I already know of Vanguard cards but I wanted to put this idea up. What I want to consider is to make a customizable character that represents you. These cards I call Caster Cards. They are divided into two types. The first is Race Card. Each race card has a built in ability a starter life points, and starting and maximum Hand size. The second card is a class card. These cards have a built in ability and may modify the starting hand size and starting life totals. This is just a concept and I bet several other people have considered this but I would appreciate any opinion. Here are some concepts:
Race: Angel
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Unable to learn a Class.
When you play your first White spell each turn, you gain X life. X is equal to the converted mana cost of that spell.
Race: Demon
Life Points: 26
Max/Starting Hand Size: 5
Unable to learn a Class.
(X)(X) Lose X life: Non-Black Creatures target player controls get -1/-1 till the end of turn. You may only spend black mana on this ability.
Race: Dragolord
Life Points: 19
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
Non-combat damage is reduce by (2).
Race: Dwarf
Life Points: 22
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Equipments cost (1) less to play.
Race: Elf
Life Points: 18
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Creature spells gain Affinity for Elf. (This spell costs (1) less to cast for each Elf you control.)
Race: Fairy
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 9
Sorcery and Instant spells gain, "Buyback (3)"
Race: Gargoyle
Life Points: 26
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
Each Non-Creature and Non-Equipment Artifact is an Artifact Gargoyle Creature with power and toughness each equal to its converted mana cost.
Race: Goblin
Life Points: 24
Max/Starting Hand Size: 5
Creatures you control gain +1/+0
Race: Human
Life Points: 20
Max/Starting Hand Size: 7
Can learn two Classes.
Race: Kithkin
Life Points: 23
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
(1) Prevent the next 1 damage done to target creature your control.
Race: Merfolk
Life Points: 22
Max/Starting Hand Size: 7
Lands you control are Islands in addition to their land type.
Race: Minotaur
Life Points: 27
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
When a creature comes onto the battlefield, you may deal 1 damage to target creature opponent controls.
Race: Shapeshifter
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 5
Spells you control gain Changeling. (This card is every creature type at all times)
Race: Sliver
Life Points: 20
Max/Starting Hand Size: 7
Creatures you control are Sliver in addition to their creature type.
Race: Vampire
Life Points: 23
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
When a creature deals combat damage to you, you may pay (2) and deal 2 damage to that creature and gain 2 life.
Class: Archer
Life Points: +0
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
(3) Deal 2 damage to target attacking creature.
Class: Beast Tamer
Life Points: +3
Max/Starting Hand Size: -2
Creature spells with mana cost 6 or greater are reduce by (2).
Class: Berserker
Life Points: +5
Max/Starting Hand Size: -3
(4) Discard a random card from your hand. Deal X damage to target opponent. X is equal the converted mana cost of the card discarded."
Class: Cleric
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
(3) Choose a color. The next time a source of your choice of the chosen color would deal damage to you this turn, prevent that damage.
Class: Crypt Keeper
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: -2
When a creature you control is sent from the battlefield to the graveyard, you may put it back on top of your library.
Class: Defender
Life Points: +4
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
Creatures you control has +0/+2.
Class: Druid
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: +1
During the end of your turn, untap two lands.
Class: Hive Queen
Life Points: +5
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
Sliver Only. (3) Put a 1/1 Colorless Sliver token onto the battlefield.
Class: Hunter
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
When you play a creature spell, you may pay (1). If you do, draw a card.
Class: Knight
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
(1) Untap target creature you control.
Class: Ninja
Life Points: -2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
Creatures you control are Ninja in addition to their creature type. Your creature spells without Ninjitsu gain: "Ninjitsu (X)-(2) (Return an unblocked attacker you control to hand: Put this card into play from your hand tapped and attacking. X is equal to the that creature's casting cost."
Class: Pirate
Life Points: -1
Max/Starting Hand Size: -3
During your draw step, you may draw an additional card and put a card from your hand to the bottom of your library.
Class: Rogue
Life Points: -3
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
Creatures you control with power 2 or less has, "When this creature deals combat damage to an opponent, that player discards a card."
Class: Samurai
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
(2) Put a training counter on target creature. Creatures that have a training counter gains Bushido X and becomes a Samurai in addition to its other creature types. (When this blocks or becomes blocked, it gets +X/+X until end of turn. X is equal to the number of training counters on this creature.)
Class: Scout
Life Points: -2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
During your first three upkeeps, seach your library for a basic land and put it into play tapped.
Class: Shaman
Life Points: -2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +1
(3) Change the target(s) of target instant or sorcery spell.
Class: Soldier
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
(1) Target creature you control has, "Whenever this creature becomes blocked, this creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn for each creature blocking it."
Class: Symbiote
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
Sliver Only. Whenever a creature is dealt damage by a Sliver and is sent to the graveyard, return the creature to the battlefield under your control.
Class: Tinker
Life Points: -1
Max/Starting Hand Size: +2
Artifacts and Enchantments gain Flash.
Class: Warrior
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: -2
(1) Target creature you control gains Haste.
Class: Wizard
Life Points: -4
Max/Starting Hand Size: +3
When a player casts a spell, you may discard a spell with the same converted mana cost as that spell to counter it.
I know you said you are aware of Vanguard - so, that makes it even clearer that this question needs asked. Why make these instead of Vanguard, when a clear implemenation of the mechanics here already exists?
The only real difference to Vanguard i see is the given combination of Race+Class , which is not bad, but produces some problem in itself, as some possible combinations of abilities result in combos that are really fun.
Vanguard alone is potential broken, as they can be really annoying overpowered in decks that abuse the effect, this means even just a simpel combo deck can use a Vanguard with a high +card to get in the combo more efficient (an annoying factor that wants to be avoided by a brutal -life or something).
So overall, its a nice thing, but its just a funny thing for some trys and gets annoying in the long run.
The most funny Vanguards are the one that produce games of themself, looking for Momir and friends, this formats offer something special which i highly enjoyed (but again not for a long time, as its just a fun thing for some games).
////
However you could drive your idea a lot further if you make the idea "a lot" more customizable.
This means that a card could real:
Angel => your deck must have at least 20 angels in it.
Something like "generals" in EDH could be used aswell, for something like:
Class Summoner => You may play a "General" from outside the game.
The Class doesnt effect your hand size etc. it will just give you abilities , your values could be set by your "Race" and some randomisation , like in D&D if you create a character , you either get points to disripute or randomize them.
You could even give some classes ingame "Quest" conditions, something along :
- Have 5 or more creatures on the battlfield. => draw three cards , +2 EXP
- Have exactly 1 life => your life total becomes 20. +5 EXP
- Draw five cards during a turn. => Each opponent discards a card. +2 EXP
This Quests are "randomly" given away of pairs in 3 for example, and you can exchange 1 of them at the end of your turn , in case you can't reach it fast enough or at all.
If you fullfill the condition you gain the reward , and for example some "Exp" , you would keep and gain more and more "EXP" this way and some classes requiere more EXP to get, or you even give out some "2nd Tier" classes etc.
This things means Magic becomes slighty like an RPG , you play Magic with special characters, with conditions, quests/rewards and you gain more and more possibilities, rather than just deck building, which is like getting "Items".
I could really see such a thing made in a possible "Online" version of Magic, its an intresting thing, an highly Casual.
All this could easy include "Plane" Cards as the actual Area you play, or even give out some "Szenarios" where you play again 2 opponents, or you have a "King" to protect in an 3vs3 game (Emperor actual) but you play your normal deck and get through all this "adventures".
Examples for that:
Quest:
Protect your King against the enemies "attacking forces".
1 Player = King // King dies, game lost
2 Players = "Generals"
against
3 opponents => attacks
*Simpel Magic in the end, with a lot modifications outside the normal game rulez.
**The King can't be attacked unless a General has no creatures, more or less like the King is a "Planeswalker" card , the generals can block everything that attacks the King.
***Other Emperor like rulez.
Quest:
Protect a Ship
1 Player = you
1 Opponent = attacking opponent
1 NPC = ship
Here again, you have to protect the NPC player which is considerer the "ship", that player will play islands each turn and move forward, the goal is that the player has 20 islands in play, this means the quest will take 20 turns which it has to survive.
You could even take it further and make it that the player walks outside like in an MMORPG, and the "combat" is just made via Magic, so the possibilities get bigger and bigger with a giant amount of possible "Casual" formats that get supported to allow a big difference between each game.
Could be really really nice, but drives the game away from normal Magic and extends it with RPG elements.
MagicOnline is a thing for itself, making all this in an idea of an MMORPG is incredible but not easy to do, and its something that goes far beyond the normal "card game" that Magic currently is (and will actual be).
Pichoro:
What I was aiming for in making Casters different from Vanguard was that they can be customizable and can be a personal representation of you. When I play Magic, I see my abilities defined by my deck and draw. Luck says whether I do great or not. I like luck and I think that is what makes the game fun and challenging. I thought about making me, the player, more interactive in the game. When I played Vanguard, it was exciting but I felt that some Vanguard cards were overpowering and only a few would ever be used. The idea of Casters was to be unpredictable and each card to have a power that can be used in several deck styles.
So making Vanguard cards to me would be just a little stale in itself. Not saying Vanguard cards are all bad. I've played other card games and ones where you use a character card and a deck was always fun and challenging to make a deck to bring that character's powers to the fullest. I do appreciate the question and I hope this answers it.
TheOnlyOne652089:
I do appreciate your insight on these cards. I always believe in starting simple and then advancing on them. What you have said made me realize that how far I could go. I'll work on them more. I'll cut the alteration on hand and life created by class cards and focus on the abilities being a little more dependent on what type of deck you use. I'll post what I put together. I'll even consider the quest cards as a random deck.
Pichoro:
What I was aiming for in making Casters different from Vanguard was that they can be customizable and can be a personal representation of you. When I play Magic, I see my abilities defined by my deck and draw. Luck says whether I do great or not. I like luck and I think that is what makes the game fun and challenging. I thought about making me, the player, more interactive in the game. When I played Vanguard, it was exciting but I felt that some Vanguard cards were overpowering and only a few would ever be used. The idea of Casters was to be unpredictable and each card to have a power that can be used in several deck styles.
So making Vanguard cards to me would be just a little stale in itself. Not saying Vanguard cards are all bad. I've played other card games and ones where you use a character card and a deck was always fun and challenging to make a deck to bring that character's powers to the fullest. I do appreciate the question and I hope this answers it.
But the issues you raise aren't with the Vanguard mechanic - its with the existant Vanguard cards. The only thing I can see this bringing to the table is having one for race and one for class, but then, who says you can't have multiple Vanguards too?
If you think the current Vanguard cards are either overpowering or useless, make better Vanguards. But the concept in itself doesn't seem to be what your issue is with, and I'm simply saying that I don't think it warrants yet another kind of card, when they basically are Vanguards.
Pichoro: Yeah. I see your point. I just could develop better vanguard cards. I just want try a different method of how the vanguard can be done. The only other thing that I could be against (even though its just being picky) is the fact the vanguard cards are based on actual cards in the game. Caster cards are just RPG cards. They state a Race and a Class but they don't state a name. When you get a Vanguard card, you are who that card says you are. With this concept, you are who you want to be.
I was working on the alterations from what was said last time. I won't post all that I got. I'll just post four. Two Race. Two Class.
Angel
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Deck Requirement: 8 Angels
Unable to learn a Class.
Four Basic Plains or fewer: When you play your first White spell each turn, you gain X life. X is equal to the converted mana cost of that spell.
Five or more Basic Plain Lands: During your end phase, if you control an Angel, you gain 2 life for each Plains you control.
Vampire
Life Points: 23
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
Deck Requirement: 4 Swamps B2: Deal 2 damage to that creature and gain 2 life.
Four or more Black Creatures: Creatures you control has, "Whenever this creature deals damage to a creature, put a +1/+1 counter on this creature."
Archer
One Archer: (2) Deal 2 damage to target attacking creature.
Three Archers: (3) Deal 3 damage to three attacking creatures.
Five Archers: (3) Deal 5 damage to attacking or blocking creatures.
Crypt Keeper
Two to fewer Creatures in the Graveyard: When a creature you control is sent from the battlefield to the graveyard, put a 2/2 black zombie creature token onto the battlefield.
Three or more Creatures in the Graveyard: When you cast a creature spell, you may return target creature from your graveyard to your hand.
Seven or more Creatures in the Graveyard: When you cast a creature spell, return target creature from your graveyard to the battlefield.
Well i feel that to stay in RPG flavour the requierments and actual effect should really have a "big" effect than just modifications that make your deck somehow "stronger" and imba.
In Example:
Class: Fighter
Life Points : +5
Hand Limit: -1
Requierment :
- 30+ creature cards
- Less or equal to 8 non-creature, non-land cards.
Abilities:
- Creatures you control have provoke and trample
- Discard a creature card from your hand: Target creature you control gets +3/+3 and loses all abilities until end of turn. (Once in your turn, like planeswalker ability)
So by the idea, a "Fighter" uses more brute force, and is not considered "smart" like an wizard would be.
This element is displayed with the requierment for 30+ creatures and the "abilities" that push the deck for using creatures, without giving an totally imbalanced advantage (especially reducing the cost etc.)
That the fighter isnt smart in casting spells is in the 8 or less spell requierment, so you have to choose harder what you actual use in that slots, but in exchange you can have all your creatures be Giant Growth, to avoid the obvisious "double strike" etc. the creature will go in frenzy and not controll the actions it does.
The possible "taunt" of an Fighter is displayed via the "provoke" mechanic, which helps your creatures to get removal aswell and gives you big creatures trample to push against the opponent.
So this examples wants to show that:
Your class gives you abilities and changes slighty your physical body, means your life points.
Being not so smart means less hand cards.
Pretty much the opposit is a Wizard:
Class: Wizard
Life Points : -10
Hand Limit: +2
Requierment :
- Less or equal to 4 creature, land cards.
- At least 20 cards of a choosen color, and up to 5 of any other color.
- At least 20 cards of a choosen non-creature , non-land card type and up to 5 of the other types.
Abilities: Once per "Zyklus" (your turn, till your next turn) one of this abilities.
- Discard a white card: You gain 5 life.
- Discard a red card: You deal 2 damage to target player.
- Discard a blue card: Return target spell to its owners hand.
- Discard a black card: Each creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn.
- Discard a green card: Search your library for a basic land card, reveal it and put it in your hand. Shuffle your library.
- Discard an artifact card: Put an 1/1 artifact golem token onto the battlfield.
Here again Once per "Zyklus" (your turn, till your next turn) one of this abilities aswell.
- Discard three white cards: Destroy all non-white creatures.
- Discard three red cards: Destroy all artifacts or target land.
- Discard three blue cards: Gain controll of all spells.
- Discard three black cards: Each opponent discards three cards, than sacrifices three creatures for each card not discarded. (2 discarded cards = 1 sacrificed creature etc.)
- Discard three green cards: Put a green 6/6 wurm token onto the battlefield.
*So for wizard, the idea is that its actual "smart" and weak in physic. In D&D you can special one Magic and still use the others, but not that good.
You are limited by your cards and the "colors" what profession you actual want to use, you can either pull of many "small" spells or use the stronger activations, but that requiere you to focus on a color to use them more often.
It mirrors parts of D&D pretty well i think, and gives a big amount of customisation.
Theirs a lot deck building in that 2 classes allready, the "discard" allows nice interactions with "Madness" and you might use more creatures to bounce back ala "Squee" or use Unearth etc. even Demigod of Revenge might come in mind.
For the Wizard you might use "flashback" / "retrace" and such more often, or use greens All Suns Dawn , etc. as you aim for 5-color or you play Hybrid and/or Split cards to avoid the 5-color.
So many possible things, its insane, and thats only 2 classes, without any "Race" or "Sub-Class" into account.
Ofcourse you could also introduce a "Plane" thing similiar to the PlanceChase, or even introduce a "Day/night" system (i once did).
The Day/Night cycle in magic is allready a Sub-Game part i tryd to introduce in an "Un" Set (mainly because the rulez get a big stretch).
It featured mainly flip cards with a "Light" and a "Dark" part and the story was about a Plane that actual consists of 2 planes fused into another, a Light side and a Dark side, which is not limited to "white" and "black" , every color has its evil and good.
So a way is that you use a simpel rotation of Night/day , which might influence a bunch of things , like give some "Dark" creatures a boost, or really turn some creatures like Vampires unable to act during Light, or turn some Humans into a Werewolf form.
But thats just one thing, to get a "Day/Night" cycle in the game.
On the card game itself its not that easy to do, but it could be well done on MTGO versions, so the Day/Night cycle might even effect the game while its running during a turn or play of a spell, so a spell on the stack flips to its shadow part etc.
Theirs tons of possible things which make the game more and more complex, give it more RPG elements , content, flavour and a giant amount of possible ways to go.
Race: Angel
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Unable to learn a Class.
When you play your first White spell each turn, you gain X life. X is equal to the converted mana cost of that spell.
Race: Demon
Life Points: 26
Max/Starting Hand Size: 5
Unable to learn a Class.
(X)(X) Lose X life: Non-Black Creatures target player controls get -1/-1 till the end of turn. You may only spend black mana on this ability.
Race: Dragolord
Life Points: 19
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
Non-combat damage is reduce by (2).
Race: Dwarf
Life Points: 22
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Equipments cost (1) less to play.
Race: Elf
Life Points: 18
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Creature spells gain Affinity for Elf. (This spell costs (1) less to cast for each Elf you control.)
Race: Fairy
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 9
Sorcery and Instant spells gain, "Buyback (3)"
Race: Gargoyle
Life Points: 26
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
Each Non-Creature and Non-Equipment Artifact is an Artifact Gargoyle Creature with power and toughness each equal to its converted mana cost.
Race: Goblin
Life Points: 24
Max/Starting Hand Size: 5
Creatures you control gain +1/+0
Race: Human
Life Points: 20
Max/Starting Hand Size: 7
Can learn two Classes.
Race: Kithkin
Life Points: 23
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
(1) Prevent the next 1 damage done to target creature your control.
Race: Merfolk
Life Points: 22
Max/Starting Hand Size: 7
Lands you control are Islands in addition to their land type.
Race: Minotaur
Life Points: 27
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
When a creature comes onto the battlefield, you may deal 1 damage to target creature opponent controls.
Race: Shapeshifter
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 5
Spells you control gain Changeling. (This card is every creature type at all times)
Race: Sliver
Life Points: 20
Max/Starting Hand Size: 7
Creatures you control are Sliver in addition to their creature type.
Race: Vampire
Life Points: 23
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
When a creature deals combat damage to you, you may pay (2) and deal 2 damage to that creature and gain 2 life.
Class: Archer
Life Points: +0
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
(3) Deal 2 damage to target attacking creature.
Class: Beast Tamer
Life Points: +3
Max/Starting Hand Size: -2
Creature spells with mana cost 6 or greater are reduce by (2).
Class: Berserker
Life Points: +5
Max/Starting Hand Size: -3
(4) Discard a random card from your hand. Deal X damage to target opponent. X is equal the converted mana cost of the card discarded."
Class: Cleric
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
(3) Choose a color. The next time a source of your choice of the chosen color would deal damage to you this turn, prevent that damage.
Class: Crypt Keeper
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: -2
When a creature you control is sent from the battlefield to the graveyard, you may put it back on top of your library.
Class: Defender
Life Points: +4
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
Creatures you control has +0/+2.
Class: Druid
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: +1
During the end of your turn, untap two lands.
Class: Hive Queen
Life Points: +5
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
Sliver Only. (3) Put a 1/1 Colorless Sliver token onto the battlefield.
Class: Hunter
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
When you play a creature spell, you may pay (1). If you do, draw a card.
Class: Knight
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
(1) Untap target creature you control.
Class: Ninja
Life Points: -2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
Creatures you control are Ninja in addition to their creature type. Your creature spells without Ninjitsu gain: "Ninjitsu (X)-(2) (Return an unblocked attacker you control to hand: Put this card into play from your hand tapped and attacking. X is equal to the that creature's casting cost."
Class: Pirate
Life Points: -1
Max/Starting Hand Size: -3
During your draw step, you may draw an additional card and put a card from your hand to the bottom of your library.
Class: Rogue
Life Points: -3
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
Creatures you control with power 2 or less has, "When this creature deals combat damage to an opponent, that player discards a card."
Class: Samurai
Life Points: +2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
(2) Put a training counter on target creature. Creatures that have a training counter gains Bushido X and becomes a Samurai in addition to its other creature types. (When this blocks or becomes blocked, it gets +X/+X until end of turn. X is equal to the number of training counters on this creature.)
Class: Scout
Life Points: -2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
During your first three upkeeps, seach your library for a basic land and put it into play tapped.
Class: Shaman
Life Points: -2
Max/Starting Hand Size: +1
(3) Change the target(s) of target instant or sorcery spell.
Class: Soldier
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: +0
(1) Target creature you control has, "Whenever this creature becomes blocked, this creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn for each creature blocking it."
Class: Symbiote
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: -1
Sliver Only. Whenever a creature is dealt damage by a Sliver and is sent to the graveyard, return the creature to the battlefield under your control.
Class: Tinker
Life Points: -1
Max/Starting Hand Size: +2
Artifacts and Enchantments gain Flash.
Class: Warrior
Life Points: +1
Max/Starting Hand Size: -2
(1) Target creature you control gains Haste.
Class: Wizard
Life Points: -4
Max/Starting Hand Size: +3
When a player casts a spell, you may discard a spell with the same converted mana cost as that spell to counter it.
NO. This turns any creature that taps for more than one mana into a one-card "infinite" mana producer. It needs a "once per turn" restriction.
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Vanguard alone is potential broken, as they can be really annoying overpowered in decks that abuse the effect, this means even just a simpel combo deck can use a Vanguard with a high +card to get in the combo more efficient (an annoying factor that wants to be avoided by a brutal -life or something).
So overall, its a nice thing, but its just a funny thing for some trys and gets annoying in the long run.
The most funny Vanguards are the one that produce games of themself, looking for Momir and friends, this formats offer something special which i highly enjoyed (but again not for a long time, as its just a fun thing for some games).
////
However you could drive your idea a lot further if you make the idea "a lot" more customizable.
This means that a card could real:
Angel => your deck must have at least 20 angels in it.
Something like "generals" in EDH could be used aswell, for something like:
Class Summoner => You may play a "General" from outside the game.
The Class doesnt effect your hand size etc. it will just give you abilities , your values could be set by your "Race" and some randomisation , like in D&D if you create a character , you either get points to disripute or randomize them.
You could even give some classes ingame "Quest" conditions, something along :
- Have 5 or more creatures on the battlfield. => draw three cards , +2 EXP
- Have exactly 1 life => your life total becomes 20. +5 EXP
- Draw five cards during a turn. => Each opponent discards a card. +2 EXP
This Quests are "randomly" given away of pairs in 3 for example, and you can exchange 1 of them at the end of your turn , in case you can't reach it fast enough or at all.
If you fullfill the condition you gain the reward , and for example some "Exp" , you would keep and gain more and more "EXP" this way and some classes requiere more EXP to get, or you even give out some "2nd Tier" classes etc.
This things means Magic becomes slighty like an RPG , you play Magic with special characters, with conditions, quests/rewards and you gain more and more possibilities, rather than just deck building, which is like getting "Items".
I could really see such a thing made in a possible "Online" version of Magic, its an intresting thing, an highly Casual.
All this could easy include "Plane" Cards as the actual Area you play, or even give out some "Szenarios" where you play again 2 opponents, or you have a "King" to protect in an 3vs3 game (Emperor actual) but you play your normal deck and get through all this "adventures".
Examples for that:
Quest:
Protect your King against the enemies "attacking forces".
1 Player = King // King dies, game lost
2 Players = "Generals"
against
3 opponents => attacks
*Simpel Magic in the end, with a lot modifications outside the normal game rulez.
**The King can't be attacked unless a General has no creatures, more or less like the King is a "Planeswalker" card , the generals can block everything that attacks the King.
***Other Emperor like rulez.
Quest:
Protect a Ship
1 Player = you
1 Opponent = attacking opponent
1 NPC = ship
Here again, you have to protect the NPC player which is considerer the "ship", that player will play islands each turn and move forward, the goal is that the player has 20 islands in play, this means the quest will take 20 turns which it has to survive.
You could even take it further and make it that the player walks outside like in an MMORPG, and the "combat" is just made via Magic, so the possibilities get bigger and bigger with a giant amount of possible "Casual" formats that get supported to allow a big difference between each game.
Could be really really nice, but drives the game away from normal Magic and extends it with RPG elements.
MagicOnline is a thing for itself, making all this in an idea of an MMORPG is incredible but not easy to do, and its something that goes far beyond the normal "card game" that Magic currently is (and will actual be).
*But i like it a lot.
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What I was aiming for in making Casters different from Vanguard was that they can be customizable and can be a personal representation of you. When I play Magic, I see my abilities defined by my deck and draw. Luck says whether I do great or not. I like luck and I think that is what makes the game fun and challenging. I thought about making me, the player, more interactive in the game. When I played Vanguard, it was exciting but I felt that some Vanguard cards were overpowering and only a few would ever be used. The idea of Casters was to be unpredictable and each card to have a power that can be used in several deck styles.
So making Vanguard cards to me would be just a little stale in itself. Not saying Vanguard cards are all bad. I've played other card games and ones where you use a character card and a deck was always fun and challenging to make a deck to bring that character's powers to the fullest. I do appreciate the question and I hope this answers it.
TheOnlyOne652089:
I do appreciate your insight on these cards. I always believe in starting simple and then advancing on them. What you have said made me realize that how far I could go. I'll work on them more. I'll cut the alteration on hand and life created by class cards and focus on the abilities being a little more dependent on what type of deck you use. I'll post what I put together. I'll even consider the quest cards as a random deck.
But the issues you raise aren't with the Vanguard mechanic - its with the existant Vanguard cards. The only thing I can see this bringing to the table is having one for race and one for class, but then, who says you can't have multiple Vanguards too?
If you think the current Vanguard cards are either overpowering or useless, make better Vanguards. But the concept in itself doesn't seem to be what your issue is with, and I'm simply saying that I don't think it warrants yet another kind of card, when they basically are Vanguards.
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I was working on the alterations from what was said last time. I won't post all that I got. I'll just post four. Two Race. Two Class.
Angel
Life Points: 17
Max/Starting Hand Size: 8
Deck Requirement: 8 Angels
Unable to learn a Class.
Four Basic Plains or fewer: When you play your first White spell each turn, you gain X life. X is equal to the converted mana cost of that spell.
Five or more Basic Plain Lands: During your end phase, if you control an Angel, you gain 2 life for each Plains you control.
Vampire
Life Points: 23
Max/Starting Hand Size: 6
Deck Requirement: 4 Swamps
B2: Deal 2 damage to that creature and gain 2 life.
Four or more Black Creatures: Creatures you control has, "Whenever this creature deals damage to a creature, put a +1/+1 counter on this creature."
Archer
One Archer: (2) Deal 2 damage to target attacking creature.
Three Archers: (3) Deal 3 damage to three attacking creatures.
Five Archers: (3) Deal 5 damage to attacking or blocking creatures.
Crypt Keeper
Two to fewer Creatures in the Graveyard: When a creature you control is sent from the battlefield to the graveyard, put a 2/2 black zombie creature token onto the battlefield.
Three or more Creatures in the Graveyard: When you cast a creature spell, you may return target creature from your graveyard to your hand.
Seven or more Creatures in the Graveyard: When you cast a creature spell, return target creature from your graveyard to the battlefield.
In Example:
Class: Fighter
Life Points : +5
Hand Limit: -1
Requierment :
- 30+ creature cards
- Less or equal to 8 non-creature, non-land cards.
Abilities:
- Creatures you control have provoke and trample
- Discard a creature card from your hand: Target creature you control gets +3/+3 and loses all abilities until end of turn. (Once in your turn, like planeswalker ability)
So by the idea, a "Fighter" uses more brute force, and is not considered "smart" like an wizard would be.
This element is displayed with the requierment for 30+ creatures and the "abilities" that push the deck for using creatures, without giving an totally imbalanced advantage (especially reducing the cost etc.)
That the fighter isnt smart in casting spells is in the 8 or less spell requierment, so you have to choose harder what you actual use in that slots, but in exchange you can have all your creatures be Giant Growth, to avoid the obvisious "double strike" etc. the creature will go in frenzy and not controll the actions it does.
The possible "taunt" of an Fighter is displayed via the "provoke" mechanic, which helps your creatures to get removal aswell and gives you big creatures trample to push against the opponent.
So this examples wants to show that:
Your class gives you abilities and changes slighty your physical body, means your life points.
Being not so smart means less hand cards.
Pretty much the opposit is a Wizard:
Class: Wizard
Life Points : -10
Hand Limit: +2
Requierment :
- Less or equal to 4 creature, land cards.
- At least 20 cards of a choosen color, and up to 5 of any other color.
- At least 20 cards of a choosen non-creature , non-land card type and up to 5 of the other types.
Abilities:
Once per "Zyklus" (your turn, till your next turn) one of this abilities.
- Discard a white card: You gain 5 life.
- Discard a red card: You deal 2 damage to target player.
- Discard a blue card: Return target spell to its owners hand.
- Discard a black card: Each creature gets -1/-1 until end of turn.
- Discard a green card: Search your library for a basic land card, reveal it and put it in your hand. Shuffle your library.
- Discard an artifact card: Put an 1/1 artifact golem token onto the battlfield.
Here again Once per "Zyklus" (your turn, till your next turn) one of this abilities aswell.
- Discard three white cards: Destroy all non-white creatures.
- Discard three red cards: Destroy all artifacts or target land.
- Discard three blue cards: Gain controll of all spells.
- Discard three black cards: Each opponent discards three cards, than sacrifices three creatures for each card not discarded. (2 discarded cards = 1 sacrificed creature etc.)
- Discard three green cards: Put a green 6/6 wurm token onto the battlefield.
*So for wizard, the idea is that its actual "smart" and weak in physic. In D&D you can special one Magic and still use the others, but not that good.
You are limited by your cards and the "colors" what profession you actual want to use, you can either pull of many "small" spells or use the stronger activations, but that requiere you to focus on a color to use them more often.
It mirrors parts of D&D pretty well i think, and gives a big amount of customisation.
Theirs a lot deck building in that 2 classes allready, the "discard" allows nice interactions with "Madness" and you might use more creatures to bounce back ala "Squee" or use Unearth etc. even Demigod of Revenge might come in mind.
For the Wizard you might use "flashback" / "retrace" and such more often, or use greens All Suns Dawn , etc. as you aim for 5-color or you play Hybrid and/or Split cards to avoid the 5-color.
So many possible things, its insane, and thats only 2 classes, without any "Race" or "Sub-Class" into account.
Ofcourse you could also introduce a "Plane" thing similiar to the PlanceChase, or even introduce a "Day/night" system (i once did).
The Day/Night cycle in magic is allready a Sub-Game part i tryd to introduce in an "Un" Set (mainly because the rulez get a big stretch).
It featured mainly flip cards with a "Light" and a "Dark" part and the story was about a Plane that actual consists of 2 planes fused into another, a Light side and a Dark side, which is not limited to "white" and "black" , every color has its evil and good.
So a way is that you use a simpel rotation of Night/day , which might influence a bunch of things , like give some "Dark" creatures a boost, or really turn some creatures like Vampires unable to act during Light, or turn some Humans into a Werewolf form.
But thats just one thing, to get a "Day/Night" cycle in the game.
On the card game itself its not that easy to do, but it could be well done on MTGO versions, so the Day/Night cycle might even effect the game while its running during a turn or play of a spell, so a spell on the stack flips to its shadow part etc.
Theirs tons of possible things which make the game more and more complex, give it more RPG elements , content, flavour and a giant amount of possible ways to go.
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