HISTORY
OK, well the history of this deck was a Horde of Notions deck that gradually accumulated more and more combos for infinite mana. The idea was Infinite mana+sac effect=as many replays of the lorwyn evoke elementals as you want I originally used Claws of Gix and a few other cards as sac effects. Therefore draw your deck with mulldrifter, destroy all lands with faultgrinder etc. As this idea became more refined i added cards like Greater Good, Carnage Altar, and Legacy Weapon. Recently however I have realised that Horde's reanimation ability is no longer essential to this strategy as any general can simply be sacced and replayed to draw your deck.
Therefore I set out to see which of the 5 colour tribal sets would be the best for this deck and have investigated Slivers, Dragons, Scarecrows, and even Atogs.
In the end I decided that each general has its own distinct advantages (which I will go into later). So why not run all of them? Build a skeleton deck with several sets of cards for each general that fit into the base.
WHY THEY ARE GOOD FOR THE MAIN DECK Bloom tender makes mana with umbral mantle but he is really good anyway and should be a staple in virtually every 5cc deck. Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, works well with Survival of the Fittest to grab stuff out of the grave for :symg::symg: and with cards like tooth and nail and Pattern of rebirth. Palinchron makes mana with Mirari's Wake or Mana reflection. Spearbreaker Behemoth protects the general. Maelstrom Archangel works well to cheat Emrakul or Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker into play as well as other expensive spells.
I wont go into the tutors except Tooth and Nail. with this card if i have other things that i want to do in the same turn I tend to go for Palinchron+Emrakul and untap. This gives me all but 2 of my mana back (more if I have ravnica bouncelands in play.) if i have Greaves and a free flying hit on a player open I might go for Maelstrom Archangel-->into play and Emrakul-->into my hand and then bash with the hasty archangel and take another turn. Carnage Altar is a wincon with infinite mana. Same with Greater Good. Crystal Shard protects your general from tucks and kill and synergises well with alot of cards from the tribal sets. Crystal ball an odd choice, I would run top if I had another one. Mimic vat I fully expect to become an EDH staple of sorts. it is INSANE. Requires removal or else creatures just don't die for a while as people don't want to activate it. Momentary Blink great synergy with Palincron, (It produces exactly 15 mana, hmmmm... what costs 15?) It also works well with other cards from the tribal sets. Survival of the Fittest is awesome with any general but especially with horde. Nicol bolas, Planeswalker is really powerful and pretty easy to play in this deck, at the very least he is the ultimate answer. Reiterate, Turnabout, Rude Awakening and Aggravated Assault are combo pieces and all relatively useful by themselves.
WHY THEY AREN'T HERE Sol Ring and Mana crypt I simply don't have and money is somewhat of a barrier here, same goes for Top (Although I like Sylvan Library better it is better than the Crystal bal). Additionally alot of the combos involve untapping lands and so they dont work as well as in many decks. This second argument explains why Darksteel Ingot and Coalition relic aren't featured.
THE LANDS
I am building up my collection of ravnica duals and fetches. so there will be more of these.
I like the Ravnica bounce-lands because in multiplayer where early speed isn't as important they are a land, that for the price of coming into play tapped, gives you card advantage.
Many of the lands that come into play tapped will be substituted for duals fetches eventually.
THE TRIBAL SETS
As I said before, on of each of the following sets of 20 cards gets "sided in" at the beginning of each game.
Horde doesn't look overly threatening but has a reasonable power level. he is a comfortable middle ground for wishing to have impact while simultaneously not wanting to be perceived as a threat. When playing with him I rarely attack, just leave him back as a blocker. He stays alive longer and people don't start gunning for me.
The cards Avenger of Zendikar is a card made for recurring, and works really well with Momentary Blink and Crystal Shard Crib Swap: Yep it says elemental card, exile a creature for 5, repeatedly? yeah... Fertilid has allowed me to systematically put all the basics in my deck into play while other players are busy bashing each other. Ingot Chewer and Wispmare are great toolbox creatures as well as Shriekmaw. Multani Maro sorcerer works for me mostly as a giant wall that I don't attack with (unless its open of course.) Spawnwrithe on turn three with no board wipe can become overwhelming and win by itself. Ashes of the Fallen turns creatures in my grave into elementals cheaper than Conspiracy and enables a couple of combos with Palinchron and Emrakul but is generally just for recurring cards like Spearbreaker etc. Awesome with Survival of the fittest, pitch Emrakul into your grave and play him out for 5. Seedborn Muse allows for degenerate stuff with Survival of the Fittest and Crib Swap. Steely Resolve is in all of the tribal sets but is kept out of the main deck because some of the later generals are not tribal and hence don't gain as much from this card.
The cards not included Incandecent Soulstoke: not alot of elementals, this goes for Brightearth banneret as well. Doomgape: not particularly inspiring Lord of Extinction I find his lack of evasion or protection means he doesn't live long at all, Multani Maro sorcerer is better because he has shroud and is better in the early game when I need a massive shrouded wall.
Sliver Overlord is very good in 1v1 and in multiplayer with mostly aggro players. He tends to die alot but if you can get 10 mana open you can shroud him at instant speed with tutor quick sliver-->tutor crystaline sliver. You can also bounce him for 5 with Hibernation sliver so sometimes it is worth it to wait until 10 mana to play him. because of Mnemonic sliver, infinite mana almost always means an instant win.
The cards
Most of the slivers are pretty self-explanitory but a few need deeper discussion. Mnemonic sliver allows infinite mana to become "draw your deck" Totoring and playing this card and then by sacking and replaying the general. (this can be uncouterable and shrouded with Root sliver-->Crystaline sliver-->Mnemonic sliver. Conspiracy says that I can grab non-slivers from my deck. Shields of velis vel can be better than Ameboid changeling because it's at instant speed and can potentially steal multiple creatures from one player in a turn. Ameboid changeling without an answer or with a lightning greaves or crystaline sliver can be brutal for your opponents.
The cards not included
Any haste slivers, primarily due to no spot in the deck. These are better in primarily aggressive sliver decks. Crib swap would be very good with Sliver overlord's tutor ability as well as being able to steal the token just as insult to injury:D. Hivestone: Conspiracy does its job far better. Synapse sliver is good but is a heavy investment and ward sliver took his place.
Reaper King is great when you need to have lots of removal and is definitely on par or better than Slivers when playing 1v1. He is difficult to protect in multiplayer however.
None of the other changelings are particularly inspiring but are better than the remaining scarecrows.
also, It's harvest time...
The cards Wingrattle Scarecrow/Rattleblaze scarecrow are the best of this cycly of scarecrows because they both have persist which makes them a great double vindicate Antler Skullkin and Shell Skullkin are great because they both confer good bonuses to Reaper King. Scarecrone can use infinite mana to draw your deck as well as just being really good at recurring other artifact scarecrows. Chainbreaker works well with the persist effects. Grim Poppet is great at taking out small utility creatures. Changeling Berserker (and friends) are great for doubling your scarecrow drops (especially with a sac effect) and also make a cute infinite vindicate combo with all three in play when they repeatedly champion each other. Couldron of souls and Ghostway are for blinking your scarecrows to make more vindicates when a wrath happens. Both also can make wraths one-sided. Mistmeadow Witch is great for a 4 mana vindicate. He can also make net mana from Palincron although only at the end of each turn.
Cards not included Conspiracy: there really aren't enough non scarecrows to justify this.
Scion relies on the general quite a bit, so it can be bad if he gets tucked. best to play him at 8 mana for the Quicksilver Dragon redirect. Really powerful with Two-Headded dragon-->Nicol Bolas or with any of the damage activator dragons.
The cards Dragon Mage can quickly get you an extra hand of cards as well as disrupt others when they tutor for a win/answer. Dragon Tyrant... double strike... Hoard-Smelter Dragon and Steel Hellkite are for destroying stuff. Quicksilver Dragon puts a nice redirect on scion for 3 mana. Chameleon Colossus does a similar thing for protection from black. Shivan Hellkite kills people instantly when you get infinite mana. Conspiracy=Annihilate with Emrakul/Scion, bounce with Palincron/Scion, indestructible with Spearbreaker/Scion, play something for free with Maelstrom Archangel/Scion, etc.
Additional combos:
With infinite mana-->Scion-->Shivan Hellkite-->Win Hellkite Charger (or Scion guising as one) with Bear Umbra is infinite attacks, but not mana.
Cards not included Bladewing the risen combos well with Teneb to chuck two extra dragons into play and I am considering running him.
Atogatog is the best in large games of 5-6 players beacause you can sit back and let them take you as non-threatening. Also it is kind of fun to play atogs.
The cards
Most of the atogs are ☺☺☺☺ but a few of the changelings are decent. Chameleon Collossus with two activations can be sacked for an instant kill. Mirror entity is similar. Shapesharer can become a copy of someone else's creature and sac to the Atogatog. Taurean Mauler can also get pretty good Psychatog kicks ass.
Not much more to say here, the idea with this general is to look unthreatening or just for the lols.
Playing the deck
With large games Atogatog, Horde and Scion, are the best while in 2 or 3 player games the Overlord or Reaper King can be far superior.
Phase I: Building mana
With this deck you want to start with a land heavy hand, chuck back your bombs for more lands/ramp.
Phase II Assembling combos and disruption
during this period of the game (from 6 or more lands) you will attempt to assemble combos while disrupting other players and simultaneously building more lands. You should try to play people off of each other and try to look unthreatening. This deck is alot about playing politically.
Phase III Comboing and beyond
Turn 8-10 and beyond...
Now you should definitely be trying to combo off. People will be dying now and if you are smart and/or lucky your deck will go off and kill everyone now.
Again there can be some pretty insane fourth or fifth turn wins with Bloom Tender/umbral mantle, Maelstrom Archangel/Greaves/Emrakul or pattern of rebirth.
Matchups
I wont be posting matchups as this is meant to be a primarily multiplayer deck and it depends alot on the general you choose anyway. However this deck generally doesn't like alot of control chucked at it and if you are playing against control you will have to play politically and get your timing right.
Conclusion
So far there is a general for most multiplayer metas. However, when playing in a meta with lots of control it will be necessary to play an anti-control general. When only 1 player is playing heavy control you can usually work around them by playing politically and turning people against them or waiting till they tap out. This can sometimes be possible with two as well. However with three or more players controlling the game it can be nearly impossible to combo off. As a result I am currently working on Child of Alara and will post as soon as finished.
Child allows repeated wraths of the board which keep people from getting out of control and also has a handful of cheap (and even free) counterspells for use when attempting to combo off with lots of people. this however can piss a lot of people off, so if you plan on wrathing, try to get the board consensus that it "needs to happen" unless you think you can support repeated wraths. It can be the most efficient list here at enabling comboing off due to counters+stalling the game for a long time to build up.
The cards
There are lots of Reanimation effects in this deck, without a doubt Diabolic Servitude works extremely well with Child. Necromancy is the other enchantment based reanimation but I thought it good because at instant speed I can bring Child back and then it kills her for me. Angel of Despair is very good with the reanimation effects in the deck, same with Yosei. Glen Elendra Archmage, is to help with comboing off as she can stop up to two counterspells for one mana each.
Most of the counters are 2 mana or less. Phyrexian Tower is obviously for sacking Child
Scrabbling Claws is for putting him back in the GZ in the event i have no reanimation.
Additional combos:
none
The cards not included
Because I have only limited card space, I cannot include some of the other spells which are commonly run in Child decks, although if I overlooked a good one please feel free to point it out, as I have never played Child before.
Cromat was chosen for this list because it doesn't have alot of creatures and therefore it is the best list so far to be able to keep mana open for his diverse set of abilities. He is awesome whether attacking or blocking and will rarely get targeted due to his regenerate and bounce to the top of library effects. The specific idea with this list is to either (a) get one or more Myojins out and proliferate the counters on them to use their abilities more than once or (b) proceed with main deck win conditions. This List is alot about fun and less competitive but can be very powerful all the same.
The cards Wickerbough Elder, is highly efficient with proliferate and almost as good as Indrik Stomphowler even without it. Spike weaver is great with proliferate. Doubling Season works well with the myojins to get them off to a flying start and also helps with the planeswalkers in the maindeck as well as making all the proliferate INSANE. Gilder Bairn is very powerful with the Myojins and also works great with planeswalkers. Throne of Geth, might end up just sacking itself but it still gives at least one proliferate.
The Magistrate's Scepter, is again to take advantage of proliferate. Myojin of Life's web: this guy does not have any particular synergy with the deck but is in for the flavour and is at least an 8/8 indestructible. I have considered running Suncrusher, or Cytoplast manipulator in its place. The Myojin of Infinite rage is a bit better, with cards like trumming bird he can win the game. The white and black Myojins can make effective locks against opponents and the blue one with proliferate can draw me most of my deck in short order.
Additional combos:
A Myojin with repeatable proliferate, clockspinning, Gilder Bairn, or That Which Was Taken can make an effective lock, especially white black and red, blue will eventually draw me my deck (and therefore combo off)
An combo for infinite turns was revealed with Clockspinning and Magistrate's Scepter the other day and I thought it was a lot of fun. It is also possible with contagion engine and another of the proliferate cards or with the Gilder Bairn. (you just have to find a way of proliferating 3 counters on it each turn and you are sweet)
The cards not included Giant fan obviously would be epic too, I would love to use it to put a divinity counter on That Which Was Taken but unfortunately it isn't allowed. Rings of Brighthearth, just makes every proliferate ability double and also helps to colour-fix repeats of Cromat's abilities. but only helps with a few of the effects (mostly just the artifact proliferators and the Scepter)
You may consider Allies; I used to run an Ally deck using Karona, False God as the general (she hits the battlefield when I plan to swing for the kill).
Yeah that's a good idea, especially as ive already used all the non-sliver 5cc generals. Ill post it when i finish working on it... if i make it, another guy in my playgroup already has an ally deck sooo...
so far my favorite one to play is the Cromat "myojins of infinite pawnage" deck as it is a hell of alot of fun. the magistrate's scepter combo is SO MUCH FUN!
Sliver Overlord IMO is the best but because of a combo you didn't even mention Mana Echoes. I consistently get infinite colorless mana and infinite slivers T5 - T6. Being tribal your other lists may look at using echoes too and having tutors in all colors open to us and several viable back up plans I have built a deck pretty much around these two cards alone.
This is one of the best threads in this forum IMO. Really informative. I too would like to see the Karona/Ally varient of this as that's probably THE card for it. However the question is which allies do you go for as there are a ton of good ones but also good changelings AND proliferate can be amazing with allies AND various types of clones can sometimes be the best thing you can do.
Allies have always been a favorite of mine and I'd really enjoy seeing that list.
Thanks again for this primer and sorry if this post violates a thread necromancy rule.
I'm in love with this deck and I have decided to build it, with an allies theme for the 20 cards. So here's my first attempt at the 20 cards I'm probably gonna run with it:
Card Choices:
Most of them are obvious but there are at least a few combos in here: Turntimber Ranger, if you have a conspiracy out and play him (or play conspiracy with him out and then play another ally), you get infinite wolf-ally tokens and of course infinite ally ETB effects. This combo is the main reason that conspiracy is in here.
Conspiracy is in for the above combo, and so that Karona and any otherwise non-ally gets her own ability, and triggers all of my allies one more time when she comes down to swing for the kill. In addition to that, having the maindeck creatures enter the battlefield as allies is also nice because of all the ally effects. I might play Xenograft instead because of the slightly less intensive casting cost and because this deck only cares about what the creature is as it enters the battlefield.
Sea Gate Loremaster with an umbral mantle and infinite mana means draw your deck.
The Changeling Berserker and Changeling Hero are both actually pretty great cards because they activate your ally effects and you can gaurantee another ally effect when they die or 2 ally effects when you blink them.
Cards that Don't make the cut or barely make the cut.
I'm still uncertain about Akoum Battlesinger in an EDH deck, but I think they're at least worth testing. In EDH I'm afraid Hada Freeblade just doesn't make the cut.
Harabaz Druid is not currently in because we have plenty of other ways of getting a ton of mana.
Murassa Pyromancer is just barely not good enough IMO because it can only target creatures. If it was creature or player it would obviously be in in a heartbeat. And of course, the pyromancer is better than Tajuru Archers in EDH.
I decided just now to cut Jwari Shapeshifter in favor of Phyrexian Metamorph. It costs one mana more and gives you way WAY more options than Jwari Shapeshifter. It is the cheapest clone varient other than Jwari Shapeshifter and also the most versatile, being able to become not only a creature, but an artifact if necessary as well.
Ondu Cleric was the last ally I cut. Without the infinite combo Talus Paladin will almost always be the superior lifegainer.
Tezzeret's Gambit should probably go in, but I would have to cut something from the main deck for it I think because we need all the allies we can get, but proliferate (and draw 2 of course) can be pretty damn handy with allies.
I would love some feedback on this and eventually it would be REALLY cool to see this in the OP once the list is tweaked a bit.
Edit: Also I have a Reflecting Pool so I'm gonna play it. The inverse reflecting pool (I forget the name, it's from Alara block I think), might be good in multiplayer games as well.
OK, well the history of this deck was a Horde of Notions deck that gradually accumulated more and more combos for infinite mana. The idea was Infinite mana+sac effect=as many replays of the lorwyn evoke elementals as you want I originally used Claws of Gix and a few other cards as sac effects. Therefore draw your deck with mulldrifter, destroy all lands with faultgrinder etc. As this idea became more refined i added cards like Greater Good, Carnage Altar, and Legacy Weapon. Recently however I have realised that Horde's reanimation ability is no longer essential to this strategy as any general can simply be sacced and replayed to draw your deck.
Therefore I set out to see which of the 5 colour tribal sets would be the best for this deck and have investigated Slivers, Dragons, Scarecrows, and even Atogs.
In the end I decided that each general has its own distinct advantages (which I will go into later). So why not run all of them? Build a skeleton deck with several sets of cards for each general that fit into the base.
THE COMBOS
Limitless Mana:
Reiterate+Turnabout,
Palinchron+Mirari's Wake/Mana Reflection,
Bloomtender+Umbral Mantle+General,
Rude awakening+Aggravated Assault,
Rude awakening+Reiterate
Easy Wincons: legacy weapon/greater good/carnage altar
THE BASE
The base is 80 cards, no general and only creatures that are parts of combos or are synergistic with the base itself.
1 Bloom Tender
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Oracle of Mul Daya
1 Palinchron
1 Spearbreaker Behemoth
1 Maelstrom Archangel
Tutors
1 Beseech the Queen
1 Conflux
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Diabolic Intent
1 Diabolic Tutor
1 Eladamri's Call
1 Liliana Vess
1 Pattern of Rebirth
1 Tooth and Nail
1 Worldly Tutor
Artifacts
1 Carnage Altar
1 Crystal Shard
1 Crystal Ball
1 Legacy Weapon
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Umbral Mantle
1 Mimic Vat
Other Spells
1 Austere Command
1 Hallowed Burial
1 Martial Coup
1 Wrath of God
1 Cultivate
1 Kodama's Reach
1 Explosive Vegetation
1 Journey of Discovery
1 Shard Convergence
1 Momentary Blink
1 Rush of Knowledge
1 Sylvan Library
1 Survival of the Fittest
1 Bant Charm
1 Rhystic Study
1 Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker
1 Greater Good
1 Mana Reflection
1 Mirari's Wake
1 Reiterate
1 Turnabout
1 Rude Awakening
1 Aggravated Assault
1 Arcane Sanctum
1 Azorius Chancery
1 Boros Garrison
1 Crumbling Necropolis
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Exotic Orchard
1 Forbidden Orchard
1 Golgari Rot Farm
1 Grand Coliseum
1 Izzet Boilerworks
1 Jungle Shrine
1 City of Brass
1 Orzhov Basilica
1 Rakdos Carnarium
1 Rupture Spire
1 Savage Lands
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Marsh Flats
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Blood Crypt
1 Temple Garden
1 Verdant Catacombs
2 Forest
2 Island
2 Mountain
2 Plains
2 Swamp
WHY THEY ARE GOOD FOR THE MAIN DECK
Bloom tender makes mana with umbral mantle but he is really good anyway and should be a staple in virtually every 5cc deck.
Emrakul, the Aeons Torn, works well with Survival of the Fittest to grab stuff out of the grave for :symg::symg: and with cards like tooth and nail and Pattern of rebirth.
Palinchron makes mana with Mirari's Wake or Mana reflection.
Spearbreaker Behemoth protects the general.
Maelstrom Archangel works well to cheat Emrakul or Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker into play as well as other expensive spells.
I wont go into the tutors except Tooth and Nail. with this card if i have other things that i want to do in the same turn I tend to go for Palinchron+Emrakul and untap. This gives me all but 2 of my mana back (more if I have ravnica bouncelands in play.) if i have Greaves and a free flying hit on a player open I might go for Maelstrom Archangel-->into play and Emrakul-->into my hand and then bash with the hasty archangel and take another turn.
Carnage Altar is a wincon with infinite mana. Same with Greater Good.
Crystal Shard protects your general from tucks and kill and synergises well with alot of cards from the tribal sets.
Crystal ball an odd choice, I would run top if I had another one.
Mimic vat I fully expect to become an EDH staple of sorts. it is INSANE. Requires removal or else creatures just don't die for a while as people don't want to activate it.
Momentary Blink great synergy with Palincron, (It produces exactly 15 mana, hmmmm... what costs 15?) It also works well with other cards from the tribal sets.
Survival of the Fittest is awesome with any general but especially with horde.
Nicol bolas, Planeswalker is really powerful and pretty easy to play in this deck, at the very least he is the ultimate answer.
Reiterate, Turnabout, Rude Awakening and Aggravated Assault are combo pieces and all relatively useful by themselves.
WHY THEY AREN'T HERE
Sol Ring and Mana crypt I simply don't have and money is somewhat of a barrier here, same goes for Top (Although I like Sylvan Library better it is better than the Crystal bal). Additionally alot of the combos involve untapping lands and so they dont work as well as in many decks. This second argument explains why Darksteel Ingot and Coalition relic aren't featured.
THE LANDS
I am building up my collection of ravnica duals and fetches. so there will be more of these.
I like the Ravnica bounce-lands because in multiplayer where early speed isn't as important they are a land, that for the price of coming into play tapped, gives you card advantage.
Many of the lands that come into play tapped will be substituted for duals fetches eventually.
THE TRIBAL SETS
As I said before, on of each of the following sets of 20 cards gets "sided in" at the beginning of each game.
ELEMENTALS
1 Hoard of Notions
1 Avenger of Zendikar
1 Crib Swap
1 Fertilid
1 Flamekin Harbinger
1 Forgotten Ancient
1 Fulminator Mage
1 Hate Flayer
1 Ingot Chewer
1 Living Inferno
1 Mulldrifter
1 Multani, Maro-Sorcerer
1 Shapesharer
1 Shriekmaw
1 Smokebraider
1 Spawnwrithe
1 Wispmare
1 Seedborn Muse
1 Steely Resolve
Horde doesn't look overly threatening but has a reasonable power level. he is a comfortable middle ground for wishing to have impact while simultaneously not wanting to be perceived as a threat. When playing with him I rarely attack, just leave him back as a blocker. He stays alive longer and people don't start gunning for me.
The cards
Avenger of Zendikar is a card made for recurring, and works really well with Momentary Blink and Crystal Shard
Crib Swap: Yep it says elemental card, exile a creature for 5, repeatedly? yeah...
Fertilid has allowed me to systematically put all the basics in my deck into play while other players are busy bashing each other.
Ingot Chewer and Wispmare are great toolbox creatures as well as Shriekmaw.
Multani Maro sorcerer works for me mostly as a giant wall that I don't attack with (unless its open of course.)
Spawnwrithe on turn three with no board wipe can become overwhelming and win by itself.
Ashes of the Fallen turns creatures in my grave into elementals cheaper than Conspiracy and enables a couple of combos with Palinchron and Emrakul but is generally just for recurring cards like Spearbreaker etc. Awesome with Survival of the fittest, pitch Emrakul into your grave and play him out for 5.
Seedborn Muse allows for degenerate stuff with Survival of the Fittest and Crib Swap.
Steely Resolve is in all of the tribal sets but is kept out of the main deck because some of the later generals are not tribal and hence don't gain as much from this card.
Additional combos:
Palincron+Greater Good+Ashes of the fallen+General
Emrakul, the aeons torn+Greater Good/Carnage altar+Ashes of the fallen+General+Discard
Due to having a hasty general, aggravated assault combo means infinite attacks (with general replaying after he is killed in combat and continuing to attack)
The cards not included
Incandecent Soulstoke: not alot of elementals, this goes for Brightearth banneret as well.
Doomgape: not particularly inspiring
Lord of Extinction I find his lack of evasion or protection means he doesn't live long at all, Multani Maro sorcerer is better because he has shroud and is better in the early game when I need a massive shrouded wall.
SLIVERS
1 Sliver Overlord
1 Fury sliver
1 Crystaline sliver
1 Brood sliver
1 Crypt sliver
1 Root sliver
1 Shifting sliver
1 Hibernation sliver
1 Mnemonic sliver
1 Gemhide sliver
1 Quick Sliver
1 Harmonic sliver
1 Telekenetic sliver
1 Ward sliver
1 Sedge sliver
1 Necrotic sliver
1 Shields of velis vel
1 Ameboid changeling
1 Steely Resolve
Sliver Overlord is very good in 1v1 and in multiplayer with mostly aggro players. He tends to die alot but if you can get 10 mana open you can shroud him at instant speed with tutor quick sliver-->tutor crystaline sliver. You can also bounce him for 5 with Hibernation sliver so sometimes it is worth it to wait until 10 mana to play him. because of Mnemonic sliver, infinite mana almost always means an instant win.
The cards
Most of the slivers are pretty self-explanitory but a few need deeper discussion.
Mnemonic sliver allows infinite mana to become "draw your deck" Totoring and playing this card and then by sacking and replaying the general. (this can be uncouterable and shrouded with Root sliver-->Crystaline sliver-->Mnemonic sliver.
Conspiracy says that I can grab non-slivers from my deck.
Shields of velis vel can be better than Ameboid changeling because it's at instant speed and can potentially steal multiple creatures from one player in a turn.
Ameboid changeling without an answer or with a lightning greaves or crystaline sliver can be brutal for your opponents.
Additional combos:
Ameboid changeling/Shields of velis-veil+General means steal creatures
Additional win condition with Mnemonic sliver, combined with general's tutoring, infinite mana=draw your deck.
The cards not included
Any haste slivers, primarily due to no spot in the deck. These are better in primarily aggressive sliver decks.
Crib swap would be very good with Sliver overlord's tutor ability as well as being able to steal the token just as insult to injury:D.
Hivestone: Conspiracy does its job far better.
Synapse sliver is good but is a heavy investment and ward sliver took his place.
SCARECROWS
1 Reaper King
1 Wingrattle Scarecrow
1 Scarecrone
1 Scuttlemutt
1 Shell Skullkin
1 Rattleblaze scarecrow
1 Grim poppet
1 Antler Skullkin
1 Chainbreaker
1 Changeling Titan
1 Changeling Hero
1 Mirror entity
1 Shapesharer
1 Taurean mauler
1 Chameleon Colossus
1 Couldron of souls
1 Mistmeadow Witch
1 Ghostway
1 Steely Resolve
Reaper King is great when you need to have lots of removal and is definitely on par or better than Slivers when playing 1v1. He is difficult to protect in multiplayer however.
None of the other changelings are particularly inspiring but are better than the remaining scarecrows.
also, It's harvest time...
The cards
Wingrattle Scarecrow/Rattleblaze scarecrow are the best of this cycly of scarecrows because they both have persist which makes them a great double vindicate
Antler Skullkin and Shell Skullkin are great because they both confer good bonuses to Reaper King.
Scarecrone can use infinite mana to draw your deck as well as just being really good at recurring other artifact scarecrows.
Chainbreaker works well with the persist effects.
Grim Poppet is great at taking out small utility creatures.
Changeling Berserker (and friends) are great for doubling your scarecrow drops (especially with a sac effect) and also make a cute infinite vindicate combo with all three in play when they repeatedly champion each other.
Couldron of souls and Ghostway are for blinking your scarecrows to make more vindicates when a wrath happens. Both also can make wraths one-sided.
Mistmeadow Witch is great for a 4 mana vindicate. He can also make net mana from Palincron although only at the end of each turn.
Cards not included
Conspiracy: there really aren't enough non scarecrows to justify this.
Additional combos:
Changeling Berserker+Changeling Titan+Changeling hero+general means destroy any number of target permanents.
Additional win condition for infinite mana with Scarecrone
DRAGONS
1 Scion of the Ur-dragon
1 Dragon Mage
1 Dragon Tyrant
1 Dromar, the Banisher
1 Hellkite Charger
1 Hoard-Smelter Dragon
1 Intet, the Dreamer
1 Karrthus, Tyrant of Jund
1 Two-Headed Dragon
1 Nicol Bolas
1 Numot, the Devastator
1 Quicksilver Dragon
1 Shivan Hellkite
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Teneb, the Harvester
1 Chameleon Colossus
1 Zirilan of the Claw
1 Conspiracy
1 Steely Resolve
Scion relies on the general quite a bit, so it can be bad if he gets tucked. best to play him at 8 mana for the Quicksilver Dragon redirect. Really powerful with Two-Headded dragon-->Nicol Bolas or with any of the damage activator dragons.
The cards
Dragon Mage can quickly get you an extra hand of cards as well as disrupt others when they tutor for a win/answer.
Dragon Tyrant... double strike...
Hoard-Smelter Dragon and Steel Hellkite are for destroying stuff.
Quicksilver Dragon puts a nice redirect on scion for 3 mana.
Chameleon Colossus does a similar thing for protection from black.
Shivan Hellkite kills people instantly when you get infinite mana.
Conspiracy=Annihilate with Emrakul/Scion, bounce with Palincron/Scion, indestructible with Spearbreaker/Scion, play something for free with Maelstrom Archangel/Scion, etc.
Additional combos:
With infinite mana-->Scion-->Shivan Hellkite-->Win
Hellkite Charger (or Scion guising as one) with Bear Umbra is infinite attacks, but not mana.
Cards not included
Bladewing the risen combos well with Teneb to chuck two extra dragons into play and I am considering running him.
ATOGS
1 Atogatog
1 Atog
1 Chronatog
1 Chronatog Totem
1 Foratog
1 Lithatog
1 Megatog
1 Necratog
1 Phantatog
1 Psychatog
1 Sarcatog
1 Traumatog
1 Changeling Berserker
1 Changeling Titan
1 Turtleshell Changeling
1 Mirror entity
1 Shapesharer
1 Taurean mauler
Atogatog is the best in large games of 5-6 players beacause you can sit back and let them take you as non-threatening. Also it is kind of fun to play atogs.
The cards
Most of the atogs are ☺☺☺☺ but a few of the changelings are decent.
Chameleon Collossus with two activations can be sacked for an instant kill.
Mirror entity is similar.
Shapesharer can become a copy of someone else's creature and sac to the Atogatog.
Taurean Mauler can also get pretty good
Psychatog kicks ass.
Not much more to say here, the idea with this general is to look unthreatening or just for the lols.
Playing the deck
With large games Atogatog, Horde and Scion, are the best while in 2 or 3 player games the Overlord or Reaper King can be far superior.
Phase I: Building mana
With this deck you want to start with a land heavy hand, chuck back your bombs for more lands/ramp.
Phase II Assembling combos and disruption
during this period of the game (from 6 or more lands) you will attempt to assemble combos while disrupting other players and simultaneously building more lands. You should try to play people off of each other and try to look unthreatening. This deck is alot about playing politically.
Phase III Comboing and beyond
Turn 8-10 and beyond...
Now you should definitely be trying to combo off. People will be dying now and if you are smart and/or lucky your deck will go off and kill everyone now.
Again there can be some pretty insane fourth or fifth turn wins with Bloom Tender/umbral mantle, Maelstrom Archangel/Greaves/Emrakul or pattern of rebirth.
Matchups
I wont be posting matchups as this is meant to be a primarily multiplayer deck and it depends alot on the general you choose anyway. However this deck generally doesn't like alot of control chucked at it and if you are playing against control you will have to play politically and get your timing right.
Conclusion
So far there is a general for most multiplayer metas. However, when playing in a meta with lots of control it will be necessary to play an anti-control general. When only 1 player is playing heavy control you can usually work around them by playing politically and turning people against them or waiting till they tap out. This can sometimes be possible with two as well. However with three or more players controlling the game it can be nearly impossible to combo off. As a result I am currently working on Child of Alara and will post as soon as finished.
1 Child of Alara
1 Angel of Despair
1 Yosei, the Morning Star
1 Greater Gargadon
1 Karmic Guide
1 Makeshift Mannequin
1 Diabolic Servitude
1 Beacon of Unrest
1 Necromancy
1 Profane Command
1 Miraculous Recovery
1 Voidslime
1 Hinder
1 Pact of negation
1 Arcane Denial
1 Counterspell
1 Glen Elendra Archmage
1 Scrabbling Claws
Child allows repeated wraths of the board which keep people from getting out of control and also has a handful of cheap (and even free) counterspells for use when attempting to combo off with lots of people. this however can piss a lot of people off, so if you plan on wrathing, try to get the board consensus that it "needs to happen" unless you think you can support repeated wraths. It can be the most efficient list here at enabling comboing off due to counters+stalling the game for a long time to build up.
The cards
There are lots of Reanimation effects in this deck, without a doubt Diabolic Servitude works extremely well with Child.
Necromancy is the other enchantment based reanimation but I thought it good because at instant speed I can bring Child back and then it kills her for me.
Angel of Despair is very good with the reanimation effects in the deck, same with Yosei.
Glen Elendra Archmage, is to help with comboing off as she can stop up to two counterspells for one mana each.
Most of the counters are 2 mana or less.
Phyrexian Tower is obviously for sacking Child
Scrabbling Claws is for putting him back in the GZ in the event i have no reanimation.
Additional combos:
none
The cards not included
Because I have only limited card space, I cannot include some of the other spells which are commonly run in Child decks, although if I overlooked a good one please feel free to point it out, as I have never played Child before.
"MYOJINS. PROLIFERATE!"
1 Cromat
1 Myojin of Night's Reach
1 Myojin of Cleansing Fire
1 Myojin of Infinite Rage
1 Myojin of Life's Web
1 Myojin of Seeing Winds
1 Wickerbough Elder
1 Spike weaver
1 Cytoplast Manipulator
1 Gilder Bairn
1 Clockspinning
1 Inexorable Tide
1 Contagion Clasp
1 Contagion engine
1 Steady Progress
1 Throne of Geth
1 Thrummingbird
1 Magistrate's Scepter
Cromat was chosen for this list because it doesn't have alot of creatures and therefore it is the best list so far to be able to keep mana open for his diverse set of abilities. He is awesome whether attacking or blocking and will rarely get targeted due to his regenerate and bounce to the top of library effects. The specific idea with this list is to either (a) get one or more Myojins out and proliferate the counters on them to use their abilities more than once or (b) proceed with main deck win conditions. This List is alot about fun and less competitive but can be very powerful all the same.
The cards
Wickerbough Elder, is highly efficient with proliferate and almost as good as Indrik Stomphowler even without it.
Spike weaver is great with proliferate.
Doubling Season works well with the myojins to get them off to a flying start and also helps with the planeswalkers in the maindeck as well as making all the proliferate INSANE.
Gilder Bairn is very powerful with the Myojins and also works great with planeswalkers.
Throne of Geth, might end up just sacking itself but it still gives at least one proliferate.
The Magistrate's Scepter, is again to take advantage of proliferate.
Myojin of Life's web: this guy does not have any particular synergy with the deck but is in for the flavour and is at least an 8/8 indestructible. I have considered running Suncrusher, or Cytoplast manipulator in its place. The Myojin of Infinite rage is a bit better, with cards like trumming bird he can win the game. The white and black Myojins can make effective locks against opponents and the blue one with proliferate can draw me most of my deck in short order.
Additional combos:
A Myojin with repeatable proliferate, clockspinning, Gilder Bairn, or That Which Was Taken can make an effective lock, especially white black and red, blue will eventually draw me my deck (and therefore combo off)
An combo for infinite turns was revealed with Clockspinning and Magistrate's Scepter the other day and I thought it was a lot of fun. It is also possible with contagion engine and another of the proliferate cards or with the Gilder Bairn. (you just have to find a way of proliferating 3 counters on it each turn and you are sweet)
The cards not included
Giant fan obviously would be epic too, I would love to use it to put a divinity counter on That Which Was Taken but unfortunately it isn't allowed.
Rings of Brighthearth, just makes every proliferate ability double and also helps to colour-fix repeats of Cromat's abilities. but only helps with a few of the effects (mostly just the artifact proliferators and the Scepter)
▲
▲ ▲
so far my favorite one to play is the Cromat "myojins of infinite pawnage" deck as it is a hell of alot of fun. the magistrate's scepter combo is SO MUCH FUN!
Allies have always been a favorite of mine and I'd really enjoy seeing that list.
Thanks again for this primer and sorry if this post violates a thread necromancy rule.
WUB Merieke Ri Berit BUW
GWU Phelddagrif 1 2 3 4 UWG
BR Kaervek the Merciless RB
B Chainer, Dementia Master B
WUB Sen Triplets BUW
BG Sisters of Stone Death GB
WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon GRBUW
GWU Angus Mackenzie UWG
R Kumano, Master Yamabushi R
WB Teysa BW
U Higure U
B Geth B
WUBRG Child of Alara 1 2GRBUW
R Zirilan R
U Arcum U
UR Nin RU
BRG Sek'Kuar GRB
U Teferi U
G Melira G
GU Edric UG
BG Glissa GB
Casual
GUB Knacksaw Clique BUG
RWU Sunforger UWR
1 Karona, False God
1 Turntimber Ranger
1 Agadeem Ocultist
1 Akoum Battlesinger
1 Bala Ged Theif
1 Kabira Evangel
1 Kazandu Blademaster
1 Kazuul Warlord
1 Sea Gate Loremaster
1 Talus Paladin
1 TukTuk Scrapper
1 Taurean Mauler
1 Chameleon Colossus
1 Mirror Entity
1 Hagra Diabolist
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Changeling Berserker
1 Changeling Hero
1 Sea Scape Arialist
1 Conspiracy
Card Choices:
Most of them are obvious but there are at least a few combos in here:
Turntimber Ranger, if you have a conspiracy out and play him (or play conspiracy with him out and then play another ally), you get infinite wolf-ally tokens and of course infinite ally ETB effects. This combo is the main reason that conspiracy is in here.
Conspiracy is in for the above combo, and so that Karona and any otherwise non-ally gets her own ability, and triggers all of my allies one more time when she comes down to swing for the kill. In addition to that, having the maindeck creatures enter the battlefield as allies is also nice because of all the ally effects. I might play Xenograft instead because of the slightly less intensive casting cost and because this deck only cares about what the creature is as it enters the battlefield.
Sea Gate Loremaster with an umbral mantle and infinite mana means draw your deck.
The Changeling Berserker and Changeling Hero are both actually pretty great cards because they activate your ally effects and you can gaurantee another ally effect when they die or 2 ally effects when you blink them.
Cards that Don't make the cut or barely make the cut.
I'm still uncertain about Akoum Battlesinger in an EDH deck, but I think they're at least worth testing. In EDH I'm afraid Hada Freeblade just doesn't make the cut.
Harabaz Druid is not currently in because we have plenty of other ways of getting a ton of mana.
Murassa Pyromancer is just barely not good enough IMO because it can only target creatures. If it was creature or player it would obviously be in in a heartbeat. And of course, the pyromancer is better than Tajuru Archers in EDH.
I decided just now to cut Jwari Shapeshifter in favor of Phyrexian Metamorph. It costs one mana more and gives you way WAY more options than Jwari Shapeshifter. It is the cheapest clone varient other than Jwari Shapeshifter and also the most versatile, being able to become not only a creature, but an artifact if necessary as well.
Ondu Cleric was the last ally I cut. Without the infinite combo Talus Paladin will almost always be the superior lifegainer.
Tezzeret's Gambit should probably go in, but I would have to cut something from the main deck for it I think because we need all the allies we can get, but proliferate (and draw 2 of course) can be pretty damn handy with allies.
I would love some feedback on this and eventually it would be REALLY cool to see this in the OP once the list is tweaked a bit.
Edit: Also I have a Reflecting Pool so I'm gonna play it. The inverse reflecting pool (I forget the name, it's from Alara block I think), might be good in multiplayer games as well.