Here is my list that uses Marrow-Gnawer for a general. I'd say that the strategy should be pretty self-explanatory. Play all your Relentless Rats and smash face, or drop Tendrils of Agony after playing all the rats.
I'm sorry, but unless your gaming group wants to make a house-rule, you can only have one relentless rats. The EDH format rule overrides relentless rat's special rule.
Genomancer goes on to say that they need to make a final ruling on it. For the time being, let's not argue about whether or not it's legal. I'd rather just get people's opinions on the deck.
To be honest, it seems like a one trick pony. I agree with some of the posters in that other thread. I don't like it because it seems to go against the whole point of EDH being Highlander. What's the point of playing a 100 card deck that basically plays like a standard 60 card deck? What's the point of playing an EDH deck that does the same thing ever game and has no variety in game plan.
That is just my opinion of course. After all, I think tutors in general need to be looked at abit closer on the same princible. Why bother playing lesser versions of certain cards if you can run enough tutors to always get the best ones and do the same combos every game?
As for it being legal, the rats are a completely casual card, so I don't have a problem using them. Especially given the mass removal in this format, it's like bringing a knife to a gunfight.
@Darktzar: Though not as reliable as tutors, the same argument could be used against cantrips in decks. The spikes will always be an issue for the game, but thankfully in this format you keep enough casual players at a table and you can gang up on that player. Or not invite them to the table at all.
Whoa, I didn't even know Merrow Gnawer was legendary. Awesome! My only suggestion would be to add some way to recur Thrumming Stone in the probable case that it gets countered/destroyed. How about Ill-Gotten Gains or Forbidden Crypt or something? Also, Demonic Collusion is a great tutor spell for EDH.
I also don't see what all the fuss is about regarding the deck's legality/variety. The argument of it being a "one trick pony" can usually hold true for Zur decks (play Zur and ATTACK!!!), Rofellos decks (play Rofellos and OVERPOWER!!!!), old Braids decks (play Braids and WINNN!!!!), etc. I'm happy to hear that the official ruling makes Relentless Rats doable. But, to be fair, I'm also of the camp that thinks Memnarch, Bosh, Iron Golem, and Phage the Untouchable should be legit generals.
So what happenes when a rat gets Extirpate'd? LOLz ensue... There is a guy in our playgroup that had this built, we always threatened him with that....
So what happenes when a rat gets Extirpate'd? LOLz ensue... There is a guy in our playgroup that had this built, we always threatened him with that....
... but you didn't go through with it, because it's utterly useless against any other highlander deck.
You'll never get such specific hate pointed your way unless you're winning alot, in which case you aren't going to need much more help with deckbuilding.
he then goes on to say that the RC met and the current ruling is that you can run multiples, but they reserve the right to change their mind
I know you think you are "correcting me", but I do have to point a little detail because you apparently missed it. I posted that statement yesterday and he posted his new/update today. Thanks for the update though.
Ludd Gang: A card that cantrips for one card isn't anywhere near as powerfull as tutor effects on the format. Yes, ultracompative spikes who bring that mentality into what normally is a casual format is irritating but that's a seperate issue IMO. As far as I'm concerned, EDH should ban most of the tutors that are banned in Prismatic (another large deck format).
Dosu: I know he is a really powerfull and popular general but I think Zur should be banned as a general. I agree with you when you suggest that Bosh and Phage should be allowable... and I would go a step further and suggest that Rys (the green one with a black activacted ability) and Daughter of Autumn (a green one with a white activated ability) should be playable as a green/black general and a green/white general.
Relentless Rats seems pointless and boring even in constructed, nevermind in singleton format... why bother? As people have pointed out, it's far too easy to break and it's probably really annoying to play against... that and it takes very little skill to put the deck together. That's my thoughts on the deck, anyways.
@DarkTzar: So you think that all tutors should be banned outright from EDH? I think that would kill any type of combo deck, pretty much... unless you could find several versions of cards that provide the same desired effect. Is having 3 or 4 tutor cards out of a 100 card deck really that big of an issue? That's a serious question, by the way, seeming as I have yet to actually play a game in this format.
it takes very little skill to put the deck together.
If you do 62 rats and a bunch of swamps, yes.
I've found constructing this deck has been very challenging. Moreso than some of the "goodstuff" decks I've put together. Haven't tested it yet, so we'll see how well it works...
Scrappy: I'm fine with decks that can combo, but I disagree with the idea that it should be able to do so every game. BTW, there are more than just 3 or 4 tutor cards you can use. If more than 1/10th of your library is tutors (which is pretty easy in certain colors), then you are pretty much certain to be able to find the pieces of your combo every single game making most of your deck either pointless or stuff that prevents you from losing long enough for you to pull off your combo every single game. If you want to pull off a combo then yes, you need to use simular cards that have simular effects. Control and aggro decks are required to do that as a general rule, why shouldn't combo decks as well.
@DarkTzar: Yeah, alright... I can certainly see how having double digits worth of tutors is a bit silly... Having played a constructed deck with 14 tutor effects in it myself, it is a bit much. I guess I was just making the assumption that most players would want to play a less abusive game of EDH. That's where the "3 or 4 tutors" comment came from. Everything in moderation, yes?
I don't think every tutor effect should be gotten rid of to be honest. I just think it goes against the spirit of the format to always play the same cards almost every single game because you have enough tutors to always tutor for them. IMO, the games should vary as to what happens. Isn't that the point of playing with 100 cards instead of 60? Isn't that the point of it being highlander instead of 4 ofs? Yes, the decks won't be as consistant, nor should they be.
General: Marrow-Gnawer
Creatures - 40
38x Relentless Rats
Artifacts - 11
Other Spells - 15
Lands - 33
24x Swamp
According to Genomancer of the EDH Rules Committee, you can, at least for now.
That is just my opinion of course. After all, I think tutors in general need to be looked at abit closer on the same princible. Why bother playing lesser versions of certain cards if you can run enough tutors to always get the best ones and do the same combos every game?
My Rats deck I'm building uses Karona, False God for the general. It's almost entirely UB with some mana color splashes (Chromatic Star, etc.) so I can cast Karona anf (maybe) Maelstrom Nexus. That gives me access to Spitting Image, Phyrric Revival, Snakeform and some other hybrids. There's also a touch of countermagic to ward mass removal.
As for it being legal, the rats are a completely casual card, so I don't have a problem using them. Especially given the mass removal in this format, it's like bringing a knife to a gunfight.
@Darktzar: Though not as reliable as tutors, the same argument could be used against cantrips in decks. The spikes will always be an issue for the game, but thankfully in this format you keep enough casual players at a table and you can gang up on that player. Or not invite them to the table at all.
he then goes on to say that the RC met and the current ruling is that you can run multiples, but they reserve the right to change their mind
I also don't see what all the fuss is about regarding the deck's legality/variety. The argument of it being a "one trick pony" can usually hold true for Zur decks (play Zur and ATTACK!!!), Rofellos decks (play Rofellos and OVERPOWER!!!!), old Braids decks (play Braids and WINNN!!!!), etc. I'm happy to hear that the official ruling makes Relentless Rats doable. But, to be fair, I'm also of the camp that thinks Memnarch, Bosh, Iron Golem, and Phage the Untouchable should be legit generals.
Nice deck! Let me know how it works out!
Draft my Mono-Blue Cube!
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... but you didn't go through with it, because it's utterly useless against any other highlander deck.
You'll never get such specific hate pointed your way unless you're winning alot, in which case you aren't going to need much more help with deckbuilding.
I know you think you are "correcting me", but I do have to point a little detail because you apparently missed it. I posted that statement yesterday and he posted his new/update today. Thanks for the update though.
Ludd Gang: A card that cantrips for one card isn't anywhere near as powerfull as tutor effects on the format. Yes, ultracompative spikes who bring that mentality into what normally is a casual format is irritating but that's a seperate issue IMO. As far as I'm concerned, EDH should ban most of the tutors that are banned in Prismatic (another large deck format).
Dosu: I know he is a really powerfull and popular general but I think Zur should be banned as a general. I agree with you when you suggest that Bosh and Phage should be allowable... and I would go a step further and suggest that Rys (the green one with a black activacted ability) and Daughter of Autumn (a green one with a white activated ability) should be playable as a green/black general and a green/white general.
@DarkTzar: So you think that all tutors should be banned outright from EDH? I think that would kill any type of combo deck, pretty much... unless you could find several versions of cards that provide the same desired effect. Is having 3 or 4 tutor cards out of a 100 card deck really that big of an issue? That's a serious question, by the way, seeming as I have yet to actually play a game in this format.
If you do 62 rats and a bunch of swamps, yes.
I've found constructing this deck has been very challenging. Moreso than some of the "goodstuff" decks I've put together. Haven't tested it yet, so we'll see how well it works...
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[url]http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=5301342#post5301342"]What kind of Magic Player are you?
Probably the most brokenly created commander deck ever:http://deckstats.net/decks/811/1859-ubr-teps-desire-commander