This is the Iona deck I've been working on. I'm try to keep it balanced between a good 1v1 deck and multiplayer deck. If You have any suggestions for it please let Me know.
Made some changes to the set up today. 35 land wasn't enough. I cut Crovax and Mangara because I'm trying to run minimal legends, I also cut True Believer coz I have Ivory Mask for that effect. I also cut Decree of Justice and Conqueror's Pledge coz the Enchantment token makers better fit the current set up.
Updated the deck again after an average effort with the play group on Sunday. I discovered that the Gaddock Teeg deck is probably the biggest problem I have in My play group.
I don't like Luminarch Ascension in this deck. It's going to be very hard for you to keep yourself from receiving no damage since it paints such a big bullet on your head.
I don't like Luminarch Ascension in this deck. It's going to be very hard for you to keep yourself from receiving no damage since it paints such a big bullet on your head.
Luminarch Ascension is great really early (like turn 2) or once You have the board locked down. It wraps the game up really quickly once You have it online, thats why I put it in.
Luminarch Ascension is great really early (like turn 2) or once You have the board locked down. It wraps the game up really quickly once You have it online, thats why I put it in.
In a 4-5 player game, drop it on turn 2 and it will be active by the time its your next turn. hardly anyone will have threats in play that fast.
you need a LOT more land. a lot. and accelerants. sadly mono-white has very little in the way of accelerants, but there should be a fair number of artifacts that will work.
you need a LOT more land. a lot. and accelerants. sadly mono-white has very little in the way of accelerants, but there should be a fair number of artifacts that will work.
I did have 40 land in here at 1 point and 5 or 6 more mana artifacts. I was getting mana flooded with that set up all the time so I cut a few at a time and this is the set up thats worked best so far.
maybe you should put in some more mana dumps, then. call me crazy but i don't see the point to having a general that takes until turn 15 to cast, especially when that general is restricting you to one color.
maybe you should put in some more mana dumps, then. call me crazy but i don't see the point to having a general that takes until turn 15 to cast, especially when that general is restricting you to one color.
Like what? Turn 15 is a bit of a stretch. By the time I can play Her (which can be as early as turn 5) I'm usually ready to. I'd probably be playing a mono white, even if I wasn't playing Iona
Like what? Turn 15 is a bit of a stretch. By the time I can play Her (which can be as early as turn 5) I'm usually ready to. I'd probably be playing a mono white, even if I wasn't playing Iona
Turn 15 may not be a stretch, especially if you're dropping your "Fast mana" in an Iona deck.
The best kind of deck to use Iona is a Green/White deck with Tooth and Nail and Defense of the Heart because that is just really really mean early on. Turn 5 is possible for Iona, but I just don't think that's very fun.
Anyways, good luck with the General. I would recommend Reveillark for when you need to fetch Painter's Servant or your other weenies, and it combos well with Karmic Guide.
Like what? Turn 15 is a bit of a stretch. By the time I can play Her (which can be as early as turn 4) I'm usually ready to. I'd probably be playing a mono white, even if I wasn't playing Iona
But what turn can you cast her? Turn 9-15 are late, even in EDH.
I think I've tipped the balance of this deck too far in favor of 1v1. I'm finding it struggling in multiplayer a bit now. Any suggestion to improve My multiplayer game?
But what turn can you cast her? Turn 9-15 are late, even in EDH.
Turn 9 isn't late in EDH. In a multiplayer format with four people, the peak of spells begin getting cast turns 6-10 and then tend to descend for the next few turns, and then pick up again. That's why the curves in EDH decks are allowed to be so ridiculous without getting shot at.
Things like Autochoton Wurm actually see play in a Doran deck.
Next time you play a multiplayer game I want you to count how many spells per turn each player casts. You'll see that some players will pass, not play anything early turns (1-3) and some players MIGHT cast a spell 4-6, and if they do it's usually a utility creature, or an instant/sorcery. The unusual case here is for Politics deck (which tend to drop Propaganda/Jace/Howling Mine/Aurification/etc) will cast on 3-6, and won't cast any other spells unless it's during their opponent's turn.
Regardless, for a deck like this you shouldn't be worried about 1-3, start preparing on 4-6 and should be able to cast Iona consistently by turn 7 - which really isn't a problem.
I would consider putting Knight of the White Orchid in there if you're having land issues. It's not as good as Eternal Dragon, but it still has some potential
Anyways, good luck with your deck.
In an eight player game, is anything good? Don't you just sit there countering combos until someone genesis waves for 42 after all the blue players tap out fighting over a bribery?
I think I've tipped the balance of this deck too far in favor of 1v1. I'm finding it struggling in multiplayer a bit now. Any suggestion to improve My multiplayer game?
Like what? Turn 15 is a bit of a stretch. By the time I can play Her (which can be as early as turn 5) I'm usually ready to. I'd probably be playing a mono white, even if I wasn't playing Iona
turn 5? o_O there's only 4 mana accelerants in your deck by my count, which means you'll be playing her on turn 9 or later a good 70%+ of the time. sure, if you sol ring an extraplanar lens turn 1, you can get her out turn 5, but that's hardly likely. CONSISTENCY is the name of the game. if you get just lens she'll be out turn 6 at the earliest, turn 7 with sol ring, turn 7 with relic, or turn 6 with gauntlet. those wouldn't be terrible numbers except that you're assuming you'll get ONE of those things, AND you're assuming you'll play a land every turn, which is fairly unlikely with so few lands. i'd say you'd be LUCKY to get her out on turn 9.
I'd say you have 2 good options:
1) put in a lot more lands and mana acceleration to get her out CONSISTANTLY on turn 6 or earlier. mana vault, grim monolith, basalt monolith, mana crypt, gilded lotus, ur-golem's eye, thran dynamo, etc. all work great for that, and i'm sure there's plenty more. put in a bunch of expensive crap and sweepers to keep the field clean until you can drop your big stuff. (EDIT: there's also some storage lands that might help - fountain of cho and icatian store, and don't forget doubling cube and remote farm, maybe even ruins of trokair)
2) keep it as-is but switch the general for something cheaper. personally i think mageta the lion could be fun, but pick anything you like with a cmc less than 7 or so.
Next time you play a multiplayer game I want you to count how many spells per turn each player casts. You'll see that some players will pass, not play anything early turns (1-3) and some players MIGHT cast a spell 4-6, and if they do it's usually a utility creature, or an instant/sorcery. The unusual case here is for Politics deck (which tend to drop Propaganda/Jace/Howling Mine/Aurification/etc) will cast on 3-6, and won't cast any other spells unless it's during their opponent's turn.
Honestly, in most games I play, if you have no plays before turn 5, you might as well have no plays at all.
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The Sage is occupied with the unspoken
and acts without effort.
Teaching without verbosity,
producing without possessing,
creating without regard to result,
claiming nothing,
the Sage has nothing to lose.
Regardless, for a deck like this you shouldn't be worried about 1-3, start preparing on 4-6 and should be able to cast Iona consistently by turn 7 - which really isn't a problem.
I normally spend the 1st 3 turns running out mana. Not being able get her down by turn 7 is an issue so rarely its not worth fixing. Mostly, I don't want Her before then anyway
Quote from Himetic »
turn 5? o_O there's only 4 mana accelerants in your deck by my count, which means you'll be playing her on turn 9 or later a good 70%+ of the time. sure, if you sol ring an extraplanar lens turn 1, you can get her out turn 5, but that's hardly likely. CONSISTENCY is the name of the game. if you get just lens she'll be out turn 6 at the earliest, turn 7 with sol ring, turn 7 with relic, or turn 6 with gauntlet. those wouldn't be terrible numbers except that you're assuming you'll get ONE of those things, AND you're assuming you'll play a land every turn, which is fairly unlikely with so few lands. i'd say you'd be LUCKY to get her out on turn 9.
You haven't factored for Land Tax, Journeyer's Kite, Expedition Map or Thawing Glaciers but whatever, thats not the point. The question was how fast can I get her out? Which is as fast as turn 5 (however unlikely You find it) The question wasn't how soon do I want her out? which isn't til turn 7 or later most games anyway.
Quote from Himetic »
I'd say you have 2 good options:
1) put in a lot more lands and mana acceleration to get her out CONSISTANTLY on turn 6 or earlier. mana vault, grim monolith, basalt monolith, mana crypt, gilded lotus, ur-golem's eye, thran dynamo, etc. all work great for that, and i'm sure there's plenty more. put in a bunch of expensive crap and sweepers to keep the field clean until you can drop your big stuff. (EDIT: there's also some storage lands that might help - fountain of cho and icatian store, and don't forget doubling cube and remote farm, maybe even ruins of trokair)
2) keep it as-is but switch the general for something cheaper. personally i think mageta the lion could be fun, but pick anything you like with a cmc less than 7 or so.
1) I tried it that way 1st. It sucked. The set up I'm running now is a hell of a lot more reliable than mana flood, do nothing, get killed which is what was happening with that kind of set up.
2)I could but it would defeat the purpose. I wanted to do a deck with Iona as general
I normally spend the 1st 3 turns running out mana. Not being able get her down by turn 7 is an issue so rarely its not worth fixing. Mostly, I don't want Her before then anyway
You haven't factored for Land Tax, Journeyer's Kite, Expedition Map or Thawing Glaciers but whatever, thats not the point. The question was how fast can I get her out? Which is as fast as turn 5 (however unlikely You find it) The question wasn't how soon do I want her out? which isn't til turn 7 or later most games anyway.
1) I tried it that way 1st. It sucked. The set up I'm running now is a hell of a lot more reliable than mana flood, do nothing, get killed which is what was happening with that kind of set up.
2)I could but it would defeat the purpose. I wanted to do a deck with Iona as general
land tax, journeyer's kite, etc do NOT give you mana acceleration. they only give you lands, so they still can't accelerate it out any earlier than turn 9. now, they DO add consistency, but there's only 4 of them. so the odds are still around 50% that you won't get any land-fetchers OR mana accelerants, in which case it could take until turn 15 to get enough lands. with just a fetcher, it will take until turn 9. you only have about a 20-30% chance of getting him out earlier than that. no matter how you slice it, it's slowwwww.
also, you're wrong. it's possible to get it out turn 4. but either way, the answer to that question is fairly pointless.
for 1) are you using it for multiplayer? yeah, in multiplayer iono is pretty crap. in 1v1 she can lock people down quite well, and the faster the better. for multiplayer, i'd definitely just use a different general, but if 2), then it's your funeral. as i mentioned earlier, you could always put in a bunch of mana dumps so that mana flood is irrelevant.
The whole "How fast can You get Her out?" argument is kinda pointless. I almost never want to play Iona early anyway. I know She isn't the best choice for a general as a multiplayer deck, I'm playing Her in 1v1 more than multiplayer lately and playing Wort as My multiplayer deck deck for the most part. I do want the deck to be decent for multiplayer at least so that if I don't want to play it in big games I can lend it out.
The whole "How fast can You get Her out?" argument is kinda pointless. I almost never want to play Iona early anyway. I know She isn't the best choice for a general as a multiplayer deck, I'm playing Her in 1v1 more than multiplayer lately and playing Wort as My multiplayer deck deck for the most part. I do want the deck to be decent for multiplayer at least so that if I don't want to play it in big games I can lend it out.
well for 1v1 she could be a real bomb. if they're mono-colored that's basically game over when she's out, unless they've already got a good field position, or something on the field to kill her (i.e. kiku, night's flower), and vs multicolor she can lock out their main color and screw them pretty well. no matter what, they won't be able to play their general again while she's out. if you're using her for 1v1, i think accelerating her onto the field is your best bet, along with some board sweepers, protection for her in case they have multiple colors of removal, and some fatties to control the field once she's out. admittedly much less effective in multiplayer, but you could always sideboard. she's just not a general who can be effective in multiplayer and 1v1 with the same deck, imo. unless everyone else is playing the same color.
I personally think that Iona is a very viable general in edh, for 1v1 or multiplayer games. I have a build that I threw together about a month ago, and have been stomping the competition. However in my build, I run 6 wrath effects and play equipto weenie. My opponents usually get me to 7-8 life before I lock the board down. my advise, spot removal early, and mass removal Meta. Save o rings for generals, and play iona after a board wipe. Running annoying card like kor hookmaster, yosei, and sceptre of dominance are key. Kor cartographer, journeyers kite, weathered wayfarer, land tax, solemn simulacrum, and font of mythos are great ways to accelerate, and/or not over extend. And you have to make sur you keep yjerpressure on your opponents. White is hard to do it with, if your playing control. Hence why i run so many wrath effects. Ill post my deck list soon so you can take a look and compare
Just a personal thought and opinion, if you wanna go enchantments, run Uril , or horde of notions as your general. The deck will do much better. enchantments in white are good, same with artifacts. But better when paired with other colors. Mono white should be aggressive control. but whatever works, works. Ive found when you theme your deck around something it does make it better, but it has to be the right theme for the colors.
1 Iona, Shield of Emeria
LANDS
30 Plains
1 Serra's Sanctum
1 Ancient Den
1 Kjeldoran Outpost
1 High Market
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Dust Bowl
1 Mistveil Plains
1 Reliquary Tower
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Kor Haven
CREATURES
1 Platinum Angel
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Painter's Servant
1 Duplicant
1 Baneslayer Angel
1 Windborn Muse
1 Yosei, the Morning Star
1 Magus of the Disk
1 Felidar Sovereign
1 Exalted Angel
1 Academy Rector
1 Weathered Wayfarer
1 Eternal Dragon
1 World Queller
1 Emeria Angel
1 Twilight Shepherd
1 Akroma, Angel of Wrath
1 Beacon of Immortality
1 Oblation
1 Return to Dust
1 Condemn
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Path to Exile
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Argivian Find
PLANESWALKERS
1 Ajani Goldmane
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
ARTIFACTS
1 Expedition Map
1 Planar Portal
1 Skullclamp
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Eternity Vessel
1 Scroll Rack
1 Sol Ring
1 Journeyer's Kite
1 Mind's Eye
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Coalition Relic
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Day of Judgment
1 Wrath of God
1 Austere Command
1 Planar Cleansing
1 Akroma's Vengeance
1 Idyllic Tutor
1 Open the Vaults
1 Replenish
ENCHANTMENTS
1 Land Tax
1 Test of Endurance
1 Karmic Justice
1 Story Circle
1 Luminarch Ascension
1 Prison Term
1 Sacred Mesa
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Ghostly Prison
1 Ivory Mask
1 Faith's Fetters
I'm taking this to a big playgroup on sunday. Some of the other generals in this group I know about are Sharuum the Hegemon, Gaddock Teeg, Razia, Boros Archangel, Wort, Boggart Auntie, Jenera, Asura of War (the winner last time) and Uril, the Miststalker. I'm particularly worried about the Jenera deck, last time it came down to Him, the Sharuum deck and Myself and He killed Me in one hit.
Any suggestions for a playgroup like I've described would be greatly appreciated
I switch generals 1v1 I use isamaru, hound of konda
Thanks spiderboy and Highlight Studios!!!
My trade thread!
I cut Ethersworn Canonist because I never play it. I cut Scourglass because it was handing the win to the Sharuum deck. I cut Grim Monolith and Mana Vault coz the deck needed more land instead of fast mana.
I added High Market so that I could have a Yosei lock for 1v1, its also great with Solemn Simulacrum which I added as well. I added Test of Endurance as another cheesy win condition and Beacon of Immortality to make it work.
Luminarch Ascension is great really early (like turn 2) or once You have the board locked down. It wraps the game up really quickly once You have it online, thats why I put it in.
In a 4-5 player game, drop it on turn 2 and it will be active by the time its your next turn. hardly anyone will have threats in play that fast.
or after a wrath...
its a solid card.
Thanks Darth Monkey
I did have 40 land in here at 1 point and 5 or 6 more mana artifacts. I was getting mana flooded with that set up all the time so I cut a few at a time and this is the set up thats worked best so far.
Like what? Turn 15 is a bit of a stretch. By the time I can play Her (which can be as early as turn 5) I'm usually ready to. I'd probably be playing a mono white, even if I wasn't playing Iona
Turn 15 may not be a stretch, especially if you're dropping your "Fast mana" in an Iona deck.
The best kind of deck to use Iona is a Green/White deck with Tooth and Nail and Defense of the Heart because that is just really really mean early on. Turn 5 is possible for Iona, but I just don't think that's very fun.
Anyways, good luck with the General. I would recommend Reveillark for when you need to fetch Painter's Servant or your other weenies, and it combos well with Karmic Guide.
But what turn can you cast her? Turn 9-15 are late, even in EDH.
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW
Reveillark is a good idea. I'll try to make room for it.
depending on the draw anywhere from turn 5 onwards
Turn 9 isn't late in EDH. In a multiplayer format with four people, the peak of spells begin getting cast turns 6-10 and then tend to descend for the next few turns, and then pick up again. That's why the curves in EDH decks are allowed to be so ridiculous without getting shot at.
Things like Autochoton Wurm actually see play in a Doran deck.
Next time you play a multiplayer game I want you to count how many spells per turn each player casts. You'll see that some players will pass, not play anything early turns (1-3) and some players MIGHT cast a spell 4-6, and if they do it's usually a utility creature, or an instant/sorcery. The unusual case here is for Politics deck (which tend to drop Propaganda/Jace/Howling Mine/Aurification/etc) will cast on 3-6, and won't cast any other spells unless it's during their opponent's turn.
Regardless, for a deck like this you shouldn't be worried about 1-3, start preparing on 4-6 and should be able to cast Iona consistently by turn 7 - which really isn't a problem.
I would consider putting Knight of the White Orchid in there if you're having land issues. It's not as good as Eternal Dragon, but it still has some potential
Anyways, good luck with your deck.
Thanks to DarkNightCavalier
Since it's mono-white, Light from Within & Springjack Shepherd would both kick hard here in Multi
Current Generals:
GWU Jenara WUB Sharuum WUB Zur
WB Ghost Council RGW Uril RB Wort GU Kraj
turn 5? o_O there's only 4 mana accelerants in your deck by my count, which means you'll be playing her on turn 9 or later a good 70%+ of the time. sure, if you sol ring an extraplanar lens turn 1, you can get her out turn 5, but that's hardly likely. CONSISTENCY is the name of the game. if you get just lens she'll be out turn 6 at the earliest, turn 7 with sol ring, turn 7 with relic, or turn 6 with gauntlet. those wouldn't be terrible numbers except that you're assuming you'll get ONE of those things, AND you're assuming you'll play a land every turn, which is fairly unlikely with so few lands. i'd say you'd be LUCKY to get her out on turn 9.
I'd say you have 2 good options:
1) put in a lot more lands and mana acceleration to get her out CONSISTANTLY on turn 6 or earlier. mana vault, grim monolith, basalt monolith, mana crypt, gilded lotus, ur-golem's eye, thran dynamo, etc. all work great for that, and i'm sure there's plenty more. put in a bunch of expensive crap and sweepers to keep the field clean until you can drop your big stuff. (EDIT: there's also some storage lands that might help - fountain of cho and icatian store, and don't forget doubling cube and remote farm, maybe even ruins of trokair)
2) keep it as-is but switch the general for something cheaper. personally i think mageta the lion could be fun, but pick anything you like with a cmc less than 7 or so.
In my experiences it's more like..
Turn 1: Sol Ring/Skullclamp/Brainstorm/Sensei's Divining Top/Serum Visions/Duress/Thoughtseize
Turn 2: Signets/Talismans/Rampant Growth/Journeyer's Kite/Hymn to Tourarch/Sinkhole
Turn 3: Armageddon/Ravages of War/Mwonwuli Acid-Moss/Garruk Wildespeaker/Jace Beleren/Mana Vortex/Necropotence/Zur the Enchanter/Arcum Daggson/Braids, Cabal Minion/Trinisphere/Smokestack
And I am not even talking about the god draws of: Ancient Tomb+Azorius Signet=>Smokestack or Ancient Tomb+Sol Ring+Trinisphere.
Honestly, in most games I play, if you have no plays before turn 5, you might as well have no plays at all.
and acts without effort.
Teaching without verbosity,
producing without possessing,
creating without regard to result,
claiming nothing,
the Sage has nothing to lose.
I normally spend the 1st 3 turns running out mana. Not being able get her down by turn 7 is an issue so rarely its not worth fixing. Mostly, I don't want Her before then anyway
You haven't factored for Land Tax, Journeyer's Kite, Expedition Map or Thawing Glaciers but whatever, thats not the point. The question was how fast can I get her out? Which is as fast as turn 5 (however unlikely You find it) The question wasn't how soon do I want her out? which isn't til turn 7 or later most games anyway.
1) I tried it that way 1st. It sucked. The set up I'm running now is a hell of a lot more reliable than mana flood, do nothing, get killed which is what was happening with that kind of set up.
2)I could but it would defeat the purpose. I wanted to do a deck with Iona as general
land tax, journeyer's kite, etc do NOT give you mana acceleration. they only give you lands, so they still can't accelerate it out any earlier than turn 9. now, they DO add consistency, but there's only 4 of them. so the odds are still around 50% that you won't get any land-fetchers OR mana accelerants, in which case it could take until turn 15 to get enough lands. with just a fetcher, it will take until turn 9. you only have about a 20-30% chance of getting him out earlier than that. no matter how you slice it, it's slowwwww.
also, you're wrong. it's possible to get it out turn 4. but either way, the answer to that question is fairly pointless.
for 1) are you using it for multiplayer? yeah, in multiplayer iono is pretty crap. in 1v1 she can lock people down quite well, and the faster the better. for multiplayer, i'd definitely just use a different general, but if 2), then it's your funeral. as i mentioned earlier, you could always put in a bunch of mana dumps so that mana flood is irrelevant.
well for 1v1 she could be a real bomb. if they're mono-colored that's basically game over when she's out, unless they've already got a good field position, or something on the field to kill her (i.e. kiku, night's flower), and vs multicolor she can lock out their main color and screw them pretty well. no matter what, they won't be able to play their general again while she's out. if you're using her for 1v1, i think accelerating her onto the field is your best bet, along with some board sweepers, protection for her in case they have multiple colors of removal, and some fatties to control the field once she's out. admittedly much less effective in multiplayer, but you could always sideboard. she's just not a general who can be effective in multiplayer and 1v1 with the same deck, imo. unless everyone else is playing the same color.
WRGUril, the MiststalkerWRG http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=205561
BOb Nixilis, the FallenBhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207096
RKiki-Jiki, Mirror BreakerR http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207861
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=208506
WRGUril, the MiststalkerWRG http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=205561
BOb Nixilis, the FallenBhttp://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207096
RKiki-Jiki, Mirror BreakerR http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=207861
WUBRGHorde of NotionsWUBRG http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=208506