Thread title chosen to piss off every clan member in at least one way, including myself!
#6) [thread=16631][Ivory Tower]: Cartesianally Coordinated[/thread]
#5) [thread=12215][Ivory Tower]: Stylistically Singular[/thread]
#4) [thread=8781][Ivory Tower] was a book before it was a movie.[/thread]
#3) [thread=5600][Ivory Tower] on a Hill[/thread]
#2) [thread=2560][Ivory Tower] Ascend and Transcend[/thread]
#1) [thread=273][Ivory Tower] clan formation[/thread]
Members (max 15):
T2sux- Cameron (Founder)
Goblinboy- Nick (Leader)
Senori- Ethan
r@sputin - Art
Denver
ljossberir- Matt
Prizm- Herbert
bardo_trout - Dan
Mono-G
Mach1
The Blue Wizard - Justin
Dervish Lieutenant
Reality Twister
Furor - Nick
extremestan - (i dunno maybe his name is Stan? )
As always, here are the last four posts on the thread to stimulate continued discussion:
Quote from bardo_trout »
Quote from Denver »
You know what cures insomnia, right?
Alcohol or Pot.
Both.
@ T2 - I'll answer your post a little later. Just got to work and I'm leaving early for training in Salem later.
Busy, busy, busy.
Quote from T2sux »
Bardo: Can't wait I'll be very much looking forward to it.
I'm supposed to be writing an essay right now. Instead, I'm forum-hopping. My teacher keeps glaring at me from across the room, so I keep minimizing this screen and opening a document, on which I am pretending to work.
Meh. I suppose I should get back to work. British literature sucks.
Quote from Furor »
Quote from T2Sux »
British literature sucks
Clearly, you've never had the crap beaten out of you. Were that the case, you wouldn't be spouting bull**** like this.
Luckily, I may have a solution. *steps forward menacingly*
Quote from TheBlueWizard »
British literature I can handle (except Austen). British poetry...specifically British renaissance poetry...makes me gag. Shakespeare is okay. Shakespeare gets you chicks...
I used to watch Blind Date during dinner before I discovered Seinfeld was on a different channel at the same time. That show deliberately put mismatches together.
Ah, first post. And what a title! Sure to offend everyone. Me too, of course, but that's half the fun!
Of course I don't really hate Brit lit. That was just a bit of adolescent rage. I don't admire Jane Austen, or Charles Dickens, but I do enjoy my Shakespeare.
WHY don't you admire Charles Dickens? I can understand the aversion to Austen. A disdain for Jane Austen seems to be drilled into every North American schoolchild for no reason that I can see, but I accept that it's there.
But how on earth can you make such a claim against Dickens? The man is incredible.
(Also, a note for Goblinboy; you can put my name next to Furor; it is Nick as well. Seems to be a number of Nicks about.)
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Then loom'd his streaming majesty From out that wine-dark fog, And spake he unto all our crew: "Go forth, and read my blog."
WHY don't you admire Charles Dickens? I can understand the aversion to Austen. A disdain for Jane Austen seems to be drilled into every North American schoolchild for no reason that I can see, but I accept that it's there.
But how on earth can you make such a claim against Dickens? The man is incredible.
Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against him, per se. I actually enjoyed A Tale of Two Cities. But his style bothers me. Too prolix. See my liking for Hemingway.
I'm going to take this opportunity to add the thread back to my signature. Woo.
New thread. We should have a Rotating Order of Thread Starters or something.
Something about Dickens' style bothers me. The stories are engaging, but there's just something missing.
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Sing lustily and with good courage.
Be aware of singing as if you were half dead,
or half asleep:
but lift your voice with strength.
Be no more afraid of your voice now,
nor more ashamed of its being heard,
than when you sang the songs of Satan.
Have any of you heard of Reed College, in Portland, Oregon? Their school credo is Atheism - Communism - Free Love. . . what a great place
Their Rennefayre is especially pleasant on the drugs + debauchery tip The last one I attended, I missed most of the Calvin + Hobbes-themed glow opera because when my mushrooms kicked in, I suddenly had to pee really bad, + it took me forever to crawl through all the people lurking in the dark between my seat in the amphitheatre + the campus post office bathroom. I came back to see a blacklit Hobbes thrashing about to "Wild Thing" @_@ + then it was over.
Apparently. In what way do you disagree with my statement?
In the most basic possible way. I do not consider it possible for an informed reader to assert that Dickens is more prolix than Hemingway.
I'm afraid I don't understand.
It's a snippy sort of way of saying that Mr. Hemingway's writing leaves much to be desired.
Quote from Tanthalas »
Nick (as in Furor - maybe you should go with second initials?), you can add me to your list as well - I don't like Austen at all.
As to my name, you can use whatever you like. Nick M., Furor, Gisgo, whatever.
Whilst I accept that her work still has great relevance today, something about her style irritates me. Of course, this wasn't helped by having to study Pride and Prejudice (her worst book, IMO) at school. But even Emma and Northanger Abbey, which were much better, didn't really do anything for me.
Your objection to her seems to be a fairly common one. Most of the people who "hate" Jane Austen eventually backpedal to "not really hating her, in fact BOOK X was good," to eventually saying "there's just something about her that irritates me." While I utterly condemn the academic merit of such an argument, it appears to be simply a matter of taste.
I would posit that what people "don't like" about her, possibly, is that she is not Feminist enough. I find it thrilling.
Dickens, however, I'm with you on. The fact that everyone has to study Shakespeare while Dickens is left on the shelf is no less than a crime against literature.
Indeed. I would also suggest that putting so much emphasis on the genre of the play is not particularly worthwhile. Narrative exposition is the beating heart of literature, and it seems ridiculous to venerate above all others the form that has as little of it as possible. Some plays try to include it, but it never works very well. This is a reason, for example, why adaptations of books onto the screen or stage are often so terrible. Consider the recent Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, the best part of which book was Adams' own description of things. They tried to capture it; they failed. It was still enjoyable, in a general sense, but by no means mind-blowing.
Personally, I'd rather have people study Hardy, but then I suppose exposing large numbers of impressionable and hormonally imbalanced teenagers to relentless depression might not be a great idea.
I think Hardy is a worthy subject for a University-level student of English. High Schoolers just wouldn't get him, I think.
A Hardy-related anecdote, for you:
Quote from Gilbert Chesterton »
The first great Victorian I ever met, I met very early, though only for a brief interview: Thomas Hardy. I was then a quite obscure and shabby young writer awaiting an interview with a publisher. And the really remarkable thing about Hardy was this; that he might have been himself an obscure and shabby young writer awaiting a publisher; even a new writer awaiting his first publisher.
Yet he was already famous everywhere; he had written his first and finest novels culminating in Tess; he had expressed his queer personal pessimism in the famous passage about the President of the Immortals. He had already the wrinkle of worry on his elfish face that might have made a man look old; and yet, in some strange way, he seemed to me very young. If I say as young as I was, I mean as simply pragmatical and even priggish as I was. He did not even avoid the topic of his alleged pessimism; he defended it, but somehow with the innocence of a boys' debating-club. In short, he was in a sort of gentle fuss about his pessimism, just as I was about my optimism.
He said something like this: "I know people say I'm a pessimist; but I don't believe I am naturally; I like a lot of things so much; but I could never get over the idea that it would be better for us to be without both the pleasures and the pains; and that the best experience would be some sort of sleep." I have always had a weakness for arguing with anybody; and this involved all that contemporary nihilism against which I was then in revolt; and for about five minutes, in a publisher's office, I actually argued with Thomas Hardy.
I argued that nonexistence is not an experience; and there can be no question of preferring it or being satisfied with it. Honestly, if I had been quite simply a crude young man, and nothing else, I should have thought his whole argument very superficial and even silly. But I did not think him either superficial or silly.
For this was the rather tremendous truth about Hardy; that he had humility. My friends who knew him better have confirmed my early impression; Jack Squire told me that Hardy in his last days of glory as a Grand Old Man would send poems to the Mercury and offer to alter or withdraw them if they were not suitable. He defied the gods and dared the lightning and all the rest of it; but the great Greeks would have seen that there was no thunderbolt for him, because he had not hubris or insolence. For what heaven hates is not impiety but the pride of impiety. Hardy was blasphemous but he was not proud; and it is pride that is a sin and not blasphemy.
I have been blamed for an alleged attack on Hardy, in a sketch of Victorian literature; it was apparently supposed that talking about the village atheist brooding on the village idiot was some sort of attack. But this is not an attack on Hardy; this is the defence of Hardy. The whole case for him is that he had the sincerity and simplicity of the village atheist; that is, that he valued atheism as a truth and not a triumph. He was the victim of that decay of our agricultural culture, which gave men bad religion and no philosophy. But he was right in saying, as he said essentially to me all those years ago, that he could enjoy things, including better philosophy or religion. There came back to me four lines, written by an Irish lady in my own little paper:
Who can picture the scene at the starry portals?
Truly, imagination fails,
When the pitiless President of the Immortals
Shows unto Thomas the print of the nails?
I hope it is not profane to say that this hits the right nail on the head. In such a case, the second Thomas would do exactly what Prometheus and Satan never thought of doing; he would pity God.
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Then loom'd his streaming majesty From out that wine-dark fog, And spake he unto all our crew: "Go forth, and read my blog."
I just never found that any of Jane Austen's books connected with me. With novels that I enjoy, something (whether it be plot, style, characters) draws me into them and makes me want to continue reading. None of Austen's works which I've read had that X-factor to them. My initial post wasn't particularly clear - I didn't particularly enjoy Emma or Northanger Abbey, I simply enjoyed P&P even less. I certainly don't hate her, though - if I did, I wouldn't have read more than 1 or 2 of her works.
Yes, that initial X Factor is important. I think it would be worthwhile to try to objectively determine what that factor is, someday.
It's possible that the lack of feminism (by modern standards) is one of the features of her work that distances me from it - that, by our standards, she is tame, yet is held up as revolutionary (which she undoubtedly was, when you are detached from her work, yet seems less so when you are actually reading it). Yet I don't think a relatively minor detail such as this would completely explain my disliking of her - especially as overt feminism tends to anger me.
Well, the typical English student has been raised on a steady diet of in-your-face Feminism (most Arts students, actually), and it is often disconcerting to read books that portray the women as being just as ridiculous and worthless as the men. The most admirable characters in Austen's books are men. The least admirable are women.
When you really get down to it (and I agree that it has little in the way of academic meaning), it's possibly down to a simple failure to connect. Many great works in various fields of the arts do not appeal to me; it is by no means implausible that the collected works of Jane Austen fall into this category.
Do you have a similar reaction to other works by women? It seems unlikely, but it's worth examining.
I agree that overstressing the importance of the play is a severe disservice to literature. To my mind, a play is somewhat like a recipe - it provides the basic ingredients from which an expert can improvise and improve. The real essence of plays comes in the performance, rather than in the literature.
Exactly. I have no objection to watching Shakespeare; in fact I encourage it wholeheartedly. Merely reading him, though, leaves much to be desired. He is a genius of blank verse, it's true, but that it not always enough.
Personally, I don't really enjoy plays very much, whether read or performed (with the exception of Goldsmith's She Stoops to Conquer), but I do recognize their importance.
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Then loom'd his streaming majesty From out that wine-dark fog, And spake he unto all our crew: "Go forth, and read my blog."
Have any of you heard of Reed College, in Portland, Oregon? Their school credo is Atheism - Communism - Free Love. . . what a great place
Reed? Why would anyone attend such a silly school?
Quote from Furor »
A Hardy-related anecdote, for you:
That was fairly interesting. Any Hardy recommendations?
Quote from Furor »
Exactly. I have no objection to watching Shakespeare; in fact I encourage it wholeheartedly. Merely reading him, though, leaves much to be desired. He is a genius of blank verse, it's true, but that it not always enough.
I agree totally. I was soured on Shakespeare for years and refused to see his plays because my first exposure was in a class in which the teacher told us that watching the play or a movie version while reading our school copies of Romeo and Juliet would result in a failure for the unit. Then I saw Midsummer Night's Dream on stage and gave a big "ohhhhhh so THAT'S why it's supposed to be good."
Speaking of Midsummer Night's Dream, is it true in other places, like here, that nobody ever performs any of the other Shakespearian plays? Something like the last five times I've seen Shakespeare on stage it's been Midsummer because that's all anybody ever wants to put on. I'm so damn tired of that play.
@Austen:
I've completely hated all Austen I've come into contact with. Like I said on the other thread, it's not that I think she's all that bad as an author (though a bit dry), it's just that I despise with a deep satisfying ire every character in every book. All the men and all the women seem petty, uninteresting, self-important, and overblown. It reminds me of the middle school social landscape, really, but with more money. The fact that exposure to, say, Emma (the character) makes me want to scream in rage is probably a compliment to Austen, but it certainly doesn't make me want to keep reading.
So, I went down to the Barnes & Noble today. Let me just say - this bookstore sucks. It's HUGE but it is filled with a bunch of worthless crap. To give you an idea, let me just say this: the New Age section is over 3x larger than the Philosophy section. The Science section has some Dawkins, some Einstein, some Hawkings and that is about it.
I did manage to pick up some classics that I have never read though and that is always good. I can't believe I haven't read any of these already, my life is a waste! Oh well. My list:
Rousseau - The Social Contract
Marcus Aurelius - Meditations
Thoreau - Walden and Civil Disobedience
Jefferson - Basic Writings
Dante - The Inferno
And right now I'm watching Pi. Anyone seen this before? It rocks.
Quote from T2sux »
Yepperz! I plan on going there next fall.
You'll be going to school with a bunch of damned hippies? *sigh*
And now for something entirely different: is it true that extra weight "insulates" the body, making it warmer? I've heard this claim a number of times but I have never been able to verify it.
So, I went down to the Barnes & Noble today. Let me just say - this bookstore sucks.
Well, oftentimes the register clerks are really cute. Bookstores a real lure to young pseudo-intellectual women who can find easy work in the retail sector. Both otherwise, B&N ****ing blows.
Quote from Ljossberir »
is it true that extra weight "insulates" the body, making it warmer?
The heat capacity for body fat is much lower (or higher?) than bone and skin, so yes, I think so. But extra weight also allows big people to regulate their internal heat much better than people like me. I'm as skinny as a bean pole (never been over 125 lbs), but in hot weather, my organs and whatnot are so close to the surface of my skin, I think I get a lot hotter and have a harder time cooling down than people twice my weight.
Anyway, it's something to think about.
@ T2 - You know Goblinboy goes to Reed, right?
@ Ljoss - That's an awesome list of books there, but no Bakunin? or Rocker?
I'm at Portland State University myself. But I work here and only occasionally take classes.
So, I went down to the Barnes & Noble today. Let me just say - this bookstore sucks. It's HUGE but it is filled with a bunch of worthless crap. To give you an idea, let me just say this: the New Age section is over 3x larger than the Philosophy section. The Science section has some Dawkins, some Einstein, some Hawkings and that is about it.
Ours is the same, except that the science section is big. But New Age > Philosophy.
Rousseau - The Social Contract
Marcus Aurelius - Meditations
Thoreau - Walden and Civil Disobedience
Jefferson - Basic Writings
Dante - The Inferno
All good, though I've never read much of Jefferson, outside of the DoI.
You'll be going to school with a bunch of damned hippies? *sigh*
Yep Can't wait
Quote from bardo »
@ T2 - You know Goblinboy goes to Reed, right?
Yeah. If I go, I get to stalk someone!! I mean..um...I get to know someone. Freudian slip.
If you think she's a fine looking dog, check out my amazing Australian Cattle Dog, Jarvis. Yes, that's my daughter's butt under his head. No trick photography here, he's a two-faced dog.
One of the more edgier English teachers I have had threatened playfully (I hope) to make me write an essay analyzing all the symbolism in Dante's Inferno. I think I would have cried if he did =p
UC Berkeley is like Reeds Southern California then. Hooray for hippies!
As I'm in a classical literature kick at the moment, and to help study for the AP Lit Exam I have in May, I have made myself a list of books to read by that time to deal with any of the "open essays" they can throw at me. If any of you know other books I should add, please add. Keep in mind high school novels are not usually good anyway, so I may have to swallow reading something like Wuthering Heights:
Don Quixote
David Copperfield
A Tale of Two Cities
Crime and Punishment
The Sound and the Fury (ugh, Faulkner)
Of Mice and Men
The Turn of the Screw
A Portrait of the Artist
Candide
Medea
The Crucible
Antigone
A Streetcar Named Desire
Looks like I have my evenings planned for a while.
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"I never allowed my schooling to interfere with my education" -Mark Twain
Quote from hybrid life »
The war is for oil..its one of the ways to make this huge operation worthwhile. People care more about lower gas prices than iraqis anyway.
What others say about me:
Quote from JayC »
You're obviously an ignorant conservative. I blame your hill-billy Mom and Dad.
I take it you've read Swift's works (Gulliver's Travels and Tale of a Tub, for example)?
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Sing lustily and with good courage.
Be aware of singing as if you were half dead,
or half asleep:
but lift your voice with strength.
Be no more afraid of your voice now,
nor more ashamed of its being heard,
than when you sang the songs of Satan.
Don Quixote
David Copperfield
A Tale of Two Cities
Crime and Punishment
The Sound and the Fury (ugh, Faulkner)
Of Mice and Men
The Turn of the Screw
A Portrait of the Artist
Candide
Medea
The Crucible
Antigone
A Streetcar Named Desire
The Brothers Karamazov (Dostoyevsky) is the only book anyone ever really needs to read. I'd add that. But I'd certainly add The Stranger to your list as well.
But the "best book ever" is clearly Proust's À la Recherche du Temps Perdu. No ****ing contest. But I'd really wait to read that until you're in your mid-20s/early-30s.
#6) [thread=16631][Ivory Tower]: Cartesianally Coordinated[/thread]
#5) [thread=12215][Ivory Tower]: Stylistically Singular[/thread]
#4) [thread=8781][Ivory Tower] was a book before it was a movie.[/thread]
#3) [thread=5600][Ivory Tower] on a Hill[/thread]
#2) [thread=2560][Ivory Tower] Ascend and Transcend[/thread]
#1) [thread=273][Ivory Tower] clan formation[/thread]
Members (max 15):
T2sux- Cameron (Founder)
Goblinboy- Nick (Leader)
Senori- Ethan
r@sputin - Art
Denver
ljossberir- Matt
Prizm- Herbert
bardo_trout - Dan
Mono-G
Mach1
The Blue Wizard - Justin
Dervish Lieutenant
Reality Twister
Furor - Nick
extremestan - (i dunno maybe his name is Stan? )
Friends:
Solace
Nemata
Onikani
Tanthalas- Craig
Stax- James
SorryGuy
Craniumuser
WarEmblem
As always, here are the last four posts on the thread to stimulate continued discussion:
-Goblinboy
Of course I don't really hate Brit lit. That was just a bit of adolescent rage. I don't admire Jane Austen, or Charles Dickens, but I do enjoy my Shakespeare.
I should go to bed. I won't, but I should.
Again...FIRST POST!!
But how on earth can you make such a claim against Dickens? The man is incredible.
(Also, a note for Goblinboy; you can put my name next to Furor; it is Nick as well. Seems to be a number of Nicks about.)
From out that wine-dark fog,
And spake he unto all our crew:
"Go forth, and read my blog."
From out that wine-dark fog,
And spake he unto all our crew:
"Go forth, and read my blog."
New thread. We should have a Rotating Order of Thread Starters or something.
Something about Dickens' style bothers me. The stories are engaging, but there's just something missing.
Be aware of singing as if you were half dead,
or half asleep:
but lift your voice with strength.
Be no more afraid of your voice now,
nor more ashamed of its being heard,
than when you sang the songs of Satan.
Have any of you heard of Reed College, in Portland, Oregon? Their school credo is Atheism - Communism - Free Love. . . what a great place
Their Rennefayre is especially pleasant on the drugs + debauchery tip The last one I attended, I missed most of the Calvin + Hobbes-themed glow opera because when my mushrooms kicked in, I suddenly had to pee really bad, + it took me forever to crawl through all the people lurking in the dark between my seat in the amphitheatre + the campus post office bathroom. I came back to see a blacklit Hobbes thrashing about to "Wild Thing" @_@ + then it was over.
Anyway. Felt like sharing, free love + all.
In the most basic possible way. I do not consider it possible for an informed reader to assert that Dickens is more prolix than Hemingway.
It's a snippy sort of way of saying that Mr. Hemingway's writing leaves much to be desired.
As to my name, you can use whatever you like. Nick M., Furor, Gisgo, whatever.
Your objection to her seems to be a fairly common one. Most of the people who "hate" Jane Austen eventually backpedal to "not really hating her, in fact BOOK X was good," to eventually saying "there's just something about her that irritates me." While I utterly condemn the academic merit of such an argument, it appears to be simply a matter of taste.
I would posit that what people "don't like" about her, possibly, is that she is not Feminist enough. I find it thrilling.
Indeed. I would also suggest that putting so much emphasis on the genre of the play is not particularly worthwhile. Narrative exposition is the beating heart of literature, and it seems ridiculous to venerate above all others the form that has as little of it as possible. Some plays try to include it, but it never works very well. This is a reason, for example, why adaptations of books onto the screen or stage are often so terrible. Consider the recent Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy, the best part of which book was Adams' own description of things. They tried to capture it; they failed. It was still enjoyable, in a general sense, but by no means mind-blowing.
I think Hardy is a worthy subject for a University-level student of English. High Schoolers just wouldn't get him, I think.
A Hardy-related anecdote, for you:
The first great Victorian I ever met, I met very early, though only for a brief interview: Thomas Hardy. I was then a quite obscure and shabby young writer awaiting an interview with a publisher. And the really remarkable thing about Hardy was this; that he might have been himself an obscure and shabby young writer awaiting a publisher; even a new writer awaiting his first publisher.
Yet he was already famous everywhere; he had written his first and finest novels culminating in Tess; he had expressed his queer personal pessimism in the famous passage about the President of the Immortals. He had already the wrinkle of worry on his elfish face that might have made a man look old; and yet, in some strange way, he seemed to me very young. If I say as young as I was, I mean as simply pragmatical and even priggish as I was. He did not even avoid the topic of his alleged pessimism; he defended it, but somehow with the innocence of a boys' debating-club. In short, he was in a sort of gentle fuss about his pessimism, just as I was about my optimism.
He said something like this: "I know people say I'm a pessimist; but I don't believe I am naturally; I like a lot of things so much; but I could never get over the idea that it would be better for us to be without both the pleasures and the pains; and that the best experience would be some sort of sleep." I have always had a weakness for arguing with anybody; and this involved all that contemporary nihilism against which I was then in revolt; and for about five minutes, in a publisher's office, I actually argued with Thomas Hardy.
I argued that nonexistence is not an experience; and there can be no question of preferring it or being satisfied with it. Honestly, if I had been quite simply a crude young man, and nothing else, I should have thought his whole argument very superficial and even silly. But I did not think him either superficial or silly.
For this was the rather tremendous truth about Hardy; that he had humility. My friends who knew him better have confirmed my early impression; Jack Squire told me that Hardy in his last days of glory as a Grand Old Man would send poems to the Mercury and offer to alter or withdraw them if they were not suitable. He defied the gods and dared the lightning and all the rest of it; but the great Greeks would have seen that there was no thunderbolt for him, because he had not hubris or insolence. For what heaven hates is not impiety but the pride of impiety. Hardy was blasphemous but he was not proud; and it is pride that is a sin and not blasphemy.
I have been blamed for an alleged attack on Hardy, in a sketch of Victorian literature; it was apparently supposed that talking about the village atheist brooding on the village idiot was some sort of attack. But this is not an attack on Hardy; this is the defence of Hardy. The whole case for him is that he had the sincerity and simplicity of the village atheist; that is, that he valued atheism as a truth and not a triumph. He was the victim of that decay of our agricultural culture, which gave men bad religion and no philosophy. But he was right in saying, as he said essentially to me all those years ago, that he could enjoy things, including better philosophy or religion. There came back to me four lines, written by an Irish lady in my own little paper:
Who can picture the scene at the starry portals?
Truly, imagination fails,
When the pitiless President of the Immortals
Shows unto Thomas the print of the nails?
I hope it is not profane to say that this hits the right nail on the head. In such a case, the second Thomas would do exactly what Prometheus and Satan never thought of doing; he would pity God.
From out that wine-dark fog,
And spake he unto all our crew:
"Go forth, and read my blog."
Yes, that initial X Factor is important. I think it would be worthwhile to try to objectively determine what that factor is, someday.
Well, the typical English student has been raised on a steady diet of in-your-face Feminism (most Arts students, actually), and it is often disconcerting to read books that portray the women as being just as ridiculous and worthless as the men. The most admirable characters in Austen's books are men. The least admirable are women.
Do you have a similar reaction to other works by women? It seems unlikely, but it's worth examining.
Exactly. I have no objection to watching Shakespeare; in fact I encourage it wholeheartedly. Merely reading him, though, leaves much to be desired. He is a genius of blank verse, it's true, but that it not always enough.
Personally, I don't really enjoy plays very much, whether read or performed (with the exception of Goldsmith's She Stoops to Conquer), but I do recognize their importance.
From out that wine-dark fog,
And spake he unto all our crew:
"Go forth, and read my blog."
I just want to go on record and say that neither communism, nor atheism, nor free love offends me. But I'm not the judgemental sort.
Puppy update. After one week of living with us, ads in the Oregonian, etc. we finally reuinted our found stray dog with her family.
Her name was Meeka
She lives on the second floor
She lives upstairs from you
Yes, I think you've seen her before.
Erm. Her name was Meeka and I'm not a huge fan of Suzanne Vega...
Anyway, I live in a single-story ranch as well. Though there's an attic... I suppose.
Attached is a picture of her.
I spent yesterday afternoon Salem. Pretty depressing really.
Anyway, I'm back. Hi.
Edit - Check out those sexy "Salmon Shade" cabinets. I painted them.
- Bardo Trout, more of a home improvement guy than I realized.
That was fairly interesting. Any Hardy recommendations?
I agree totally. I was soured on Shakespeare for years and refused to see his plays because my first exposure was in a class in which the teacher told us that watching the play or a movie version while reading our school copies of Romeo and Juliet would result in a failure for the unit. Then I saw Midsummer Night's Dream on stage and gave a big "ohhhhhh so THAT'S why it's supposed to be good."
Speaking of Midsummer Night's Dream, is it true in other places, like here, that nobody ever performs any of the other Shakespearian plays? Something like the last five times I've seen Shakespeare on stage it's been Midsummer because that's all anybody ever wants to put on. I'm so damn tired of that play.
@Austen:
I've completely hated all Austen I've come into contact with. Like I said on the other thread, it's not that I think she's all that bad as an author (though a bit dry), it's just that I despise with a deep satisfying ire every character in every book. All the men and all the women seem petty, uninteresting, self-important, and overblown. It reminds me of the middle school social landscape, really, but with more money. The fact that exposure to, say, Emma (the character) makes me want to scream in rage is probably a compliment to Austen, but it certainly doesn't make me want to keep reading.
-Goblinboy
Just so you know, we don't take kindly to fat-cat plutocratic capitalist pigs in these parts Cameron.
Try the University of Chicago instead... You'll fit right in.
Psh. If I'm going to do that, I may as well just pack up and go to Austria
So, I went down to the Barnes & Noble today. Let me just say - this bookstore sucks. It's HUGE but it is filled with a bunch of worthless crap. To give you an idea, let me just say this: the New Age section is over 3x larger than the Philosophy section. The Science section has some Dawkins, some Einstein, some Hawkings and that is about it.
I did manage to pick up some classics that I have never read though and that is always good. I can't believe I haven't read any of these already, my life is a waste! Oh well. My list:
Rousseau - The Social Contract
Marcus Aurelius - Meditations
Thoreau - Walden and Civil Disobedience
Jefferson - Basic Writings
Dante - The Inferno
And right now I'm watching Pi. Anyone seen this before? It rocks.
You'll be going to school with a bunch of damned hippies? *sigh*
And now for something entirely different: is it true that extra weight "insulates" the body, making it warmer? I've heard this claim a number of times but I have never been able to verify it.
The heat capacity for body fat is much lower (or higher?) than bone and skin, so yes, I think so. But extra weight also allows big people to regulate their internal heat much better than people like me. I'm as skinny as a bean pole (never been over 125 lbs), but in hot weather, my organs and whatnot are so close to the surface of my skin, I think I get a lot hotter and have a harder time cooling down than people twice my weight.
Anyway, it's something to think about.
@ T2 - You know Goblinboy goes to Reed, right?
@ Ljoss - That's an awesome list of books there, but no Bakunin? or Rocker?
I'm at Portland State University myself. But I work here and only occasionally take classes.
If you think she's a fine looking dog, check out my amazing Australian Cattle Dog, Jarvis. Yes, that's my daughter's butt under his head. No trick photography here, he's a two-faced dog.
He even has a page at oddtodd.
UC Berkeley is like Reeds Southern California then. Hooray for hippies!
As I'm in a classical literature kick at the moment, and to help study for the AP Lit Exam I have in May, I have made myself a list of books to read by that time to deal with any of the "open essays" they can throw at me. If any of you know other books I should add, please add. Keep in mind high school novels are not usually good anyway, so I may have to swallow reading something like Wuthering Heights:
Don Quixote
David Copperfield
A Tale of Two Cities
Crime and Punishment
The Sound and the Fury (ugh, Faulkner)
Of Mice and Men
The Turn of the Screw
A Portrait of the Artist
Candide
Medea
The Crucible
Antigone
A Streetcar Named Desire
Looks like I have my evenings planned for a while.
What others say about me:
Sven Dostei
Unofficial Official arrogant teenage elitist of The Ivory Tower
Be aware of singing as if you were half dead,
or half asleep:
but lift your voice with strength.
Be no more afraid of your voice now,
nor more ashamed of its being heard,
than when you sang the songs of Satan.
The Brothers Karamazov (Dostoyevsky) is the only book anyone ever really needs to read. I'd add that. But I'd certainly add The Stranger to your list as well.
But the "best book ever" is clearly Proust's À la Recherche du Temps Perdu. No ****ing contest. But I'd really wait to read that until you're in your mid-20s/early-30s.