This is my first attempt at a Pauper EDH deck. I was put onto the idea by Miffed Moogle. I have wanted to build an artifact based EDH deck for a while now, and with the strength of Affinity in 60 card Pauper, I was inspired to try to come up with a 100 card singleton version which still had some affinity beats.
There are also a few sub themes in the list. I wanted to try and push the black discard idea as far as I could, so I've gone a little heavy on that. I also wanted to try and find some protective elements for my commander, as he is a target with only 1 toughness.
Essentially, Dreadwing is the commander for a few reasons - He beats well when boosted, is cheap, and has potential to do 21 commander damage. He is also one of the only viable Grixis commanders around, and he took a long time to find.
The gameplan is to either a) evade and beat for 21 general, b) Whittle them down with persistant pings, or c) Set up an affinity based win condition (plating, atog, disciple of the vault, etc. Hopefully one of those will pan out.
I need a bit of help with how much land to run. At the moment i'm trying to generate as much mana from artifacts as possible, but am unsure where the threshold will lie in regards to too little actual land.
Here's the list, comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Ok sorry about the delayed response I got swamped at the end of the day with other things. I will see what I can do:
1) Discard is a very touchy subject in multiplayer. If you talk to anyone who has been around for a while on the multiplayer forums they will tell you that they are card disadvantage monsters. You need to be hitting everyone with hand discard for it to be even decent. Anytime you choose one of the 3 opponents you have and use a card to make them discard 2 cards you are loosing card advantage. Dont bother doing this as it is a waste of time as you still have 2 other opponents who are not affected by these effects. If you are trying to deal with problematic buyback spells then I will say that counterspells and removal works much much better. Using the random discard 2 card effects never really hits the really good stuff and while that player is down resources they arent big enough generally in scope. Also you are missing the by far best multiplayer common discard effect out there: Syphon Mind. Your opponents all go down a card in hand and you go up probably 3+ cards depending upon how many opponents you have. Cinderhaze Wretch is probably your next best discard in your list. Outside of those 2 I would probably scrap all of the rest of the discard effects.
2) The affinity stuff looks really sort of weak I am sorry to say. I can completely understand building a theme into a deck and if you are set on it then that is fine. However I just wanted to point out that it is not making your deck stronger. A lot of those cards are really sort of meh cards to be included to make the mechanic work. I wont beat you up on it though as if that is how you want to run it so be it. I just wanted to point out that it probably isn't the ideal way to run it.
Other than that I dont really have anything huge. It looks like you did your homework. I dont see like any way for you to deal with artifacts / enchantments so you might consider some shatter effects and or some coutnerspells. Sometimes it gives you options for your transmute cards to target which can be nice.
Steamcore Wierd -> Stinging Barrier I think the ability to hit things every turn with the Barrier trumps 2 damage on entry. It also gives you a bigger toughness defender.
Stinkweed Imp really really nice defensive creature that you can pull back if you need him. He works a bit better if you have more rez type of stuff but I think he is still good enough to strongly consider.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
1. You are right about the discard mechanics. I think I was classicly blinded by the power of the cards 1v1. Syphon mind, however, is very good. Thanks for putting that on my radar.
2. The power level of the affinity stuff is low, but it was a theme I wanted to explore. I'll see how it pans out in testing.
3. Stinging barrierand the Imp look impressive. I think they will be included over some of the discard things
Do you have any suggestions for versitile artifact/enchantment removal? I know I'm in the right colour for the artifacts (should be easy) but the wrong colours for the enchantments.
Lastly, after your suggestion of Stinging barrier, my mind started ticking about a possible 'pingers' deck - A gereral like gelectrode and a bunch of blue and red pingers, the 10 or so that exist. A buch of draw and burn to back it up and maybe a subtheme of bounce with the remaining creature spots. Could an archetype like this work? Or am I dreaming?
As for artifact removal I think you should consider the following:
Shattering Pulse buyback is really nice here so you can sort of slow roll over all the artifacts in play with a single card. It also sort of dissuades opponents from playing further artifacts in fear of this spell.
Manic Vandal shatter + 2/2 body. Fairly basic but nice for some small card advantage.
Aftershock nice versatile removal. It can do more than just hit artifacts which is nice.
Builder's Bane sort of an expensive option but it works for multiple targets.
Icefall the recover option is nice on this one but you have to plan arround it.
Smash Shatter + card draw for one extra mana is nice.
Capsize it is a temporary answer but it can target anything and has buyback.
Unfortunately outside of counterspells you wont really be able to stop enchantments. If they are auras you can answer the creatures they are on but there aren't too many really backbreaking non aura enchants in pauper.
Actually a buddy of mine just made a Gelectrode deck. It is annoying to play against if you run a lot of utility guys and or token based. It is a fine deck but you might also consider Blood Cultist as there are a few black pinger type guys as well but you gain access to rez which might be invaluable. People tend to get annoyed if you try to stack out like 3+ pingers on the field so I would assume you will be met with some removal when trying to do it.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
I don't think the Grixis Affinity idea is terrible and I think one game out of the 10 or so it really came across. You almost always had Galvanic Blast for value too (talk about number one tutoring target!).
In future iterations you need more lands and less equipment, notably Onslaught cycling lands are better value, Rupture Spire is also fantastic, as would be the karoos. I can't wait to see glectrode list and hope you dont give up entirely on this idea.
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Weiss Schwarz Sets
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Just a heads up but Karoo and its cycle are all uncommons thus unusable in pauper. If you were referring to the ravnica dual land Karoo types that is different.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Just a heads up but Karoo and its cycle are all uncommons thus unusable in pauper. If you were referring to the ravnica dual land Karoo types that is different.
Referring to rav block cycle, yes, original karoos arent anything special.
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Weiss Schwarz Sets
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Ha! the repeated beatings only strengthened my resolve to build better and bigger. Some of the games were really close too so the deck didn't function as badly as i'd expected. It was clear, however, that you were getting 10x more benefit out of your commanders than I was. Dreadwing, although cheap, dies too easily and has no real other strat than a general kill (which is difficult when running 27 lands). Gelectrode is where i'm putting my energy at the moment. List coming up soon. Must kill Rakdos Guildmage....
Ha! the repeated beatings only strengthened my resolve to build better and bigger. Some of the games were really close too so the deck didn't function as badly as i'd expected. It was clear, however, that you were getting 10x more benefit out of your commanders than I was. Dreadwing, although cheap, dies too easily and has no real other strat than a general kill (which is difficult when running 27 lands). Gelectrode is where i'm putting my energy at the moment. List coming up soon. Must kill Rakdos Guildmage....
Heh, you do sound resolved. The benefit of Dreadwing was getting in early damage, so against slower non-black/red it may be more successful. Evasion can be rare in pauper I've noticed so far, so the flying was undoubtably doing a lot. Pinging gets around that entirely, which would work in your current deck. Gift of Fire I think it is, would fit right in.
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Weiss Schwarz Sets
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Wixoss - Just trial decks for now!
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This is my first attempt at a Pauper EDH deck. I was put onto the idea by Miffed Moogle. I have wanted to build an artifact based EDH deck for a while now, and with the strength of Affinity in 60 card Pauper, I was inspired to try to come up with a 100 card singleton version which still had some affinity beats.
There are also a few sub themes in the list. I wanted to try and push the black discard idea as far as I could, so I've gone a little heavy on that. I also wanted to try and find some protective elements for my commander, as he is a target with only 1 toughness.
Essentially, Dreadwing is the commander for a few reasons - He beats well when boosted, is cheap, and has potential to do 21 commander damage. He is also one of the only viable Grixis commanders around, and he took a long time to find.
The gameplan is to either a) evade and beat for 21 general, b) Whittle them down with persistant pings, or c) Set up an affinity based win condition (plating, atog, disciple of the vault, etc. Hopefully one of those will pan out.
I need a bit of help with how much land to run. At the moment i'm trying to generate as much mana from artifacts as possible, but am unsure where the threshold will lie in regards to too little actual land.
Here's the list, comments and suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Sorry if I screw up the formatting, new at this.
1 Mulldrifter
1 Ninja of the Deep Hours
1 Mnemonic Wall
1 Okiba Gang Shinobi
1 Faceless Butcher
1 Crypt Rats
1 Dimir Infiltrator
1 Vulshok Sorcerer
1 Merfolk Looter
1 Ulamog's Crusher
1 Scrivener
1 Augur of Skulls
1 Cinderhaze Wretch
1 Steamcore Wierd
1 Nightscape Familiar
1 Trinket Mage
1 Atog
1 Frogmite
1 Myr Enforcer
1 Somber Hoverguard
1 Arcbound Worker
1 Arcbound Bruiser
1 Vault Skirge
1 Tresspassing Souleater
1 Tidehollow Strix
1 Etherium Sculptor
1 Orcish Mechanics
1 Clout of the Dominus
1 Quicksilver Dagger
1 Protective Bubble
1 Compulsive Research
1 Deep Analysis
1 Thoughtcast
1 Forbidden Alchemy
1 Consult the Necrosages (also discard)
1 Capsize
1 Recoil
1 Deny Reality
1 Perplex
1 Hymn to tourach
1 Wrench mind
1 Blightning
1 Disturbed Burial
1 Fling
1 Galvanic Blast
1 Terminate
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Ashes to Ashes
1 Snuff Out
1 Wrecking Ball
1 Fireball
1 Rolling Thunder
1 Oubliette
1 Obelisk of Grixis
1 Prophetic Prism
1 Izzet Signet
1 Dimir Signet
1 Rakdos Signet
1 Pristine Tailsman
1 Mistvein Borderpost
1 Veinfire Borderpost
1 Springleaf Drum
1 Chromatic Star
1 Whispersilk Cloak
1 Sylvok Lifestaff
1 Neurok Stealthsuit
1 Cranial Plating
1 Golem Foundry
1 Viridian Longbow
1 Executioner's Capsule
1 Great Furnace
1 Seat of the Synod
1 Vault of Whispers
1 Darksteel Citadel
1 Grixis Panorama
1 Terramorphic Expanse
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Strip Mine
1 Halimar Depths
1 Polluted mire
1 Remote Isle
1 Smouldering Crater
6 Island
5 Swamp
5 Mountain
Lands might be (most probably are) short @ 27, but there are plenty of fixers in there.
No need for deck and card tags. Just use deck tags, and remember to put the quantity before the card name.
1) Discard is a very touchy subject in multiplayer. If you talk to anyone who has been around for a while on the multiplayer forums they will tell you that they are card disadvantage monsters. You need to be hitting everyone with hand discard for it to be even decent. Anytime you choose one of the 3 opponents you have and use a card to make them discard 2 cards you are loosing card advantage. Dont bother doing this as it is a waste of time as you still have 2 other opponents who are not affected by these effects. If you are trying to deal with problematic buyback spells then I will say that counterspells and removal works much much better. Using the random discard 2 card effects never really hits the really good stuff and while that player is down resources they arent big enough generally in scope. Also you are missing the by far best multiplayer common discard effect out there: Syphon Mind. Your opponents all go down a card in hand and you go up probably 3+ cards depending upon how many opponents you have. Cinderhaze Wretch is probably your next best discard in your list. Outside of those 2 I would probably scrap all of the rest of the discard effects.
2) The affinity stuff looks really sort of weak I am sorry to say. I can completely understand building a theme into a deck and if you are set on it then that is fine. However I just wanted to point out that it is not making your deck stronger. A lot of those cards are really sort of meh cards to be included to make the mechanic work. I wont beat you up on it though as if that is how you want to run it so be it. I just wanted to point out that it probably isn't the ideal way to run it.
Other than that I dont really have anything huge. It looks like you did your homework. I dont see like any way for you to deal with artifacts / enchantments so you might consider some shatter effects and or some coutnerspells. Sometimes it gives you options for your transmute cards to target which can be nice.
Steamcore Wierd -> Stinging Barrier I think the ability to hit things every turn with the Barrier trumps 2 damage on entry. It also gives you a bigger toughness defender.
Stinkweed Imp really really nice defensive creature that you can pull back if you need him. He works a bit better if you have more rez type of stuff but I think he is still good enough to strongly consider.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
1. You are right about the discard mechanics. I think I was classicly blinded by the power of the cards 1v1. Syphon mind, however, is very good. Thanks for putting that on my radar.
2. The power level of the affinity stuff is low, but it was a theme I wanted to explore. I'll see how it pans out in testing.
3. Stinging barrierand the Imp look impressive. I think they will be included over some of the discard things
Do you have any suggestions for versitile artifact/enchantment removal? I know I'm in the right colour for the artifacts (should be easy) but the wrong colours for the enchantments.
Lastly, after your suggestion of Stinging barrier, my mind started ticking about a possible 'pingers' deck - A gereral like gelectrode and a bunch of blue and red pingers, the 10 or so that exist. A buch of draw and burn to back it up and maybe a subtheme of bounce with the remaining creature spots. Could an archetype like this work? Or am I dreaming?
Shattering Pulse buyback is really nice here so you can sort of slow roll over all the artifacts in play with a single card. It also sort of dissuades opponents from playing further artifacts in fear of this spell.
Manic Vandal shatter + 2/2 body. Fairly basic but nice for some small card advantage.
Aftershock nice versatile removal. It can do more than just hit artifacts which is nice.
Builder's Bane sort of an expensive option but it works for multiple targets.
Icefall the recover option is nice on this one but you have to plan arround it.
Smash Shatter + card draw for one extra mana is nice.
Capsize it is a temporary answer but it can target anything and has buyback.
Unfortunately outside of counterspells you wont really be able to stop enchantments. If they are auras you can answer the creatures they are on but there aren't too many really backbreaking non aura enchants in pauper.
Actually a buddy of mine just made a Gelectrode deck. It is annoying to play against if you run a lot of utility guys and or token based. It is a fine deck but you might also consider Blood Cultist as there are a few black pinger type guys as well but you gain access to rez which might be invaluable. People tend to get annoyed if you try to stack out like 3+ pingers on the field so I would assume you will be met with some removal when trying to do it.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
I don't think the Grixis Affinity idea is terrible and I think one game out of the 10 or so it really came across. You almost always had Galvanic Blast for value too (talk about number one tutoring target!).
In future iterations you need more lands and less equipment, notably Onslaught cycling lands are better value, Rupture Spire is also fantastic, as would be the karoos. I can't wait to see glectrode list and hope you dont give up entirely on this idea.
Main Decks
Diaochan, Iroas, God of Victory, Kaalia, Marton, Ulasht, Volrath,
Kaervek, Prossh, Titania
Amusing or Themed
Progenitus
Pauper Guildmages
Azorius Boros Dimir Golgari Gruul Izzet Korozda
Orzhov Rakdos Rix Maadi Selesyna Simic Skarrg Zameck
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Wixoss - Just trial decks for now!
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Referring to rav block cycle, yes, original karoos arent anything special.
Main Decks
Diaochan, Iroas, God of Victory, Kaalia, Marton, Ulasht, Volrath,
Kaervek, Prossh, Titania
Amusing or Themed
Progenitus
Pauper Guildmages
Azorius Boros Dimir Golgari Gruul Izzet Korozda
Orzhov Rakdos Rix Maadi Selesyna Simic Skarrg Zameck
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Wixoss - Just trial decks for now!
Heh, you do sound resolved. The benefit of Dreadwing was getting in early damage, so against slower non-black/red it may be more successful. Evasion can be rare in pauper I've noticed so far, so the flying was undoubtably doing a lot. Pinging gets around that entirely, which would work in your current deck. Gift of Fire I think it is, would fit right in.
Main Decks
Diaochan, Iroas, God of Victory, Kaalia, Marton, Ulasht, Volrath,
Kaervek, Prossh, Titania
Amusing or Themed
Progenitus
Pauper Guildmages
Azorius Boros Dimir Golgari Gruul Izzet Korozda
Orzhov Rakdos Rix Maadi Selesyna Simic Skarrg Zameck
I also play Weiss Schwarz, Chaos, Vanguard and Wixoss.
Accel World, Angel Beats, Familiar of Zero, Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet, Guilty Crown, Kill La Kill, Robotics;Notes, Sword Art Online.
Chaos Partners
Arpeggio of Blue Steel: Iona, Kirishima, Kongou.
Dangan Ronpa: Asahina, Togami.
Freezing: Vibration: Chiffon, Satelizer.
Vanguard Clans Favoured
Angel Feather, Dark Irregulars, Genesis, Neonecter, Pale Moon, Shadow Paladins, Tachikaze.
Wixoss - Just trial decks for now!