Good common TS Draft Picks

[argumentative]

I think sprout is better used as a surprise blocker blocking attacking x/1's.

[toodumbtopost]

Originally Posted by moogie

White:
Ivory Giant
Temporal Isolation
Amrou Scout
Fortify
Amrou Seekers

Blue:
Errant Ephemeron
Fathom Seer
Crookclaw Transmuter
Snapback
Looter Il Kor

Black:
Strangling Soot
Trespasser Il Vek
Urborg Syphon Mage
Tendrils of Despair
Gorgon Recluse

Red:
Lightning Axe
Rift Bolt
Empty the Warrens
Coal Stoker
Grapeshot

Green:
Penumbra Spider
Search for Tomorrows
Gemhide Sliver
Thallid Shell Dweller
Herd Gnarr

Aside from white and blue, these are pretty loose.

Durkwood Baloth in Green?

other than that this is pretty much me.

[dar482]

Really? Ivory Giant at 1? No Blink?
I have Looter higher and Drakeling Top 5. I have Snapback way lower.
Tendrils at 2 for me.
I like Empty the Warrens high. It can be really strong and isn't hard to draft with so many options.
Yeah, I have Baloth at 1 and Sliver over Search.

[bateleur]

Ivory Giant is great only in mono-White decks, which are very hard to draft at most tables. On top of that it goes late (because most other decks don't much value it). So no, I don't think it belongs on top of any list.

Also, I'd prefer Temporal Isolation to a Giant even for a mono-White deck and even independent of the scarcity of each at the table.

Amrou Scout is similarly hard to rate, because it's vital in the Rebel deck, but again that's hard to draft and the card's otherwise not that great.

[moogie]

Originally Posted by dar482

Really? Ivory Giant at 1? No Blink?
I have Looter higher and Drakeling Top 5. I have Snapback way lower.
Tendrils at 2 for me.
I like Empty the Warrens high. It can be really strong and isn't hard to draft with so many options.
Yeah, I have Baloth at 1 and Sliver over Search.

Ivory Giant could have very well been a mistake at 1, but he's easily the most important card for the white deck, and while i agree with baleteur that you can normally wheel them if you know hte table, i still think he deserves a high spot. Blink could be subbed in for amrou seekers at 5, and it could maybe be a little higher. Its just hard as white's commons are so deep, some just can't make the top 5.

Looter is a low as he is only because he has one toughness and doesn't fly. I have an extreme distaste for creatures of that variety in this format. And snapback could very well be higher, tempo is unbelievable important in this format.

I'm sure I have black wrong past strangling soot. My only experience with black is UB madness, hense the tresspasser being as high as it is.

I have Empty the Warrens as the top non-removal red spell in the format, it can't justifiably get higher than that.

Baloth doesn't make top 5 for me because, in practice, it's too slow. "How can this be?" you ask? Simple, so many games my opponent has suspended a baloth on turn one (I remember once where my opponent suspended baloths on turns 1-3) and was either dead or so close that they simply didn't matter, or my ivory giants started goming into play and they were irrelevant. And even if i were to put baloth in my top five, I absolutely wont put it over spider.

---

I probably should have said this in my first post. But alot of my rankings have to do with the cards' relevaance either in or against the "white deck," which is in my opinion the strongest deck in the format.

[Sheera]

Still wondering what's the deal with Trespasser and Syphon-Mage. In my black decks those have performed rather mediocre, so far. So you can flash a Gorgon into play via Syphon-Mage for just 2BBB instead of 3BB? Great deal. As a madness enabler at least the Mage is sub-par, while Trespasser at least also doesn't generate card advantage (which Looter il-Kor; Tolarian Sentinel and other cards do combined with Madness).

Incidentally, I think this is exactly where most people get that impression that black should be avoided under all circumstances. Their card evaluations are simply off (although I don't understand why these misevaluations are still lingering since performance of good cards should of course be better than that of average ones, for everyone to see).

The key to drafting black isn't to obstinately going the aggro route because everyone does, or to draft low-quality madness enablers over cards that are good on their own just so you can cast your Dark Banishing before you die. The key is - as with any other color in any limited format - to draft the good cards first, ever.

Also many people have pointed out that black is sloooooow in TS-Limited. Which is true. But I can't understand that so many don't draw the right consequences by putting Feebleness (most desireable black common-2-Drop) into the black Top 5 which can deal very well with an opponent's tempo draw.

I just don't get it, but I think many of you can still learn a lot about how to successfully draft black by observing the Japanese TS-Limited strategy.

Originally Posted by moogie

I'm sure I have black wrong past strangling soot. My only experience with black is UB madness, hense the tresspasser being as high as it is.

All right, this might explain a little bit. But still, with UB Madness your other options (Looter, Sentinel, Considerations) are superior to Trespasser, and espescially in this combination I'd take the madness cards first, since every time you're paying a madness cost off a blue enabler you generate card advantage.

[Puzzle]

I think you have a good point about too much focus on madness but Considerations is not a madness outlet to me. Trespasser is quite good in this respect and as an evasive 3/1 for 3, it's still nice. Problem is : it fits more in an aggro strategy and black can't really play aggro in TS.

Point is : I don't think much of madness and black both lacks depths and has high colour requirements. It can work if it's underdrafted but cannot support 3 "more-than-splash" players on the table.

My top five in black is not fixed at all, apart from Soot. It changes depending on how open black is but the following are what I hope to end up with in decent quantity if I go black (to be decided on P1P4 to P1P8) :
1. Soot
2. Feebleness
3. Corpulent Corpse
4. Mindstab
5. Urborg Syphon-Mage
The 3 to 5 I'd want in about equal proportions.
With 6 Swamps or less as a target, I would probably neglect Tendrils of Corruption. If I'm heavy black (8 Swamps or more), then Tendrils jumps to 2nd.

[MTGPhreak]

Originally Posted by Puzzle

My top five in black is not fixed at all, apart from Soot. It changes depending on how open black is but the following are what I hope to end up with in decent quantity if I go black (to be decided on P1P4 to P1P8) :
1. Soot
2. Feebleness
3. Corpulent Corpse
4. Mindstab
5. Urborg Syphon-Mage
The 3 to 5 I'd want in about equal proportions.

I agree with that list with everything except for Corpulent Corpse. I have never won a single game with it, and for that matter, has hardly ever even dealt damage. In theory Fear should be very good in this format, but every time he comes out of suspend he seems unexciting.

Anyway, I would drop Corpulent Corpse off of that list and replace it with Trespasser il-Vec. It's basically always unblockable and is also the best black madness outlet.

[argumentative]

Ｉ had a fnm draft and I drafted Gaze of Justice pretty high (since its removal). But I was never able to cast it. Lol had to learn that the hard way

[phuqdao]

Temporal Isolation - I need to learn to read. Had this on my Plague sliver last night, and I thought I was "losing life" from the Sliver.
Fortify - underrated, IMHO


Errant Ephemeron
Looter il-Kor


Strangling Soot - hands down, get in there one random mountain.


Lightning Axe
Rift Bolt
Grapeshot


Nantuko Shaman - annoying when a land gets Trickster-ed
Penumbra Spider


Terramorphic Expanse