[Deck] AIR - All In Red (aka Dragon Stompy)

[Troll_ov_Grimness]

Goblins is an extremely good deck in legacy. However, many of the "important" goblins are extremely expensive, and face it, for a lot of them you're going to want them in playsets.

Lets look at some..

Goblin Lackey
Goblin Piledriver
Goblin Wizard
Goblin Welder..

Some of these guys can be $10 even $20 each if not more

But if you already have some highly sought after goblins, and a bunch of mountains, I see no reason why you couldn't do fine in legacy with goblins.

[Eseph]

Originally Posted by shinyflavors7

Does this deck gain any amount of validation due to the top 4 finish in Chicago or will this be written off as fluke? I guess what I am trying to ask is does a deck need to win a major event to be viable or can it just top 8?

Didn't this deck do well last year as well?

side note: I'm trying to bust in to legacy in a competitive way(I previously only dabbled in a casual/competitive atmosphere but my love of fnm/standard play is dwindling and I am looking for away to play very challenging but brief games with primarily skilled opponents.) is this deck a good one for me to jump in on or will it be a waste of my somewhat lacking funds?(I have a good part of a goblin deck together from when I play goblins in extended. None of the land unfortunately.)

I wouldn't call it a waste, the only problem is this is a meta deck, it needs a meta like chicago, where non-basics are going to be extremely prevalent. If you're playing in an underdeveloped meta, then this might not be the best deck to pick up.

Comparatively Goblins will almost always be competitive, the difference being that when this deck hits it's stride within a meta it can easily go places. AKA the top 4 at the GP.

Also to whoever asked about this being an extended deck... this is not. All-in Red plays very differently from this one, and isn't really even viable anymore thanks to the printing of Path to Exile. As the deck relied heavily on landing a Deus of Calamity or Demigod of Revenge on turn 1 or 2. AKA the list you posted, which thanks to Swords already existing in the meta is just not going to work. Plus Trinisphere and Chalice of the Void combined with the Blood Moon effects are the reason to run this deck. None of them should ever leave the main.

[Troll_ov_Grimness]

Originally Posted by Eseph

I wouldn't call it a waste, the only problem is this is a meta deck, it needs a meta like chicago, where non-basics are going to be extremely prevalent. If you're playing in an underdeveloped meta, then this might not be the best deck to pick up.

Comparatively Goblins will almost always be competitive, the difference being that when this deck hits it's stride within a meta it can easily go places. AKA the top 4 at the GP.

Also to whoever asked about this being an extended deck... this is not. All-in Red plays very differently from this one, and isn't really even viable anymore thanks to the printing of Path to Exile. As the deck relied heavily on landing a Deus of Calamity or Demigod of Revenge on turn 1 or 2. AKA the list you posted, which thanks to Swords already existing in the meta is just not going to work. Plus Trinisphere and Chalice of the Void combined with the Blood Moon effects are the reason to run this deck. None of them should ever leave the main.

Why does wizards continue to print cards that are better than cards they used to say were overpowered?

Case in point.. Swords has nothing on Path to Exile

[Naz]

Originally Posted by Troll_ov_Grimness

Goblin Lackey
Goblin Piledriver
Goblin Wizard
Goblin Welder..

Eh... The bottom two aren't played in Goblins, at all.

Case in point.. Swords has nothing on Path to Exile

I think you might want to play Legacy for a little longer before jumping to conclusions...Swords still reigns supreme for now. It just isn't that viable outside legacy because there's no chalice or 3sphere.

[shinyflavors7]

I just priced this and it is in the range of 200-250. I priced the land alone for the goblin deck and they where at the same price point but the land are an investment that seems to to be sound. Options?

How does this deck measure up to a well established control deck like stax. (In all areas. playability, speed, price point, longevity of meta playability, etc.)

[Naz]

Dragon Stompy is probably one of the strongest in the format, with a huge if - that if would be when it isn't its own worst enemy. The time you'll lose with this deck is either against random jank (anything that uses only basics too) or due to having to mulligan multiple times. It's higher up there then stax is though. So, it's inconsistent and you can lose games just because the deck is hating you.

So anyway, it does have a lot going for it as the landbase, 3sphere and chalice are all legacy staples and having dragons with swords is just cool

Goblins is far more consistent though and doesn't lose against random decks (instead it preys on it)

[Complete_Jank]

4 out of 1230 is deffinately a fluke.

I mean Death and Taxes, Red Death, Eva Green, Aggro Elves, and Counterslivers are much more proven, they each have taken 1st in events twice as large as this right?


Dragon Stompy is more proven than any of those. Play it at a big event and it will cary you to many easy wins and often Top 8's and Top 16's.

[Troll_ov_Grimness]

Originally Posted by Naz

Eh... The bottom two aren't played in Goblins, at all.

I think you might want to play Legacy for a little longer before jumping to conclusions...Swords still reigns supreme for now. It just isn't that viable outside legacy because there's no chalice or 3sphere.

Having an opponent put out a basic land is much less of an punishment than an opponent gaining like 4 or 7 life.

I never understood though why Swords wasn't in used in sideboards in favor of Exile instead. I know Exile costs 2 more mana but you GAIN life instead of your opponent gaining.. seems a lot better?

[JunioRcmf]

Originally Posted by Troll_ov_Grimness

Having an opponent put out a basic land is much less of an punishment than an opponent gaining like 4 or 7 life.

I never understood though why Swords wasn't in used in sideboards in favor of Exile instead. I know Exile costs 2 more mana but you GAIN life instead of your opponent gaining.. seems a lot better?

You don't win with life, you win with game speed. It is easier to get rid of some extra life than thinning opponents deck and giving him/her faster plays.

Also if you're in low life you can always StoP your own Dark Confidant or use StoP instead of Stifle to your Dreadnought to gain 12 life for or just StoP any of your creatures to gain small amount of life.
Also giving some life to opponent isn't that big deal if you play right creatures, say for example, Piledriver, Tombstalker, 'Goyf or Dreadnought which all eat that small amount of life they got very fast in few turns (or in just one turn as the life gain ain't usually that much).
Path also gives 'em answer against many good metagame threats like Back to Basics and Blood Moon effects which usually screw opponents games completely until they draw one of their few basic lands.

Path is nowhere near as useful as StoP in Legacy. Read forums, articles and tournament reports in order to get better understanding of Legacy. For now your knowledge hasn't been that accurate.
All out Red is way different deck than Dragon Stompy (only similarity is that they are both mono red and have mana-accel) and you don't play Welder or Goblin Wizard (this card sucks, it is way too slow and useless) in Goblins, Welder is for other decks and Wizard shouldn't be played in any deck.

[Complete_Jank]

Originally Posted by Troll_ov_Grimness

I never understood though why Swords wasn't in used in sideboards in favor of Exile instead. I know Exile costs 2 more mana but you GAIN life instead of your opponent gaining.. seems a lot better?

Exile requires the creature to attack, Painter's Servant doesn't usually attack, and that is just one of many reasons why STP is better.

[Kevinliu]

I enjoyed reading the opening post seemed to be detailed but once it has a complete matchup analysis it should be a pretty helpful primer.

I definitely think this deck should be moved to proven competitive. Dragon stompy has proven itself to be a pretty solid contender in Legacy for awhile now. Dragon stompy is one of those decks that can do really well in the swiss rounds but after a certain period of time in a tournament it's ability to be consistent and resilient in later rounds tends to not be there for Dragon Stompy. So it loses in the top 4 of a big tournament such as the Chicago GP.

[strangeuniverse]

I think the OP meant Pyroblast not Hydroblast in the SB card discussion next to Red Elemental Blast.

Originally Posted by Complete_Jank

Exile requires the creature to attack, Painter's Servant doesn't usually attack, and that is just one of many reasons why STP is better.

No it does not, I think you're thinking about condemn

[Kevinliu]

Originally Posted by strangeuniverse

No it does not, I think you're thinking about condemn

I think your thinking about Path to Exile which isn't the same card as Exile. I think Complete Jank was referring to "Exile" instead of "Path to Exile" as well.

[Complete_Jank]

Originally Posted by strangeuniverse

No it does not, I think you're thinking about condemn

He was talking about the card Exile. RCFTW.

Originally Posted by Cecilia

I think your thinking about Path to Exile which isn't the same card as Exile. I think Complete Jank was referring to "Exile" instead of "Path to Exile" as well.

Thanks Cecilia, the discussion was on Exile, not Path to Exile.

[Johm000]

Moderator Action: Thread moved to Proven Competitive.

I think this one was going to be moved as soon as a decent primer was written, so here it is.