Apparently Wizards of the Coast own the patent to strategic trading card games. Supposedly the reason why other trading card games with similar mechanics have to pay royalties and a patent infringement fee to Wizard of the Coast.
It's a huge crutch on the industry. Wizards of the Coast is effectively monopolizing the TCG market by owning that kind of patent. This inhibits the growth and expansion of the industry as small games are forced to pay off Wizards in order to have their game even created. If you want to know why TCGs are dying, this is probably one of the causes.
The current economic crisis and the Recession doesn't help it that much either, thus people not having enough money to pay for royalties to Wizards in order for their TCG's to get patented by WoTC. That could explain the lack of new TCG/CCG's being released prior to 2004 which was 6 years ago and why more and more people are possibly jumping into MMORPG's and Online games such as World of Warcraft.
As a holder of the patent, Wizards of the Coast has requested that all trading card game publishers license the mechanics described in the patent, usually for a royalty fee based on total sales.
In October 2003, Wizards of the Coast filed suit against Nintendo and related companies in U.S. District Court in Seattle shortly after its distribution agreement expired. The suit alleged, along with other claims, that the Pokemon Trading Card Game, infringed on the company's patent. In December of that year, the parties settled the case on undisclosed terms, precluding a judicial ruling which might have been the first test of the patent's legal validity.
I didn't know where to post this but I thought it'd be good here since it's debatable. What do you guys think?
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America Bless Christ Jesus
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
DISCLAIMER I am a patent attorney, none of what I say here should be construed as legal advice or commentary and I do not represent you (unless you want to give me a retainer...). Anyone acting on what is said here does so at their own risk. It's an internet forum for heaven's sake.
Apparently Wizards of the Coast own the patent to strategic trading card games. Supposedly the reason why other trading card games with similar mechanics have to pay royalties and a patent infringement fee to Wizard of the Coast.
I've looked through the WotC patent on my own on several occasions, and a couple of things have struck me about it. The first being it really is a good idea that they came up with, and it is certainly within the realm of patentable subject matter. The second being its also somewhat narrow and relatively easy to get around while still competing in the TCG market. That and patents only have a life of 20 years, so fairly soon it will be moot anyway.
It's a huge crutch on the industry. Wizards of the Coast is effectively monopolizing the TCG market by owning that kind of patent. This inhibits the growth and expansion of the industry as small games are forced to pay off Wizards in order to have their game even created. If you want to know why TCGs are dying, this is probably one of the causes.
I think more games are dying (or have died) from WotC's predatory practices, than from the patent royalties. WotC has intentionally (or seemingly intentionally) sunk several card games they were involved in that were going elsewhere in what appears to be an attempt to destroy the game soas not to compete with their flagship product.
L5R, deadlands, and Pokemon being "prime" examples. Furthermore for a period of about 5 years the only true competitor to Magic was "Star Wars:CCG" which was produced by Decipher, Inc. SWCCG went down the tubes when WotC pulled a predatory move and ripped the license away from decipher. Without the SW license Decipher could no longer produce their game, and couldn't even sell the product that they had already produced but hadn't left the distributors yet.
Now, whether you think these moves were ethical or unethical is up to you, I'm undecided. I don't like them because they killed one of my favorite games ever (SWCCG), but that is admittedly biased.
The current economic crisis and the Recession doesn't help it that much either, thus people not having enough money to pay for royalties to Wizards in order for their TCG's to get patented by WoTC. That could explain the lack of new TCG/CCG's being released prior to 2004 which was 6 years ago and why more and more people are possibly jumping into MMORPG's and Online games such as World of Warcraft.
The reason I don't quite buy this is that in order to receive royalties there must be profits in the first place. If the WotC royalty is 2%, then WotC only makes any money if and when the company licensing the patent sells a product.
I do think the recession is playing into the lack of other CCG's but I don't think its due to the royalties issues.
As a holder of the patent, Wizards of the Coast has requested that all trading card game publishers license the mechanics described in the patent, usually for a royalty fee based on total sales.
Interesting side note: This is one of the reasons why every card game not made by WotC that uses a "tap" mechanic requires you to turn your card to the left (instead of magics right), or turn it 45 degrees instead of 90, because this is one of the areas where WotC's patent is narrow.
Why shouldn't they patent it? It was a brilliant idea, and every Tom, Dick, and Harry with a printing press shouldn't be able to make a Magic clone and make money off of all the hard work and innovation of others. This is why such laws exist.
You wanna worry about a monopoly? A year or so ago the company making Bratz dolls become like the 500th company forced to shut down production of their dolls and destroy the molds. Why? Because Mattel (makers of Barbie) have sole rights to produce pose-able dolls under 12 inches in height.
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"Rage is the only freedom left me"
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
I'm going on record right now and stating that before the end of 2012 we will see foil dual lands in booster packs (The real, Alpha dual lands). You can quote me on that.
Why shouldn't they patent it? It was a brilliant idea, and every Tom, Dick, and Harry with a printing press shouldn't be able to make a Magic clone and make money off of all the hard work and innovation of others. This is why such laws exist.
Since when is every TGC a magic clone?
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We have laboured long to build a heaven, only to find it populated with horrors.
Most aren't. But the aspects that ARE cloned are the patented aspects. (basically building a customized deck out of cards obtained through purchase of random booster packs). A card game (such as the Fantasy flight LCG's) that doesn't randomly pack the cards doesn't have to pay royalties to wizards on that one aspect.
The distribution method is the really genius part about it, and consequently is the most valuable.
as far as the recession is concerned MTG is at a all time high in terms of sales tourney attendance and MTGO. Just something that goes against your theories.
They're not. A few tried, and were shut down. I said every Tom, Dick, and Harry SHOULDN'T be able to make a Magic clone, and they can't. The system works.
Private Mod Note
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"Rage is the only freedom left me"
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
I'm going on record right now and stating that before the end of 2012 we will see foil dual lands in booster packs (The real, Alpha dual lands). You can quote me on that.
You wanna worry about a monopoly? A year or so ago the company making Bratz dolls become like the 500th company forced to shut down production of their dolls and destroy the molds. Why? Because Mattel (makers of Barbie) have sole rights to produce pose-able dolls under 12 inches in height.
The reason Bratz was shut down was because its inventor conceived the dolls while he was working for Mattel. By contract, it makes sense you can't work for someone and then take your work for them to someone else. The inventor of Bratz had argued that he had conceived the idea of the dolls while in between contracts with Mattel. MGA Entertainment also contended that the company has expanded on the product line so much from the original dolls that they should not be bound by Mattel's rights over the originals.
Previous courts had ruled in favor of Mattel but the court battle is still ongoing. Read more about it on wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bratz
There is no patent on poseable dolls under 12 inches.
Yes, there's tones of varietys out there. Just look Yu-Gi-Oh! There you don't tap cards in a way you do with MTG.
However, it's sad that WotC have taking the patent, because then they can monopolize the TCG market as a result of that.
YGO has done everything it can to distance any connection to Magic. Like when they changed Magic cards to Spell cards. Out of all the TCG's out there YGO is probably the only one that could make an argument for being a unique subtype. It has no formal resource system, which is what WoTC's patent primarily concerns, and that seperates it from nearly every other TCG.
@the patent itself: Its something that needs to be watched closely. If it can be proven WoTC is trying to put all other TCG's out of business then action needs to be taken. Its sort of an assholish patent now but warranted at the time.
YGO has done everything it can to distance any connection to Magic. Like when they changed Magic cards to Spell cards. Out of all the TCG's out there YGO is probably the only one that could make an argument for being a unique subtype. It has no formal resource system, which is what WoTC's patent primarily concerns, and that seperates it from nearly every other TCG.
Are you trying to tell me the Star Wars TCG in any way resembles Magic? Because I don't follow how it does.
YGO has done everything it can to distance any connection to Magic. Like when they changed Magic cards to Spell cards. Out of all the TCG's out there YGO is probably the only one that could make an argument for being a unique subtype. It has no formal resource system, which is what WoTC's patent primarily concerns, and that seperates it from nearly every other TCG.
You clearly haven't tried very many of the TCG's out there....
L5R is nothing like magic, 7th sea was nothing like magic, VS was nothing like magic...
Really the simlarities are pretty much only in distribution method
You clearly haven't tried very many of the TCG's out there....
L5R is nothing like magic, 7th sea was nothing like magic, VS was nothing like magic...
Really the simlarities are pretty much only in distribution method
Nope. I started in 2002 with YGO and started Magic at the end of 2003. L5R was dead by the time I started playing YGO and the other two games never gained a foothold in my area. People tried to garner interest for VS but store owners were raking in the dough with YGO and Magic and so weren't so open to the idea of displacing loyal customers for potential customers.
I wonder what would happen if all the other TCG started calling themselves CCG's(collectible card game) or even OCG's(original card game). Could Wizards sue them? They only patented the phrase "trading card game", not CCG or OCG.
@the patent itself: Its something that needs to be watched closely. If it can be proven WoTC is trying to put all other TCG's out of business then action needs to be taken. Its sort of an assholish patent now but warranted at the time.
If you ask me, I think the patent is just their way of making more money and considering the success and popularity of the Magic: The Gathering TCG which of course paved the way for the TCG Genre for close to 2 decades already it would also prove that Wizards of the Coast recognizes and acknowledges the popularity and success of other TCG's such as Yu-Gi-Oh! and Pokemon which are also popular with young teenagers and adults not just kids.
It also boils down to people's interest in the TCG Genre of what they'd like to play and get a feel of the game's flavor and uniqueness. Two games that come to my mind that almost make you feel like you're actually in the anime series was Dragonball Z/GT by Score Entertainment (not Re-Z) which almost made you feel like you were fighting in the actual Anime/Manga series as your favorite characters and such.
Then there's also the Pokemon: Trading Card Game by Wizards of the Coast and Nintendo (POP/PUI) which almost makes you feel like a real Pokemon Trainer with 6 Pokemon against another Trainer to win or at least that's what that mindset is supposed to feel like. Other Anime/Manga oriented TCG/CCG's have followed suit by Score and Bandai although while some succeeded others have failed due to declining game popularity usually when the series itself ends, excessive power creep, or something wrong with the function of how balanced the game is in general.
It doesn't hurt to have other Trading Card Games and Collectible Card Games coexist alongside Magic: The Gathering, Japan also took advantage of the genre as well. What makes the TCG Genre such a unique way of entertainment that sets it apart from video games is the strategy, ciritical thinking, and tactics that are also inspired from board game classics most specifically Chess and Shogi, as well as being with people to play cards with besides making friends along the way, but overall just to have fun.
Heck some TCG's most specifically Yu-Gi-Oh!, Duel Masters, and possibly Pokemon were in a sense "stepping stones" or "starter decks" for people who are brand new to the TCG Genre before they start playing Magic which is sort of the somewhat easy to mid and expert level TCG.
It is a complex game that's for sure and it took some of my friends close to a year to master it fully while it's hard for others like myself who play other TCG's besides Magic to master it fully due to spending issues with the games in general as well as figuring out what decks to build, which to scrap and renew, that sort of thing.
If someone enjoys playing Magic they can also spend on other TCG's simultaneously as well too, as long as you have the money and a part time job to keep up with them though. I always enjoy varietizing what TCG/CCG's to play cause it's one of the fun aspects of the genre that I enjoy most, probably even more than video games IMO.
Sure alot of times you end up spending money on cards that cost you an arm and a leg but you still need to understand that Wizards of the Coast and other companies like Upper Deck Entertainment, Nintendo/POP/PUI, and Bandai are businesses, and as they say money makes the world go around even the global economy as well. So that's another thing to consider.
I don't think there's any TCG's/CCG's other than Magic currently that are under any huge threat in terms of this issue right now or in the near future, but like you said Bitsy it is wise to stay vigilant about this issue incase it goes out of hand which I doubt. Anyway this is just how I feel personally about it.
Wizards figured that when they were having trouble with some of their other properties like Dungeons & Dragons that are also owned by Hasbro that they needed to kick it up a notch and even in these economic times they needed to look out for themselves financially and they're still in business which is a good thing.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
I think you mean Yu-gi-oh, who's following is still retarded-ly large.
For a broken TCG with a Banned/Restricted list that flip flops like crazy, excessive power creep, highly expensive cards/decks, and no resource system at all I'm still surprised that Yu-Gi-Oh! is still popular to this day despite how bad the 5D's series is.
Who plays card games on motorcycles at 100 mph? That's just retarded. What's even worse is that the Anime rips off of Akira too much cause it's set in a post-apocalyptic world.
To be honest, it was beating Magic some years ago in popularity.
Yeah back like right before Invasion of Chaos with Chaos Emperor Dragon and Yata-Garasu, when CED and the Chaos decks emerged the game went insane. Heck it's just too expensive these days and I've overheard that one of the most popular decks recently Lightsworn decks are worth like $600.
Whose right mind would spend $500+ on cards when you could be spending less on other TCG's like Magic and Pokemon? It's bad enough the Mythic Rarity in Magic is making cards like Baneslayer Angel and Lotus Cobra highly expensive cards.
I may even go as far as to say that Yu-Gi-Oh is about as popular to children as Magic is to teenagers/adults.
Pokemon's also still doing okay for itself, somehow.
Pokemon is doing great actually, the Diamond/Pearl sets really got alot of people back into the game (myself included) and Platinum was pretty good as well. Not sure what to think about HeartGold & SoulSilver though...
Yu-Gi-Oh! is still somewhat popular in my area but it isn't the phenomenon it used to be years ago before things got out of hand with the game in 2003-2004 I believe? The Anime sorta hurt it as well, If anything the franchise also sorta paved way for emos and goths.
Underestimating the market of a child? I concur, teenagers and kids fail to see the flaws in Yu-Gi-Oh! itself while they refuse to try other TCG's in the genre itself to broaden their horizons. I remember when I used to be a Yu-Gi-Oh! addict and I quit back in 2004, still haven't regretted it to this day nor do I play that game anymore.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
America Bless Christ Jesus
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
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It's a huge crutch on the industry. Wizards of the Coast is effectively monopolizing the TCG market by owning that kind of patent. This inhibits the growth and expansion of the industry as small games are forced to pay off Wizards in order to have their game even created. If you want to know why TCGs are dying, this is probably one of the causes.
The current economic crisis and the Recession doesn't help it that much either, thus people not having enough money to pay for royalties to Wizards in order for their TCG's to get patented by WoTC. That could explain the lack of new TCG/CCG's being released prior to 2004 which was 6 years ago and why more and more people are possibly jumping into MMORPG's and Online games such as World of Warcraft.
As a holder of the patent, Wizards of the Coast has requested that all trading card game publishers license the mechanics described in the patent, usually for a royalty fee based on total sales.
In October 2003, Wizards of the Coast filed suit against Nintendo and related companies in U.S. District Court in Seattle shortly after its distribution agreement expired. The suit alleged, along with other claims, that the Pokemon Trading Card Game, infringed on the company's patent. In December of that year, the parties settled the case on undisclosed terms, precluding a judicial ruling which might have been the first test of the patent's legal validity.
I didn't know where to post this but I thought it'd be good here since it's debatable. What do you guys think?
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
I've looked through the WotC patent on my own on several occasions, and a couple of things have struck me about it. The first being it really is a good idea that they came up with, and it is certainly within the realm of patentable subject matter. The second being its also somewhat narrow and relatively easy to get around while still competing in the TCG market. That and patents only have a life of 20 years, so fairly soon it will be moot anyway.
I think more games are dying (or have died) from WotC's predatory practices, than from the patent royalties. WotC has intentionally (or seemingly intentionally) sunk several card games they were involved in that were going elsewhere in what appears to be an attempt to destroy the game soas not to compete with their flagship product.
L5R, deadlands, and Pokemon being "prime" examples. Furthermore for a period of about 5 years the only true competitor to Magic was "Star Wars:CCG" which was produced by Decipher, Inc. SWCCG went down the tubes when WotC pulled a predatory move and ripped the license away from decipher. Without the SW license Decipher could no longer produce their game, and couldn't even sell the product that they had already produced but hadn't left the distributors yet.
Now, whether you think these moves were ethical or unethical is up to you, I'm undecided. I don't like them because they killed one of my favorite games ever (SWCCG), but that is admittedly biased.
The reason I don't quite buy this is that in order to receive royalties there must be profits in the first place. If the WotC royalty is 2%, then WotC only makes any money if and when the company licensing the patent sells a product.
I do think the recession is playing into the lack of other CCG's but I don't think its due to the royalties issues.
Interesting side note: This is one of the reasons why every card game not made by WotC that uses a "tap" mechanic requires you to turn your card to the left (instead of magics right), or turn it 45 degrees instead of 90, because this is one of the areas where WotC's patent is narrow.
Just my thoughts.
You wanna worry about a monopoly? A year or so ago the company making Bratz dolls become like the 500th company forced to shut down production of their dolls and destroy the molds. Why? Because Mattel (makers of Barbie) have sole rights to produce pose-able dolls under 12 inches in height.
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
Since when is every TGC a magic clone?
Most aren't. But the aspects that ARE cloned are the patented aspects. (basically building a customized deck out of cards obtained through purchase of random booster packs). A card game (such as the Fantasy flight LCG's) that doesn't randomly pack the cards doesn't have to pay royalties to wizards on that one aspect.
The distribution method is the really genius part about it, and consequently is the most valuable.
Yes i am the same guy who trades/sells on MOTL AND Wizards of the Coast and i trade on POJO.
They're not. A few tried, and were shut down. I said every Tom, Dick, and Harry SHOULDN'T be able to make a Magic clone, and they can't. The system works.
"Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they're folded.". - Dr. Jeebus
Or something to that effect.
Previous courts had ruled in favor of Mattel but the court battle is still ongoing. Read more about it on wikipedia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bratz
There is no patent on poseable dolls under 12 inches.
YGO has done everything it can to distance any connection to Magic. Like when they changed Magic cards to Spell cards. Out of all the TCG's out there YGO is probably the only one that could make an argument for being a unique subtype. It has no formal resource system, which is what WoTC's patent primarily concerns, and that seperates it from nearly every other TCG.
@the patent itself: Its something that needs to be watched closely. If it can be proven WoTC is trying to put all other TCG's out of business then action needs to be taken. Its sort of an assholish patent now but warranted at the time.
Are you trying to tell me the Star Wars TCG in any way resembles Magic? Because I don't follow how it does.
You clearly haven't tried very many of the TCG's out there....
L5R is nothing like magic, 7th sea was nothing like magic, VS was nothing like magic...
Really the simlarities are pretty much only in distribution method
And how attacks were done.
And how you got damaged.
Really the only significant similarity was that guys had a strength stat and a defense stat...
Nope. I started in 2002 with YGO and started Magic at the end of 2003. L5R was dead by the time I started playing YGO and the other two games never gained a foothold in my area. People tried to garner interest for VS but store owners were raking in the dough with YGO and Magic and so weren't so open to the idea of displacing loyal customers for potential customers.
I wonder what would happen if all the other TCG started calling themselves CCG's(collectible card game) or even OCG's(original card game). Could Wizards sue them? They only patented the phrase "trading card game", not CCG or OCG.
If you ask me, I think the patent is just their way of making more money and considering the success and popularity of the Magic: The Gathering TCG which of course paved the way for the TCG Genre for close to 2 decades already it would also prove that Wizards of the Coast recognizes and acknowledges the popularity and success of other TCG's such as Yu-Gi-Oh! and Pokemon which are also popular with young teenagers and adults not just kids.
It also boils down to people's interest in the TCG Genre of what they'd like to play and get a feel of the game's flavor and uniqueness. Two games that come to my mind that almost make you feel like you're actually in the anime series was Dragonball Z/GT by Score Entertainment (not Re-Z) which almost made you feel like you were fighting in the actual Anime/Manga series as your favorite characters and such.
Then there's also the Pokemon: Trading Card Game by Wizards of the Coast and Nintendo (POP/PUI) which almost makes you feel like a real Pokemon Trainer with 6 Pokemon against another Trainer to win or at least that's what that mindset is supposed to feel like. Other Anime/Manga oriented TCG/CCG's have followed suit by Score and Bandai although while some succeeded others have failed due to declining game popularity usually when the series itself ends, excessive power creep, or something wrong with the function of how balanced the game is in general.
It doesn't hurt to have other Trading Card Games and Collectible Card Games coexist alongside Magic: The Gathering, Japan also took advantage of the genre as well. What makes the TCG Genre such a unique way of entertainment that sets it apart from video games is the strategy, ciritical thinking, and tactics that are also inspired from board game classics most specifically Chess and Shogi, as well as being with people to play cards with besides making friends along the way, but overall just to have fun.
Heck some TCG's most specifically Yu-Gi-Oh!, Duel Masters, and possibly Pokemon were in a sense "stepping stones" or "starter decks" for people who are brand new to the TCG Genre before they start playing Magic which is sort of the somewhat easy to mid and expert level TCG.
It is a complex game that's for sure and it took some of my friends close to a year to master it fully while it's hard for others like myself who play other TCG's besides Magic to master it fully due to spending issues with the games in general as well as figuring out what decks to build, which to scrap and renew, that sort of thing.
If someone enjoys playing Magic they can also spend on other TCG's simultaneously as well too, as long as you have the money and a part time job to keep up with them though. I always enjoy varietizing what TCG/CCG's to play cause it's one of the fun aspects of the genre that I enjoy most, probably even more than video games IMO.
Sure alot of times you end up spending money on cards that cost you an arm and a leg but you still need to understand that Wizards of the Coast and other companies like Upper Deck Entertainment, Nintendo/POP/PUI, and Bandai are businesses, and as they say money makes the world go around even the global economy as well. So that's another thing to consider.
I don't think there's any TCG's/CCG's other than Magic currently that are under any huge threat in terms of this issue right now or in the near future, but like you said Bitsy it is wise to stay vigilant about this issue incase it goes out of hand which I doubt. Anyway this is just how I feel personally about it.
Wizards figured that when they were having trouble with some of their other properties like Dungeons & Dragons that are also owned by Hasbro that they needed to kick it up a notch and even in these economic times they needed to look out for themselves financially and they're still in business which is a good thing.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta
I think you mean Yu-gi-oh, who's following is still retarded-ly large.
To be honest, it was beating Magic some years ago in popularity.
Never underestimate the market of the child~.
I may even go as far as to say that Yu-Gi-Oh is about as popular to children as Magic is to teenagers/adults.
Pokemon's also still doing okay for itself, somehow.
SWCCG was one of the few games to legitmately challenge MTG while nope aping the formating of MTG
For a broken TCG with a Banned/Restricted list that flip flops like crazy, excessive power creep, highly expensive cards/decks, and no resource system at all I'm still surprised that Yu-Gi-Oh! is still popular to this day despite how bad the 5D's series is.
Who plays card games on motorcycles at 100 mph? That's just retarded. What's even worse is that the Anime rips off of Akira too much cause it's set in a post-apocalyptic world.
Yeah back like right before Invasion of Chaos with Chaos Emperor Dragon and Yata-Garasu, when CED and the Chaos decks emerged the game went insane. Heck it's just too expensive these days and I've overheard that one of the most popular decks recently Lightsworn decks are worth like $600.
Whose right mind would spend $500+ on cards when you could be spending less on other TCG's like Magic and Pokemon? It's bad enough the Mythic Rarity in Magic is making cards like Baneslayer Angel and Lotus Cobra highly expensive cards.
Pokemon is doing great actually, the Diamond/Pearl sets really got alot of people back into the game (myself included) and Platinum was pretty good as well. Not sure what to think about HeartGold & SoulSilver though...
Yu-Gi-Oh! is still somewhat popular in my area but it isn't the phenomenon it used to be years ago before things got out of hand with the game in 2003-2004 I believe? The Anime sorta hurt it as well, If anything the franchise also sorta paved way for emos and goths.
Underestimating the market of a child? I concur, teenagers and kids fail to see the flaws in Yu-Gi-Oh! itself while they refuse to try other TCG's in the genre itself to broaden their horizons. I remember when I used to be a Yu-Gi-Oh! addict and I quit back in 2004, still haven't regretted it to this day nor do I play that game anymore.
"Restriction breeds creativity." - Sheldon Menery on EDH / Commander in Magic: The Gathering
"Cancel Culture is the real reason why everyone's not allowed to have nice things anymore." - Anonymous
"For what will it profit a man if he gains the whole world, and loses his own soul?" - Mark 8:36
"Most men and women will grow up to love their servitude and will never dream of revolution." - Aldous Huxley, Brave New World
"Every life decision is always a risk / reward proposition." - Sanjay Gupta