I just got back from Worlds last night (this morning), and have a couple of pieces of info for everyone from the round table event. I had thought they were going to post it up in a podcast, but it doesn't seem to be up yet. Most of it was pretty worthless, but they did give out a couple of things:
1) Aaron Forsythe confirmed that 11th will be black bordered, as will all core sets going forward. His comment was something on the order of "white bordered sets are ugly".
2) There will be no Choosing 11th. Due to the cut in set size, they don't want to commit to anything up front. He said that, for example, if they had a vote off for a 4-cc Counterspell, and then decided that the slot had to be cut from the set, they would be in trouble.
3) Almost-sorta-confirmation of shock lands in 11th. An audience member asked if there was a chance that they would be in, and after some thought Forsythe answers "Yes, there is a chance" At a followup about how the pains seem old and shocks being a natural replacement, Forsythe gave a statement about the fact that they did seem to be a natural replacement, and that they were designed without guild names to be generic for future printings, but he couldn't give a commit at this time.
4) The next sets up are code-named Lights-Camera-Action, and Live-Long-Prosper. I can't recall if we knew that or not, so there you go.
5) Aaron Forsythe is involved in development for Lights and Live, and is excited about them, not that I would expect them to announce that they suck.
6) Forsythe and Rosewater both apologized for Bitterblossom, admitting that the card was a mistake to print in its current form, but not quite good enough to axe.
7) In a related note, Matt Place and Mark Rosewater both admitted that they totally mis-evaluated the Vivid land/Reflecting Pool thing and that they hadn't intended to push 5-color in the way it is now. They also said that it had hurt what they hoped to accomplish with Shards, as 5-color negates pushing the tri-color shards.
8) Matt Place told me after the official show that Conflux had some cards in it to "fix" faeries and allow the metagame to grow. Take it for what you will, he wouldn't give any additional details.
I'm sure there's probably some more stuff I'm not thinking of off the top of my head. If you guys can think of anything you're interested in, post it up and I'll see if you jog anything loose.
Edit: A couple more things I'm recalling now that I'm good and awake:
1) 11th is confirmed to have Mystic Rares, I can't recall if that was already established or not. Along the same lines, all the development guys think that planeswalkers were a huge success and that they were "putting some thinking" into including them into the base.
2) At the demo for the new Xbox Live game, the rep had an alternate art foil Garruk that they will be offering as a redemption thing. You are supposed to get some sort of code when you get the game, that you can register online and they would mail the promo to you. The art was pretty decent, but the rep said that it wasn't the final version.
1. Thank God for this!
2. I wasn't around for Selecting 10th but I think this explanation is perfectly rational.
3. Oh snaps. I just completed my painland set and now that I've read this, I need to double my efforts to get the shocklands. I have BW, GW, and 1 BGand that is not near enough. When does 11th even come out? Summer 2009?
4 & 5. What can be said? Um...nice code names?
6. I'm wondering what ppl think a "fixed" Bitterblossum would look like? More like Goblin Assault? Or just the same with a higher mana cost?
7. After reading this, my question is what did they expect? It sounds like they completly forgot about Lorwyn and were just thinking Reflecting Pool + tri-lands. Not even filter + pool, just shards.
8. Engineered Plague. Just saying.
In the thread about the conflux art at worlds it was said that the answers would be revealed. Did you hear anythingabout that?
The poster said they'd be doing the reveal this afternoon, but I already came back since I didn't qualify for the Gold Challenge.
Lol. I didn't even think about that (just looked at the time). I don't think I thanked you for the info; everything (excluding 4 & 5) is huge news IMHO.
6) Forsythe and Rosewater both apologized for Bitterblossom, admitting that the card was a mistake to print in its current form, but not quite good enough to axe.
On behalf of all those in my tourney area, Thank you and we accept your apologie.
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The possible bringing back of dual lands would be awesome if they come back. I thought they would with 10th, honestly, with the "generic" nonguild names, although I would definitely love duals and bouncelands, that's probably asking too much!
6. I'm wondering what ppl think a "fixed" Bitterblossum would look like? More like Goblin Assault? Or just the same with a higher mana cost?
Imo, Fixed Bitterblossom would:
A) Cost 2B so the starting player can't play it T2 when it's unable to be countered, making Fae vs. Fae less of a "who get's BB first" thing.
And/Or
B) Not have subtype Faerie so it isn't counted by Spellstutter Sprite, and can't be championed and thus "shut off" with Mistbind Clique.
Nicol Bolis was just confirmed to be the most expensive planeswalker yet in the video feed. It was said that he would be "well worth the cost".
We can assume him to be 3UBR?
Lets try not to derail the thread with the BB comment, and talk about the actual rumors here...
The blackbordered core set makes complete sense. No surprise there at all.
I wonder (but doubt) if the free for all at worlds will spoil cards like they did last year...
I thought it was a given that the Lorwyn walkers would be in 11th...WoTC saying they were 'thinking' about it...they might have well as confirmed them.
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6) Forsythe and Rosewater both apologized for Bitterblossom, admitting that the card was a mistake to print in its current form, but not quite good enough to axe.
I know I'm probably in the minority when I say this, but if it weren't for mistakes like these, there'd be no all-time classic cards. Goyf, Blossom, Skullclamp are examples of cards that will be good forever. Magic needs those cards, IMHO, tie all the formats together and give players a sense of history and a point of reference. Personally, I don't mind it at all if every block as one or two busted cards that change the direction of the game.
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WoTC, thank you for finally announcing the Modern format, an eternal format where everyone can participate.
it means they could print counterspell and then players are able to counter it
We already have Negate...I don't think that's the issue...making it cost BB might have been a little better, so it can't be splashed around everywhere a la Tarmogoyf.
Thank goodness for black borders, although not much of a surprise
I don't know about assuming any given cost, I mean, the original Nicol was 2UUBBRR, so it could be entirely possible to just stick with that for nostalgia/continuity. Or they could emphasize the black with an off balance cost like Cruel Ultimatum like 2UBBR. But, he's going to cost at least 6.
Black border core sets from now on it sounds like, that's such a good thing to hear. I can understand why they cut Choosing 11th but it still makes me kinda sad. *Sigh* I was one of the few people who liked the pain lands over the shocklands. Oh well, guess I gotta go for those now if I run out of my Dual Hybrids. As usual the set code names are confusing but at least we know they exist. The only time I ever hated Bitterblossom was when everyone was making an OMG big deal about it (See: Tarmogoyf, Garruk for other examples), but I use it in my BG aggro so I'm glad it's still around. I do wish that tricolor got more spotlight then it is with 5-color dominating now. "Fix Fae" eh? Somehow I think were going to see some anti-flier, anti small creature things. Mythic rares and PW's in 11th sounds fine to me. Bolas having the highest PW mana cost but worth it? No complaints here, I'll still play him if he's worth the mana, and if he turns out to be 2UUBBRR he better be worth it. As for promo Garruk... blah if I get one it's up for trade.
I added a couple more things to the first post. I was still half-asleep when I posted. Didn't get home until ~10am this morning (as in, up since 6am Sat.)
At this point, I think the least they could do is apologize for Bitterblossom and Reflecting Pool. Interestingly, guess just what cards the Finals at Worlds involved. I wonder just how many of Development's "mistakes" are gonna end up winning World Championships in the following years; three's plenty as far as I'm concerned, thank you very much...
The news that Conflux will feature some cards to "fix" Faeries worries me to no end. So far, all the specific Faerie hosers they've printed have accomplished is to make matters more difficult for control players, leaving Faeries more or less intact. I think their current commitment to broken tribal interactions cannot be undone by printing corrective spells; the last we see of Faeries in Type II will probably be the moment Lorwyn rotates out, unless they emergency-ban Bitterblossom, which, let's face it, is not gonna happen.
The Shocklands are good news. They are some of the best lands printed in the last ten years, and I'd love the second chance to get my complete 40-land playset. I hope they don't turn out to be the only reason to pick up 11th, though. I'm excited about the rehash of base editions, and they hope they make it worth our time and money. Seeing the amount of core set cards being played competitively right now, I am seriously looking forward to some power uncommons and rares.
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People hiss and grunt at Mark Rosewater for the state of the game. Few realize, though, that it is Aaron Forsythe who is directly responsible of the current state of affairs due to negligence as head of Magic R&D and a completely skewed view of the game as a whole.
So next time you want to make an avvy with Rosewater pissing on something, take a deep breath and consider pasting Forsythe's face there instead...
I'm pretty against shocks (and pains even) in 11th... ten rare spots pretty much wasted as it's a smaller core set, and the fact they say they are upset that 5-color got so out of control and this is yet another way to feed it. I honestly wouldn't be sad at all if the tri-lands were the only new multilands we have printed for another year. All we had was City Of Brass and junky allied CITP tapped lands in 8th, and every since 9th/RAV release we've been spoiled by pains and shocks. People have forgotten just how special it IS to have enemy colored anything.
Sorry to boo hoo, but I personally really enjoy the Core Sets and now that it's a tighter ship, I don't want to see 10 rare slots taken away for lands.
I don't want to see 10 rare slots taken away for lands.
Will you really be that sad if those 10 rare slots are going to go to the likes of Scoria Wurm and its ilk?
I'm not saying they are DEFINITELY going to cut back on the ****** rares of the set, but with a smaller set size I'd much rather have ten rare lands than 10... Wurms...
Shock lands in the base set will be interesting to say the least. Kind of begs the question if City of Brass will take the old pain land status? At least there wont be any ugly white bordered shock lands running around.
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I'm pretty against shocks (and pains even) in 11th... ten rare spots pretty much wasted as it's a smaller core set, and the fact they say they are upset that 5-color got so out of control and this is yet another way to feed it. I honestly wouldn't be sad at all if the tri-lands were the only new multilands we have printed for another year. All we had was City Of Brass and junky allied CITP tapped lands in 8th, and every since 9th/RAV release we've been spoiled by pains and shocks. People have forgotten just how special it IS to have enemy colored anything.
Sorry to boo hoo, but I personally really enjoy the Core Sets and now that it's a tighter ship, I don't want to see 10 rare slots taken away for lands.
While you may see it as 10 slots wasted, I see it as 10 of the best rare slots in 11th.
it means they could print counterspell and then players are able to counter it
Negate and Broken Ambitions can already counter it for 2 mana. Of course, if the faerie player is on the play, then it's impossible to counter Bitterblossom unless a 1cc counterspell is printed.
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Forsythe and Rosewater both apologized for Bitterblossom, admitting that the card was a mistake to print in its current form, but not quite good enough to axe.
The card is perfectly balanced, if it didn't have the Faerie subtype. Otherwise, it would just be very strong... As it is, it's just a tad too abusable, but it doesn't change the fact that the entire deck is overpowered.
Otherwise, thanks for the info! It's nice to have Core Sets feel just as special as the other sets... In fact, a lot of people really appreciate the older reprints, getting a chance to shine again. (now that they are in legacy/vintage land, they are ignored)
Personally, I don't mind it at all if every block as one or two busted cards that change the direction of the game.
I agree- I like the idea of there being an "enemy" in the format every now and then. Gives you something to fight for, instead of just a rock/paper/scissors scenario. But truth be told, Faeries does need another hoser in the format, but I think people should realize that even with Faeries being the best deck, the format is still very diverse, which is why you can't have an "Anti-Faeries" deck, since you'll just get stomped by Kithkin, or Lark.
Shock lands in the base set will be interesting to say the least. Kind of begs the question if City of Brass will take the old pain land status? At least there wont be any ugly white bordered shock lands running around.
Ugh, don't even joke about white-bordered Shocklands.
Personally, I'm excited about shocklands in 11th. IMO, the core sets for a long time have just been a going-through-the-motions sort of set; they could just as well tell me on DailyMTG which cards are now allowed or not allowed in Standard for all the good the core sets do. They don't do a good job of getting new players into the game, and experienced players only buy packs to grab the rares they couldn't get from older sets. (Hurray for finally getting a playset of Troll Ascetic!)
So with a smaller set size, shocklands and, if I remember right, Wizards upping the difficulty of the core set away from amoeba-intelligence to something more, I'm pretty happy about that.
I'm not as upset about Bitterblossom as I am about Mutavault, honestly. Bitterblossom was in one or two small, tribal decks, and it's taken it's time branching out into other decks. Mutavault was in every stupid tribal deck that didn't need WW on turn 2. Mishra's Factory is/was one of the best man-lands ever printed and is STILL played in decks, and they reprint it, AND give it relevant creature types?? No wonder the card saw $40+ price tags.
As for everything else....kick ass. I'm excited. Now if they'd just sneak us a little look-see at a certain Dragon Planeswalker, I'd be totally content for another month until spoiler season starts.
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I just got back from Worlds last night (this morning), and have a couple of pieces of info for everyone from the round table event. I had thought they were going to post it up in a podcast, but it doesn't seem to be up yet. Most of it was pretty worthless, but they did give out a couple of things:
1) Aaron Forsythe confirmed that 11th will be black bordered, as will all core sets going forward. His comment was something on the order of "white bordered sets are ugly".
2) There will be no Choosing 11th. Due to the cut in set size, they don't want to commit to anything up front. He said that, for example, if they had a vote off for a 4-cc Counterspell, and then decided that the slot had to be cut from the set, they would be in trouble.
3) Almost-sorta-confirmation of shock lands in 11th. An audience member asked if there was a chance that they would be in, and after some thought Forsythe answers "Yes, there is a chance" At a followup about how the pains seem old and shocks being a natural replacement, Forsythe gave a statement about the fact that they did seem to be a natural replacement, and that they were designed without guild names to be generic for future printings, but he couldn't give a commit at this time.
4) The next sets up are code-named Lights-Camera-Action, and Live-Long-Prosper. I can't recall if we knew that or not, so there you go.
5) Aaron Forsythe is involved in development for Lights and Live, and is excited about them, not that I would expect them to announce that they suck.
6) Forsythe and Rosewater both apologized for Bitterblossom, admitting that the card was a mistake to print in its current form, but not quite good enough to axe.
7) In a related note, Matt Place and Mark Rosewater both admitted that they totally mis-evaluated the Vivid land/Reflecting Pool thing and that they hadn't intended to push 5-color in the way it is now. They also said that it had hurt what they hoped to accomplish with Shards, as 5-color negates pushing the tri-color shards.
8) Matt Place told me after the official show that Conflux had some cards in it to "fix" faeries and allow the metagame to grow. Take it for what you will, he wouldn't give any additional details.
I'm sure there's probably some more stuff I'm not thinking of off the top of my head. If you guys can think of anything you're interested in, post it up and I'll see if you jog anything loose.
Edit: A couple more things I'm recalling now that I'm good and awake:
1) 11th is confirmed to have Mystic Rares, I can't recall if that was already established or not. Along the same lines, all the development guys think that planeswalkers were a huge success and that they were "putting some thinking" into including them into the base.
2) At the demo for the new Xbox Live game, the rep had an alternate art foil Garruk that they will be offering as a redemption thing. You are supposed to get some sort of code when you get the game, that you can register online and they would mail the promo to you. The art was pretty decent, but the rep said that it wasn't the final version.
probably the same as how kamigawa was used to "fix" affinity
2. I wasn't around for Selecting 10th but I think this explanation is perfectly rational.
3. Oh snaps. I just completed my painland set and now that I've read this, I need to double my efforts to get the shocklands. I have BW, GW, and 1 BGand that is not near enough. When does 11th even come out? Summer 2009?
4 & 5. What can be said? Um...nice code names?
6. I'm wondering what ppl think a "fixed" Bitterblossum would look like? More like Goblin Assault? Or just the same with a higher mana cost?
7. After reading this, my question is what did they expect? It sounds like they completly forgot about Lorwyn and were just thinking Reflecting Pool + tri-lands. Not even filter + pool, just shards.
8. Engineered Plague. Just saying.
In the thread about the conflux art at worlds it was said that the answers would be revealed. Did you hear anythingabout that?
Lol. I didn't even think about that (just looked at the time). I don't think I thanked you for the info; everything (excluding 4 & 5) is huge news IMHO.
On behalf of all those in my tourney area, Thank you and we accept your apologie.
Thanks to PurpleD from Left Play Designs for the banner:D
Fixed (bad pun intended.)
The possible bringing back of dual lands would be awesome if they come back. I thought they would with 10th, honestly, with the "generic" nonguild names, although I would definitely love duals and bouncelands, that's probably asking too much!
I used to write cube articles on StarCityGames, now for GatheringMagic and podcast about cube (w/Antknee42.)
Imo, Fixed Bitterblossom would:
A) Cost 2B so the starting player can't play it T2 when it's unable to be countered, making Fae vs. Fae less of a "who get's BB first" thing.
And/Or
B) Not have subtype Faerie so it isn't counted by Spellstutter Sprite, and can't be championed and thus "shut off" with Mistbind Clique.
We can assume him to be 3UBR?
Lets try not to derail the thread with the BB comment, and talk about the actual rumors here...
The blackbordered core set makes complete sense. No surprise there at all.
I wonder (but doubt) if the free for all at worlds will spoil cards like they did last year...
I thought it was a given that the Lorwyn walkers would be in 11th...WoTC saying they were 'thinking' about it...they might have well as confirmed them.
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I know I'm probably in the minority when I say this, but if it weren't for mistakes like these, there'd be no all-time classic cards. Goyf, Blossom, Skullclamp are examples of cards that will be good forever. Magic needs those cards, IMHO, tie all the formats together and give players a sense of history and a point of reference. Personally, I don't mind it at all if every block as one or two busted cards that change the direction of the game.
We already have Negate...I don't think that's the issue...making it cost BB might have been a little better, so it can't be splashed around everywhere a la Tarmogoyf.
Thank goodness for black borders, although not much of a surprise
I don't know about assuming any given cost, I mean, the original Nicol was 2UUBBRR, so it could be entirely possible to just stick with that for nostalgia/continuity. Or they could emphasize the black with an off balance cost like Cruel Ultimatum like 2UBBR. But, he's going to cost at least 6.
The news that Conflux will feature some cards to "fix" Faeries worries me to no end. So far, all the specific Faerie hosers they've printed have accomplished is to make matters more difficult for control players, leaving Faeries more or less intact. I think their current commitment to broken tribal interactions cannot be undone by printing corrective spells; the last we see of Faeries in Type II will probably be the moment Lorwyn rotates out, unless they emergency-ban Bitterblossom, which, let's face it, is not gonna happen.
The Shocklands are good news. They are some of the best lands printed in the last ten years, and I'd love the second chance to get my complete 40-land playset. I hope they don't turn out to be the only reason to pick up 11th, though. I'm excited about the rehash of base editions, and they hope they make it worth our time and money. Seeing the amount of core set cards being played competitively right now, I am seriously looking forward to some power uncommons and rares.
So next time you want to make an avvy with Rosewater pissing on something, take a deep breath and consider pasting Forsythe's face there instead...
Sorry to boo hoo, but I personally really enjoy the Core Sets and now that it's a tighter ship, I don't want to see 10 rare slots taken away for lands.
Will you really be that sad if those 10 rare slots are going to go to the likes of Scoria Wurm and its ilk?
I'm not saying they are DEFINITELY going to cut back on the ****** rares of the set, but with a smaller set size I'd much rather have ten rare lands than 10... Wurms...
No, your anime sig is NOT cool.
Currently Playing:
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Standard - RDW
While you may see it as 10 slots wasted, I see it as 10 of the best rare slots in 11th.
Negate and Broken Ambitions can already counter it for 2 mana. Of course, if the faerie player is on the play, then it's impossible to counter Bitterblossom unless a 1cc counterspell is printed.
The card is perfectly balanced, if it didn't have the Faerie subtype. Otherwise, it would just be very strong... As it is, it's just a tad too abusable, but it doesn't change the fact that the entire deck is overpowered.
Otherwise, thanks for the info! It's nice to have Core Sets feel just as special as the other sets... In fact, a lot of people really appreciate the older reprints, getting a chance to shine again. (now that they are in legacy/vintage land, they are ignored)
I agree- I like the idea of there being an "enemy" in the format every now and then. Gives you something to fight for, instead of just a rock/paper/scissors scenario. But truth be told, Faeries does need another hoser in the format, but I think people should realize that even with Faeries being the best deck, the format is still very diverse, which is why you can't have an "Anti-Faeries" deck, since you'll just get stomped by Kithkin, or Lark.
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Ugh, don't even joke about white-bordered Shocklands.
Personally, I'm excited about shocklands in 11th. IMO, the core sets for a long time have just been a going-through-the-motions sort of set; they could just as well tell me on DailyMTG which cards are now allowed or not allowed in Standard for all the good the core sets do. They don't do a good job of getting new players into the game, and experienced players only buy packs to grab the rares they couldn't get from older sets. (Hurray for finally getting a playset of Troll Ascetic!)
So with a smaller set size, shocklands and, if I remember right, Wizards upping the difficulty of the core set away from amoeba-intelligence to something more, I'm pretty happy about that.
I'm not as upset about Bitterblossom as I am about Mutavault, honestly. Bitterblossom was in one or two small, tribal decks, and it's taken it's time branching out into other decks. Mutavault was in every stupid tribal deck that didn't need WW on turn 2. Mishra's Factory is/was one of the best man-lands ever printed and is STILL played in decks, and they reprint it, AND give it relevant creature types?? No wonder the card saw $40+ price tags.
As for everything else....kick ass. I'm excited. Now if they'd just sneak us a little look-see at a certain Dragon Planeswalker, I'd be totally content for another month until spoiler season starts.