Old thread here. So I was unhappy with my old Hanna deck, and I have slowly started tweaking it to what it is now. I didn't like it being seen as a douchebag deck for having combos like Enchanted Evening + Opalescence or Parallax Tide + sac outlet, so I took those out for cards that seem much more interactive. The other issue I had was it was too reliant on a good draw, and without it, it was just way too clunky to be of any use. I toned down the curve considerably and added a ton of cheap draw, and now I feel the deck is much faster, consistent, and fun to play against. I am a casual player at heart, and while I'd still like the deck to be competitive, the main goal isn't winning.
There are a ton of hidden synergies and combos within the deck. It will take quite a while to list them all. Just about every card has multiple synergies with other cards, though. I did try to stay away from infinite combos though.
it makes parallax cards brokener (any bounce card works)
I like that it puts Wave back into my hand so that I won't have to recur it, but I'm not sure if it has enough other uses to warrant a spot. It's definitely worth considering though.
Currently testing:
-1 Mimic Vat
-1 Honden of Seeing Winds
+1 Faerie Machinist
+1 other utility card
Honden was expensive, slow, and seemed like win-more, Vat is too awkward in this deck since it doesn't use enough creatures. I'm deciding between Brainstorm or Trinket Mage for the other slot. Thoughts?
Edit: Well I still couldn't find any extra brainstorms so Trinket Mage goes back in, lol.
Yep, I was just testing Vat since I just recently got one, it really was extremely awkward in the deck. It's now gone.
I'm not a fan of Disk because it hits so many of my own stuff, and it's not as thorough or controllable as O-Stone.
I like that it puts Wave back into my hand so that I won't have to recur it, but I'm not sure if it has enough other uses to warrant a spot. It's definitely worth considering though.
Currently testing:
-1 Mimic Vat
-1 Honden of Seeing Winds
+1 Faerie Machinist
+1 other utility card
Honden was expensive, slow, and seemed like win-more, Vat is too awkward in this deck since it doesn't use enough creatures. I'm deciding between Brainstorm or Trinket Mage for the other slot. Thoughts?
Edit: Well I still couldn't find any extra brainstorms so Trinket Mage goes back in, lol.
throw in the white parallax.
and do you know the combo on how to PERMANANTLY exile stuff with the parallax cards?
I guess this version isn't as popular as my last version. Even without the broken combos, I feel it's a lot more fun to play.
I removed Faerie Mechanist, it's good in theory, especially with Master Transmuter shenanegans but 33 artifacts wasn't enough to make it hit consistently. If only it searched four or five deep...
Trinket Mage actually wasn't needed, I have so many ways of getting Claws of Gix that the Mage just didn't fit in. I might play around with Riptide Laboratory though, especially since I added the first counterspell into the deck in a LONG time, in Glen Elendra Archmage.
I added Unbender Tine on a whim but so far it's amazing. At worst it's a slightly overcosted mana rock, but it does so much more than that - Voltaic Key #2 and shenanegans with a ton of activated abilities.
I also made some changes to the mana base. I'm trying to fit Thawing Glaciers in the deck but right now I'm not sure if there's enough support to make it good. I have three cards that abuse it (Deserted Temple, Rings of Brighthearth, Unbender Tine) but without them it's pretty bad. I'm also testing Emeria the Sky Ruin for actual creature recursion, I might have to fix the mana base a bit more to support it (And Thawing Glaciers) better though.
In terms of what to take out, I don't really like:
Sanctum Plowbeast (very meh)
Ichor Wellspring (only 2 sac outlets and not very easy to recur)
Aura of Silence (will draw lots of hate)
Enchanted Evening (doesn't seem to actually do anything much)
[oh, it goes with Teferi's care...but...meh]
Didn't quite make the cut since it doesn't produce colored mana and is usually worse than Mind Stone.
Myr Incubator can be pretty stupid - pooping out 30 1/1s at EoT can win the game.
It's extremely expensive to use, doesn't guarantee a win, and doesn't really have any other good applications. It's one of those cards that I considered but just didn't quite make the cut.
If I wanted another version of Orrery, I'd run Leyline of Anticipation. I don't want to devote another spot for it atm since they don't really affect the board.
I've tested it, I didn't like it for being too slow. Granted, it's the same speed as Scourglass but Scourglass is a pretty one-sided sweeper in this deck.
I've also included an infinite mana combo in the form of Salvaging Station + Claws of Gix + Summoning Station + Lotus Bloom,
This version doesn't run infinite combos. I'm currently working on a combo version of Hanna though so I might consider it for that version. I'll have to see if they have any other applications to warrant inclusion. Lotus Bloom can also be replaced with Krark-Clan Ironworks in your combo.
These are very good for Stax or Prison builds, but it's not what I'm going for here.
In terms of what to take out, I don't really like:
Sanctum Plowbeast (very meh)
Ichor Wellspring (only 2 sac outlets and not very easy to recur)
Aura of Silence (will draw lots of hate)
Enchanted Evening (doesn't seem to actually do anything much)
[oh, it goes with Teferi's care...but...meh]
But, overall, it seems like a pretty awesome list
Sanctum Plowbeast may not do much, but it does enough. It's a good mana fixer, another shuffle effect, and it can be recurred. Also, I can even use Rings of Brighthearth with it. It's a utility card that I've found no reason not to leave in, especially considering it replaces itself.
Ichor Wellspring also combos with Master Transmuter. Also, keep in mind I have about 10 tutors for Claws and Scepter, and even without them, it still replaces itself so it's never really a dead card.
Enchanted Evening, I've thought about taking it out since I'm not comboing it with the usual suspects (Opalescence, Aura Thief, Cleansing Meditation) but even without them it's just too strong. Getting it with Serra's Sanctum is usually game ending since it can produce upwards of 60+ mana especially with untappers, and I think you're underselling its ability with Teferi's Care. This deck runs a LOT of stuff that wants to hit the graveyard, so saccing them to Vindicate other players is extremely powerful.
Yeah, I've not done all that much testing, and I certainly see why incubator and planar collapse aren't great. I do feel that the chalice is better than Thran Dynamo - it's worse when you pay 4, but it's really easy to find, can be used T2, and becomes pretty monstrous in the late game.
You might also want to consider Treasure Mage because it finds some good stuff.
Yeah, I've not done all that much testing, and I certainly see why incubator and planar collapse aren't great. I do feel that the chalice is better than Thran Dynamo - it's worse when you pay 4, but it's really easy to find, can be used T2, and becomes pretty monstrous in the late game.
You might also want to consider Treasure Mage because it finds some good stuff.
I think I might have taken Thran Dynamo out actually. I'll have to double check. In my combo version Basalt Monolith replaced it since it just does everything I wanted Dynamo to do, but cheaper and more combo potential. I think Grand Architect replaced it here but I'm not positive, since the list has both of them included. I like that Chalice can be searched up by Artificer's Intuition/Trinket Mage though.
Right now Treasure Mage isn't strong enough for a spot. Finding good cards isn't good enough, it needs to find cards that I can use in that situation, which won't always happen with six mana artifacts.
Grand Architect doesn't seem very exciting when you only run 11 creatures, 4 of which are blue...
Keep in mind GA produces mana by himself. Think of him as a mana rock, that turns all your other useless creatures into additional mana rocks. By himself, he's a Worn Powerstone that doesn't come into the battlefield tapped, which isn't too bad. With other creatures, he just gets much better.
Keep in mind GA produces mana by himself. Think of him as a mana rock, that turns all your other useless creatures into additional mana rocks. By himself, he's a Worn Powerstone that doesn't come into the battlefield tapped, which isn't too bad. With other creatures, he just gets much better.
I thought so too until I tried it. Most of my other creatures have no actual purpose once they are in play, being able to use them for mana is pretty nice. It also opens up more room to fit in more creatures if I feel they are deserving.
I've been looking into Voltaic Construct and Filigree Sages for my combo build. Construct could definitely make it in if I find enough uses for him, but so far, I haven't been able to. Sages is only good when I have infinite mana, which I should win anyway. Voltaic Key and Unbender Tine are amazing even without infinite mana or Rings of Brighthearth, which is why I run them instead.
Yeah, I'm just wondering if the repeated untap effects have sufficient extra value to justify their cost. Construct seems too narrow, since he's only busted if Karn's out.
I'm really interested in seeing your combo build, too. Any idea when you'll put it up?
Yeah, I'm just wondering if the repeated untap effects have sufficient extra value to justify their cost. Construct seems too narrow, since he's only busted if Karn's out.
I'm really interested in seeing your combo build, too. Any idea when you'll put it up?
It's still in its testing stages. It's really hard to get right because there are so many interactions that are possible, and it's not as consistent as I'd like it to be. I don't know, maybe by next week? That might be too optimistic though.
Creatures (11)
1 Academy Rector
1 Duplicant
1 False Prophet
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 Karn, Silver Golem
1 Master Transmuter
1 Sanctum Gargoyle
1 Sanctum Plowbeast
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Trinket Mage
1 Weathered Wayfarer
Artifacts (23)
1 Aether Spellbomb
1 Claws of Gix
1 Darksteel Ingot
1 Despotic Scepter
1 Expedition Map
1 Ichor Wellspring
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Mind Stone
1 Mirrorworks
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Phyrexian Furnace
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Salvaging Station
1 Scourglass
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Sol Ring
1 Spine of Ish Sah
1 Thousand-Year Elixir
1 Thran Dynamo
1 Tormod's Crypt
1 Vedalken Orrery
1 Voltaic Key
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Artificer's Intuition
1 Aura of Silence
1 Dance of Many
1 Enchanted Evening
1 Faith's Fetters
1 Future Sight
1 Greater Auramancy
1 Hatching Plans
1 Journey to Nowhere
1 Karmic Justice
1 Mystic Remora
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Parallax Wave
1 Prison Term
1 Teferi's Care
1 Treachery
Spells (10)
1 Argivian Restoration
1 Austere Command
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Fabricate
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Idyllic Tutor
1 Open the Vaults
1 Ponder
1 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Thoughtcast
Planeswalkers (1)
1 Tezzeret the Seeker
Lands (37)
1 Academy Ruins
1 Ancient Den
1 Azorius Chancery
1 Celestial Colonnade
1 Darksteel Citadel
1 Deserted Temple
1 Dust Bowl
1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
1 Flagstones of Trokair
1 Flooded Strand
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 High Market
1 Kor Haven
1 Maze of Ith
1 Minamo, School at Water's Edge
1 Mistveil Plains
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Serra's Sanctum
1 Strip Mine
1 Temple of the False God
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Tolaria West
1 Tundra
7 Island
7 Plains
There are a ton of hidden synergies and combos within the deck. It will take quite a while to list them all. Just about every card has multiple synergies with other cards, though. I did try to stay away from infinite combos though.
On the list of cards I'm looking to add, I'm thinking about Faerie Mechanist, Sun Titan, Brainstorm (I couldn't find any of my extra copies of it so Ponder went in instead), and Auriok Salvagers.
Among the cards I'm thinking of cutting are Weathered Wayfarer, Enchanted Evening, Greater Auramancy, Honden of Seeing Winds, Mystic Remora, and Mimic Vat.
As always, any thoughts/comments are appreciated.
Changelog:
3/6:
-1 Mimic Vat
-1 Honden of Seeing Winds
+1 Faerie Mechanist
+1 Trinket Mage
3/8:
-1 Faerie Mechanist
-1 Trinket Mage
-1 Adarkar Wastes
-1 Nimbus Maze
-1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
-1 Seachrome Coast
-1 Sejiri Refuge
+1 Glen Elendra Archmage
+1 Unbender Tine
+1 Emeria, the Sky Ruin
+1 Hallowed Fountain
+1 Island
+1 Plains
+1 Thawing Glaciers
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
As long as you have Voltaic Key, why not another sweeper in Nevinryall's Disk?
EDH:
RNorin the WaryR <-Link! (Primer - Mono Red Control)
GUEdric, Spymaster of TrestUG <- Link! (Mini-Primer - Dredge)
Duel Commander:
WUGeist of Saint TraftUW <- Link! (Aggro-Control)
BGSkullbriar, the Walking GraveGB <- Link! (Aggro)
BUGDamia, Sage of StoneGUB <- Link! (Extinction Control)
Church of the Wary
it makes parallax cards brokener (any bounce card works)
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyI'm not a fan of Disk because it hits so many of my own stuff, and it's not as thorough or controllable as O-Stone.
I like that it puts Wave back into my hand so that I won't have to recur it, but I'm not sure if it has enough other uses to warrant a spot. It's definitely worth considering though.
Currently testing:
-1 Mimic Vat
-1 Honden of Seeing Winds
+1 Faerie Machinist
+1 other utility card
Honden was expensive, slow, and seemed like win-more, Vat is too awkward in this deck since it doesn't use enough creatures. I'm deciding between Brainstorm or Trinket Mage for the other slot. Thoughts?
Edit: Well I still couldn't find any extra brainstorms so Trinket Mage goes back in, lol.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
throw in the white parallax.
and do you know the combo on how to PERMANANTLY exile stuff with the parallax cards?
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyCommander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
I removed Faerie Mechanist, it's good in theory, especially with Master Transmuter shenanegans but 33 artifacts wasn't enough to make it hit consistently. If only it searched four or five deep...
Trinket Mage actually wasn't needed, I have so many ways of getting Claws of Gix that the Mage just didn't fit in. I might play around with Riptide Laboratory though, especially since I added the first counterspell into the deck in a LONG time, in Glen Elendra Archmage.
I added Unbender Tine on a whim but so far it's amazing. At worst it's a slightly overcosted mana rock, but it does so much more than that - Voltaic Key #2 and shenanegans with a ton of activated abilities.
I also made some changes to the mana base. I'm trying to fit Thawing Glaciers in the deck but right now I'm not sure if there's enough support to make it good. I have three cards that abuse it (Deserted Temple, Rings of Brighthearth, Unbender Tine) but without them it's pretty bad. I'm also testing Emeria the Sky Ruin for actual creature recursion, I might have to fix the mana base a bit more to support it (And Thawing Glaciers) better though.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
Everflowin Chalice seems pretty good, since it's a 0-cost guy.
Myr Incubator can be pretty stupid - pooping out 30 1/1s at EoT can win the game.
Shimmer Myr is Orrery number 2
Auriok Salvagers is strong recursion
Planar Collapse is a recurable sweeper
I've also included an infinite mana combo in the form of Salvaging Station + Claws of Gix + Summoning Station + Lotus Bloom,
I also run cards like Solitary Confinement, Possessed Portal and Sundering Titan, but I'm a bad person
In terms of what to take out, I don't really like:
Sanctum Plowbeast (very meh)
Ichor Wellspring (only 2 sac outlets and not very easy to recur)
Aura of Silence (will draw lots of hate)
Enchanted Evening (doesn't seem to actually do anything much)
[oh, it goes with Teferi's care...but...meh]
But, overall, it seems like a pretty awesome list
It's extremely expensive to use, doesn't guarantee a win, and doesn't really have any other good applications. It's one of those cards that I considered but just didn't quite make the cut.
If I wanted another version of Orrery, I'd run Leyline of Anticipation. I don't want to devote another spot for it atm since they don't really affect the board.
I've considered it as another Salvaging Station but currently it's just quite not good enough since it has far less combo potential.
I've tested it, I didn't like it for being too slow. Granted, it's the same speed as Scourglass but Scourglass is a pretty one-sided sweeper in this deck.
This version doesn't run infinite combos. I'm currently working on a combo version of Hanna though so I might consider it for that version. I'll have to see if they have any other applications to warrant inclusion. Lotus Bloom can also be replaced with Krark-Clan Ironworks in your combo.
These are very good for Stax or Prison builds, but it's not what I'm going for here.
Sanctum Plowbeast may not do much, but it does enough. It's a good mana fixer, another shuffle effect, and it can be recurred. Also, I can even use Rings of Brighthearth with it. It's a utility card that I've found no reason not to leave in, especially considering it replaces itself.
Ichor Wellspring also combos with Master Transmuter. Also, keep in mind I have about 10 tutors for Claws and Scepter, and even without them, it still replaces itself so it's never really a dead card.
Enchanted Evening, I've thought about taking it out since I'm not comboing it with the usual suspects (Opalescence, Aura Thief, Cleansing Meditation) but even without them it's just too strong. Getting it with Serra's Sanctum is usually game ending since it can produce upwards of 60+ mana especially with untappers, and I think you're underselling its ability with Teferi's Care. This deck runs a LOT of stuff that wants to hit the graveyard, so saccing them to Vindicate other players is extremely powerful.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
You might also want to consider Treasure Mage because it finds some good stuff.
Right now Treasure Mage isn't strong enough for a spot. Finding good cards isn't good enough, it needs to find cards that I can use in that situation, which won't always happen with six mana artifacts.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
You guys know that the creature token that Mimic Vat creates is exiled instead of put into a graveyard, right?
So it does. You could still use a sac outlet though.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
I suppose so, he's just underwhelming. What do you think of Voltaic construct (mostly with Karn) and Filgree sages?
I thought so too until I tried it. Most of my other creatures have no actual purpose once they are in play, being able to use them for mana is pretty nice. It also opens up more room to fit in more creatures if I feel they are deserving.
I've been looking into Voltaic Construct and Filigree Sages for my combo build. Construct could definitely make it in if I find enough uses for him, but so far, I haven't been able to. Sages is only good when I have infinite mana, which I should win anyway. Voltaic Key and Unbender Tine are amazing even without infinite mana or Rings of Brighthearth, which is why I run them instead.
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W
I'm really interested in seeing your combo build, too. Any idea when you'll put it up?
Commander/EDH:
WU Hanna, Ship's Navigator WU
GW Saffi Eriksdotter GW
BW Selenia, Dark Angel BW
W Heliod, God of Sun W
Retired:
Jenara, Asura of War Thada Adel, Acquisitor Jaya Ballard, Task Mage Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero Lyzolda, the Blood Witch Akroma, Angel of Wrath Nath of the Gilt-Leaf Tajic, Blade of the Legion Selvala, Explorer Returned Maga, Traitor to Mortals
Tiny Leaders:
W Mangara of Corondor W