Revealing Cards, is it the same as Drawing?

Daniel277 · 07-25-2010, 04:29 PM

I'm hoping someone here can help me with this.

Is revealing a card the same as drawing a card for the purposes of losing a game?

My example is with Goblin Charbelcher it says that I must reveal cards until I reveal a land, and if I reveal cards until my library is no more do I lose the game?

If not what does happen?

Thanks for any help you can give me.

Sonata Guardian · 07-25-2010, 04:32 PM

If you reveal cards and reach the bottom of your library, you don't lose the game from not finding a land. However, you probably will lose the game from the resulting damage...

MetalPipe · 07-25-2010, 04:34 PM

No. You do not lose if you reveal the last card of your library. Even if the text is 'reveal it and put it into your hand' it doesnt count as drawing for the purpose of losing via an empty library.

ChaosSlayer · 07-25-2010, 04:36 PM

revealing from library is not exactly drawing.

when you Draw- you put card into hand.
when you reveal from library - you put it on the table face up - so everyone can see.
When you done revealing as much as effect told you to do (until you find a land in this case), you then put those cards where effect tell you to put them (on the bottom of your library).

When you turn begins, and you need to draw a card as you normally do, and you don't have any to draw- you loose the game.

Daniel277 · 07-25-2010, 04:42 PM

Ok I feel I may have over complicated the question a little.

In the case of the Charbelcher it says until I find a land; what if I search through the library and don't find a land?

Does the Charbelcher then deal damage equal to that many cards even though I didn't hit a land?

My understanding of this is some what limited but don't if I don't hit a land then surely I can't move on to the next step of what the card says and then I can't continue to resolve the card and then I'm stuck.

I found this opinion online, is it correct?

"If there are no more land cards in your library, you reveal all cards in your library, do damage equal to the count, and then put your library in any order you want."

ArrogantSOB · 07-25-2010, 04:51 PM

We talked about this a few days ago, and my local judge was a bit confused on it but he believed (but was not sure) that you would do zero damage if you did not reveal a land.

ChaosSlayer · 07-25-2010, 04:52 PM

my take is, if you can't find a land at all, then effect cannot resolve, and it is countered.

indomitablebug · 07-25-2010, 04:54 PM

You don't need to reveal a land.
If you go through your entire library without revealing a land you'll just deal damage equal to the number of revealed cards.

CodGod · 07-25-2010, 05:00 PM

If you don't reveal a land, it will deal damage based on how many cards are in your library.
You always do as much of an effect as possible, so if you don't find a land you reveal all of your library and then since you can't reveal any more, you continue with the effect, which is based on the number of nonland cards revealed. Regardless of whether you reveal a land or not, you did reveal some number of nonland cards, and that number is what determines the damage.

In order to not work if you didn't get any land, it would have to say "If you revealed a land card this way, Goblin Charbelcher deals damage...".

Daniel277 · 07-25-2010, 05:07 PM

Excellent, thanks for your help everyone.

**MDenham** · 07-25-2010, 05:08 PM

And to build on that last comment with what should be obvious, if you don't find a land, it certainly isn't a Mountain, so the effect will not do twice as much damage.

07-25-2010, 04:29 PM	#1
Daniel277 Just Getting Started Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 7	Revealing Cards, is it the same as Drawing? I'm hoping someone here can help me with this. Is revealing a card the same as drawing a card for the purposes of losing a game? My example is with Goblin Charbelcher it says that I must reveal cards until I reveal a land, and if I reveal cards until my library is no more do I lose the game? If not what does happen? Thanks for any help you can give me.
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07-25-2010, 04:34 PM	#3
MetalPipe Archmage Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 934	No. You do not lose if you reveal the last card of your library. Even if the text is 'reveal it and put it into your hand' it doesnt count as drawing for the purpose of losing via an empty library. __________________ DCI Rules Advisor
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07-25-2010, 05:08 PM	#11
MDenham Two racks of antlers and one of ribs Moderator Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: [This feature only available to users with MTGS Uranium] Posts: 5,973 Blog Entries: 1	And to build on that last comment with what should be obvious, if you don't find a land, it certainly isn't a Mountain, so the effect will not do twice as much damage. __________________ Learn why Clan Flamingo is starting a Kickstarter to buy Zimbabwe \| Learn more about MTGS Uranium here \| Discount Taxidermy and Barbeque (otherwise known as my helpdesk)
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07-25-2010, 04:32 PM	#2
Sonata Guardian Ascended Mage Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 159	If you reveal cards and reach the bottom of your library, you don't lose the game from not finding a land. However, you probably will lose the game from the resulting damage...
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07-25-2010, 04:36 PM	#4
ChaosSlayer Just Getting Started Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 16	revealing from library is not exactly drawing. when you Draw- you put card into hand. when you reveal from library - you put it on the table face up - so everyone can see. When you done revealing as much as effect told you to do (until you find a land in this case), you then put those cards where effect tell you to put them (on the bottom of your library). When you turn begins, and you need to draw a card as you normally do, and you don't have any to draw- you loose the game.
0

07-25-2010, 04:42 PM	#5
Daniel277 Just Getting Started Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 7	Ok I feel I may have over complicated the question a little. In the case of the Charbelcher it says until I find a land; what if I search through the library and don't find a land? Does the Charbelcher then deal damage equal to that many cards even though I didn't hit a land? My understanding of this is some what limited but don't if I don't hit a land then surely I can't move on to the next step of what the card says and then I can't continue to resolve the card and then I'm stuck. I found this opinion online, is it correct? "If there are no more land cards in your library, you reveal all cards in your library, do damage equal to the count, and then put your library in any order you want."
0

07-25-2010, 04:51 PM	#6
ArrogantSOB Ascended Mage Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 171	We talked about this a few days ago, and my local judge was a bit confused on it but he believed (but was not sure) that you would do zero damage if you did not reveal a land.
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07-25-2010, 04:52 PM	#7
ChaosSlayer Just Getting Started Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 16	my take is, if you can't find a land at all, then effect cannot resolve, and it is countered.
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07-25-2010, 05:00 PM	#9
CodGod Ascended Mage Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 461	If you don't reveal a land, it will deal damage based on how many cards are in your library. You always do as much of an effect as possible, so if you don't find a land you reveal all of your library and then since you can't reveal any more, you continue with the effect, which is based on the number of nonland cards revealed. Regardless of whether you reveal a land or not, you did reveal some number of nonland cards, and that number is what determines the damage. In order to not work if you didn't get any land, it would have to say "If you revealed a land card this way, Goblin Charbelcher deals damage...".
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07-25-2010, 05:07 PM	#10
Daniel277 Just Getting Started Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 7	Excellent, thanks for your help everyone.
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