This is a game. As such, I expect everyone to obey the general rules of sportsmanlike conduct one would expect in any game, which includes following all the rules below. Keep it fun; do not harass me or your fellow players.
You may not talk outside of the thread to anyone about anything that goes on in this game, period. Whether you're dead, or they're dead, whether they are in the game or not. The only exception is if your role specifically allows it.
Days will last as long as they need to, within reason. A deadline may be imposed at my discretion, in the event that discussion lags severely. Prods will be more liberal when a deadline is in effect.
Nights will generally last about three days. They may be longer, or occasionally shorter, at my discretion. You will always be informed of exactly when night will end.
Night actions may be submitted and resubmitted at any point during the night phase. The final submission will be the action counted. A role might override this rule.
Votes must be in bold, in the form "vote moniker". It would help my bookkeeping greatly if you would unvote before voting for someone else, but it is not required. You may vote no lynch if you so choose.
A majority is always required to lynch. If a deadline is imposed, and no majority is reached prior to it, the day will end with no lynch.
You may not, under any circumstances, edit or delete your posts. If you really need to add something to a previous post, the general tactic is to double-post. However, try to avoid doing so unless it's necessary (That's more of a forum rule than a mafia rule).
You may not, under any circumstances, quote any game-related PM's. Use caution when paraphrasing them. If you are unsure whether you can post something, just private message me to ask about it.
You may not discuss the structure of game-related PM’s. There will be a short leash on this behavior.
Any QuickTopic discussions are counted as game-related PM’s.
BASIC ONLY RULE: Players in a basic game I am hosting my quote from their role PMs freely, but only from their role PMs.
You may not post anything game-related after you die. You are allowed one short "bah" style post, but that's it. Then you're, well, dead.
I expect a certain level of participation out of all the players. Please post at least once every two or three days. If you will be unable to post for a longer duration than this, please state so in thread. If it's going to be an incredibly long delay, or you don't think you will be able to participate enough in the future, please request replacement. Unexcused inactivity will result in a "mod prod" for first violation, and replacement after that. If no replacements are found in a week, you will be mod-killed regardless of alignment.
Role actions are of set priority, and that priority is determined by me. I will never tell you what that priority is, so don’t ask.
Please be aware that I will not be posting much if at all on weekends or holidays. I will work with the needs of you (the players) if you are willing to work with me.
Direct correspondence from me may override any of the above rules. I will provide such correspondence publicly.
THIS GAME: Players will only be prodded three times in a single game. After three prods they will be forcibly replaced.
THIS GAME: No player slot will be replaced more than twice. If the slot requires additional replacements, the slot will be modkilled.
THIS GAME: If there are two modkills in a single day, the day will end.
So stuff I like is hanging out in my head, and I decide to let them be and let my mind wonder elsewhere for a while. Little do I know that some things in my head have become jealous of my diverse tastes and have teamed up so they are the only things I care about.
The rest of the stuff I like have caught on to the other stuff's devious plot and must oust them from my mind, never to be thought of again - like that one girl from that one time with those things!
Day 1 will start when most people have confirmed and I feel like starting. NO POSTING!
Okay. I am confused. I thought this was supposed to be a game where one group (Mafia) tries to kill another group (Town) while hiding amongst the Town players.
If that is the case, I don't understand my Role PM.
I'm going to use the following rule to allow me to ask for help...
BASIC ONLY RULE: Players in a basic game I am hosting my quote from their role PMs freely, but only from their role PMs.
So, here is my role PM:
Electricity
Wiki
You are Self
Killer – You can PM the name of one player per night to kill.
Electricity is the ****. It controls the modern world. You cannot be a part of the modern world without it. Everything from lights and computers to microwaves and elevators. Heck, it even controls our bodies, from your heart rate to the electrical impulses used to control your muscles. And it can kill. Apply enough electricity to just about anything and you'll destroy it, one way or another. Now if only I could control it with my mind…
You win when all other players are eliminated.
Confirm by responding to this PM.
Am I part of the Town group, looking for the Mafia? But I can kill, so does that mean I am Mafia? If so, then how do I find out who my teammates are so I don't accidentally kill one of them?
looking forward to a great game, looks like the first lynching is gonna be an easy one. I hate to appear lynch happy, but the situation clearly couldn't be more obvious.
looking forward to a great game, looks like the first lynching is gonna be an easy one. I hate to appear lynch happy, but the situation clearly couldn't be more obvious.
Vote: Ahlyis
See, now this is what I expect from someone that doesn't know me and thinks this may be my first game of Mafia. But how PK could possibly think I was serious after all the games we've played together... well, either he's still drunk, or he thinks I'm a threat and wants to try to get rid of me early. I doubt he's still drunk. I think I'll be leaving my vote on him.
Awww, and here I was hoping to get back into the swing of things with a Random Voting Stage™ vote. Now it looks like I'm gonna have to start deducing right off the bat.
If someone claims that they are an unlynchable, unkillable, octa-voter, with 4 daykills and 6 doc-protects, then technically lynching that person solely based on his claim would be gaming the mod, but I would be just fine doing that.
See, now this is what I expect from someone that doesn't know me and thinks this may be my first game of Mafia. But how PK could possibly think I was serious after all the games we've played together... well, either he's still drunk, or he thinks I'm a threat and wants to try to get rid of me early. I doubt he's still drunk. I think I'll be leaving my vote on him.
So are you suggesting you forged that PM, and if so why? It certainly doesn't look forged to me, and looks like something the mod would say. If you explain yourself better, I may be convinced to change my vote... But as is my vote still stands.
It looks to me like Ahlyis was just fishing for reactions. I don't like how early he did it, but, I suppose with the way he did it, it would pretty much have to be his first post anyways, but still...
I'd put him on town...seems too risky to start out trying to pull that off as scum; they'd rather not call too much attention upon themselves initially; they're more likely to ones to sit back. I don't necessarily agree with Ahlyis that PK is scum, though. I don't know enough about either of them to concur with his analysis, and his initial reaction seems to be saying 'What a newb', which doesn't seem like it says anything about his alignment.
If someone claims that they are an unlynchable, unkillable, octa-voter, with 4 daykills and 6 doc-protects, then technically lynching that person solely based on his claim would be gaming the mod, but I would be just fine doing that.
Hhhmmm... I think I'll wait for Ahlyis' response before I retract my vote, but do you honestly believe the PM was forged? Call me gullible, but the post looks like something the mod would write... But I guess if he is a regular on a different account, then its possible he knows Emo quite well, and he may have copied a post from a previous game, or is simply very good at forging, haha.
I suspected PK at first, but his reaction to Ahlyis makes me think he is town, but the whole thing could be one big mafia plot.
This is certainly an odd situation. I don't see why you would straight up quote that on day one/page one. It feels like he was joking. Then again, why would you paint a big target on your forehead like that. Seems like a big risk for some laughs.
Obviously you guys are more experienced players, so I definitely won't be disregarding your opinions on the matter... But it definitely feels like he just slipped up to me; newbie error and then he tried to cover it up by lying. I am actually intrigued to hear whether or not PK does remember him from previous games, as Ahlyis claims.
If Ahlyis is telling the truth then he is a SK which we now know and has become Mafia number 1 target. He is not a problem for town now because we know who he is and we can use him as a vig.
Now if that is a lie then the only reason to lynch him is that we suspect that he is scum claiming SK because for now Mafia is the priority not the SK.
The last case is town claiming SK which would hurt town if he is lynched so he could be claiming to draw the NK on him instead of somebody else.
So the important question is:
Is Ahlyis scum? --> For now I don't think so but if he does something suspicious then he will become a good Day 1 lynch.
Yeah that is a good point, and may be part of his strategy. But either way, it might be useful to keep him alive, if you think mafia will kill him in the night phase.
But there are still questions.
1. Do you think the mafia will kill him in the night phase? If they know who he is, then they might just kill the strongest town.
2. If he is SK I am presuming he doesn't know who the mafia are, so could easily kill off town as well; and has a greater chance of doing so.
3. We take a greater risk (depending on how the rest of the day pans out) picking someone else who seems mafia, but by numbers, is most likely town, and then leaving one death that is most certainly town, and one death that is most likely town =
he kills town
we kill town
mafia kills town
3 dead towns. So by lynching him, it could still be three towns dead, but seems more likely, I think, it will look like this:
1 town
1 SK
or can he kill in the day phase, before we lynch?
I am just going to play it out and see if anyone else slips up, or if another explanation is given better than mine in favour of not lynching Ahlyis; but for now my vote stands. And if he is SK and can kill in the day phase, then I am pretty scared right now.
So we need four more votes, and it will be decided. I certainly don't want to get to night phase and see town ripped to shreds, particularly myself, by mafia kills, inappropriate lynchings, and a newbie SK. And I am not sure, as you say Pdr, that the mafia will kill him on night one.
Hhhmmm... I think I'll wait for Ahlyis' response before I retract my vote, but do you honestly believe the PM was forged? Call me gullible, but the post looks like something the mod would write... But I guess if he is a regular on a different account, then its possible he knows Emo quite well, and he may have copied a post from a previous game, or is simply very good at forging, haha..
I'm a regular at a different site, not here with a different account. This is my first Mafia game... here.
If you want to see proof that I'm not a newb, check out this site...
After looking at some of the games there, it should be obvious that I am not new to Mafia. And that first post could only be "serious" if I were actually new to Mafia.
If you go into the Ancient games archive, the very oldest game they still have recorded has me in it (and alive at the end). The second oldest game not only has me in it, but has me pretty much single-handedly winning the game for Town. Granted, that was a bit of a strange game. Sadly, Shawshank Mafia is even older and now lost. I mention Shawshank because in that game too I claimed SK day 1 (as Town).
And that's why PK's reaction confused me. PK has been playing even longer than I have, is an excellent player, and KNOWS I'm not some newb to not even know what an SK is or be confused by a role PM like that.
However... I'm going to have to change my vote off of PK. Something bigger just came along...
I find the possibility of a vig highly unlikely given the existence of a serial killer.
The mafia will not kill him. If there are only two mafia which is highly likely, there is only a 20% chance that one of them will be killed by the killer, and they know that to win, the town will eventually would have to lynch him anyways to win.
I'm going to assume that this was merely a newb mistake, but regardless, we need to kill him. Town, read your wincons. Look at how it doesn't say anything about mafia, just 'threats.'
That's interesting... because that IS what my wincon says in my actual role PM.
If everyone else wants to step forward and say that their wincon specifically says "Mafia" and not "threats", then I'll just take one for the team and write it down to extremely bad luck that I got the ONLY role PM worded differently.
I think it much more likely though that this is a slip. That he actually has a role PM that specifies he remove all Town, and just assumed Town had the reverse.
That's interesting... because that IS what my wincon says in my actual role PM.
If everyone else wants to step forward and say that their wincon specifically says "Mafia" and not "threats", then I'll just take one for the team and write it down to extremely bad luck that I got the ONLY role PM worded differently.
I think it much more likely though that this is a slip. That he actually has a role PM that specifies he remove all Town, and just assumed Town had the reverse.
Unvote. Vote: MzztrTetris
Extremely bad luck, or an extremely big lie, considering my wincon stated threats, too.
How many times will you get to do something like that? How often will people think you are new?
I felt reasonably safe with it because almost half the players are from Px2 and know me as a regular player of long standing there. I was expecting support from them that I wasn't a newb that wouldn't understand what a SK role was... not a vote from the first one that came along! *glares at PK*
Someone else please read Mzztr's post and tell me whether he said his wincon specified Mafia or not. I thought he was accusing me of slipping with "threats" in my wincon because his specified Mafia. But if that's not what he meant, as he now claims, then I'll retract my vote.
Look back at Tetris' original post. He says Town's wincon says threats, and so does mine. Pretty sure I feel safe he's town right now.
Okay, I can see it now. I misunderstood it the first time.
But, if you're sure he is Town because of that, then why not me as well? I obviously had "threats" in my wincon or I wouldn't have known to use that wording. And if you check up on my history at Px2 you'll see I'm definitely not a newb that wouldn't understand their role PM.
Still, if people really want to lynch me, so be it. If nothing else, at least I got this game started off without days and days of joke voting and nothing consequential being said.
Okay, I can see it now. I misunderstood it the first time.
But, if you're sure he is Town because of that, then why not me as well? I obviously had "threats" in my wincon or I wouldn't have known to use that wording. And if you check up on my history at Px2 you'll see I'm definitely not a newb that wouldn't understand their role PM.
Still, if people really want to lynch me, so be it. If nothing else, at least I got this game started off without days and days of joke voting and nothing consequential being said.
I am mostly convinced you aren't a newbie, no worries about that. And yeah, my hat is off to you, it has made the game interesting, at least for now. I guess your slip ups and seedy behaviour still have me wondering, so I am not ready to retract my vote, particularly as there is still a risk you are SK, and if you are, I would now be one of your prime targets for a round one death. It's all in the maths man, but no hard feelings. Convince me you won't kill me, and someone else is most definitely mafia, and I will definitely reconsider.
I understand, and have looked at the chances of this being a gambit.
However, two things stand out to me:
1. The fact that the town wincon is in the OP for everyone to see.
2. The wincon itself. In every game I have played where there are no neutrals, the wincon will say mafia. In every game where there are neutrals, it will say something along the lines of 'threats.' The fact that you walk in and falseclaim a neutral role is just a bit to coincidental for my tastes.
But if he did notice the wincon in the OP, then I don't see your line of argument; if most games that have neutrals have threat on town wincons, and he saw this, then he would assume there was a neutral in the game.
I understand, and have looked at the chances of this being a gambit.
However, two things stand out to me:
1. The fact that the town wincon is in the OP for everyone to see.
2. The wincon itself. In every game I have played where there are no neutrals, the wincon will say mafia. In every game where there are neutrals, it will say something along the lines of 'threats.' The fact that you walk in and falseclaim a neutral role is just a bit to coincidental for my tastes.
So... #2 argues that you think this is NOT a gambit, but #1 argues that you think this IS a gambit (and that it is a gambit done by Mafia).
That's interesting. I think I'll switch my vote to you after all.
Unvote. Vote: Mzztr
If you were Town, and as experienced as you seem to be, I see no reason why you would lockjaw on only possibilities that I'm a threat. But that would be the perfect thing to do as Mafia jumping on what they see as an easy mislynch.
I am mostly convinced you aren't a newbie, no worries about that. And yeah, my hat is off to you, it has made the game interesting, at least for now. I guess your slip ups and seedy behaviour still have me wondering, so I am not ready to retract my vote, particularly as there is still a risk you are SK, and if you are, I would now be one of your prime targets for a round one death. It's all in the maths man, but no hard feelings. Convince me you won't kill me, and someone else is most definitely mafia, and I will definitely reconsider.
I'd kill PK if I actually were an SK or Vig. You voting for me makes sense, but PK voting for me makes no sense at all.
I'm not worried about your vote though. You can't lynch me. It takes you and about 6 others to lynch me. Would I prefer you vote someone else? Sure. But unless we're near the deadline, or the banbdwagon continues piling up, even the three votes I have now (it is three, isn't it?) isn't all that worrying... yet.
There's still a LOT of time left in Day 1. I may still be the lynch by the the end of the Day, but I expect once more people have a chance to participate, there will be some other candidates as well.
I will explain it this way Ahl: you broke my brain.
I'm not often tricked by reaction trolls but a PM quote still sets off mental alarms - it didn't even occur to me that it might be a trick at first.
I did go through the rules but I didn't mentally parse "you may quote your role PM." So my instant kneejerk reaction was "oh my god, I've set up this game with the council and on the first page someone takes a modkill worthy action - we've instantly hit snafu." So the irrationality/panic/paranoia and "oh damn it we're gonna be poor" alarm is going off on my brain.
After re-reading your post, I saw you could quote your PM. My original post was something like ".../Seriously?/WHY WHY WHY would you DO THIS AHL, REALLY?!?! [anger]" Then I downgraded it to what you saw removing the condemnation for quoting the PM without really thinking about it much more.
The fact I have knowledge of you works both ways - clearly I can't exploit the situation and claim you're a scrub or something. Four other people here are aware of our relative histories and would be able to verify your game awareness. A master plan to try and exploit you're a new player when I know you're not would be, well, stupid.
Now obviously I've had more time away from the situation to think about it and I'm inclined to think that kind of gambit speaks more toward a town Ahl than a scum one. There's zero percent chance of any kind of serious "I am really a SK" kind of claim given my personal knowledge of Ahl given his listed misunderstanding.
Unvote: Ahl, Vote: Freddeh
...
"2. The wincon itself. In every game I have played where there are no neutrals, the wincon will say mafia. In every game where there are neutrals, it will say something along the lines of 'threats.' The fact that you walk in and falseclaim a neutral role is just a bit to coincidental for my tastes."
I can't agree that this has been my general experience.
I'd kill PK if I actually were an SK or Vig. You voting for me makes sense, but PK voting for me makes no sense at all.
I'm not worried about your vote though. You can't lynch me. It takes you and about 6 others to lynch me. Would I prefer you vote someone else? Sure. But unless we're near the deadline, or the banbdwagon continues piling up, even the three votes I have now (it is three, isn't it?) isn't all that worrying... yet.
There's still a LOT of time left in Day 1. I may still be the lynch by the the end of the Day, but I expect once more people have a chance to participate, there will be some other candidates as well.
And then by the second or third night, with PK and Tetris gone, and me unable to convince the others that there is a direct correlation between their deaths and you, I suddenly drop dead... No thanks. Maybe you are right, and things will change, but there are still five people to speak, and I have no idea what way they will swing, so I am keeping an open mind, but conscious that at this point in the game, you seem a threat.
But if he did notice the wincon in the OP, then I don't see your line of argument; if most games that have neutrals have threat on town wincons, and he saw this, then he would assume there was a neutral in the game.
That would be true if I were familiar with Emo or the norms of this forum.
I'm not a newb to Mafia, but I am a newb to the ways and standard practices of this forum. It's possible I would've caught something like that on my own, but more likely it would have had to be a scumbuddy familiar with these forums suggesting it to me.
In this case, I wanted to make a post of a "rookie mistake", so I needed a role which might be confusing to a newb. I would've made the same claim whether the wincon's said threats or Mafia/Town. Granted, the wording might have been a little different, but I'd have made the same claim because that's the role I felt was most likely to be confusing for a newb. Also, I'd done it before (claiming SK Day 1 in Shawshank Mafia back when Px2 was still part of the MPFG area of the Wizards forums).
I will explain it this way Ahl: you broke my brain.
I'm not often tricked by reaction trolls but a PM quote still sets off mental alarms - it didn't even occur to me that it might be a trick at first.
I did go through the rules but I didn't mentally parse "you may quote your role PM." So my instant kneejerk reaction was "oh my god, I've set up this game with the council and on the first page someone takes a modkill worthy action - we've instantly hit snafu." So the irrationality/panic/paranoia and "oh damn it we're gonna be poor" alarm is going off on my brain.
After re-reading your post, I saw you could quote your PM. My original post was something like ".../Seriously?/WHY WHY WHY would you DO THIS AHL, REALLY?!?! [anger]" Then I downgraded it to what you saw removing the condemnation for quoting the PM without really thinking about it much more.
The fact I have knowledge of you works both ways - clearly I can't exploit the situation and claim you're a scrub or something. Four other people here are aware of our relative histories and would be able to verify your game awareness. A master plan to try and exploit you're a new player when I know you're not would be, well, stupid.
Now obviously I've had more time away from the situation to think about it and I'm inclined to think that kind of gambit speaks more toward a town Ahl than a scum one. There's zero percent chance of any kind of serious "I am really a SK" kind of claim given my personal knowledge of Ahl given his listed misunderstanding.
Unvote: Ahl, Vote: Freddeh
...
"2. The wincon itself. In every game I have played where there are no neutrals, the wincon will say mafia. In every game where there are neutrals, it will say something along the lines of 'threats.' The fact that you walk in and falseclaim a neutral role is just a bit to coincidental for my tastes."
I can't agree that this has been my general experience.
Or that I really care about win cons at all.
I am assuming you are voting Freddeh because you know him to be a powerful mafia, rather than a likely mafia. Not a reason I would use to vote for someone, given he could be an awesome town player, too.
I think it was a gambit, but a gambit using an ACTUAL post... because it definitely did not look fabricated.
Yes. My reasoning for that sentance was that I was expecting a fun little neutral hunt after I saw the wincon. Now that you've out and claimed, you've lost the excitement.
Okay. Fair enough. Lynch me then so you can have your excitement back.
Also, fair enough to Techno. As I said, I'm really not worried about your vote. It's just one of 7 needed to lynch me, and it's a perfectly reasonable vote given the situation. I don't blame you for the vote, or even for leaving it on me given it's Day 1 and I'm the only show in Town so far.
I would start to blame you if you started to lockjaw on me and refused to entertain any other possibilities. THEN, I'd start to take it more seriously and want to see you gone (if I had a NK).
That would be true if I were familiar with Emo or the norms of this forum.
I'm not a newb to Mafia, but I am a newb to the ways and standard practices of this forum. It's possible I would've caught something like that on my own, but more likely it would have had to be a scumbuddy familiar with these forums suggesting it to me.
In this case, I wanted to make a post of a "rookie mistake", so I needed a role which might be confusing to a newb. I would've made the same claim whether the wincon's said threats or Mafia/Town. Granted, the wording might have been a little different, but I'd have made the same claim because that's the role I felt was most likely to be confusing for a newb. Also, I'd done it before (claiming SK Day 1 in Shawshank Mafia back when Px2 was still part of the MPFG area of the Wizards forums).
You are saying you fabricated the PM, yeah? And you fabricated it off the flavour from your town PM?
I see only one solution to this problem.
If the rules state you can post PM's, then post your real, Town PM right now, and everyone will know you are town for the rest of the game. And no one will else will have that opportunity, because they can simply copy/paste.
Okay. Fair enough. Lynch me then so you can have your excitement back.
Also, fair enough to Techno. As I said, I'm really not worried about your vote. It's just one of 7 needed to lynch me, and it's a perfectly reasonable vote given the situation. I don't blame you for the vote, or even for leaving it on me given it's Day 1 and I'm the only show in Town so far.
I would start to blame you if you started to lockjaw on me and refused to entertain any other possibilities. THEN, I'd start to take it more seriously and want to see you gone (if I had a NK).
Yeah, it's pretty much 60/40 right now, so I am unlikely to lockjaw any time soon.
FreddehSharkFinnigan, Dr McNinja - GoontheatogImTehFairyShalako, Santikos Silverado 19, Bulletproof ScumMan, I was lame to ever like:
GamerzWheat_Grinder: HYPERBOLE AND A HALF, VANILLA TOWN; Killed Night 1Pdr_BrProphylaxisTanarin; NOAH ANTWILER, TOWN DOCTOR; Killed Night 3MzztrTetrisNis; DaMARCO, VANILLA TOWN; Lynched Day 4Run out of town:
ProphetKingvoid; Kevin Smith, Vanilla TownStatus and important links:
PREGAME/D1/V1/V2/M1/V3/M2/V4/M3/V5/V6/V7/V8/M4/M5/V9/V10/M6/V11/N1
D2/V1/M1/V2/V3/V4/V5/V6/V7/N2
D3/V1/V2/V3/V4/N3
D4/V1/V2/GAME OVER
SCUM WIN!
Here's a vanilla town's role PM:
If your role deviated from this format, it is a typo.
The rest of the stuff I like have caught on to the other stuff's devious plot and must oust them from my mind, never to be thought of again - like that one girl from that one time with those things!
Day 1 will start when most people have confirmed and I feel like starting. NO POSTING!DAY 1 IS GO. HAVE FUN AND READ THE RULES!
uh wait...
Unvote: Peregrine, Vote: Freddeh
...
FYI Px2ers:
Don't post bold red text, double post without content or image leech. Or you can pick up flags like I did in 2010.
Unvote: Freddeh, Vote: PDR
LAL
If that is the case, I don't understand my Role PM.
I'm going to use the following rule to allow me to ask for help...
So, here is my role PM:
Am I part of the Town group, looking for the Mafia? But I can kill, so does that mean I am Mafia? If so, then how do I find out who my teammates are so I don't accidentally kill one of them?
...seriously?...
Unvote: PDR, Vote: Ahl
...Seriously?...
You know, I expected that kind of a response from someone... but not from you!
VOTE: PK
Then I read the rule you quoted twice more and went from abject horror to moderate disgust as it appeared you tossed the game via brain farting.
Now I've been reaction trolled (successfully, congratulations) and we're playing a real game ten posts in.
I'll mark you down next to SJT, Rhox, Murica as "people to take extremely skeptically" in the future.
looking forward to a great game, looks like the first lynching is gonna be an easy one. I hate to appear lynch happy, but the situation clearly couldn't be more obvious.
Vote: Ahlyis
So are you suggesting you forged that PM, and if so why? It certainly doesn't look forged to me, and looks like something the mod would say. If you explain yourself better, I may be convinced to change my vote... But as is my vote still stands.
I'd put him on town...seems too risky to start out trying to pull that off as scum; they'd rather not call too much attention upon themselves initially; they're more likely to ones to sit back. I don't necessarily agree with Ahlyis that PK is scum, though. I don't know enough about either of them to concur with his analysis, and his initial reaction seems to be saying 'What a newb', which doesn't seem like it says anything about his alignment.
I suspected PK at first, but his reaction to Ahlyis makes me think he is town, but the whole thing could be one big mafia plot.
Sig & Avvy by Disappointing Signets Inc.
CCC&G BRAGGING RIGHTS
Mafia Statistics
I collect pacifism: 228
Yeah that is a good point, and may be part of his strategy. But either way, it might be useful to keep him alive, if you think mafia will kill him in the night phase.
But there are still questions.
1. Do you think the mafia will kill him in the night phase? If they know who he is, then they might just kill the strongest town.
2. If he is SK I am presuming he doesn't know who the mafia are, so could easily kill off town as well; and has a greater chance of doing so.
3. We take a greater risk (depending on how the rest of the day pans out) picking someone else who seems mafia, but by numbers, is most likely town, and then leaving one death that is most certainly town, and one death that is most likely town =
he kills town
we kill town
mafia kills town
3 dead towns. So by lynching him, it could still be three towns dead, but seems more likely, I think, it will look like this:
1 town
1 SK
or can he kill in the day phase, before we lynch?
I am just going to play it out and see if anyone else slips up, or if another explanation is given better than mine in favour of not lynching Ahlyis; but for now my vote stands. And if he is SK and can kill in the day phase, then I am pretty scared right now.
If you want to see proof that I'm not a newb, check out this site...
http://community.wizards.com/paranoia/go/forum/viewboard
After looking at some of the games there, it should be obvious that I am not new to Mafia. And that first post could only be "serious" if I were actually new to Mafia.
If you go into the Ancient games archive, the very oldest game they still have recorded has me in it (and alive at the end). The second oldest game not only has me in it, but has me pretty much single-handedly winning the game for Town. Granted, that was a bit of a strange game. Sadly, Shawshank Mafia is even older and now lost. I mention Shawshank because in that game too I claimed SK day 1 (as Town).
And that's why PK's reaction confused me. PK has been playing even longer than I have, is an excellent player, and KNOWS I'm not some newb to not even know what an SK is or be confused by a role PM like that.
However... I'm going to have to change my vote off of PK. Something bigger just came along...
newbie question, but what is a vig?
Me too.
If everyone else wants to step forward and say that their wincon specifically says "Mafia" and not "threats", then I'll just take one for the team and write it down to extremely bad luck that I got the ONLY role PM worded differently.
I think it much more likely though that this is a slip. That he actually has a role PM that specifies he remove all Town, and just assumed Town had the reverse.
Unvote. Vote: MzztrTetris
Extremely bad luck, or an extremely big lie, considering my wincon stated threats, too.
How many times will you get to do something like that? How often will people think you are new?
I felt reasonably safe with it because almost half the players are from Px2 and know me as a regular player of long standing there. I was expecting support from them that I wasn't a newb that wouldn't understand what a SK role was... not a vote from the first one that came along! *glares at PK*
If your wincon also states threats, then that confirms that I didn't get trapped by Mzztr, but that he actually is the one that slipped.
Someone else please read Mzztr's post and tell me whether he said his wincon specified Mafia or not. I thought he was accusing me of slipping with "threats" in my wincon because his specified Mafia. But if that's not what he meant, as he now claims, then I'll retract my vote.
Look back at Tetris' original post. He says Town's wincon says threats, and so does mine. Pretty sure I feel safe he's town right now.
But, if you're sure he is Town because of that, then why not me as well? I obviously had "threats" in my wincon or I wouldn't have known to use that wording. And if you check up on my history at Px2 you'll see I'm definitely not a newb that wouldn't understand their role PM.
Still, if people really want to lynch me, so be it. If nothing else, at least I got this game started off without days and days of joke voting and nothing consequential being said.
I am mostly convinced you aren't a newbie, no worries about that. And yeah, my hat is off to you, it has made the game interesting, at least for now. I guess your slip ups and seedy behaviour still have me wondering, so I am not ready to retract my vote, particularly as there is still a risk you are SK, and if you are, I would now be one of your prime targets for a round one death. It's all in the maths man, but no hard feelings. Convince me you won't kill me, and someone else is most definitely mafia, and I will definitely reconsider.
But if he did notice the wincon in the OP, then I don't see your line of argument; if most games that have neutrals have threat on town wincons, and he saw this, then he would assume there was a neutral in the game.
If we lynch you and you are indeed SK, then maybe, yeah. But at the moment, I would have to disagree with Tetris, haha.
That's interesting. I think I'll switch my vote to you after all.
Unvote. Vote: Mzztr
If you were Town, and as experienced as you seem to be, I see no reason why you would lockjaw on only possibilities that I'm a threat. But that would be the perfect thing to do as Mafia jumping on what they see as an easy mislynch.
I'm not worried about your vote though. You can't lynch me. It takes you and about 6 others to lynch me. Would I prefer you vote someone else? Sure. But unless we're near the deadline, or the banbdwagon continues piling up, even the three votes I have now (it is three, isn't it?) isn't all that worrying... yet.
There's still a LOT of time left in Day 1. I may still be the lynch by the the end of the Day, but I expect once more people have a chance to participate, there will be some other candidates as well.
I'm not often tricked by reaction trolls but a PM quote still sets off mental alarms - it didn't even occur to me that it might be a trick at first.
I did go through the rules but I didn't mentally parse "you may quote your role PM." So my instant kneejerk reaction was "oh my god, I've set up this game with the council and on the first page someone takes a modkill worthy action - we've instantly hit snafu." So the irrationality/panic/paranoia and "oh damn it we're gonna be poor" alarm is going off on my brain.
After re-reading your post, I saw you could quote your PM. My original post was something like ".../Seriously?/WHY WHY WHY would you DO THIS AHL, REALLY?!?! [anger]" Then I downgraded it to what you saw removing the condemnation for quoting the PM without really thinking about it much more.
The fact I have knowledge of you works both ways - clearly I can't exploit the situation and claim you're a scrub or something. Four other people here are aware of our relative histories and would be able to verify your game awareness. A master plan to try and exploit you're a new player when I know you're not would be, well, stupid.
Now obviously I've had more time away from the situation to think about it and I'm inclined to think that kind of gambit speaks more toward a town Ahl than a scum one. There's zero percent chance of any kind of serious "I am really a SK" kind of claim given my personal knowledge of Ahl given his listed misunderstanding.
Unvote: Ahl, Vote: Freddeh
...
"2. The wincon itself. In every game I have played where there are no neutrals, the wincon will say mafia. In every game where there are neutrals, it will say something along the lines of 'threats.' The fact that you walk in and falseclaim a neutral role is just a bit to coincidental for my tastes."
I can't agree that this has been my general experience.
Or that I really care about win cons at all.
And then by the second or third night, with PK and Tetris gone, and me unable to convince the others that there is a direct correlation between their deaths and you, I suddenly drop dead... No thanks. Maybe you are right, and things will change, but there are still five people to speak, and I have no idea what way they will swing, so I am keeping an open mind, but conscious that at this point in the game, you seem a threat.
I'm not a newb to Mafia, but I am a newb to the ways and standard practices of this forum. It's possible I would've caught something like that on my own, but more likely it would have had to be a scumbuddy familiar with these forums suggesting it to me.
In this case, I wanted to make a post of a "rookie mistake", so I needed a role which might be confusing to a newb. I would've made the same claim whether the wincon's said threats or Mafia/Town. Granted, the wording might have been a little different, but I'd have made the same claim because that's the role I felt was most likely to be confusing for a newb. Also, I'd done it before (claiming SK Day 1 in Shawshank Mafia back when Px2 was still part of the MPFG area of the Wizards forums).
I am assuming you are voting Freddeh because you know him to be a powerful mafia, rather than a likely mafia. Not a reason I would use to vote for someone, given he could be an awesome town player, too.
I think it was a gambit, but a gambit using an ACTUAL post... because it definitely did not look fabricated.
I believe he's electricity, sure.
Also, fair enough to Techno. As I said, I'm really not worried about your vote. It's just one of 7 needed to lynch me, and it's a perfectly reasonable vote given the situation. I don't blame you for the vote, or even for leaving it on me given it's Day 1 and I'm the only show in Town so far.
I would start to blame you if you started to lockjaw on me and refused to entertain any other possibilities. THEN, I'd start to take it more seriously and want to see you gone (if I had a NK).
You are saying you fabricated the PM, yeah? And you fabricated it off the flavour from your town PM?
I see only one solution to this problem.
If the rules state you can post PM's, then post your real, Town PM right now, and everyone will know you are town for the rest of the game. And no one will else will have that opportunity, because they can simply copy/paste.
Yeah, it's pretty much 60/40 right now, so I am unlikely to lockjaw any time soon.
Unvote: Freddeh, Vote: TeChNoWC