Also, if looking at lists is getting tiring, here's a video of the list http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQSVHNPi0As (NEEDS TO BE UPDATED; I plan on doing this once I get some cards back from being painted).
Karador has a very powerful recursion ability and gets discounted by the number of creatures in your yard. This deck has been built to help with the discount and abuse his ability as much as possible. It's like an Animar deck that uses the yard in that many of our spell effects are tacked onto creatures. The difference is that quite a few of our creatures either have to be sacrificed to activate their abilities or have something like echo so they die fairly quickly to "ramp" out Karador.
Pretty much you ramp, play stuff, fill your yard but don't overextend (grave hate is a thing, apperantly), and use your plentiful tutors to answer anything your opponents are doing. It sounds simple but it might not be. Usually if you lose, it was a play mistake on your part. I still find myself making these even after all the months I've been playing it. But the deck is resilient and, if played right, can pull through some nasty crap.
On Hermit Druid and his Place Within this Particular Build:
As you may see, I run nine basic lands in a deck that runs Hermit Druid. This is pointed out within the comments of this thread and is a question of how competetive a deck is in most people's eyes. This deck is semi-competetive and seeks to use Hermit Druid in much the same way you might use Golgari Grave-Troll. He simply helps fill my yard. I don't plan to use him as an "I win if I untap with this" card, especially when I am shying away from combo kills in this deck.
Not only am I trying to not overextend with the Druid, but I must also maintain a certain amount of Plains and Forests to sac off to Knight of the Reliquary, who is a very useful land tutor. Her significance will increase as I find room for and get the funds for better/more utility lands (i.e. Maze of Ith) so I don't want to cut her.
I hope that this gives you all an idea of where I'm at with this guy. He CAN be used to great effect in this manner. He does win me games. He just isn't an auto-win, which makes games more interactive and fun.
Obscure Card Choices:
There are a few card choices in here that people might think to themselves "Why did you ..? That card is crap! Why is it here!?" or "Hm, that's interesting. I wonder why that's there. Maybe there's a section that tells me why." This section will explain those.
Order of Whiteclay: In the five months I've been playing this deck I think I've only cast this guy once or twice. The reason he's in here is to combo with Necrotic Ooze in the yard. Usually I use other peoples' tap abilities or if I have lots of mana I use Fauna Shaman. This creates an expensive, but powerful "tutor to the field" combo.
Loaming Shaman: There is better grave hate out there and I know this. But mine's Japanese! Also, there are some things, like the above combo and Necromancy, which can reanimate him at instant speed to potentially save our own yard from hate so he is talented in multiple ways.
Golgari Rot Farm: This is not for mana. I cannot stress how much I despise karoo lands as mana sources. It's just a personal thing. I've had enough blown up and blown enough up, myself, to know that it isn't really worth it. What this guy is in here for is reusing Bojuka Bog and saving utility lands with things like Crop Rotation. Not my idea, though. The idea is hiding in the comments of one of the lists in the intro. I lost the will to look so sorry. I'll look later and site the contributor like I should.
Martyred Rusalka: Another card I stole from comments in other threads. I have a good friend who loves him some Kaalia of the Vast and we have a lot of green decks romping around with things like Primeval Titan. She stops those stupic attack triggers and furthers my goal to wean down on Lark combos without taking out the pieces.
Dawntreader Elk?!?!: Yes, this is a wonky Sakura-Tribe Elder. Yes, I took out a card that gives me more card advantage and is proven to be good. However, in my conquest to be able to screw with my opponents as much as possible, I cut a little too far into my ramp. Yavimaya Elder is not ramp. He is land-drop assurance. This guy is ramp. Also, I want Birthing Pod to be good and 3cc is where most of my answers are. Dawntreader Elk can be eaten to get there. And yes, I do know that I get card advantage from eating Yavimaya Elder with the Pod, but I really think it's not as needed. I also want Hermit Druid to not dump half my deck into a Relic of Progenitus. The Elk takes less basics so this is less of a happening. I hope this makes sense and isn't completely off-base. You never know until you try!
Entomb:Not really obscure, just not used enough. I honestly do not know why more people don't run this card in Karador. It is so good. At instant speed, just before your turn, you can poop a Survival of the Fittest (or nearly any artifact or enchantment; also spells for E. Wit.) into your yard to bring back with Sun Tian, or any creature you want to rip out with any of the plentiful recursion pieces at your disposal. I don't know. Maybe tutors aren't good when they are in-strategy and instant speed. (In reality it's probably because it's expensive and not everyone bought Graveborn)
Necrotic Ooze: The ooze is quite useful in here as a way to use abilities in others' decks or to make neat little combos as I mentioned with Order of Whiteclay. He can also do Magus of the Disk/Dauntless Escort duty among other things.
Why isn't this Here?!?!?:
Tooth and Nail: This is partly due to my not having one. Also it is unsynergistic with Teeg (from here on out think of this guy befor suggesting Gen. Wave, Damnation or any other spell that's an "auto-include"{NON-EXISTENT!!}) and I'm just not the hugest fan of "Oh, T&N. I win!
Avenger of Zendikar: I want my win conditions to do more than just be win conditions. Avenger is only a win condition.
Sensei's Divining Top: The deck can be mana hungry. Also, it hurts when you find both this and Sylvan Library because one becomes nearly useless (Top). Finally, the list is tight as is and I figured it was better off as another tutor or answer and whatnot.
Angel of Despair/Acidic Slime: These two actually came out for the Sliver coupling which can be reused by our conditional recursion. Also, Necrotic sliver is cheaper overall and can stagger its effect and use its Harmonic friend as well.
Stinkweed Imp/Golgari Grave-Troll/Other dredge stuff: I'm not all in on dredge in here, partly because I don't want to cut good cards for them because they don't do enough imo, and partly because I'm just not their biggest fan. I'd rather stick to my Hermit Druid who usually gets me something I want RIGHT NOW and LftL which has other things it can be abused with (cycle lands, Strip Mine, etc.).
Pull from Eternity/Riftsweeper: I can see the thought behind these guys but I just don't have the room for them. Also, PfE is a spell, making it a bit harder to abuse in the event we need multiple things pulled out of eternity and Riftsweeper is only really good if we have Survival, imo. Like I said, I understand, I just don't think highly of them. Edit: these will probably be tested here soon just to check my thoughts on them.
So there you have it. If you have any questions, comments, suggestions, concerns, religious experiences, gossip, or Taco Bell, feel free to leave it here.
-Sadistic Hypnotist(really mean and not instant speed sac outlet) +Viscera Seer(trying him out again)
-Meteor Crater +Entomb(this has been in my list and somehow didn't get on here)
2/26
-Seedborn Muse +Necromancy
-Mentor of the Meek +Animate Dead
-Tilling Treefolk +Life from the loam
-lands +other lands
3/19
-Viscera Seer +Martyred Rrusalka
-Yavimaya Elder +Dawntreader Elk
-Avatar of Woe +Archon of Justice
I don't see what seedborn muse is going to do for you when you have almost no instant speed abilities and almost all come into play effects. Sure untapping your creatures is cool, but especially with all of the damage mitigation you have, it doesn't need the spot IMO.
I don't see what seedborn muse is going to do for you when you have almost no instant speed abilities and almost all come into play effects. Sure untapping your creatures is cool, but especially with all of the damage mitigation you have, it doesn't need the spot IMO.
It is true that Seedborn is normally not amazing, however, I devote a lot to the Ooze/Shaman/Order combo which eats a lot of mana. The Muse just lets me do it more. I may eventually take it out after further testing, however.
Lotus Cobra was a filler and will possibly come out for Vorinclex. I've really been shy of him in EDH for some reason. I guess with the amount of recursion I'm packing, though, I can probably make him stick after a while. Thanks for the suggestions!
No, no Vorinclex. You of all people should know what happens to you when you play him. Also, Saffi Eriksdotter will eat your soul and should be in any GW EDH deck. Jackalope Herd
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's kinda like both were printed with "Bear" as the first ability, and one was errata'd to "Support Weight" the other was errata'd to "Large Furry Animal". Both are correct, depending on the context
Great List! I’ve been working on my own Karador list for quite some time, here’s a few Ideas:
I play Crop Rotation over Expedition map. You may have to sacrifice a land but you get you utility at instant speed which can be really powerful. If you can you should also get a Homeward Path then you can basically counter any steel effects with Crop Rotation.
Dimir House Guard seems much better than Viscera Seer. It also is a sac outlet but even better: it lets you tutor for four-drops like necrotic Ooze, Oracle of Mul-Daya or Day of Judgment. Another powerful 4cmc option to consider is Birthing Pod, which not only lets you get your creatures in the GY but can also chain powerfull ETB effects together.
Another Guy not too many people seem to like in Karador is Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter but I found him amazing. He not only lets you sacrifice your Creatures but provides lifegain, heavy beatings and, most important, repeatable removal that even lets you get around indestructability.
Last but not least: Rune-Scarred Demon. What’s not to like about easily recurrable Demonic Tutors on fat flyers? He's even cheap to pick up.
I also have a question: How have Phyrexian Revoker and True Believer been for you? Gravehate is obviously a huge problem for Karador and while these two carry obvious answers I’m worried that they are much to fragile.
Great List! I’ve been working on my own Karador list for quite some time, here’s a few Ideas:
I play Crop Rotation over Expedition map. You may have to sacrifice a land but you get you utility at instant speed which can be really powerful. If you can you should also get a Homeward Path then you can basically counter any steel effects with Crop Rotation.
Thanks for reminding me about the Rotation. I just get engrained sometimes with cards and Map is on of them. Instant speed grave hate on others could be sweet. As for Homeward Path, my playgroup doesn't really run stealing. We either bounce or kill stuff normally so my Path is super underused:frown:.
Dimir House Guard seems much better than Viscera Seer. It also is a sac outlet but even better: it lets you tutor for four-drops like necrotic Ooze, Oracle of Mul-Daya or Day of Judgment. Another powerful 4cmc option to consider is Birthing Pod, which not only lets you get your creatures in the GY but can also chain powerfull ETB effects together.
I do love transmute but Seer works over and over again whereas the Guard is a one shot thing. The deck usually has enough tutors to get what it wants. I may put in Houseguard after I test it a bit, however, I will run both in that instance.
For Birthing Pod, my friend and I were just postulating the amazing that could come of that card. The only sad thing is I traded mine when it ran at $4 and now it's $12 so it may be harder to get:mad:.
Another Guy not too many people seem to like in Karador is Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter but I found him amazing. He not only lets you sacrifice your Creatures but provides lifegain, heavy beatings and, most important, repeatable removal that even lets you get around indestructability.
Vish Kal seems like he could be amazing and I will probably test him. The reason I didn't throw him inn the Original list is because he is very expensive. Now that you bring him up I realize that his ability can be used from the yard with Ooze so he may be a little better than I thought. I will admit that he made me not lose a few times when this was a Ghave deck.
Last but not least: Rune-Scarred Demon. What’s not to like about easily recurrable Demonic Tutors on fat flyers? He's even cheap to pick up.
I've been disinclined to use this guy for mana reasons as well as the fact that we run a lot of Clone friends in my meta. I'll test him now because I sort of forgot of his existence due to this un-want but there are a few sac outlets available so he may be good.
I also have a question: How have Phyrexian Revoker and True Believer been for you? Gravehate is obviously a huge problem for Karador and while these two carry obvious answers I’m worried that they are much to fragile.
In my meta, these guys are great. The main thing I worry about is that Relic of Progenitus exists. It really is the main thing Revoker calls and can't be thwarted by poping out Believer at instant speed via Order. In a theoretical sense they are briliant even in a world with Relic and I've found they are worth having in real world play. Do mind, however, that I am in a grave-hate light meta so you may find them to be sub par or not enough grave-hate hate.
Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll have to test them in the near future.
Edit: Phyrexian Revoker is amazing. Don't listen to me in this post
lol at your meta, ian. Why are you running multiples of random stuff?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
It's kinda like both were printed with "Bear" as the first ability, and one was errata'd to "Support Weight" the other was errata'd to "Large Furry Animal". Both are correct, depending on the context
It's kinda like both were printed with "Bear" as the first ability, and one was errata'd to "Support Weight" the other was errata'd to "Large Furry Animal". Both are correct, depending on the context
It's kinda like both were printed with "Bear" as the first ability, and one was errata'd to "Support Weight" the other was errata'd to "Large Furry Animal". Both are correct, depending on the context
I decided to test Splinterfright. He's easy to cast, can be returned with sun titan and puts lands and creatures into the GY. Plus he can can get a scary beater.
I decided to test Splinterfright. He's easy to cast, can be returned with sun titan and puts lands and creatures into the GY. Plus he can can get a scary beater.
He could be one scary beater, that's for sure. Plus he can come back with Sun Titan (and Order in my deck.)
What do you all think about Mentor of the Meek in here? I pulled one out of Innistad and am thnking about testing him. I can draw off of a quarter of the deck. Is that not enough or okay?
He seems really solid but the real question is do you need more card advantage and if so is he better than Necropotence or some other draw you could run like Phyrexian Arena?
He seems really solid but the real question is do you need more card advantage and if so is he better than Necropotence or some other draw you could run like Phyrexian Arena?
I'm thinking about cutting my Sylvan proxy. My playgroup is very close and we have a rule that if one of us owns a card, the others can proxy it. I don't own the Sylvan and would like to replace the proxy(even if Mentor is worse) because it is more aesthetically pleasing than a written on Traumatic Visions.
First off, I would like to say thank you for mentioning my primer in your intro. I'm glad I could help you out, and I'm always happy to see more people enjoying Karador. As to your list, there are some things in here that I'm considering for myself, which is pretty impressive. As to things you may want, Phyrexian Arena, Bloodgift Demon, and Karmic Guide are some pretty amazing cards, and I highly recommend them.
First off, I would like to say thank you for mentioning my primer in your intro. I'm glad I could help you out, and I'm always happy to see more people enjoying Karador. As to your list, there are some things in here that I'm considering for myself, which is pretty impressive. As to things you may want, Phyrexian Arena, Bloodgift Demon, and Karmic Guide are some pretty amazing cards, and I highly recommend them.
Yeah I've been in the need of the Demon. He seems so amazing(tutorable Arenas normally seem to be.) I have Guide on my watchlist. It's mostly because I traded mine a few months ago and now noone has one and I already shelled out $45 to have my Animar and Karador get extended borders so another $10 is a bit for a semi-tightwad. Arena is also being considered.
I'm also trying to find an Urza's Greater Good to replace my Kami of False Hope because my playgroup gets a little annoyed sometimes with the recurrable Fogs. Cutting to one seems good (even though I've been told that I may not necessarily need more card advantageous cards.) Just throwing the idea out for opinions. Also, thank you all for your comments and feedback.
Is Bloodgift demon better than Graveborn Muse?
Also I don't really understand why you run fecundity. I mean sure you have a lot of creatures dying all the time but with sweeps and repeatable spot removal your opponents have to. It seems to be a very double edged sword...
Also you could run spike weaver instead of the spore frog. It it may cost more mana but has multiple activations.
Splinterfright has been great so far it sometimes feels like drawing three cards per turn. The only problem I have with him is that he doesn't stay alive without another creature in the yard.
EDIT: Mentor of the Meek seems very interesting. Test him and post the results ;-)
Is Bloodgift demon better than Graveborn Muse?
Also I don't really understand why you run fecundity. I mean sure you have a lot of creatures dying all the time but with sweeps and repeatable spot removal your opponents have to. It seems to be a very double edged sword...
Also you could run spike weaver instead of the spore frog. It it may cost more mana but has multiple activations.
Splinterfright has been great so far it sometimes feels like drawing three cards per turn. The only problem I have with him is that he doesn't stay alive without another creature in the yard.
EDIT: Mentor of the Meek seems very interesting. Test him and post the results ;-)
In the sense that he bashes for 5 in the air, yea, the Demon is better.
Niether Muse nor Demon can get hit with my conditional recursion so they are on the same plane there. The fact that Demon is 1 more mana for 2 more power and evasiveness makes it better.
On Fecundity, I'm not playing a cutthroat playgroup so little things like this help in a multiplayer match. It may seem counterproductive but I don't want to be a total a**.
On Spike Weaver, I like Spore Frog better because conditional recursion can get him(at instant speed in some situations) but not Weaver. Also, HE'S JUST SO CUTE!
On Splinterfright, I'm glad to hear you had some success with him. I haven't had the chance to get one yet so I am not on to testing yet.
@ Everyone
thanks again for all the ideas and comments. I hope that I've been of any help to you.
Even tough you have more activated abilies in your deck, than most other lists i'd say rings of brightenearth isn't worth it, first of all it's no creature, which is a downside with Karador. Also imo a permanent has to either give you some value upon casting or etb or have a really relevant effect (especially if it isn't a creature which at least give you the value of having a blocker).
On another note: I got a Mentor of the Meek on the cheaps and thought I might as well test him. I removed Greater Good for him and so far havn't looked back. Especially early in the game (before you can drop Karador) he's great to keep your hand filled with options. Plus he's a creature with cmc 3 and power 2, so he fits all reanimation criteria ;-)
Also: have you had any experience with Novablast Wurm? I have to admit on reason I'd want him is that I really like the art but repeatable wraths are without question powerful, especially with Dauntless Escort. On the other hand he takes a turn to activate (that is without lightening greaves out).
Also, if looking at lists is getting tiring, here's a video of the list http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gQSVHNPi0As (NEEDS TO BE UPDATED; I plan on doing this once I get some cards back from being painted).
So there you have it. If you have any questions, comments, suggestions, concerns, religious experiences, gossip, or Taco Bell, feel free to leave it here.
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card Advantage-Phyrexian Rebirth +Magus of the Disk
-Swamp +Saffi Eriksdotter
-Acidic Slime +Harmonic Sliver
-Angel of Despair +Necrotic Sliver
-Archon of Justice +Mother of Runes
-Lotus Cobra +Vorinclex
-Expedition Map +Crop Rotation
-Beseech the Queen +Rune-scarred Demon
-Reliquary Tower, Llanowar Wastes, Brushland, Tectonic Edge +2 Forest, 1 Plains, 1 Swamp
10/19
-Kami of False Hope +Graveborn Muse
-Plains +High Market
2/1
-Reanimate +Karmic Guide
-Garruk +Birthing Pod
-Glory +Sadistic Hypnotist
-3 Swamp +Meteor Crater, Wooded Bastion, Fetid Heath
-Vivid Lands +Relevant Painlands
2/16
-Meteor Crater +Entomb(this has been in my list and somehow didn't get on here)
-Mentor of the Meek +Animate Dead
-Tilling Treefolk +Life from the loam
-lands +other lands
3/19
-Yavimaya Elder +Dawntreader Elk
-Avatar of Woe +Archon of Justice
3/24
-Fierce Empath +Wood Elves
-Mother of Runes +Fleshbag Marauder
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageI'd cut one or two of Birds of Paradise, Sakura-Tribe Elder, Lotus Cobra and put in Akroma's Memorial (Win con with genesis wave) and Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger. Paints a super big target on your face, but he ends games.
It is true that Seedborn is normally not amazing, however, I devote a lot to the Ooze/Shaman/Order combo which eats a lot of mana. The Muse just lets me do it more. I may eventually take it out after further testing, however.
Lotus Cobra was a filler and will possibly come out for Vorinclex. I've really been shy of him in EDH for some reason. I guess with the amount of recursion I'm packing, though, I can probably make him stick after a while. Thanks for the suggestions!
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageMy EDH decks:
BRKaervek the Merciless (unfinished)BR
I play Crop Rotation over Expedition map. You may have to sacrifice a land but you get you utility at instant speed which can be really powerful. If you can you should also get a Homeward Path then you can basically counter any steel effects with Crop Rotation.
Dimir House Guard seems much better than Viscera Seer. It also is a sac outlet but even better: it lets you tutor for four-drops like necrotic Ooze, Oracle of Mul-Daya or Day of Judgment. Another powerful 4cmc option to consider is Birthing Pod, which not only lets you get your creatures in the GY but can also chain powerfull ETB effects together.
Another Guy not too many people seem to like in Karador is Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter but I found him amazing. He not only lets you sacrifice your Creatures but provides lifegain, heavy beatings and, most important, repeatable removal that even lets you get around indestructability.
Last but not least: Rune-Scarred Demon. What’s not to like about easily recurrable Demonic Tutors on fat flyers? He's even cheap to pick up.
Anyway here’s my list for reference:
General: Karador, Ghost Chieftain
Creatures (33)
2 Stoneforge Mystic
2 Fauna Shaman
2 Sakura-Tribe Elder
2 Sylvan Ranger
2 Saffi Eriksdotter
2 Quasali Pridemage
3 Knight of the Reliquary
3 Dauntless Escort
3 Eternal Witness
3 Yavimaya Elder
3 Fleshbag Marauder
3 Big Game Hunter
3 Wood Elves
3 Harmonic Sliver
3 Necrotic Sliver
3 Fierence Empath
4 Oracle of Mul-Daya
4 Spike Weaver
4 Dimir House-Guard
4 Magus of the Disc
5 Acidic Slime
5 Archon of Justice
5 Reveillark
6 Sun Titan
6 Yosei, the Morning Star
6 Teneb, the Harvester
7 Angel of Despair
7 Rune-Scarred Demon
7 Sheoldred, the Whispering One
7 Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter
8 Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger
9 Iona, Shield of Emeria
1 Sol Ring
1 Sklullclamp
2 Golgari Signet
2 Selesnya Signet
2 Lightening Greaves
3 Loxodon Warhammer
3 Darksteel Plate
3 Oblivion Stone
4 Greater Good
4 Birthing Pod
4 Garruk Wildspeaker
Instants/Sorceries (18)
1 Path to Exile
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Crop Rotation
2 Demonic Tutor
2 Life From the Loam
2 Eldamris Call
3 Buried Alive
3 Kodamas Reach
3 Cultivate
3 Beast Within
3 Chord of Calling
3 Genesis Wave
4 Day of Judgement
5 Rout
6 Austere Command
7 Tooth and Nail
8 Decree of Pain
1 Tranquil Thicket
1 Secluded Steppe
1 Barren Moor
1 Bojuka Bog
1 Seriji Steppe
1 High Market
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Homeward Path
1 Temple of the False God
1 Murmuring Bosk
1 Command Tower
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Marsh Flats
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Wooded Bastion
1 Sunpetal Grove
1 Stirring Wildwood
1 Golgari Rot-Farm
1 Selesnya Santuary
8 Forest
4 Swamp
4 Plains
I also have a question: How have Phyrexian Revoker and True Believer been for you? Gravehate is obviously a huge problem for Karador and while these two carry obvious answers I’m worried that they are much to fragile.
GWKarametra - The MistveiledGW
GWR Marath - The Egg-laying Wool-Milk-Pig GWR
RBGrenzo - Restrained RakdosRB
UWRGBHorde of NotionsUWRGB
Retired: Karador, Ghost Chieftain | Rafiq of the Many | Animar, Soul of Elements | Maelstrom Wanderer
Thanks for reminding me about the Rotation. I just get engrained sometimes with cards and Map is on of them. Instant speed grave hate on others could be sweet. As for Homeward Path, my playgroup doesn't really run stealing. We either bounce or kill stuff normally so my Path is super underused:frown:.
I do love transmute but Seer works over and over again whereas the Guard is a one shot thing. The deck usually has enough tutors to get what it wants. I may put in Houseguard after I test it a bit, however, I will run both in that instance.
For Birthing Pod, my friend and I were just postulating the amazing that could come of that card. The only sad thing is I traded mine when it ran at $4 and now it's $12 so it may be harder to get:mad:.
Vish Kal seems like he could be amazing and I will probably test him. The reason I didn't throw him inn the Original list is because he is very expensive. Now that you bring him up I realize that his ability can be used from the yard with Ooze so he may be a little better than I thought. I will admit that he made me not lose a few times when this was a Ghave deck.
I've been disinclined to use this guy for mana reasons as well as the fact that we run a lot of Clone friends in my meta. I'll test him now because I sort of forgot of his existence due to this un-want but there are a few sac outlets available so he may be good.
In my meta, these guys are great. The main thing I worry about is that Relic of Progenitus exists. It really is the main thing Revoker calls and can't be thwarted by poping out Believer at instant speed via Order. In a theoretical sense they are briliant even in a world with Relic and I've found they are worth having in real world play. Do mind, however, that I am in a grave-hate light meta so you may find them to be sub par or not enough grave-hate hate.
Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll have to test them in the near future.
Edit: Phyrexian Revoker is amazing. Don't listen to me in this post
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageMy EDH decks:
BRKaervek the Merciless (unfinished)BR
What do you mean by "multiples"?
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageI mean the card numbers
My EDH decks:
BRKaervek the Merciless (unfinished)BR
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageMy EDH decks:
BRKaervek the Merciless (unfinished)BR
No issues. Also Updated the OP with deck stats. Currently testing new ideas presented earlier.
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageGWKarametra - The MistveiledGW
GWR Marath - The Egg-laying Wool-Milk-Pig GWR
RBGrenzo - Restrained RakdosRB
UWRGBHorde of NotionsUWRGB
Retired: Karador, Ghost Chieftain | Rafiq of the Many | Animar, Soul of Elements | Maelstrom Wanderer
He could be one scary beater, that's for sure. Plus he can come back with Sun Titan (and Order in my deck.)
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card Advantagen0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageI'm thinking about cutting my Sylvan proxy. My playgroup is very close and we have a rule that if one of us owns a card, the others can proxy it. I don't own the Sylvan and would like to replace the proxy(even if Mentor is worse) because it is more aesthetically pleasing than a written on Traumatic Visions.
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageWBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain
Yeah I've been in the need of the Demon. He seems so amazing(tutorable Arenas normally seem to be.) I have Guide on my watchlist. It's mostly because I traded mine a few months ago and now noone has one and I already shelled out $45 to have my Animar and Karador get extended borders so another $10 is a bit for a semi-tightwad. Arena is also being considered.
I'm also trying to find an Urza's Greater Good to replace my Kami of False Hope because my playgroup gets a little annoyed sometimes with the recurrable Fogs. Cutting to one seems good (even though I've been told that I may not necessarily need more card advantageous cards.) Just throwing the idea out for opinions. Also, thank you all for your comments and feedback.
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageAlso I don't really understand why you run fecundity. I mean sure you have a lot of creatures dying all the time but with sweeps and repeatable spot removal your opponents have to. It seems to be a very double edged sword...
Also you could run spike weaver instead of the spore frog. It it may cost more mana but has multiple activations.
Splinterfright has been great so far it sometimes feels like drawing three cards per turn. The only problem I have with him is that he doesn't stay alive without another creature in the yard.
EDIT: Mentor of the Meek seems very interesting. Test him and post the results ;-)
GWKarametra - The MistveiledGW
GWR Marath - The Egg-laying Wool-Milk-Pig GWR
RBGrenzo - Restrained RakdosRB
UWRGBHorde of NotionsUWRGB
Retired: Karador, Ghost Chieftain | Rafiq of the Many | Animar, Soul of Elements | Maelstrom Wanderer
In the sense that he bashes for 5 in the air, yea, the Demon is better.
I agree about Splinterfright. It's a shame:/.
The Mentor has been fairly decent for me.
Cube 360 cards, unpowered.
Modern:
URStormUR
Block
RWHumansRW
URGStalkerURG
Niether Muse nor Demon can get hit with my conditional recursion so they are on the same plane there. The fact that Demon is 1 more mana for 2 more power and evasiveness makes it better.
On Fecundity, I'm not playing a cutthroat playgroup so little things like this help in a multiplayer match. It may seem counterproductive but I don't want to be a total a**.
On Spike Weaver, I like Spore Frog better because conditional recursion can get him(at instant speed in some situations) but not Weaver. Also, HE'S JUST SO CUTE!
On Splinterfright, I'm glad to hear you had some success with him. I haven't had the chance to get one yet so I am not on to testing yet.
@ Everyone
thanks again for all the ideas and comments. I hope that I've been of any help to you.
n0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card Advantagen0 c0mb0z Sharuum:symw::symu::symb:
Seton Druid Party:symg:
Drana Big Mana Black
Baru Landfall:symg:
Venser:symu:
Animar tempo:symu::symr::symg: (Retired)Azami, Lady of Card AdvantageOn another note: I got a Mentor of the Meek on the cheaps and thought I might as well test him. I removed Greater Good for him and so far havn't looked back. Especially early in the game (before you can drop Karador) he's great to keep your hand filled with options. Plus he's a creature with cmc 3 and power 2, so he fits all reanimation criteria ;-)
Also: have you had any experience with Novablast Wurm? I have to admit on reason I'd want him is that I really like the art but repeatable wraths are without question powerful, especially with Dauntless Escort. On the other hand he takes a turn to activate (that is without lightening greaves out).
GWKarametra - The MistveiledGW
GWR Marath - The Egg-laying Wool-Milk-Pig GWR
RBGrenzo - Restrained RakdosRB
UWRGBHorde of NotionsUWRGB
Retired: Karador, Ghost Chieftain | Rafiq of the Many | Animar, Soul of Elements | Maelstrom Wanderer