I wanted to take a different look at two types of decks that really interested me. Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker and MBC. The idea is that the deck plays largely like a mono black control deck but is able to play shirei to power a relatively small engine to support the deck with card draw, discard, recursion and a wincon.
A very important aspect of this deck is the tutor suite. I have 4 transmute spells that form the shell of the tutoring in this deck. Each transmute spell is capable of transmuting for a hard tutor to generate some card advantage if necessary in the early game.
Several X spells make this package not as good for the early game, but grabbing monolith or greaves is never bad.
3 CMC- Dimir Machination - Cruel Tutor, Ashes to Ashes, Sad Sac, Yawg Win, Big Game Hunter, Pilgrim's Eye, Scarecrone, Contamination, Phyrexian Arena, Words of Waste,Coalition Relic, Crucible of Worlds, Extraplanar Lens, Oblivion Stone, Rings of Brighthearth, Skull of Ramos, Sword of Feast and Famine, Basalt Monolith
One of my favorite numbers to tutor at. Several 2 card combos at 3, phyrexian arena + Words of waste, Contamination + Scarecrone + Shirei, as well as effects that scale well for the late game like Sad Sac.
Second favorite tutor cmc. Keep in mind that you can usually play Beseech the Queen for 3, Very good in the early game if you don't have mana for a CMC 6 card.
As seen in the decklist, this deck does not function like a normal Shirei deck. There are only five creatures in the entire deck with power 1 or less. These 5 cards (4 of which are tutor-able with the transmute spells listed above) provide card advantage, creature destruction. a versatile wincon, and the ability to lock down the board. The remaining cards of the deck play mostly like the average MBC deck; removal, wraths, drain life spells, mana doubling and lots of color pie bleed.
Important Interactions
Words of Waste + Phyrexian Arena/(Scarecrone + Shirei) - This provides an effective way to empty your opponents hands late game with cards that will still good early game. Words of Waste is a great way to recycle a sign in blood late game when you already have a reasonable grip.
Contamination + any 1 power Creature + Shirei - while black is a prominent color in most metas (debatably the 2nd or 3rd best color), locking out all other colors can lock many players entirely out of the game. Unless your opponent is playing mono black, you will likely be able to severely debilitate opponents running black as a 2nd or 3rd color. Without the lock, contamination can essentially time walk many boards, buying time to tutor for an answer. Be aware that contamination does shut off Cabal Coffers.
I played around with an artifact subtheme before changing this build, but it never seemed to work out as well as I liked. The value wasn't worth the number of card slots spent on it in my opinion. viperesque has cool artifact shirei build if that is your interest (HERE!).
5/30
- Mind Stone +basalt Monolith
-Spine of Ish shah + Karn Liberated
-Viscera Seer +Thoughtpicker witch
-Junk Diver +Triskelavus
-Myr retriever +apprentice necromancer
-Phyrexia's Core + Vesuva
-Mycosynth wellspring + crucible of worlds
-Infernal tribune + moonlight bargain
-Insidious dreams + ambition's cost
-liliana vess + beseech the queen
-N Disk + grave pact
-Eye of Ugin +bone shredder
-Krark-Clan Ironworks + Sword of Light and Shadow
So MBC and Shirei players (or just other members of the community) I would love to have your input on this build.
Interesting deck. My first thought is to add more creatures.
Dimir House Guard gives you a creature sac outlet and doubles as a tutor for cmc 4
I love Braids, but she tends to get removed pretty quick. Awesome with some Greaves though.
lol. wtf does Darksteel Plate have to do with Shirei other than protecting him?
I guess you could make the argument that every general should have buff equipment, but good luck trying to convince the EDH community that these are auto-includes.
Alot of the creatures with ETB effects you WANT to die and don't want any equipment on them.
Even the other power 1 creatures are good to have die if the deck is running Braids, Grave Pact, and Butcher of Malakir. Why would you pay 2 mana to equip indestructibility on fodder?
The only equips you want are Greaves and Skullclamp, unless your playgroup runs alot of artfact hate and you need some backup protection for your commander - then yes, maybe add some Darksteel or a Cloak.
Otherwise, I fail to see what the Plate has to do with this build.
I certainly agree the plate does not have a spot in this list. I was honestly hesitant of even running greaves which are considerably better. In a more general centric build then perhaps I would run it.
@Phoenix I am a bit iffy on skullclamp because it hoses shirei 's ability. Then again the deck does not focus that heavily on her anyway. Which brings me to my next point. I am not sure that I really need to be running more creatures because I do not want the deck to be completely focused on the general. It is an interesting balancing act to say the least. It is possible I am running too few creatures to make shirei even partially effective but I am wary of running crits that cannot sac themselves to avoid playing more general focused cards than I need too.
Does that make sense? I am willing to try out some changes but I want it to play like MBC if that is possible.
Thank you for your help btw.
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I really don't like Goodstuff, which makes me a Self-Proclaimed EDH Hipster. I'm also an avid theory-crafter, most of which are terrible.
Firstly, I must say that I quite like the idea of a MBC deck using self-contained Shirei engines as utility. It never occurred to me that you could do Shirei any other way than all-in. So kudos for that.
There are a few changes in your one-power line up I'd probably make. I would argue that there is no point running anything that doesn't sacrifice itself, so I'd kick out Retriever and Diver. In their place, I would probably first go for Triskelavus and Thoughtpicker Witch, and also add Bone Shredder, and maybe Apprentice Necromancer, Heap Doll or Hell's Caretaker.
I'd just kick out the little artifact package (Spine, Wellspring, Ironworks, Core), it's too much work for too little reward. By the same token, Infernal Tribute doesn't do enough if you cut all the cards that need to be sacrificed.
In a similar vein, a few of your other instants and sorceries seem a bit limited. Why play Tendrils when it could be Exsanguinate, for example? GftT could be Plague Wind (as could BSZ, for that matter). That sort of thing.
Eye of Ugin seems a little bit awkward. If you want repeatable creature tutoring, I'd definitely spend the slot on Citanul Flute first.
The fetches aren't really doing much for you at the moment. The only thing you have to make good use of them is Top. But rather than cut them, I'd probably slip Crucible of Worlds in.
Darksteel Plate is not a bad idea, actually. The biggest weakness of a Shirei deck is Shirei. The worst thing that can happen is that you sacrifice a bunch of dudes only to have your general killed before the end of turn, stopping you from returning all those creatures. Shirei decks really need to run a lot of ways to protect the general, in my opinion.
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EDH Azami (video)
:symw::symb::symg: Teneb (video) Drana (video) (retired)
:symw::symr: Brion (video)
:symb::symr: Wort (video) Arcum (video) (retired)
:symr::symg: Stonebrow (video) BShirei (video) WURasputin (video) (retired) RUrabrask (video) WURZedruu (video) (retired) WIsamaru UBGrimgrin UMistform Ultimus (video) UBRGwendlyn (video) URGAnimar (video) RGThromok WBSelenia Standard WUGeist of Saint Traft standard EDH (video) (retired) WUB Battle of Wits!
Alright, Changes have been made. At viper's suggestion the artifact sub theme as been scrapped. I opted for some better cards instead of artifacts (grave pact instead of Nevinyrral's Disk). Basalt Monolith for an infinite combo with Rings instead of Mind stone and I added SoLS in as shirei protection since the deck relies on the general a bit more. I opted for the sword instead of plate because it felt like more relevant protection ( I am running BSZ and Decree of Pain) not to mention the ability provided by the sword is rather helpful. Most of the other cuts follow the suggestions made above.
I am still not completely sold on Plague wind and exsanguinate. They are strong MBC cards but I feel as thought Plague wind is a bit too expensive for a sweeper and exsanguinate can't damage creatures. Its creature if I have pulled off infinite mana,but otherwise I don't know if I can rationalize that.
and secondly what are thoughts on Pentavus now that I have added Triskelavus I am not sure how I feel about pentavus. It is one of my all time favorite cards, but I am not sure that it will shine.
and lastly, thoughts on Sheoldred? Its not in too many other MBC builds likely because it is a bit slow. I would consider replacing it with Steel Hellkite, which seems to be quite the winner in many other builds. Or perhaps another strong MBC finisher suggested above.
Thanks again for the help
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I really don't like Goodstuff, which makes me a Self-Proclaimed EDH Hipster. I'm also an avid theory-crafter, most of which are terrible.
I opted for the sword instead of plate because it felt like more relevant protection ( I am running BSZ and Decree of Pain) not to mention the ability provided by the sword is rather helpful.
I can't help but point out that protection from black stops neither of those cards.
I am still not completely sold on Plague wind and exsanguinate. They are strong MBC cards but I feel as thought Plague wind is a bit too expensive for a sweeper and exsanguinate can't damage creatures. Its creature if I have pulled off infinite mana,but otherwise I don't know if I can rationalize that.
9 for Plague Wind is nothing. Your deck doesn't look like it should have any problems generating that sort of mana. Exsanguinate not hitting creatures is neither here nor there, in my opinion, because it's at least going to be a 60-point life swing every time you cast it in a 4-player game. Seems eminently playable for one card. And if you get a solid Coffers engine or some mana doubling going, it is probably just going to kill the table.
and secondly what are thoughts on Pentavus now that I have added Triskelavus I am not sure how I feel about pentavus. It is one of my all time favorite cards, but I am not sure that it will shine.
I'd still run both. They're both way too good with Shirei to miss.
and lastly, thoughts on Sheoldred? Its not in too many other MBC builds likely because it is a bit slow. I would consider replacing it with Steel Hellkite, which seems to be quite the winner in many other builds. Or perhaps another strong MBC finisher suggested above.
Sheoldred's fine. Nothing amazing, and far worse than Geth, but fine. The Hellkite is also strong, though. If I were playing this deck, the fatties I'd make room for are Geth, Revenant, Titan, Hellkite, Sheoldred, Avatar and Visara. Yes, all of them. But maybe that's just my inner Timmy talking.
I can't help but point out that protection from black stops neither of those cards.
Oh yeah, I know. I was just saying that the -x/-x or -1/-1 counters get around plate, so if I am going to be vulnerable to my own removal I might as well benefit a bit from it. In reality, most of my removal, with the exception of Damnation and a hard cast decree of pain, are good against darksteel plate anyway.
Okay I'll leave pentavus in. If it tests poorly I will remove them but hopefully it wont. Would've loved to see another one of those cards printed in SOM.
I will try to find some space for Plague wind, exsanguinate and some of the creatures you mentions but I will be hard pressed because that is 4 more slots I need to find. All of those on top of Shirei win cons is going to kill my curve. I will see what I can do and Bump once I have made progress.
Only real change for the moment is Snuff Out instead of Slaughter, for pretty much the same cost, having removal while tapped out seems superior. I was also considering adding Dismember to my removal suite, if anyone has any experience with that card in EDH, I'd love to hear about it.
I run MBC with Ob Nix and I can certainly vouch for Geth, Revenant, Titan, Hellkite, and Sheoldred.
Also have a Shirei deck, but it is a stax build, not MBC.
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Current EDH Generals: WAvacyn, Angel of Hope|UAzami, Lady of Scrolls|B| Ob Nixilis, the Fallen|R Daretti, Scrap Savant|GEzuri, Renegade Leader|WUBrago, King Eternal|UBGrimgrin, Corpse-born|BR Wort, Boggart Auntie|RGUlasht, the Hate Seed|GW Captain Sisay|WBGhost Council of Orzhova|BGGlissa, the Traitor|GUExperiment Kraj|URMelek, Izzet Paragon RWJor Kadeen, the Prevailer|WBRKaalia of the Vast|GWBGhave, Guru of Spores|UBRMarchesa, the Black Rose
Retired WDarien, King of Kjeldor|RJaya Ballard, Task Mage|RNorin the Wary|GBMomir Vig, Simic Visionary|WUBRGSliver Overlord
Recently I played a few games with this deck and then made some changes and the played again and I'm not sure that they helped a whole lot. The deck does not do a whole lot the earlier turns, which is think is characteristic of most Shirei and MBC control builds, but I would prefer to have some reasonable plays before turn 5.
I am still fairly torn regarding Sheoldred v. Geth, because both seem like excellent cards, it is likely just a matter of play testing to see which I prefer.
I also am strongly considering cutting Mindlash sliver either for Mind Twist (my play group is pretty competitive, so that isn't a big deal) or another Shirei related discard card. I just couldn't stand the card disadvantage of discarding as well.
Thought? Opinions? Complaints?
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I really don't like Goodstuff, which makes me a Self-Proclaimed EDH Hipster. I'm also an avid theory-crafter, most of which are terrible.
I've made some major updates to the list, which means I have more questions. I would love to get some input on the new build.
Questions...
Bone Shredder v Big Game Hunter-Both have limited targets, which makes me uncomfortable. BGH seems like it will hit more things that bone shredder, unfortunately it doesn't kill itself nearly as well.
Triskelion v Triskelavus - I like triskelavus much better as a win con despite the required mana investment because I can swing with the tokens as well. Unfortunately, there is not a black transmute card for 7 which makes the card less accessible. Whichever loses is being cut for Sundering Titan.
Lastly CMC 4 or CMC 5 tutor package - I am very please with the other tutor packages I have but 5 is clearly the most limited. I love Batterskull to death and I think I would keep playing it even if cut the 5 CMC package. Gauntlet of power feels redundant with Caged sun and there are several cards I am really interested in at 4 (Temporal Extortion ect.)
So, there you have it. I await your input.
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I really don't like Goodstuff, which makes me a Self-Proclaimed EDH Hipster. I'm also an avid theory-crafter, most of which are terrible.
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Batterskull
1 Caged Sun
1 Coalition Relic
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Grim Monolith
1 Expedition Map
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mindslaver
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skull of Ramos
1 Sol Ring
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
Enchantments
1 Contamination
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Words of Waste
Creatures
1 Big Game Hunter
1 Duplicant
1 Geth, Lord of the Vault
1 Netherborn Phalanx
1 Nirkana Revenant
1 Pilgrim's Eye
1 Scarecrone
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Triskelion
1 Triskelavus
1 All Is Dust
1 Ashes to Ashes
1 Beseech the Queen
1 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Brainspoil
1 Bubbling Muck
1 Consume Spirit
1 Decree of Pain
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Dimir Machinations
1 Grim Tutor
1 Mind Twist
1 Night's Whisper
1 Profane Command
1 Promise of Power
1 Sadistic Sacrament
1 Sign in Blood
1 Yawgmoth's Will
Lands
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Deserted Temple
1 Lake of the Dead
1 Petrified Field
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Scrying Sheets
27 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Vesuva
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Imp's Mischief
1 Snuff Out
1 Shred Memory
1 Suffer the Past
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Withering Boon
Planeswalkers
1 Karn Liberated
1 Liliana Vess
1 Sorin Markov
0 Mana Crypt
1 Expedition Map
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Sol Ring
2 Grim Monolith
2 Lightning Greaves
3 Coalition Relic
3 Crucible of Worlds
3 Extraplanar Lens
3 Oblivion Stone
3 Rings of Brighthearth
3 Skull of Ramos
3 Sword of Feast and Famine
3 Basalt Monolith
5 Batterskull
5 Gauntlet of Power
6 Caged Sun
6 Mindslaver
Enchantments
3 Contamination
3 Phyrexian Arena
3 Words of Waste
Creatures
3 Big Game Hunter
3 Pilgrim's Eye
3 Scarecrone
5 Shriekmaw
6 Duplicant
6 Geth, Lord of the Vault
6 Netherborn Phalanx
6 Nirkana Revenant
6 Steel Hellkite
6 Triskelion
7 Triskelavus
1 Bubbling Muck
1 Mind Twist
2 Black Sun's Zenith
2 Demonic Tutor
2 Consume Spirit
2 Night's Whisper
2 Profane Command
2 Sign in Blood
3 Ashes to Ashes
3 Dimir Machinations
3 Grim Tutor
3 Sadistic Sacrament
3 Yawgmoth's Will
5 Brainspoil
6 Beseech the Queen
7 All Is Dust
8 Decree of Pain
Lands
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Deserted Temple
1 Lake of the Dead
1 Petrified Field
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Scrying Sheets
27 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Vesuva
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Suffer the Past
1 Vampiric Tutor
2 Go for the Throat
2 Imp's Mischief
2 Shred Memory
2 Withering Boon
4 Snuff Out
Planeswalkers
5 Liliana Vess
6 Sorin Markov
7 Karn Liberated
A very important aspect of this deck is the tutor suite. I have 4 transmute spells that form the shell of the tutoring in this deck. Each transmute spell is capable of transmuting for a hard tutor to generate some card advantage if necessary in the early game.
Several X spells make this package not as good for the early game, but grabbing monolith or greaves is never bad.
3 CMC- Dimir Machination - Cruel Tutor, Ashes to Ashes, Sad Sac, Yawg Win, Big Game Hunter, Pilgrim's Eye, Scarecrone, Contamination, Phyrexian Arena, Words of Waste,Coalition Relic, Crucible of Worlds, Extraplanar Lens, Oblivion Stone, Rings of Brighthearth, Skull of Ramos, Sword of Feast and Famine, Basalt Monolith
One of my favorite numbers to tutor at. Several 2 card combos at 3, phyrexian arena + Words of waste, Contamination + Scarecrone + Shirei, as well as effects that scale well for the late game like Sad Sac.
5 CMC - Brainspoil - Liliana Vess, Batterskull, Gauntlet of Power, Shriekmaw
Lacks the versatility of the other packages but still has early games plays like Shriekmaw as well as the Transmute spell being useful by itself.
6 CMC - Netherborn Phalanx - Beseech the Queen, Caged Sun, Mindslaver, Geth, Nirkana Revenant, Steel Hellkite, Triskelion, Sorin Markov
Second favorite tutor cmc. Keep in mind that you can usually play Beseech the Queen for 3, Very good in the early game if you don't have mana for a CMC 6 card.
As seen in the decklist, this deck does not function like a normal Shirei deck. There are only five creatures in the entire deck with power 1 or less. These 5 cards (4 of which are tutor-able with the transmute spells listed above) provide card advantage, creature destruction. a versatile wincon, and the ability to lock down the board. The remaining cards of the deck play mostly like the average MBC deck; removal, wraths, drain life spells, mana doubling and lots of color pie bleed.
Important Interactions
Words of Waste + Phyrexian Arena/(Scarecrone + Shirei) - This provides an effective way to empty your opponents hands late game with cards that will still good early game. Words of Waste is a great way to recycle a sign in blood late game when you already have a reasonable grip.
Contamination + any 1 power Creature + Shirei - while black is a prominent color in most metas (debatably the 2nd or 3rd best color), locking out all other colors can lock many players entirely out of the game. Unless your opponent is playing mono black, you will likely be able to severely debilitate opponents running black as a 2nd or 3rd color. Without the lock, contamination can essentially time walk many boards, buying time to tutor for an answer. Be aware that contamination does shut off Cabal Coffers.
Basalt Monolith + Rings of Brighthearth - Everyone knows it, nobody likes it but it works and Rings is great card for the deck so its in here.
1 Shirei, Shizo's Caretaker
Creatures For Shirei
1 Apprentice Necromancer
1 Bone Shredder
1 Mindlash Sliver
1 Mindless Automaton
1 Nezumi Bone-Reader
1 Pilgrim's Eye
1 Scarecrone
1 Thoughtpicker Witch
1 Triskelavus
1 Triskelion
MBC creatures
1 Duplicant
1 Geth, Lord of the Vault
1 Nirkana Revenant
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Sundering Titan
Artifacts
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Caged Sun
1 Coalition Relic
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Expedition Map
1 Extraplanar Lens
1 Gauntlet of Power
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mindslaver
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Skull of Ramos
1 Sol Ring
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Wayfarer's Bauble
1 Contamination
1 Grave Pact
1 Necropotence
1 Phyrexian Arena
Instants
1 Go for the Throat
1 Imp's Mischief
1 Snuff Out
1 Suffer the Past
1 Vampiric Tutor
Planeswalkers
1 Karn Liberated
1 Sorin Markov
Sorceries
1 All Is Dust
1 Ambition's Cost
1 Ashes to Ashes
1 Beseech the queen
1 Bubbling Muck
1 Consume Spirit
1 Damnation
1 Decree of Pain
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Diabolic Intent
1 Night's Whisper
1 Praetor's Grasp
1 Profane Command
1 Sign in Blood
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Cabal Coffers
1 Deserted Temple
1 Lake of the Dead
1 Marsh Flats
1 Petrified Field
1 Phyrexian Tower
1 Polluted Delta
1 Scrying Sheets
24 Snow-Covered Swamp
1 Thawing Glaciers
1 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Vesuva
1 Volrath's Stronghold
I played around with an artifact subtheme before changing this build, but it never seemed to work out as well as I liked. The value wasn't worth the number of card slots spent on it in my opinion. viperesque has cool artifact shirei build if that is your interest (HERE!).
5/30
- Mind Stone +basalt Monolith
-Spine of Ish shah + Karn Liberated
-Viscera Seer +Thoughtpicker witch
-Junk Diver +Triskelavus
-Myr retriever +apprentice necromancer
-Phyrexia's Core + Vesuva
-Mycosynth wellspring + crucible of worlds
-Infernal tribune + moonlight bargain
-Insidious dreams + ambition's cost
-liliana vess + beseech the queen
-N Disk + grave pact
-Eye of Ugin +bone shredder
-Krark-Clan Ironworks + Sword of Light and Shadow
So MBC and Shirei players (or just other members of the community) I would love to have your input on this build.
BBBMBC Shirei StyleBBB
URUNiv-Mizzet, Warp WorldURU
BGRKresh the BloodbraidedBGR
Dimir House Guard gives you a creature sac outlet and doubles as a tutor for cmc 4
I love Braids, but she tends to get removed pretty quick. Awesome with some Greaves though.
Abyssal Gatekeeper, Big Game Hunter, and Bone Shredder have nice ETB removal that can recur with sac outlet + Shirei
Kiku, Night's Flower and Royal Assassin are tech with Rings
Since you already have rings, throw in Basalt Monolith to produce infinite colorless mana and kill the table with Exsanguinate, or take out a player with Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief or Profane Command.
Marsh Flitter has potential to recur for goblin tokens. Tokens + sac outlet can set up a powerful removal engine with Grave Pact and Butcher of Malakir.
Skullclamp could be very tech in this build too.
If you up the creature count to maximize the effectiveness of your general, I would look at High Market, Attrition, Phyrexian Tower, and Miren, the Moaning Well. If you wanted to stay with an artifact theme, these work as sac outlets too:
Helm of possession
Mortarpod
Ashnod's Alter
Phyrexian Alter
Eldrazi Monument
Modern
RBig RedR
GMean GreenG
WWW AlliesW
BGScavengeBG
WUVenser SilenceWU
EDH
RWAurelia 1 vs 1RW
GWURoonGWU
GWSaffiGW
You wanna tell me you FORGOT the best equipment/artifact in the whole shirei deck?!!
You forgot Darksteel plate ?!
Neheb
Marath
Yidris
Sharuum
Yidris
I guess you could make the argument that every general should have buff equipment, but good luck trying to convince the EDH community that these are auto-includes.
Alot of the creatures with ETB effects you WANT to die and don't want any equipment on them.
Even the other power 1 creatures are good to have die if the deck is running Braids, Grave Pact, and Butcher of Malakir. Why would you pay 2 mana to equip indestructibility on fodder?
The only equips you want are Greaves and Skullclamp, unless your playgroup runs alot of artfact hate and you need some backup protection for your commander - then yes, maybe add some Darksteel or a Cloak.
Otherwise, I fail to see what the Plate has to do with this build.
Modern
RBig RedR
GMean GreenG
WWW AlliesW
BGScavengeBG
WUVenser SilenceWU
EDH
RWAurelia 1 vs 1RW
GWURoonGWU
GWSaffiGW
@Phoenix I am a bit iffy on skullclamp because it hoses shirei 's ability. Then again the deck does not focus that heavily on her anyway. Which brings me to my next point. I am not sure that I really need to be running more creatures because I do not want the deck to be completely focused on the general. It is an interesting balancing act to say the least. It is possible I am running too few creatures to make shirei even partially effective but I am wary of running crits that cannot sac themselves to avoid playing more general focused cards than I need too.
Does that make sense? I am willing to try out some changes but I want it to play like MBC if that is possible.
Thank you for your help btw.
BBBMBC Shirei StyleBBB
URUNiv-Mizzet, Warp WorldURU
BGRKresh the BloodbraidedBGR
I think that about wraps it up. Hope that's helpful.
EDH
Azami (video)
:symw::symb::symg: Teneb (video)
Drana (video) (retired)
:symw::symr: Brion (video)
:symb::symr: Wort (video)
Arcum (video) (retired)
:symr::symg: Stonebrow (video)
B Shirei (video)
WU Rasputin (video) (retired)
R Urabrask (video)
WUR Zedruu (video) (retired)
W Isamaru
UB Grimgrin
U Mistform Ultimus (video)
UBR Gwendlyn (video)
URG Animar (video)
RG Thromok
WB Selenia
Standard
WU Geist of Saint Traft standard EDH (video) (retired)
WUB Battle of Wits!
I am still not completely sold on Plague wind and exsanguinate. They are strong MBC cards but I feel as thought Plague wind is a bit too expensive for a sweeper and exsanguinate can't damage creatures. Its creature if I have pulled off infinite mana,but otherwise I don't know if I can rationalize that.
and secondly what are thoughts on Pentavus now that I have added Triskelavus I am not sure how I feel about pentavus. It is one of my all time favorite cards, but I am not sure that it will shine.
and lastly, thoughts on Sheoldred? Its not in too many other MBC builds likely because it is a bit slow. I would consider replacing it with Steel Hellkite, which seems to be quite the winner in many other builds. Or perhaps another strong MBC finisher suggested above.
Thanks again for the help
BBBMBC Shirei StyleBBB
URUNiv-Mizzet, Warp WorldURU
BGRKresh the BloodbraidedBGR
9 for Plague Wind is nothing. Your deck doesn't look like it should have any problems generating that sort of mana. Exsanguinate not hitting creatures is neither here nor there, in my opinion, because it's at least going to be a 60-point life swing every time you cast it in a 4-player game. Seems eminently playable for one card. And if you get a solid Coffers engine or some mana doubling going, it is probably just going to kill the table.
I'd still run both. They're both way too good with Shirei to miss.
Sheoldred's fine. Nothing amazing, and far worse than Geth, but fine. The Hellkite is also strong, though. If I were playing this deck, the fatties I'd make room for are Geth, Revenant, Titan, Hellkite, Sheoldred, Avatar and Visara. Yes, all of them. But maybe that's just my inner Timmy talking.
Oh yeah, I know. I was just saying that the -x/-x or -1/-1 counters get around plate, so if I am going to be vulnerable to my own removal I might as well benefit a bit from it. In reality, most of my removal, with the exception of Damnation and a hard cast decree of pain, are good against darksteel plate anyway.
Okay I'll leave pentavus in. If it tests poorly I will remove them but hopefully it wont. Would've loved to see another one of those cards printed in SOM.
I will try to find some space for Plague wind, exsanguinate and some of the creatures you mentions but I will be hard pressed because that is 4 more slots I need to find. All of those on top of Shirei win cons is going to kill my curve. I will see what I can do and Bump once I have made progress.
Only real change for the moment is Snuff Out instead of Slaughter, for pretty much the same cost, having removal while tapped out seems superior. I was also considering adding Dismember to my removal suite, if anyone has any experience with that card in EDH, I'd love to hear about it.
BBBMBC Shirei StyleBBB
URUNiv-Mizzet, Warp WorldURU
BGRKresh the BloodbraidedBGR
Also have a Shirei deck, but it is a stax build, not MBC.
W Avacyn, Angel of Hope|U Azami, Lady of Scrolls|B | Ob Nixilis, the Fallen|R Daretti, Scrap Savant|G Ezuri, Renegade Leader|WUBrago, King Eternal|UB Grimgrin, Corpse-born|BR Wort, Boggart Auntie|RG Ulasht, the Hate Seed|GW Captain Sisay|WB Ghost Council of Orzhova|BG Glissa, the Traitor|GU Experiment Kraj|UR Melek, Izzet Paragon
RW Jor Kadeen, the Prevailer|WBR Kaalia of the Vast|GWB Ghave, Guru of Spores|UBR Marchesa, the Black Rose
Retired
WDarien, King of Kjeldor|R Jaya Ballard, Task Mage|R Norin the Wary|GB Momir Vig, Simic Visionary|WUBRG Sliver Overlord
With that in mind I made the following changes:
-Arcbound Reclaimer +Coalition Relic
-Braids, Cabal Minion +Mana Crypt
-Pentavus +Skull of Ramos
-Moonlight Bargain +Lake of the Dead ( I was uncomfortable counting LotD as a land in my count)
-Tendrils of Corruption +Bubbling Muck
-Corrupt + Phyrexian Tower
-Sheoldred + Geth, Lord of the Vault
I am still fairly torn regarding Sheoldred v. Geth, because both seem like excellent cards, it is likely just a matter of play testing to see which I prefer.
I also am strongly considering cutting Mindlash sliver either for Mind Twist (my play group is pretty competitive, so that isn't a big deal) or another Shirei related discard card. I just couldn't stand the card disadvantage of discarding as well.
Thought? Opinions? Complaints?
BBBMBC Shirei StyleBBB
URUNiv-Mizzet, Warp WorldURU
BGRKresh the BloodbraidedBGR
I've made some major updates to the list, which means I have more questions. I would love to get some input on the new build.
Questions...
Bone Shredder v Big Game Hunter-Both have limited targets, which makes me uncomfortable. BGH seems like it will hit more things that bone shredder, unfortunately it doesn't kill itself nearly as well.
Triskelion v Triskelavus - I like triskelavus much better as a win con despite the required mana investment because I can swing with the tokens as well. Unfortunately, there is not a black transmute card for 7 which makes the card less accessible. Whichever loses is being cut for Sundering Titan.
Lastly CMC 4 or CMC 5 tutor package - I am very please with the other tutor packages I have but 5 is clearly the most limited. I love Batterskull to death and I think I would keep playing it even if cut the 5 CMC package. Gauntlet of power feels redundant with Caged sun and there are several cards I am really interested in at 4 (Temporal Extortion ect.)
So, there you have it. I await your input.
BBBMBC Shirei StyleBBB
URUNiv-Mizzet, Warp WorldURU
BGRKresh the BloodbraidedBGR