The Wizards of the Coast Headquarters
Mark Rosewater
"For the 2008 World Championships, we've decided to shake things up a bit! Instead of inviting famous competitors to be in this competition... we're inviting famous decks! That is right, ladies and gentlemen, the twelve decks in this competition will PLAY THEMSELVES! Are you excited? We know we are, and that's why, thanks to the generous funding of our fuzzy wuzzy supervillain Mark Gottlieb, twenty billion dollars is up for grabs to the winners of this tournament, but on one condition; Mark Gottlieb, the scum that he is, has entered a number of competitors that are... maybe a bit more scummy than you're used to. Not implying that that has to change anything, of course! Have fun, and make sure to tune in to the 2008 World Championships!"
And that's where Famous Decks Mafia begins.
The Basics of Mafia (Stolen from Spotofprey, stolen from Ged, stolen from atlseal, stolen from loran16, stolen from sorryguy)
In a game of mafia, the 2 basic roles are Townie and Mafioso (Often called Scum). In this game, the town will be made up of those trying to figure out who killed everyone and stop them from killing again. For the town to win, they must kill all members of the mafia. For the mafia to win, the must kill all the members of the town. Most townies have only one tool: the lynch.
-While the game is in “Day” mode, any player may post in the thread. They may also FOS or Vote.
-FOS stands for Finger of Suspision. It has no direct bearing on the game, but it is a nice way to let everyone know who you are suspicious of.
-When any one player has reached a number of votes equal to the majority of the players in the game, that player will be lynched and the game will go into night.
-You may only be voting for 1 player at a time. If you want to change your vote, you must type Unvote before doing so.
-Votes, Unvotes, and FOSes should be bolded. (ex. VOTE: Puzzle or FOS: CropCircles)
There are 2 roles that are very common in mafia games that may be used in this game as well. The Cop and the Doctor, which are both town roles.
-During the night, the Cop may send me the name of 1 player he would like to investigate. I will then reveal to the Cop whether that player is a mafioso or not.
-The Doc sends me the name of a player that he would like to protect. That player will be immune to a nightkill for that night. (Note: The doc may not protect himself)
The mafia, or those who killed everyone, will win when they exceed or equal the town in number(at which point, they control the lynch). They may also post during the day and use both Votes and FOSes. However, they have another tool: the ability to nightkill.
-While the game is in night, the mafia may communicate with each other. Then, one of them will send me the name of 1 player to be killed.
-Once I have received the mafia’s Night Choice, as well as the choice of any other player with a night ability, I will post a morning scene detailing the public results of the previous night (i.e. who died), and Day will start.
There may or may not be other roles in this game. For reference, here are a few other possible roles:
-Vigilante: The Vigilante is a killer on the Town side who can either choose to kill every night, or choose to kill a certain number of times during the game, depending on the variation.
-Back-up Doc: Assumes the Doctor’s abilities after the Doctor dies.
-Back-up Cop: Assumes the Cop’s abilities after the Cop dies.
-Role blocker: Chooses one player per night to block from performing his or her Night Choice.
-Mason: The Masons are a group on the Town’s side who know each other to be townies and can talk to each other at Night.
Rules (Stolen from Ged, Stolen from arimnaes, slightly modified)
1. This is a game. As such, I expect everyone to obey the general rules of sportsmanlike conduct one would expect in any game, which includes following all the rules below. Keep it fun; don't harass me or your fellow players.
2. You may not talk outside of the thread to anyone about anything that goes on in this game. Period. Whether you're dead, or they're dead, whether they're in the game or not. The only exception is if your role specifically allows it.
3. Votes must be in bold, in the form "vote: Chaosjuggler". I would greatly appreciate if you would unvote before voting for someone else. It makes it much easier to keep track of the gamestate.
4. A majority is always required to lynch.
5. You may not, under any circumstances, edit or delete your posts. If you really need to add something to a previous post, the general tactic is to double-post. Try to avoid doing so unless it's necessary, however. (That's more of a forum rule than a mafia rule.)
6. You may not, under any circumstances, quote any game-related PM's. Use caution when paraphrasing them. The one exception is anything in your PM that is in ALL CAPS LIKE THIS is direct game information and is definitely quotable.
7. You may not post anything game-related after you die. You are allowed one short "bah" style post, but that's it. If you're not sure if it's allowed, don't post it. Err on the side of caution.
8. I expect a certain level of participation out of all the players. Please post at least once every two or three (real life) days. Inactivity will result in a "mod prod" for the first offense, and replacement after that. If you're a player, do not hesitate to PM me or post in the thread if you think someone does not meet this minimum posting standard. All mod-prods and replacements will be posted in the thread.
Alabaska J (Replacing Urban Druid), who was the deck Fae, and a Mafia Roleblocker. JqlGirl (Replacing Caex Kothar), who was the deck The Johnny Deck, and a vanilla townie. BigTime, who was the deck Project X, and a vanilla townie.
Wo Bu Yao, who was the deck Trix, and a Townie Doctor.
Sneakyhomunculus, who was the deck Dredge, and a Townie Cop.
Kraj (Replacing thedragun) who was the deck Affinity, and a Mafia Goon. Roger Watersmelon (Replacing Frenger) who was the deck 2-Land Belcher, and a Townie One-Shot Vigilante.
krowzy, who was the deck Fires and a Vanilla Townie.
Dattebayo, who was the deck Sligh and a Vanilla Townie.
FereMiy, who was the deck Tog and a Vanilla Townie.
iLord, who was the deck Martyr-Tron and a Vanilla Townie. REPLACEMENTS:
Replacements:
1: JodoYodo
2: ea er refta
3: Wrath_Of_Dog
Role PMs are going out. Confirm either in-thread or through PM.
Media is not making me steal. But in a way is like the story of the very hot girl with the short skirt teasing the old sick guy with a history of rape.
What better mad mischief than to swap around everyone's hats? I see that you have no answer. And I am not at all surprised, for indeed there is no finer mischief than a swapping around of hats.
You're right. This is pretty much "Famous Decks Mafia: The Revenge of Simpsons Mafia".
Myself, Caex Kothar, Frenger, BigTime, Krowzy and Kman all played in that game. And with JqlGirl, JodoYodo and ea er refta on the replacements list the Simpsons involvement might grow even more.
Because of this, I would strongly suggest that everybody who hasn't yet done so, take a look at that thread. Besides actually being a pretty fun game to read, it will also give you a good look at the playstyles of the different players.
Yeah, if you look at it you will see that just because I don't post much doesn't mean I'm scum.
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Life moves pretty fast sometimes, if you don't stop
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
Everything scares me... kitties scare me... squirrels scare me... corpses....corpses bring forth a pletora of confusing feeling which i prefer not to dwell on...:p
So I've been thinking about what decks could be in this game.
______________________
Dragonstorm
Necrobridge
Boros
Tron
MUC
Pshycatog
Gruul
Affinity
RDW
Some kinds of tribal decks maybe
Elf
Goblins
Zombie
Merfolk
_____________
These are just the ones I could think of right off the top of my head.
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Life moves pretty fast sometimes, if you don't stop
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
Vote: Kman for saying when he posts often with little words it doesn't necessarily mean he's scum. This is scummy for 3 reasons.
1. Early self-analysis. Pointing out your own behaviors is WIFOMy. It also removes the not necessarily scum notion because he brought this point up himself.
2. Over-defensiveness. No ones attacking him about it, so why would he feel the need to defend himself.
3. Excuses, excuses. This essentially sets up a situation where Kman could active lurk and then say it's not necessarily scummy. It's an excuse for him not to post content.
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witch super smash bros BRAWL character are you? (spoilers)
EBWODP:
Didn't see the role speculation list Kman made.
He was in Newb 18 and a big deal was made from EH's list. Repeating this mistake when he should have learned from that experience looks very scummy.
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witch super smash bros BRAWL character are you? (spoilers)
Interestingly I was thinking of TheRock, FireballChannel, Urza's block combo-decks, Breakfast-themed decks, maybe Neropotence etc. - which shows I'm far more old school than you.
For this game it has absolutely no relevance though. I advice not getting ourselves distracted with this kind of stuff.
I'm not sure if you simulposted, but Sneaky already explained why role speculation was bad.
FoS: Zas for "For this game it has absolutely no relevance though. I advice not getting ourselves distracted with this kind of stuff."
Saying that was contradictory/ hypocritical. You say we shouldn't get distracted but earlier in that post you got distracted by it.
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witch super smash bros BRAWL character are you? (spoilers)
Vote: Kman for saying when he posts often with little words it doesn't necessarily mean he's scum. This is scummy for 3 reasons.
1. Early self-analysis. Pointing out your own behaviors is WIFOMy. It also removes the not necessarily scum notion because he brought this point up himself.
2. Over-defensiveness. No ones attacking him about it, so why would he feel the need to defend himself.
3. Excuses, excuses. This essentially sets up a situation where Kman could active lurk and then say it's not necessarily scummy. It's an excuse for him not to post content.
First of all, can someone explain WIFOM to me please? I went through the entire simpsons mafia game ignoring it but i would like know what it means.
Second, I mentioned it because last game everyone was calling me out on it and I didn't want that this game because last game it put us (town) in a bad position and the mafia in a very good position.
I made the lists of decks because i thought it might help us us decide which decks might be scummy.
You seem to be very offensive.
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Life moves pretty fast sometimes, if you don't stop
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
So I've been thinking about what decks could be in this game.
______________________
Dragonstorm
Necrobridge
Boros
Tron
MUC
Pshycatog
Gruul
Affinity
RDW
Some kinds of tribal decks maybe
Elf
Goblins
Zombie
Merfolk
_____________
These are just the ones I could think of right off the top of my head.
No no no! We discussed this already. And Kman, you were in that game. FoS: Kman and Zas
This is what happened in Newb 18. EH turned out to be town and he was just trying to help, but I added to it because I was scum and figured I could write it off as newbiness.
Kman saw the town's backlash against it. And yet he does almost the same thing? Scummy.
And Zas added to the list. That's what I did. I was scum. Using the transitive property:
Everything scares me... kitties scare me... squirrels scare me... corpses....corpses bring forth a pletora of confusing feeling which i prefer not to dwell on...:p
Guys, just a warning: Kman acted in a similar manner last game, and quite a few people believed he was scum. I'm not saying what he does so far hasn't been scummy (it certainly has), but I think a few of you who haven't should read days 1 and 2 of Newb 18. Until I see something extraordinarily out of the ordinary, I don't really have any reason to believe he's just playing in a strange (yet poor) way, so FoS: Kman.
Think of this as a warning, Kman. Continuing to act scummy and saying that it's just how you are won't make people think you're town, and certainly won't do anything to help this game.
On flavor: I suspect speculating about flavor won't really help us in this game. There are literally tons of famous decks throughout the history of Magic, and obviously only 12 players in this game.
I'm really not sure what to think at this point. To elaborate on krowzy's post: I've reread Newbie Mafia 18 where he was town, but he never really did much to help the town. He only survived to the end because Frenger found him innocent. Day 1 he his completely detrimental to the town, and from that point forward I don't see much by the way of analysis - he seems to show up to agree and vote. As pointed out, it seems like he hasn't learned much from his past play, so now do we treat his posts in the game so far as more of this slightly detrimental to barely helpful townie making more newbie mistakes, or does it now become a scum tell? Personally, I'm on the fence right now, but definitely FoS: Kman
So I've been thinking about what decks could be in this game.
______________________
Dragonstorm
Necrobridge
Boros
Tron
MUC
Pshycatog
Gruul
Affinity
RDW
Some kinds of tribal decks maybe
Elf
Goblins
Zombie
Merfolk
_____________
These are just the ones I could think of right off the top of my head.
Ok. This is a no-no. Previously stated by others. It doesn't make you scum, but its useless specualtion.
Vote: Kman for saying when he posts often with little words it doesn't necessarily mean he's scum. This is scummy for 3 reasons.
1. Early self-analysis. Pointing out your own behaviors is WIFOMy. It also removes the not necessarily scum notion because he brought this point up himself.
2. Over-defensiveness. No ones attacking him about it, so why would he feel the need to defend himself.
3. Excuses, excuses. This essentially sets up a situation where Kman could active lurk and then say it's not necessarily scummy. It's an excuse for him not to post content.
Whoa! A REAL vote? I have problems with this. So, in response to the main points he brings up:
1. I believe his early self analysis is correct. Lurking does not equal scum. That's what kman was saying. Lurkers can be scum, but not all lurkers are scum. He lurked in his last game and was NOT scum, and I think he was trying to enforce that point.
2. kman was incredibly overdefensive in his last game. He did that all throughout the beginning. This is a noob thing of his, not a scum tell.
3. Lurking isn't scummy. Period. It's bad for the town, but in noob games it does not equal scum. kman is living proof of this from Newb 18.
Lastly, his self analysis can only be a good thing for the town. We can take his analysis and compare it to our own analysis of his past play. If the comparison is off, he looks kinda scummy. Self analysis can be extremely good for the town.
EBWODP:
Didn't see the role speculation list Kman made.
He was in Newb 18 and a big deal was made from EH's list. Repeating this mistake when he should have learned from that experience looks very scummy.
Well, he hasen't changed his overdefensiveness very much, so what makes you so sure he just never learned the list-lesson?
A small break here: Listing in this game is A-OK. In Simpsons it was bad, since we were trying to find specific characters that would be evil, and a wrong guess could lead to a mislynch. That was a game based around characters. Now this game is based around decks. I've never heard a deck walk up and talk to anybody. It's highly unlikely that we are going to guess the 12 decks even involved, let alone their alignments. Not only that, but when kman listed the decks, he never implied alignment on any of them, just listing possibilities. Now, I still don't think we should be listing, as it is a distraction from the real scum-hunt, but I honestly don't believe it's vote worthy.
I'm not sure if you simulposted, but Sneaky already explained why role speculation was bad.
FoS: Zas for "For this game it has absolutely no relevance though. I advice not getting ourselves distracted with this kind of stuff."
Saying that was contradictory/ hypocritical. You say we shouldn't get distracted but earlier in that post you got distracted by it.
I don't see how Zas is contradicting himself. He is proving his own point. He says these things can get distracting, because he himself found himself distracted by it. Also, I agree that role speculation has very little relevence in this game. The mod choose the decks and their roles. Everything is really up to him. To guess the roles would be to get inside the mod's head. Simpsons mafia, you just had to know the world of simpsons. That was an educated guess. This is just a flat out guess and has very little chance to make any impact on the game.
As for this above post, I see it as spreading unwanted suspicion. We are four pages in, and it seems like DB is building his scumlist, starting with kman and next in line is Zas. I don't like the sudden jumping around.
First of all, can someone explain WIFOM to me please? I went through the entire simpsons mafia game ignoring it but i would like know what it means.
Second, I mentioned it because last game everyone was calling me out on it and I didn't want that this game because last game it put us (town) in a bad position and the mafia in a very good position.
I made the lists of decks because i thought it might help us us decide which decks might be scummy.
You seem to be very offensive.
1. WIFOM mean Wine In Front Of Me. It's when a player says something and the other players say to themselves "Is he telling the truth? Or is that what he want's me to think?". It confuses and muddles the game. Lots of things can be WIFOM.
2. The list idea overall is useless to the town. It's neither a good thing or a bad thing. I can already tell that trying to guess the decks won't work (specifically since mine is NOT on the list).
Overall, I would like to Unvote, FoS Dattebayo
Why? First, for jumping on two different players incredibly quick, and skiping the whole FoS process. Next, for spreading his suspicion around to Zas, for a very limited reason. Finally, for not taking the Newb factor into account.
Now, the reason this isn't a vote is because these could all be noob mistakes. However, this rings to me like either an eager noob trying his best, or an eager scum jumping on noob mistakes. I'm leaning 60/40 towards scum.
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Underrated, Overlooked
Thanks to THEY DID WHAT!? For the sweet banner!
Games played:3, 1 ongoing Times Town: 1, with 1 win Times Scum: 1, with 1 loss
I'm really not sure what to think at this point. To elaborate on krowzy's post: I've reread Newbie Mafia 18 where he was town, but he never really did much to help the town. He only survived to the end because Frenger found him innocent. Day 1 he his completely detrimental to the town, and from that point forward I don't see much by the way of analysis - he seems to show up to agree and vote. As pointed out, it seems like he hasn't learned much from his past play, so now do we treat his posts in the game so far as more of this slightly detrimental to barely helpful townie making more newbie mistakes, or does it now become a scum tell? Personally, I'm on the fence right now, but definitely FoS: Kman
That whole confusion thing is all part of a newb mafia. Are they scummy or are they just newbie? LET'S FIND OUT! *lynch*
That's pretty much how JqlGirl's lynch went down.
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Underrated, Overlooked
Thanks to THEY DID WHAT!? For the sweet banner!
Games played:3, 1 ongoing Times Town: 1, with 1 win Times Scum: 1, with 1 loss
1. WIFOM mean Wine In Front Of Me. It's when a player says something and the other players say to themselves "Is he telling the truth? Or is that what he want's me to think?". It confuses and muddles the game. Lots of things can be WIFOM.
2. The list idea overall is useless to the town. It's neither a good thing or a bad thing. I can already tell that trying to guess the decks won't work (specifically since mine is NOT on the list).
Overall, I would like to Unvote, FoS Dattebayo
Why? First, for jumping on two different players incredibly quick, and skiping the whole FoS process. Next, for spreading his suspicion around to Zas, for a very limited reason. Finally, for not taking the Newb factor into account.
Now, the reason this isn't a vote is because these could all be noob mistakes. However, this rings to me like either an eager noob trying his best, or an eager scum jumping on noob mistakes. I'm leaning 60/40 towards scum.
Thank you for explaining WIFOM, I would have never guessed that, lol.
I'm sorry I tried to make a list, I thought it would be helpful but if no one else thinks so then I'll forget about it. Just to let you guys know (because I see no harm in it) my deck is on the list.
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Life moves pretty fast sometimes, if you don't stop
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
Media is not making me steal. But in a way is like the story of the very hot girl with the short skirt teasing the old sick guy with a history of rape.
Media is not making me steal. But in a way is like the story of the very hot girl with the short skirt teasing the old sick guy with a history of rape.
I was thinking more evil magic decks, so whoever claims Stasis, be prepared for a vote from me [/just kidding] and yeah RIP the random phase: "live fast, die young"
Media is not making me steal. But in a way is like the story of the very hot girl with the short skirt teasing the old sick guy with a history of rape.
Wow, spend one day off the forum and stuff gets rolling. I agree with Bigtime that the points against kman could just be newb tells, but I'm going to keep an eye on him. I admittedly had him pegged as scum during Simpsons Day 1, but we know how that turned out. I'm proud to say that I knew JqlGirl was town all along. Also, I hope sneaky lives for longer this time, his posts are always fun to read.
What better mad mischief than to swap around everyone's hats? I see that you have no answer. And I am not at all surprised, for indeed there is no finer mischief than a swapping around of hats.
I already have a FoS on you, but I'd like to bring up another point. Anyone ready to "claim", even if it's a nameclaim in one out of what, 10-15 decks, is a very solid scum tell. This stands in stark contrast to your N18 play, where you were basically just defensive and nonconfrontatial.
Short reread is in order regarding Datte, will have stuff tomorrow.
Whoa! A REAL vote? I have problems with this. So, in response to the main points he brings up:
1. I believe his early self analysis is correct. Lurking does not equal scum. That's what kman was saying. Lurkers can be scum, but not all lurkers are scum. He lurked in his last game and was NOT scum, and I think he was trying to enforce that point.
2. kman was incredibly overdefensive in his last game. He did that all throughout the beginning. This is a noob thing of his, not a scum tell.
3. Lurking isn't scummy. Period. It's bad for the town, but in noob games it does not equal scum. kman is living proof of this from Newb 18.
I agree with BigTime on point number 2. We cannot think of Kman as scummy based only because of his overdefensiveness, because that's how he acted in Newb 18.
But points 1 & 3... I'm less certain. Yes, Kman lurked and was town in Newb 18. But I lurked and was scum. Lurking is both scummy and not scummy. Saying "lurking isn't scummy" doesn't work.
Saying "lurking in a newb game isn't as scummy as it normally would be in a game with more experienced players" would be the best way to phrase it. Sure, being newbs, we're more likely to not post and just observe, but saying that it isn't scummy at all is wrong. Lurking= not taking part in discussion and just observing, and is an advantage to the scum since they don't have to reveal as much.
Lastly, his self analysis can only be a good thing for the town. We can take his analysis and compare it to our own analysis of his past play. If the comparison is off, he looks kinda scummy. Self analysis can be extremely good for the town.
But after Newb 18, I'm sure he's more aware of how he plays. So he could, theoretically, be using his self-analysis to excuse his scummy behaviour because he is now more alert to his own playing style. Yes, this could be seen as WIFOM'ey, but still. I am more aware of my own playstyle after playing in Newb 18, so it stands to reason that other players could recognize their own styles, and possibly use it to their advantage.
A small break here: Listing in this game is A-OK. In Simpsons it was bad, since we were trying to find specific characters that would be evil, and a wrong guess could lead to a mislynch. That was a game based around characters. Now this game is based around decks. I've never heard a deck walk up and talk to anybody. It's highly unlikely that we are going to guess the 12 decks even involved, let alone their alignments..
So... you're saying listing is okay because there are a lot more choices and he didn't even list possible alignments. Alright, I can see where you're coming from. Unfortunately, you also said
Ok. This is a no-no.
in response to the original list.
So speculation is "a-ok", but is also a "no-no"? Which is it?
As for this above post, I see it as spreading unwanted suspicion. We are four pages in, and it seems like DB is building his scumlist, starting with kman and next in line is Zas. I don't like the sudden jumping around.
I agree. Spreading around unwanted suspicion is a bad thing. Which brings me to my next point:
Overall, I would like to Unvote, FoS Dattebayo
Why? First, for jumping on two different players incredibly quick, and skiping the whole FoS process. Next, for spreading his suspicion around to Zas, for a very limited reason. Finally, for not taking the Newb factor into account.
Now, the reason this isn't a vote is because these could all be noob mistakes. However, this rings to me like either an eager noob trying his best, or an eager scum jumping on noob mistakes. I'm leaning 60/40 towards scum.
I see this as unwanted suspicion. JqlGirl played nearly identical to this. She jumped around, skipping FoSes in favor of votes. What happened when we lynched her? See where I'm going with this?
You're playing this pretty close to how it played out against JqlGirl, and to me, Dattebayo is basically the same: Very unexperienced, and trying his best to help. You attacking him makes you more suspicious than him, IMO.
Everything scares me... kitties scare me... squirrels scare me... corpses....corpses bring forth a pletora of confusing feeling which i prefer not to dwell on...:p
firstly, i completely agree with you that lurking can be used in favor towards scum.
however, you offer from your own perspective that you would use lurking as a scum's tactic.
I am more aware of my own playstyle after playing in Newb 18, so it stands to reason that other players could recognize their own styles, and possibly use it to their advantage.
one's personal thought process or reasoning does not provide a strong reason that anyone else, specifically kman would use it to be scum. also, you take the liberty to completely assume that kman has become a much stronger player after newbie18.
as for your last FOS to BT, you state that
You're playing this pretty close to how it played out against JqlGirl
. because of JqlGirl's inexperience she brought a loss to the townies on day 1. so in suspecting BigTime, wouldn't that bring us closer to lynching another townie?
It's all very WIFOMy. Lurking can be a scum tactic, but so can hyper involvement to throw people off the trail. Debating whether or not lurking is a scum tell or not doesn't get us anywhere. The same thing can be applied to kman's posting. At this point we can't tell if he's learned from Newbie 18 or not. Is he posting this way because thats how he posts when he's town, or is he posting this way to throw us off because he's scum, etc.
You're also completely misreading Caex's post. He is making the same argument you are, because it is BigTime that's suspicious of DatteBayo for a Jqlgirl playing style.
however, you offer from your own perspective that you would use lurking as a scum's tactic.
one's personal thought process or reasoning does not provide a strong reason that anyone else, specifically kman would use it to be scum. also, you take the liberty to completely assume that kman has become a much stronger player after newbie18.
Well, my main point here was that BigTime saying that self-analysis helping the town is flawed. If a player can recognize their playstyle, then any self-analysis they do is inherently misleading. I'm not exactly sure how to word that so it's understandable.
I'm not saying that is what Kman is doing, I'm just pointing out that BT's thoughts' on the subject are one-sided and don't explore the other possibilities, such as Kman being purposfully misleading. I hope you can figure out what I'm trying to say in all that jumbled-up talkery.
as for your last FOS to BT, you state that . because of JqlGirl's inexperience she brought a loss to the townies on day 1. so in suspecting BigTime, wouldn't that bring us closer to lynching another townie?
No, I'm saying that Dattebayo, not BigTime, is playing extremely close to how JqlGirl played her first day. We lynched her, and she was town. I believe that Dattebayo is just a newb townie trying to help in any way possible, and BigTime's suspicion of him is probably going to lead us down the same path we took with JqlGirl. And since BigTime is one of the most experienced players here, he would be more likely to recognized that Dattebayo and JqlGirl posted in a very similar manner. I figure that if I, a very inexperienced player, can spot that, then the better players would be able to see it as well.
It stands to reason, then, that since JqlGirl was townie, and that since Dattebayo is playing in an extremely close replica of JqlGirl's style, then he is probably just an inexperienced (but townie) player trying to help.
Everything scares me... kitties scare me... squirrels scare me... corpses....corpses bring forth a pletora of confusing feeling which i prefer not to dwell on...:p
Not Voting: thedragun, FereMiy, Bigtime, Frenger, Urban Druid
With 12 alive, it is 7 to lynch.
Let me know if you'd like to be called something else on the vote count. I'll happily change it. Also, if people would like me to record FoSes (and Pinkies), then I'll start doing that.
Private Mod Note
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Mark Rosewater
"For the 2008 World Championships, we've decided to shake things up a bit! Instead of inviting famous competitors to be in this competition... we're inviting famous decks! That is right, ladies and gentlemen, the twelve decks in this competition will PLAY THEMSELVES! Are you excited? We know we are, and that's why, thanks to the generous funding of our fuzzy wuzzy supervillain Mark Gottlieb, twenty billion dollars is up for grabs to the winners of this tournament, but on one condition; Mark Gottlieb, the scum that he is, has entered a number of competitors that are... maybe a bit more scummy than you're used to. Not implying that that has to change anything, of course! Have fun, and make sure to tune in to the 2008 World Championships!"
And that's where Famous Decks Mafia begins.
(In addition to this description, I highly recommend this flash tutorial.)
In a game of mafia, the 2 basic roles are Townie and Mafioso (Often called Scum). In this game, the town will be made up of those trying to figure out who killed everyone and stop them from killing again. For the town to win, they must kill all members of the mafia. For the mafia to win, the must kill all the members of the town. Most townies have only one tool: the lynch.
-While the game is in “Day” mode, any player may post in the thread. They may also FOS or Vote.
-FOS stands for Finger of Suspision. It has no direct bearing on the game, but it is a nice way to let everyone know who you are suspicious of.
-When any one player has reached a number of votes equal to the majority of the players in the game, that player will be lynched and the game will go into night.
-You may only be voting for 1 player at a time. If you want to change your vote, you must type Unvote before doing so.
-Votes, Unvotes, and FOSes should be bolded. (ex. VOTE: Puzzle or FOS: CropCircles)
There are 2 roles that are very common in mafia games that may be used in this game as well. The Cop and the Doctor, which are both town roles.
-During the night, the Cop may send me the name of 1 player he would like to investigate. I will then reveal to the Cop whether that player is a mafioso or not.
-The Doc sends me the name of a player that he would like to protect. That player will be immune to a nightkill for that night. (Note: The doc may not protect himself)
The mafia, or those who killed everyone, will win when they exceed or equal the town in number(at which point, they control the lynch). They may also post during the day and use both Votes and FOSes. However, they have another tool: the ability to nightkill.
-While the game is in night, the mafia may communicate with each other. Then, one of them will send me the name of 1 player to be killed.
-Once I have received the mafia’s Night Choice, as well as the choice of any other player with a night ability, I will post a morning scene detailing the public results of the previous night (i.e. who died), and Day will start.
There may or may not be other roles in this game. For reference, here are a few other possible roles:
-Vigilante: The Vigilante is a killer on the Town side who can either choose to kill every night, or choose to kill a certain number of times during the game, depending on the variation.
-Back-up Doc: Assumes the Doctor’s abilities after the Doctor dies.
-Back-up Cop: Assumes the Cop’s abilities after the Cop dies.
-Role blocker: Chooses one player per night to block from performing his or her Night Choice.
-Mason: The Masons are a group on the Town’s side who know each other to be townies and can talk to each other at Night.
Rules (Stolen from Ged, Stolen from arimnaes, slightly modified)
1. This is a game. As such, I expect everyone to obey the general rules of sportsmanlike conduct one would expect in any game, which includes following all the rules below. Keep it fun; don't harass me or your fellow players.
2. You may not talk outside of the thread to anyone about anything that goes on in this game. Period. Whether you're dead, or they're dead, whether they're in the game or not. The only exception is if your role specifically allows it.
3. Votes must be in bold, in the form "vote: Chaosjuggler". I would greatly appreciate if you would unvote before voting for someone else. It makes it much easier to keep track of the gamestate.
4. A majority is always required to lynch.
5. You may not, under any circumstances, edit or delete your posts. If you really need to add something to a previous post, the general tactic is to double-post. Try to avoid doing so unless it's necessary, however. (That's more of a forum rule than a mafia rule.)
6. You may not, under any circumstances, quote any game-related PM's. Use caution when paraphrasing them. The one exception is anything in your PM that is in ALL CAPS LIKE THIS is direct game information and is definitely quotable.
7. You may not post anything game-related after you die. You are allowed one short "bah" style post, but that's it. If you're not sure if it's allowed, don't post it. Err on the side of caution.
8. I expect a certain level of participation out of all the players. Please post at least once every two or three (real life) days. Inactivity will result in a "mod prod" for the first offense, and replacement after that. If you're a player, do not hesitate to PM me or post in the thread if you think someone does not meet this minimum posting standard. All mod-prods and replacements will be posted in the thread.
The next post will be the direct game post.
STILL IN CONTENTION:
7 : ZasZ234
KNOCKED OUT:
Alabaska J (Replacing Urban Druid), who was the deck Fae, and a Mafia Roleblocker.
JqlGirl (Replacing Caex Kothar), who was the deck The Johnny Deck, and a vanilla townie.
BigTime, who was the deck Project X, and a vanilla townie.
Wo Bu Yao, who was the deck Trix, and a Townie Doctor.
Sneakyhomunculus, who was the deck Dredge, and a Townie Cop.
Kraj (Replacing thedragun) who was the deck Affinity, and a Mafia Goon.
Roger Watersmelon (Replacing Frenger) who was the deck 2-Land Belcher, and a Townie One-Shot Vigilante.
krowzy, who was the deck Fires and a Vanilla Townie.
Dattebayo, who was the deck Sligh and a Vanilla Townie.
FereMiy, who was the deck Tog and a Vanilla Townie.
iLord, who was the deck Martyr-Tron and a Vanilla Townie.
REPLACEMENTS:
Replacements:
1: JodoYodo
2: ea er refta
3: Wrath_Of_Dog
Role PMs are going out. Confirm either in-thread or through PM.
Modern: URStormUR|BRGW Jund BRGW|GWUB Gifts GWUB
Commander:XKarnX
Cubes: Level 1: Pauper
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
Solid Snake
With twelve alive, it is seven to lynch.
(PS: that's everyone)
Vote: Fere
Because he does not, in fact, posses any "jeenyus."
Modern: URStormUR|BRGW Jund BRGW|GWUB Gifts GWUB
Commander:XKarnX
Cubes: Level 1: Pauper
It's ironic, though, that by conforming I broke from the mold...
Because of how he played simpsons mafia....
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
Yes, It is quite possible, as a matter of fact.
But I know only sneaky, and in that case only from outside mafia, and from almost 3 years ago.
Modern: URStormUR|BRGW Jund BRGW|GWUB Gifts GWUB
Commander:XKarnX
Cubes: Level 1: Pauper
I'm sorry...
I know OF Sneaky.
I lawled at this. I lawled a lot.
Ahh....the memories. I guess I'll just flip what Sneaky said and Vote CK FoS Krowzy!
Yeah. That seems about right. Do you really expect me to EVER trust them again?
Yeah, if you look at it you will see that just because I don't post much doesn't mean I'm scum.
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
You threw me under the bus so quick in the last game
Vote: BigTime. That avatar creeps me out.
{Magic: The RPG}
______________________
Dragonstorm
Necrobridge
Boros
Tron
MUC
Pshycatog
Gruul
Affinity
RDW
Some kinds of tribal decks maybe
Elf
Goblins
Zombie
Merfolk
_____________
These are just the ones I could think of right off the top of my head.
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
1. Early self-analysis. Pointing out your own behaviors is WIFOMy. It also removes the not necessarily scum notion because he brought this point up himself.
2. Over-defensiveness. No ones attacking him about it, so why would he feel the need to defend himself.
3. Excuses, excuses. This essentially sets up a situation where Kman could active lurk and then say it's not necessarily scummy. It's an excuse for him not to post content.
Solid Snake
Didn't see the role speculation list Kman made.
He was in Newb 18 and a big deal was made from EH's list. Repeating this mistake when he should have learned from that experience looks very scummy.
Solid Snake
I'm not sure if you simulposted, but Sneaky already explained why role speculation was bad.
FoS: Zas for "For this game it has absolutely no relevance though. I advice not getting ourselves distracted with this kind of stuff."
Saying that was contradictory/ hypocritical. You say we shouldn't get distracted but earlier in that post you got distracted by it.
Solid Snake
Sneaky's a pretty cool guy. He called me a spicy little bugger and doesn't afraid of anything.
I second the second part.
Solid Snake
First of all, can someone explain WIFOM to me please? I went through the entire simpsons mafia game ignoring it but i would like know what it means.
Second, I mentioned it because last game everyone was calling me out on it and I didn't want that this game because last game it put us (town) in a bad position and the mafia in a very good position.
I made the lists of decks because i thought it might help us us decide which decks might be scummy.
You seem to be very offensive.
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
No no no! We discussed this already. And Kman, you were in that game. FoS: Kman and Zas
This is what happened in Newb 18. EH turned out to be town and he was just trying to help, but I added to it because I was scum and figured I could write it off as newbiness.
Kman saw the town's backlash against it. And yet he does almost the same thing? Scummy.
And Zas added to the list. That's what I did. I was scum. Using the transitive property:
Action A= scummy
Zas does Action A
Zas= scummy
{Magic: The RPG}
Aww! I take that as a compliment.
Anyway, I have my first case o' the game! Prepare for a minor wall of text. Oh yeah, that officially bumps us out of the random phase.
Think of this as a warning, Kman. Continuing to act scummy and saying that it's just how you are won't make people think you're town, and certainly won't do anything to help this game.
On flavor: I suspect speculating about flavor won't really help us in this game. There are literally tons of famous decks throughout the history of Magic, and obviously only 12 players in this game.
Unvote
Modern: URStormUR|BRGW Jund BRGW|GWUB Gifts GWUB
Commander:XKarnX
Cubes: Level 1: Pauper
Ok. This is a no-no. Previously stated by others. It doesn't make you scum, but its useless specualtion.
Whoa! A REAL vote? I have problems with this. So, in response to the main points he brings up:
1. I believe his early self analysis is correct. Lurking does not equal scum. That's what kman was saying. Lurkers can be scum, but not all lurkers are scum. He lurked in his last game and was NOT scum, and I think he was trying to enforce that point.
2. kman was incredibly overdefensive in his last game. He did that all throughout the beginning. This is a noob thing of his, not a scum tell.
3. Lurking isn't scummy. Period. It's bad for the town, but in noob games it does not equal scum. kman is living proof of this from Newb 18.
Lastly, his self analysis can only be a good thing for the town. We can take his analysis and compare it to our own analysis of his past play. If the comparison is off, he looks kinda scummy. Self analysis can be extremely good for the town.
Well, he hasen't changed his overdefensiveness very much, so what makes you so sure he just never learned the list-lesson?
A small break here: Listing in this game is A-OK. In Simpsons it was bad, since we were trying to find specific characters that would be evil, and a wrong guess could lead to a mislynch. That was a game based around characters. Now this game is based around decks. I've never heard a deck walk up and talk to anybody. It's highly unlikely that we are going to guess the 12 decks even involved, let alone their alignments. Not only that, but when kman listed the decks, he never implied alignment on any of them, just listing possibilities. Now, I still don't think we should be listing, as it is a distraction from the real scum-hunt, but I honestly don't believe it's vote worthy.
I don't see how Zas is contradicting himself. He is proving his own point. He says these things can get distracting, because he himself found himself distracted by it. Also, I agree that role speculation has very little relevence in this game. The mod choose the decks and their roles. Everything is really up to him. To guess the roles would be to get inside the mod's head. Simpsons mafia, you just had to know the world of simpsons. That was an educated guess. This is just a flat out guess and has very little chance to make any impact on the game.
As for this above post, I see it as spreading unwanted suspicion. We are four pages in, and it seems like DB is building his scumlist, starting with kman and next in line is Zas. I don't like the sudden jumping around.
1. WIFOM mean Wine In Front Of Me. It's when a player says something and the other players say to themselves "Is he telling the truth? Or is that what he want's me to think?". It confuses and muddles the game. Lots of things can be WIFOM.
2. The list idea overall is useless to the town. It's neither a good thing or a bad thing. I can already tell that trying to guess the decks won't work (specifically since mine is NOT on the list).
Overall, I would like to Unvote, FoS Dattebayo
Why? First, for jumping on two different players incredibly quick, and skiping the whole FoS process. Next, for spreading his suspicion around to Zas, for a very limited reason. Finally, for not taking the Newb factor into account.
Now, the reason this isn't a vote is because these could all be noob mistakes. However, this rings to me like either an eager noob trying his best, or an eager scum jumping on noob mistakes. I'm leaning 60/40 towards scum.
That whole confusion thing is all part of a newb mafia. Are they scummy or are they just newbie? LET'S FIND OUT! *lynch*
That's pretty much how JqlGirl's lynch went down.
Thank you for explaining WIFOM, I would have never guessed that, lol.
I'm sorry I tried to make a list, I thought it would be helpful but if no one else thinks so then I'll forget about it. Just to let you guys know (because I see no harm in it) my deck is on the list.
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
i guess unvote i wont have any fun
And uh, guys from simpsons? remember how kman was like the first suspect? because im getting some wicked deja vu right about now...
I was thinking more evil magic decks, so whoever claims Stasis, be prepared for a vote from me [/just kidding] and yeah RIP the random phase: "live fast, die young"
*Starts to read.*
Nothing of importance to say at this time, that hasn't already been said.
I already said I did. but why would it matter?
and look around every once and a while you could miss it. - ferris bueller
Short reread is in order regarding Datte, will have stuff tomorrow.
I agree with BigTime on point number 2. We cannot think of Kman as scummy based only because of his overdefensiveness, because that's how he acted in Newb 18.
But points 1 & 3... I'm less certain. Yes, Kman lurked and was town in Newb 18. But I lurked and was scum. Lurking is both scummy and not scummy. Saying "lurking isn't scummy" doesn't work.
Saying "lurking in a newb game isn't as scummy as it normally would be in a game with more experienced players" would be the best way to phrase it. Sure, being newbs, we're more likely to not post and just observe, but saying that it isn't scummy at all is wrong. Lurking= not taking part in discussion and just observing, and is an advantage to the scum since they don't have to reveal as much.
But after Newb 18, I'm sure he's more aware of how he plays. So he could, theoretically, be using his self-analysis to excuse his scummy behaviour because he is now more alert to his own playing style. Yes, this could be seen as WIFOM'ey, but still. I am more aware of my own playstyle after playing in Newb 18, so it stands to reason that other players could recognize their own styles, and possibly use it to their advantage.
So... you're saying listing is okay because there are a lot more choices and he didn't even list possible alignments. Alright, I can see where you're coming from. Unfortunately, you also said in response to the original list.
So speculation is "a-ok", but is also a "no-no"? Which is it?
I agree. Spreading around unwanted suspicion is a bad thing. Which brings me to my next point:
I see this as unwanted suspicion. JqlGirl played nearly identical to this. She jumped around, skipping FoSes in favor of votes. What happened when we lynched her? See where I'm going with this?
You're playing this pretty close to how it played out against JqlGirl, and to me, Dattebayo is basically the same: Very unexperienced, and trying his best to help. You attacking him makes you more suspicious than him, IMO.
So, for that, FoS: BigTime
{Magic: The RPG}
firstly, i completely agree with you that lurking can be used in favor towards scum.
however, you offer from your own perspective that you would use lurking as a scum's tactic.
one's personal thought process or reasoning does not provide a strong reason that anyone else, specifically kman would use it to be scum. also, you take the liberty to completely assume that kman has become a much stronger player after newbie18.
as for your last FOS to BT, you state that . because of JqlGirl's inexperience she brought a loss to the townies on day 1. so in suspecting BigTime, wouldn't that bring us closer to lynching another townie?
You're also completely misreading Caex's post. He is making the same argument you are, because it is BigTime that's suspicious of DatteBayo for a Jqlgirl playing style.
Modern: URStormUR|BRGW Jund BRGW|GWUB Gifts GWUB
Commander:XKarnX
Cubes: Level 1: Pauper
I'm not saying that is what Kman is doing, I'm just pointing out that BT's thoughts' on the subject are one-sided and don't explore the other possibilities, such as Kman being purposfully misleading. I hope you can figure out what I'm trying to say in all that jumbled-up talkery.
No, I'm saying that Dattebayo, not BigTime, is playing extremely close to how JqlGirl played her first day. We lynched her, and she was town. I believe that Dattebayo is just a newb townie trying to help in any way possible, and BigTime's suspicion of him is probably going to lead us down the same path we took with JqlGirl. And since BigTime is one of the most experienced players here, he would be more likely to recognized that Dattebayo and JqlGirl posted in a very similar manner. I figure that if I, a very inexperienced player, can spot that, then the better players would be able to see it as well.
It stands to reason, then, that since JqlGirl was townie, and that since Dattebayo is playing in an extremely close replica of JqlGirl's style, then he is probably just an inexperienced (but townie) player trying to help.
{Magic: The RPG}
Votes:
2 Krowzy (Sneaks, KMan)
1 Sneaks (Wo Bu Yao)
1 Urban Druid (Zas)
1 Caex Kothar (Krowzy)
1 BigTime (Caex Kothar)
1 Kman (Dattebayo)
Not Voting: thedragun, FereMiy, Bigtime, Frenger, Urban Druid
With 12 alive, it is 7 to lynch.
Let me know if you'd like to be called something else on the vote count. I'll happily change it. Also, if people would like me to record FoSes (and Pinkies), then I'll start doing that.