I know that token decks are either W/B or W/U... but the last couple of Limited events I've gone to, I kept drawing Clifftop Retreat. So I'm thinking I could make some sort of R/W variant to the usual Token build.
Special thanks to salmonman78, who mentioned Hellrider when I posted for a few ideas.
The basic idea in my mind is to drop the tokens through spells and the Doomsayer, using Hellrider to deal damage even if the tokens don't get through. Curse of Bloodletting will turn that one damage into two damage. So even blocking won't save my opponent. Intangible Virtue is there, because well, Intangible Virtue is awesome. Flaming Oil and Brimstone Volley can provide some spot removal and Wrack with Madness will remove any larger threats.
Couple of card questions:
Doomed Traveler. It's a one drop, but I'm not sure how to work it in to this current draft.
Flaming Oil or Incinerate? Flaming Oil has two uses with a White Flashback, but Incinerate can give that 3 direct damage I just might need.
Wrack with Madness or Incinerate? Wrack could deal with larger threats, but would be much more situational compared to Incinerate.
I don't really have a win card, and that's kind of bothering me. Maybe Hero of Bladehold, since that seems to be traditional win-con for token decks.
Constructive deas and suggestions are always welcome. I don't have too much knowledge about token decks, so anyone who runs one and wants to give me some pointers, I'm all ears.
W/R Is my favourite colour combo so im always looking for new strategies. Firstly, as a token based deck Elspeth Tirel is a must, and I could actually see Rally the Peasants becoming quite strong here as well.
Not to push the walkers too much, but Chandra the Firebrand doubles the effectiveness of your token generation.
Lastly, Mikaeus the Lunarch has a very low commitment to white and works fantasticly with tokens as well.
Some things I would change:
- Flaming oil -> Chandra
- Lingering Souls -> Elspeth or Rally the Peasants (the black flashback is what makes this card fantastic, without it its pretty awful)
- Wrack with Madness (not the most effective removal out there) -> Either Oblivian Ring, Mikeus or maybe even Increasing Devotion
Hope this helps, if you get the chance I could really use some feedback on my R/W Proliferate deck in RDW as well (I scratch your back, you scratch mine?). =)
RW Kuldotha tokens can be pretty strong. There's been a list at my LGS that's won FNM before using things like Origin Spellbomb, Memnite, Kuldotha Rebirth, Rally the Peasants, Midnight Haunting etc. to create a ridiculously quick aggro build. Hellrider as mentioned can fit nicely as a top of the curve.
Didn't even think of Kuldotha Rebirth. Now to find some artifacts as well.
I dropped the number on Gather the Townsfolk and Midnight Haunting to make room for Origin Spellbombs. This does provide one fewer token, but I can also sacrifice it for Kuldotha Rebirth to basically get the same number of tokens.
Planeswalkers for me will probably come a little later, once I get a chance to build a low-investment version of the deck.
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That is what I would recommend for a rough draft, although I still feel that it is an inferior version of Kuldotha red and Tempered Steel.
Thanks for the thoughts. I'll have to think about Arc Trail in place of Incinerate. Signal Pests are an interesting idea as well.
This deck really isn't Kuldotha Red or Tempered Steel. I'm sure a lot of people probably think this is inferior to W/B or W/U... and it might be. But I like to explore other ideas as well, and I think there's potential this idea.
@Flod Lawjick: Warstorm Surge seems like a good idea, however, the 6cmc seems a little prohibitive. It might be useful for when I crack the Shrine. I'll have to think a little and see where I want to put it.
I was thinking of the Champion, but if I'm going to use Midnight Haunting(spirit), Kuldotha Rebirth(goblin), Shrine of Loyal Legions(myr), and Origin Spellbomb(myr), then there's not enough human tokens to really power him up.
Thraben Doomsayer makes for a tough choice. On one hand, it's a constant generator, something that my deck lacks. On the other hand, it's a 3 drop, vulnerable to removal, and doesn't generate anything until turn 4 at the earliest. By turn 4, I should be able to generate 4 or more tokens, plus either Hellrider or Intangible Virtue.
Yeah I figured you might say something like that and to be honest I agree, I think you should probably drop the Doomsayer and go for more aggressively costed cheap creatures. Plus I think if you are going to play Lingering Souls then it would be criminal not to splash black for the flashback. That way if you did get sweepered you could rebuild immediately with either Hero of Bladehold or the flashback, but preferably both.
I suppose I could throw in 2-3 swamps since I have Evolving Wilds to fetch them if needed.
The biggest problem with Hero of Bladehold is according to the rules: " 6/1/2011: Although the tokens are attacking, they never were declared as attacking creatures (for purposes of abilities that trigger whenever a creature attacks, for example)." Which means that they don't trigger Hellrider. Small nitpick I know.
That looks like a fun deck, I may well give it a spin as I'm a bit of a token addict.
Anyway, I would probably stick in 4 Evolving Wilds and only 1 swamp. I guess Isolated Chapels are an option too. I think too that if you want to be able to use Kuldotha Rebirth you might need more artifacts. Let's face it I doubt you ever want to use it on the shrine, unless of course in a pinch. I'm a fan of Signal Pest, plus I think 2/2 tokens attacking as 3/2 is not too bad at all. It also gives you a turn one play when you don't want to use/ don't have Evolving Wilds
Even in spite of not totally synergizing the hero is still pretty sweet, especially with Intangible Virtue out. Plus although a bit costly it might be worth considering Increasing Devotion only as a 1 or 2 of.
Also, here is a question, I wonder if the flashback of spells, first of all counts as a spell for the shrine and second of all counts as white even if the cost is no longer white.
Also, here is a question, I wonder if the flashback of spells, first of all counts as a spell for the shrine and second of all counts as white even if the cost is no longer white.
The card is the color that it is, regardless of what mana was used to pay the flashback cost. For instance, Lingering Souls is a white spell whether it's cast from your hand or your graveyard.
I have heard vague rumors of a moustache-dispensing vending machine in a distant laundromat, across the street from a tattoo parlor. However, this information is shaky, and time is of the essence.
That's quite awesome especially seeing as you could recover from T4 wipe in T5 by dropping land, flashing back Lingering Souls to pump shrine once more before cracking it for a rather nice army of dudes.
I think too that if you want to be able to use Kuldotha Rebirth you might need more artifacts. Let's face it I doubt you ever want to use it on the shrine, unless of course in a pinch.
Actually, I was thinking about this, and then I remembered that the Myr tokens are artifacts. So you can crack the Origin Spellbomb, draw a card, and turn the one Myr into three Goblins. So I think there would be plenty of artifacts to go around, between the Shrines and Spellbombs.
Even in spite of not totally synergizing the hero is still pretty sweet, especially with Intangible Virtue out. Plus although a bit costly it might be worth considering Increasing Devotion only as a 1 or 2 of.
Two Heroes of Bladehold and two Increasing Devotions might be worthwhile to use and fills out the top end of the mana curve.
Now the question is: what's the sweet spot with token generating cards?
I need to remove 8 cards to get this down to sixty, and I'm not sure where to take them from. I'm going to have wean out some of the Token Generators, since there's 21 of them. Either that, or some burn. But the burn is pretty important.
Volley is a great burn spell for decks where death is common and predictable (i.e. R/B or the classic RDW) but your R/W variant seems fairly focused on keeping your tokens alive, so more often than not it will either be a 3 mana incinerate or used in your second main phase.
Lingering souls should only EVER be used with reliable black mana for it's flashback. Everyone is freaking out about how good this card is but that is ONLY because of the flashback. Without it, this card is literally just Midnight Haunting without the instant cast. Putting 4 evolving wilds and a swamp in your mana base will screw you over too often to justify this IMHO.
Volley is a great burn spell for decks where death is common and predictable (i.e. R/B or the classic RDW) but your R/W variant seems fairly focused on keeping your tokens alive, so more often than not it will either be a 3 mana incinerate or used in your second main phase.
Lingering souls should only EVER be used with reliable black mana for it's flashback. Everyone is freaking out about how good this card is but that is ONLY because of the flashback. Without it, this card is literally just Midnight Haunting without the instant cast. Putting 4 evolving wilds and a swamp in your mana base will screw you over too often to justify this IMHO.
Good luck!
That's a good point. Am I trying to keep tokens alive or not? Obviously, I want to use Hellrider, but with Intangible Virtue, the tokens can be pretty sturdy.
I think I'm starting to agree with you on Lingering Souls. It's 5cmc total for 4 tokens, the worst ratio out of the bunch.
Now I need to see if this deck can actually be any good.
Its obvious that you want to win/do alot of your dmg with Hellrider and tokens. When Hellrider was first spoiled i thought to myself, "that guy + tokens = GG"
The best way to take full advantage of this has got to be Shrine of Loyal Legions and/or Kuldotha Rebirth. You should really try to base your focus around that.
Youll need enough artifacts to support kuldotha rebirth and enough white spells to fuel shrine...all in the same deck...all while trying to win early(like a red deck) before the control decks stabilize. This sounds like a tall order...just remember youre playing red and can finish the game with straight burn. Adding all of the Intangible Virtue, Rally the peasents, Oblivion ring seems like youre focusing too much on tokens shens.
Its obvious that you want to win/do alot of your dmg with Hellrider and tokens. When Hellrider was first spoiled i thought to myself, "that guy + tokens = GG"
The best way to take full advantage of this has got to be Shrine of Loyal Legions and/or Kuldotha Rebirth. You should really try to base your focus around that.
Youll need enough artifacts to support kuldotha rebirth and enough white spells to fuel shrine...all in the same deck...all while trying to win early(like a red deck) before the control decks stabilize. This sounds like a tall order...just remember youre playing red and can finish the game with straight burn. Adding all of the Intangible Virtue, Rally the peasents, Oblivion ring seems like youre focusing too much on tokens shens.
Very true. My focus kind of wandered down into the realms of straight up token play. So then, I would think that adding in Memnite and Perilous Myr serves dual purposes in the deck: triggering Hellrider and artifacts for Kuldotha Rebirth
1. Hellrider is now my only win-con. If he doesn't show up, I don't win. Rally the Peasants might be an idea as a secondary win-con.
2. In the interests of speed and the fact that the deck has shifted to 75% red, I removed Shrine of Loyal Legions. I might add it back in if I can find some more white to put back into the deck.
Hey Dark. So, check out this list - it's a token-ish rush deck, and has both white and red (flashback), so it's "on topic", but it's in a different direction than you're going. Maybe try it out and see what you think - it is fast, however it should be because it is basically an all-in strategy. No removal in this guy.
It uses HotP instead of Virtue for reasons that will be obvious, and because it has a strong presence of non-tokens, it's not as susceptible to Ratchet Bomb shenanigans.
It looks like you're moving heavily into red, but I figured I'd post this anyway and you can see if you like it. Pretty much just always keep attacking, never let off the gas.
Hey Dark. So, check out this list - it's a token-ish rush deck, and has both white and red (flashback), so it's "on topic", but it's in a different direction than you're going. Maybe try it out and see what you think - it is fast, however it should be because it is basically an all-in strategy. No removal in this guy.
It uses HotP instead of Virtue for reasons that will be obvious, and because it has a strong presence of non-tokens, it's not as susceptible to Ratchet Bomb shenanigans.
It looks like you're moving heavily into red, but I figured I'd post this anyway and you can see if you like it. Pretty much just always keep attacking, never let off the gas.
That's not a bad deck either.
Now I just feel like I'm getting frustrated. I want to make a good R/W deck, but I'm feeling like this just isn't way. To do enough damage, I keep shifting more to mono-red. At this point, I might as well make some sort of Goblin RDW with Hellrider.
I just really wanted to take advantage of the fact I keep drafting and getting Clifftop Retreats in sealed. Doesn't look like I'm doing a good job of it though.
Oh come on, i think that deck is awesome it might not be the strongest deck around, but hopefully it'll get some love in AVR too. I'm using Hellrider in my RG Splinterfright and I'm having a blast!
So I made a R/W token deck when ISD came out because Rally the Peasants is so goo din the archetype, also I used to play goblins when ZEN block was still around so I needed some way to still use goblins XD.
It kills very fast with the right hand, but you also get a lot of sub-par hands. Basically, as with most Kuldotha rebirth decks, its an all in deck. You get the nuts, or you don't
And here is the list I wrote up after DKA came out
This is just a rough draft, as I feel 3-4 rebirths would probably give more explosive results. Some of you need to be careful tho, there are some lists in this thread that run 4 rebirths with only 7 artifacts.
Yea, I feel like most of you here forgot about the cheap living weapons of Flayer Husk and Mortarpod. I think they are great in these kinds of decks and they give more artifacts to sac. Gather the townsfolk makes this deck way more consistent and the addition of evolving wilds helps the mana base a lot. Although I'm not sure if this deck can rely on evolving wilds, having a land come in tapped on turn 1 is pretty bad for the epic turn 1 plays you can have. Maybe the mox opal count could be up'd for more hands that involve land, mox opal, signal pest, memnite, rebirth on memite/opal turn 1 plays. Ill work on different list and post it up later.
Oh come on, i think that deck is awesome it might not be the strongest deck around, but hopefully it'll get some love in AVR too. I'm using Hellrider in my RG Splinterfright and I'm having a blast!
Thanks for the support I'm working on it.
I like some of the ideas from TheWongPooky, especially a bit of the Metalcraft focus.
First off, I'm 8 cards over limit. Might have to drop a land or two, though I have a thing with going under 24 lands. Maybe silly, but it's one of my "things."
Memnite is adorable, but seeing how I'm trying to keep with a token focus, might they be on the chopping block? Either that, or replaced with Signal Pest? Though if I chop it, I'm killing a lot of the metalcraft focus.
The rest of the deck, to be honest, I'm liking. 12 token generating cards, Origin Spellbomb for a bit of draw, and Intangible Virtue seems good to me. Just need those final few cuts.
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Special thanks to salmonman78, who mentioned Hellrider when I posted for a few ideas.
So let's start off with a (very) rough draft:
4 Clifftop Retreat
9 Mountain
10 Plains
Creatures
4 Hellrider
3 Thraben Doomsayer
4 Flaming Oil
4 Brimstone Volley
3 Wrack with Madness
Token Cards
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Midnight Haunting
4 Lingering Souls
4 Intangible Virtue
3 Curse of Bloodletting
The basic idea in my mind is to drop the tokens through spells and the Doomsayer, using Hellrider to deal damage even if the tokens don't get through. Curse of Bloodletting will turn that one damage into two damage. So even blocking won't save my opponent. Intangible Virtue is there, because well, Intangible Virtue is awesome. Flaming Oil and Brimstone Volley can provide some spot removal and Wrack with Madness will remove any larger threats.
Couple of card questions:
Doomed Traveler. It's a one drop, but I'm not sure how to work it in to this current draft.
Flaming Oil or Incinerate? Flaming Oil has two uses with a White Flashback, but Incinerate can give that 3 direct damage I just might need.
Wrack with Madness or Incinerate? Wrack could deal with larger threats, but would be much more situational compared to Incinerate.
I want to add in Shrine of Loyal Legions but again, not sure how to work it in.
I don't really have a win card, and that's kind of bothering me. Maybe Hero of Bladehold, since that seems to be traditional win-con for token decks.
Constructive deas and suggestions are always welcome. I don't have too much knowledge about token decks, so anyone who runs one and wants to give me some pointers, I'm all ears.
Thanks!
Oh yes, and let's not forget a few Evolving Wilds!
Oh okay, I'll just post a decklist!
Based on your decklist... this:
4 Doomed Traveler
4 Hellrider
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Intangible Virtue
4 Shrine of Loyal Legions
4 Midnight Haunting
3 Oblivion Ring
4 Brimstone Volley
2 Elspeth Tirel
Not to push the walkers too much, but Chandra the Firebrand doubles the effectiveness of your token generation.
Lastly, Mikaeus the Lunarch has a very low commitment to white and works fantasticly with tokens as well.
Some things I would change:
- Flaming oil -> Chandra
- Lingering Souls -> Elspeth or Rally the Peasants (the black flashback is what makes this card fantastic, without it its pretty awful)
- Wrack with Madness (not the most effective removal out there) -> Either Oblivian Ring, Mikeus or maybe even Increasing Devotion
Hope this helps, if you get the chance I could really use some feedback on my R/W Proliferate deck in RDW as well (I scratch your back, you scratch mine?). =)
Didn't even think of Kuldotha Rebirth. Now to find some artifacts as well.
4 Clifftop Retreat
3 Evolving Wilds
8 Mountain
8 Plains
Creatures
4 Hellrider
4 Incinerate
4 Brimstone Volley
3 Oblivion Ring
3 Rally the Peasants
Token Cards
3 Gather the Townsfolk
3 Midnight Haunting
3 Kuldotha Rebirth
3 Shrine of Loyal Legions
3 Origin Spellbomb
4 Intangible Virtue
I dropped the number on Gather the Townsfolk and Midnight Haunting to make room for Origin Spellbombs. This does provide one fewer token, but I can also sacrifice it for Kuldotha Rebirth to basically get the same number of tokens.
Planeswalkers for me will probably come a little later, once I get a chance to build a low-investment version of the deck.
My friend used it in a token deck and it made me very sad haha
3 Hero of Bladehold
4 Memnite
3 Signal Pest
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
3 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Midnight Haunting
4 Rally the Peasants
3 Arc Trail
3 Brimstone Volley
That is what I would recommend for a rough draft, although I still feel that it is an inferior version of Kuldotha red and Tempered Steel.
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Thanks for the thoughts. I'll have to think about Arc Trail in place of Incinerate. Signal Pests are an interesting idea as well.
This deck really isn't Kuldotha Red or Tempered Steel. I'm sure a lot of people probably think this is inferior to W/B or W/U... and it might be. But I like to explore other ideas as well, and I think there's potential this idea.
@Flod Lawjick: Warstorm Surge seems like a good idea, however, the 6cmc seems a little prohibitive. It might be useful for when I crack the Shrine. I'll have to think a little and see where I want to put it.
I was thinking of the Champion, but if I'm going to use Midnight Haunting(spirit), Kuldotha Rebirth(goblin), Shrine of Loyal Legions(myr), and Origin Spellbomb(myr), then there's not enough human tokens to really power him up.
Thraben Doomsayer makes for a tough choice. On one hand, it's a constant generator, something that my deck lacks. On the other hand, it's a 3 drop, vulnerable to removal, and doesn't generate anything until turn 4 at the earliest. By turn 4, I should be able to generate 4 or more tokens, plus either Hellrider or Intangible Virtue.
The biggest problem with Hero of Bladehold is according to the rules: " 6/1/2011: Although the tokens are attacking, they never were declared as attacking creatures (for purposes of abilities that trigger whenever a creature attacks, for example)." Which means that they don't trigger Hellrider. Small nitpick I know.
So let's see...
4 Clifftop Retreat
3 Evolving Wilds
7 Mountain
7 Plains
2 Swamp
4 Hellrider
Spells
4 Incinerate
4 Brimstone Volley
3 Oblivion Ring
3 Rally the Peasants
3 Gather the Townsfolk
3 Lingering Souls
3 Kuldotha Rebirth
3 Shrine of Loyal Legions
3 Origin Spellbomb
4 Intangible Virtue
Anyway, I would probably stick in 4 Evolving Wilds and only 1 swamp. I guess Isolated Chapels are an option too. I think too that if you want to be able to use Kuldotha Rebirth you might need more artifacts. Let's face it I doubt you ever want to use it on the shrine, unless of course in a pinch. I'm a fan of Signal Pest, plus I think 2/2 tokens attacking as 3/2 is not too bad at all. It also gives you a turn one play when you don't want to use/ don't have Evolving Wilds
Even in spite of not totally synergizing the hero is still pretty sweet, especially with Intangible Virtue out. Plus although a bit costly it might be worth considering Increasing Devotion only as a 1 or 2 of.
Also, here is a question, I wonder if the flashback of spells, first of all counts as a spell for the shrine and second of all counts as white even if the cost is no longer white.
The card is the color that it is, regardless of what mana was used to pay the flashback cost. For instance, Lingering Souls is a white spell whether it's cast from your hand or your graveyard.
That's the whole point of Magic. To have some fun
Actually, I was thinking about this, and then I remembered that the Myr tokens are artifacts. So you can crack the Origin Spellbomb, draw a card, and turn the one Myr into three Goblins. So I think there would be plenty of artifacts to go around, between the Shrines and Spellbombs.
Two Heroes of Bladehold and two Increasing Devotions might be worthwhile to use and fills out the top end of the mana curve.
Now the question is: what's the sweet spot with token generating cards?
4 Clifftop Retreat
4 Evolving Wilds
7 Mountain
7 Plains
1 Swamp
Creatures
4 Hellrider
2 Hero of Bladehold
4 Incinerate
4 Brimstone Volley
3 Oblivion Ring
3 Rally the Peasants
Token Generators
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
4 Origin Spellbomb
4 Gather the Townsfolk
3 Shrine of Loyal Legions
4 Lingering Souls
2 Increasing Devotion
4 Intangible Virtue
Volley is a great burn spell for decks where death is common and predictable (i.e. R/B or the classic RDW) but your R/W variant seems fairly focused on keeping your tokens alive, so more often than not it will either be a 3 mana incinerate or used in your second main phase.
Lingering souls should only EVER be used with reliable black mana for it's flashback. Everyone is freaking out about how good this card is but that is ONLY because of the flashback. Without it, this card is literally just Midnight Haunting without the instant cast. Putting 4 evolving wilds and a swamp in your mana base will screw you over too often to justify this IMHO.
Good luck!
That's a good point. Am I trying to keep tokens alive or not? Obviously, I want to use Hellrider, but with Intangible Virtue, the tokens can be pretty sturdy.
I think I'm starting to agree with you on Lingering Souls. It's 5cmc total for 4 tokens, the worst ratio out of the bunch.
Now I need to see if this deck can actually be any good.
The best way to take full advantage of this has got to be Shrine of Loyal Legions and/or Kuldotha Rebirth. You should really try to base your focus around that.
Youll need enough artifacts to support kuldotha rebirth and enough white spells to fuel shrine...all in the same deck...all while trying to win early(like a red deck) before the control decks stabilize. This sounds like a tall order...just remember youre playing red and can finish the game with straight burn. Adding all of the Intangible Virtue, Rally the peasents, Oblivion ring seems like youre focusing too much on tokens shens.
Very true. My focus kind of wandered down into the realms of straight up token play. So then, I would think that adding in Memnite and Perilous Myr serves dual purposes in the deck: triggering Hellrider and artifacts for Kuldotha Rebirth
However, removing Intangible Virtue and Rally the Peasants leaves me with two problems.
1. Hellrider is now my only win-con. If he doesn't show up, I don't win. Rally the Peasants might be an idea as a secondary win-con.
2. In the interests of speed and the fact that the deck has shifted to 75% red, I removed Shrine of Loyal Legions. I might add it back in if I can find some more white to put back into the deck.
Updated Deck:
4 Clifftop Retreat
13 Mountain
7 Plains
//Creatures
4 Hellrider
4 Memnite
4 Perilous Myr
4 Incinerate
4 Brimstone Volley
//Token Generators
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
4 Origin Spellbomb
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Midnight Haunting
It uses HotP instead of Virtue for reasons that will be obvious, and because it has a strong presence of non-tokens, it's not as susceptible to Ratchet Bomb shenanigans.
4 Doomed Traveler
4 Champion of the Parish
2 Loyal Cathar
3 Mirran Crusader
3 Hero of Bladehold
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Lingering Souls
4 Midnight Haunting
4 Honor of the Pure
4 Rally the Peasants
4 Clifftop Retreat
3 Isolated Chapel
2 Shimmering Grotto
15 Plains
It looks like you're moving heavily into red, but I figured I'd post this anyway and you can see if you like it. Pretty much just always keep attacking, never let off the gas.
That's not a bad deck either.
Now I just feel like I'm getting frustrated. I want to make a good R/W deck, but I'm feeling like this just isn't way. To do enough damage, I keep shifting more to mono-red. At this point, I might as well make some sort of Goblin RDW with Hellrider.
I just really wanted to take advantage of the fact I keep drafting and getting Clifftop Retreats in sealed. Doesn't look like I'm doing a good job of it though.
I'd like to suggest Vault of the Archangel and Mentor of the Meek. Have you tested them?
PS: Oh, and maybe Unruly Mob as an "answer" to Ratchet Bomb?
Here was the list without DKA
4 Signal Pest
1 Chimeric Mass
2 Mox Opal
4 Flayer Husk
4 Origin Spellbomb
3 Mortarpod
4 Intagible Virtue
4 Midnight Haunting
2 Rally the Peasants
4 Galvanic Blast
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
8 Mountain
8 Plains
It kills very fast with the right hand, but you also get a lot of sub-par hands. Basically, as with most Kuldotha rebirth decks, its an all in deck. You get the nuts, or you don't
And here is the list I wrote up after DKA came out
4 Signal Pest
1 Hellrider
2 Mox Opal
4 Flayer Husk
3 Origin Spellbomb
2 Mortarpod
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Intagible Virtue
4 Midnight Haunting
2 Rally the Peasants
4 Galvanic Blast
2 Kuldotha Rebirth
5 Mountain
8 Plains
3 Evolving Wilds
This is just a rough draft, as I feel 3-4 rebirths would probably give more explosive results. Some of you need to be careful tho, there are some lists in this thread that run 4 rebirths with only 7 artifacts.
Yea, I feel like most of you here forgot about the cheap living weapons of Flayer Husk and Mortarpod. I think they are great in these kinds of decks and they give more artifacts to sac. Gather the townsfolk makes this deck way more consistent and the addition of evolving wilds helps the mana base a lot. Although I'm not sure if this deck can rely on evolving wilds, having a land come in tapped on turn 1 is pretty bad for the epic turn 1 plays you can have. Maybe the mox opal count could be up'd for more hands that involve land, mox opal, signal pest, memnite, rebirth on memite/opal turn 1 plays. Ill work on different list and post it up later.
Thanks for the support I'm working on it.
I like some of the ideas from TheWongPooky, especially a bit of the Metalcraft focus.
4 Hellrider
4 Rally the Peasants
Creatures
4 Memnite
Burn Spells
4 Incinerate
4 Galvanic Blast
4 Flayer Husk
4 Origin Spellbomb
Token Generators
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
4 Gather the Townsfolk
4 Midnight Haunting
4 Intangible Virtue
Lands
4 Clifftop Retreat
11 Mountain
9 Plains
First off, I'm 8 cards over limit. Might have to drop a land or two, though I have a thing with going under 24 lands. Maybe silly, but it's one of my "things."
I do want both Incinerate and Galvanic Blast to keep the burn focus.
Memnite is adorable, but seeing how I'm trying to keep with a token focus, might they be on the chopping block? Either that, or replaced with Signal Pest? Though if I chop it, I'm killing a lot of the metalcraft focus.
The rest of the deck, to be honest, I'm liking. 12 token generating cards, Origin Spellbomb for a bit of draw, and Intangible Virtue seems good to me. Just need those final few cuts.