf is legal.
The thing is, Modern is just not going to be cheap. It's just like Legacy was. When it started, duals were around $15 - $35. Now look at them. If you're interested in Modern, buy in now, or be left in the dust when prices get much higher.
Anyway, since this is the Legacy thread, I'll just conclude by saying that if any Legacy staple starts seeing play in Modern, expect a price surge.
I'm starting to collect Tundras now that everybody is looking the other way (BUG, Jund). Hope I can get the full playset before UW or Band catches fire again.
Is that why SCG is dropping Legacy for its day 2's in several locations?
It was always a day two event for the ones I went to. Not that big of a deal, Legacy is always going to have smaller numbers than Standard, for very obvious reasons...
I saw on my facebook LGS group guys asking if FNM standard was going to fire or not, so I asked them whats going on are people not playing Standard anymore?
Apparently, players have started to abandon standard... maybe not abandon, but not getting enough players for Standard FNM to fire. Some players have switched to Modern and are going to FNM Modern events. But it seems like standard seems to be on the decline at my LGS.
Meanwhile Legacy has been firing consistently for the last 2+years. There's a 1K Legacy event at the beginning of February and it looks like at least 8 guys from my LGS plan to attend.
What does this mean?
It seems that Modern might be displacing Standard in my area, mean while Legacy seems to be getting more popular. I don't see any risk of Legacy bottoming out soon and any notions of Legacy failing couldn't be farther from the truth.
It's not strange, because in reality Legacy has not been dropping much in attendance anywhere. It's stable and even seeing growth in a lot of markets still.
The problem here, on MTGS, is perception... perception created by a lot of people on this forum that dislike Legacy and want to see it go away, so they keep posting like it will be going away, hoping to catch the attention of others and create heresay to reaffirm their self-created propaganda.
All of this is theory crafting, can someone produce some actual attendance numbers to shut the other camp up?
2012-2013
20/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Dallas 212 Players
13/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - San Diego 166 Players
06/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Columbus 325 Players
16/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles 269 Players
09/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Las Vegas 169 Players
02/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Baltimore 287 Players
18/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Seattle 164 Players
11/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Dallas 175 Players
04/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - St. Louis 162 Players
28/10/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - New Orleans 91 Players
21/10/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Indianapolis 204 Players
2011-2012
12/02/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Cincinnati, Ohio 297 Players
05/02/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Richmond 118 Players
15/01/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles 180 Players
08/01/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Atlanta 191 Players
04/12/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - St. Louis 277 Players
06/11/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Las Vegas 168 Players
2010-2011
27/03/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles, CA 216 Players
20/03/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Fort Worth, TX 157 Players
27/02/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Washington 290 Players
06/02/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Indianapolis 267 Players
16/01/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - San Jose 151 Players
09/01/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Kansas 193 Players
I don't see much variance. Big cities get a lot of players, smaller cities get less people.
It's not strange, because in reality Legacy has not been dropping much in attendance anywhere. It's stable and even seeing growth in a lot of markets still.
The problem here, on MTGS, is perception... perception created by a lot of people on this forum that dislike Legacy and want to see it go away, so they keep posting like it will be going away, hoping to catch the attention of others and create heresay to reaffirm their self-created propaganda.
that's all.
QFT
I think you hit the nail on the head.
I would say a great deal of active posters on MTGS are newer and thus attracted to Modern and Standard. Legacy has the false reputation of being that "expensive turn 1 format dominated by force of will"
Legacy is also one of those rights of passage formats where you go through rotation a couple of times and realize how much rotation sucks and look for an alternative. I never heard such animosity towards legacy in real life anywhere. I would also suggest that there are many MTGO players on MTGS and their perception on Legacy would be based on its online presence. Legacy is more of paper format than digital.
We don't need everyone and their Grandma to play Legacy as great as that may sound. But its certainly not dying.
20/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Dallas 212 Players
13/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - San Diego 166 Players
06/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Columbus 325 Players
16/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles 269 Players
09/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Las Vegas 169 Players
02/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Baltimore 287 Players
18/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Seattle 164 Players
11/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Dallas 175 Players
04/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - St. Louis 162 Players
28/10/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - New Orleans 91 Players
21/10/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Indianapolis 204 Players
2011-2012
12/02/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Cincinnati, Ohio 297 Players
05/02/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Richmond 118 Players
15/01/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles 180 Players
08/01/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Atlanta 191 Players
04/12/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - St. Louis 277 Players
06/11/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Las Vegas 168 Players
2010-2011
27/03/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles, CA 216 Players
20/03/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Fort Worth, TX 157 Players
27/02/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Washington 290 Players
06/02/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Indianapolis 267 Players
16/01/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - San Jose 151 Players
09/01/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Kansas 193 Players
I don't see much variance. Big cities get a lot of players, smaller cities get less people.
Source was TC Decks. Excluded the Invitationals.
Too add to this:
Most widely attended event? GP Madrid, Legacy format with 2227.
Most widely attended event in North America? GP Columbus (not sure on this one), and the Wizards and TC Council servers are down, but it was definitely Legacy format with over 2000.
Most widely attended non-WotC event? Bazaar of Moxen, Legacy format with 723.
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Due to real-life obligations, I am taking a long break from Magic which may include missing the local Legacy GP. Apologies for not being able to keep my threads updated.
JTMS price could easily doubled if unbanned in modern.
you're right which is why I believe when it will be unbanned it will be reprinted in a non-standard legal set such as MM but not this years MM (although I can hope:tongue:) almost immediately
This. I have this conversation often, and everything boils down to:
Magic in general is getting a lot more popular.
As a result, so is legacy (People are still buying into it.)
And everyone wishes they jumped on the boat when they started rather than put off duals.
I totally agree with this statement. I remember back in HS and sitting around watching my friends play MTG...multiple moxes and lotus's on the table...:p yet ten years later I get into it:p
Edit: I will go on record saying I like the original duals text box color design:tongue:
Have to agree here. I got back into MTG after a long hiatus in summer 2010 and immediately bought back into dual lands, picking them up from eBay, anything the LGS picked up from collections, any GP vendors where I saw them at a good price, whether I needed them or not for a deck. Didn't end up with a full 40 but did get 2-3 of each so I don't feel any mana-base is totally out of my budget at this point. Would it have been better to have bought back in during summer 2009? Sure. 2008? Yep. With the exception of a few cards in the Spring 2011 legacy panic brought on by SCG's buylist hikes, you mostly couldn't have gone wrong buying into legacy at any point in the last few years.
There are a lot of people that, like myself, got back into the game later in life and with much more disposable income than when we were younger. Some of us might just sell off at some point, but a lot will stay in eternal magic off and on for as long as it's played, or at least sit the duals in a binder somewhere so we don't get locked out of the format if we have another hiatus.
Heck, a few weeks ago I saw two of the standard players at my store, who had never shown much legacy interest, proxying up legacy decks and playing RUG delver vs Smallpox. Now they're miles away from having legacy collections, but something has to be driving this sudden interest in people that never had it before. And the folks with modern Jund decks who are like 7 cheap dual lands away from a legacy deck have to be wondering about jumping in too.
That's a reason for him NOT to be unbanned in Modern, however. WOTC wants to keep the prices in Modern low and affordable.
And I doubt even a second MM set would help keep the price on him down to where they would want him to be.
I saw on my facebook LGS group guys asking if FNM standard was going to fire or not, so I asked them whats going on are people not playing Standard anymore?
Apparently, players have started to abandon standard... maybe not abandon, but not getting enough players for Standard FNM to fire. Some players have switched to Modern and are going to FNM Modern events. But it seems like standard seems to be on the decline at my LGS.
Meanwhile Legacy has been firing consistently for the last 2+years. There's a 1K Legacy event at the beginning of February and it looks like at least 8 guys from my LGS plan to attend.
What does this mean?
It seems that Modern might be displacing Standard in my area, mean while Legacy seems to be getting more popular. I don't see any risk of Legacy bottoming out soon and any notions of Legacy failing couldn't be farther from the truth.
To quote a guy from a shop I go to
"So long as europeans like casting doomsday, legacy is fine"
It's not strange, because in reality Legacy has not been dropping much in attendance anywhere. It's stable and even seeing growth in a lot of markets still.
The problem here, on MTGS, is perception... perception created by a lot of people on this forum that dislike Legacy and want to see it go away, so they keep posting like it will be going away, hoping to catch the attention of others and create heresay to reaffirm their self-created propaganda.
that's all.
:symu::symr::symw::symb::symg: Dream Halls :symu::symr::symw::symb::symg:
:symu::symw: U/W/x Landstill (now Miracles) :symu::symw:
:symu::symu: Merfolk :symu::symu:
contact me!
Legacy
RUG DelverRUG
BUG DelverBUG
Modern
Good ol' fashioned JundBGR)[/I]
Standard
Too Boring
Commander
Azusa, Lost But SeekingG [I](foiling out)[/I]
Is that why SCG is dropping Legacy for its day 2's in several locations?
I don't think affordability is one of their explicit goals. I do think it is part of their goal, but it isn't the driving force that some make it out to be. We're already seeing fairly large price increases on Modern staples (which crossover into Legacy territory, like the fetchlands, Thoughtseize, V Clique, etc.). Price shouldn't really be a factor in bannings/unbannings. Tarmogoyf is legal.
The thing is, Modern is just not going to be cheap. It's just like Legacy was. When it started, duals were around $15 - $35. Now look at them. If you're interested in Modern, buy in now, or be left in the dust when prices get much higher.
Anyway, since this is the Legacy thread, I'll just conclude by saying that if any Legacy staple starts seeing play in Modern, expect a price surge.
It was always a day two event for the ones I went to. Not that big of a deal, Legacy is always going to have smaller numbers than Standard, for very obvious reasons...
:symu::symr::symw::symb::symg: Dream Halls :symu::symr::symw::symb::symg:
:symu::symw: U/W/x Landstill (now Miracles) :symu::symw:
:symu::symu: Merfolk :symu::symu:
contact me!
All of this is theory crafting, can someone produce some actual attendance numbers to shut the other camp up?
2012-2013
20/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Dallas 212 Players
13/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - San Diego 166 Players
06/01/2013 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Columbus 325 Players
16/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles 269 Players
09/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Las Vegas 169 Players
02/12/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Baltimore 287 Players
18/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Seattle 164 Players
11/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Dallas 175 Players
04/11/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - St. Louis 162 Players
28/10/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - New Orleans 91 Players
21/10/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Indianapolis 204 Players
2011-2012
12/02/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Cincinnati, Ohio 297 Players
05/02/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Richmond 118 Players
15/01/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles 180 Players
08/01/2012 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Atlanta 191 Players
04/12/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - St. Louis 277 Players
06/11/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Las Vegas 168 Players
2010-2011
27/03/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Los Angeles, CA 216 Players
20/03/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Fort Worth, TX 157 Players
27/02/2011 SCG.com Legacy Open - Washington 290 Players
06/02/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Indianapolis 267 Players
16/01/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - San Jose 151 Players
09/01/2011 StarCityGames.com Legacy Open - Kansas 193 Players
I don't see much variance. Big cities get a lot of players, smaller cities get less people.
Source was TC Decks. Excluded the Invitationals.
QFT
I think you hit the nail on the head.
I would say a great deal of active posters on MTGS are newer and thus attracted to Modern and Standard. Legacy has the false reputation of being that "expensive turn 1 format dominated by force of will"
Legacy is also one of those rights of passage formats where you go through rotation a couple of times and realize how much rotation sucks and look for an alternative. I never heard such animosity towards legacy in real life anywhere. I would also suggest that there are many MTGO players on MTGS and their perception on Legacy would be based on its online presence. Legacy is more of paper format than digital.
We don't need everyone and their Grandma to play Legacy as great as that may sound. But its certainly not dying.
Too add to this:
Most widely attended event? GP Madrid, Legacy format with 2227.
Most widely attended event in North America? GP Columbus (not sure on this one), and the Wizards and TC Council servers are down, but it was definitely Legacy format with over 2000.
Most widely attended non-WotC event? Bazaar of Moxen, Legacy format with 723.
Legacy
UWR Miracles UWR
GWB Maverick GWB
GB Elves GB
UBR ANT UBR
RG Combo Lands RG
Vintage
BUG BUG Fish BUG
Modern
GBW
Junk PodMagic: the Buylisting