It's taken from today's AJ Kerrigan article on SCG. Looks janky but apparently he actually won some matches at FNM with it. Apparently he Devil's Played someone for 104 with 20 Tokens in play on Turn 4?! Basically you just make tons of tokens/tons of mana, and win with Burnt at the Stake/Devil's Play, or even token beatdown I suppose. Looks really cool (though I'd have thought it'd be inconsistent), just curious what people's thoughts are!
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard: Humanimator
Modern: Jund, Wafo-Tapa UWR
Legacy: Witch-Maw Stoneblade
EDH: Ruhan of the Fomori, Hazezon Tamar, Maga, Traitor to Mortals
I posted a thread about this a few days ago but with a different list/game plan. Mine is to stall out with tokens, drop an Arcane Melee, then combo off. It's painfully slow, but there's almost no way you can't go off once you drop an Arcane Melee.
This list is pretty interesting, and I like it a lot more than the other Kuldotha Rebirth storm lists I've seen, but it still seems VERY vulnerable to board wipes. The artifacts are a really cool way to start thinning out your deck, then used as sac fodder to get more thinning and 3 1/1's. I'll definitely do some testing with this deck!
I sincerely like this deck and it sounds like a blast being able to overtake at any time completely out of the blue. I may work on one for next weeks FNM.
Built the deck yesterday. Tested against solar flare, delver and B/W tokens.
Currently, from my experience, it wins at around turn 5~7, and earlier with a really good hand or miracle reforges.
Control just folds hard to this deck if they tap out even just once. Mind you, you only need one turn with 4~5 mana open to be able to release the 1 shot combo. It's also pretty decent against aggro with a mainboard Timely.
From my experience, it's a really fun deck. Problem is it really isn't consistent. There are so many dead cards in hand (battle hymn without creatures, and kudoltha without artifacts) at all points in the game.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Modern: GWR Naya Zoo RWG WUBRG Tribal Zoo GRBUW
Legacy: RUG RUG Delver GUR
Commander / EDH: G Ezuri, Renegade Leader G RUG Animar, Soul of Elements GUR
I am really liking the look of the deck, and considering it's pennies to build it seems like a great FNM for lulz deck.
I think I'd aim for a monored version. Need definitely x4 memnite. I think monored is simply the way to go, with all our mana generation being strcitly red but all our token generation being white in boros style, you can only generate tokens with lands.
Whereas in monored, you can get the nuts turn 3 and loot half your deck, generate dumb mana, make stupid tokens, then blow up the world. This doesnt work in WR since the need of white mana (which isn't generated by our ramp spells at all) to make tokens slows our tempo down and makes it impossible to blow out.
Increasing vengeance + past in flames makes the deck go overboard, since flames lets you flashback vengeance for RR instead of 3RR, but you still get the double copy effect proc.
Had a test turn where I had memnite in play and like 3 mana. Sacked memnite for 3 gobs, turned gob into mana, activated vengeance.
Sacked another gob adding more amna to pool, then flash backed a long long combo of revolts -> sac -> loot -> rinse and repeat until Ihad 10 tokens in play, then I cast battle hymn and double copied it with increasing vengeance, adding like 30 mana to my pool for 4 mana.
Then flashed back past in flames and basically tatcher's revolted like 8 times, and could've either swung for game or burn at the stake'd like 4 times over. Turn 3.
Well why not just drop the Kuldotha Rebirth and Artifacts and go overboard with W/R token generators? The obvious drawback would be the fact that Rebirth is only 1CC, while the alternative costs 3CC (Thatcher Revolt).
I propose Priest of Urabrask somewhere in the list.
I also like SteffenBlake's comment RE: Increasing Vengeance + Past in Flames.
I could never get this deck to work (I tried dozens of iterations from previous threads on this deck). I found that the biggest weaknesses of the deck are that 1) all the rituals are based on having creatures in play, and 2) the rituals only generate red mana.
Not only that, you need more than two creatures to get a net positive return on Battle Hymn. In my experience, once opponents read Infernal Plunge/Battle Hymn, they would relentlessly bang away at my practically defenseless dorks, and the match was over soon after. It always seemed like I was one mana/creature short of going off.
All that being said, I think the version I had the "most" success with was a mono red list that used metalcraft plus Reforge into a Molten Psyche or two as an alternate wincon. Exaggerated air quotes over "most"!
Honestly i was gonna build a list like this but wanted it to be able to do stuff to actively put aggression on opponent. so instead of koth was gonna be 2-3 hellriders and added signal pest/mox opal(2 of) to gain the ability for turn 2 kills or basically to turn 1 lay down around 3-9 power attacking turn 2 with the possibility of casting a hellrider turn 2 and swinging for near lethal.
I think that the win shouldn't be so concentrated on just burn at the stake but be able to reasonably have 2 different ways to win. Keepin in point with the whole ritual draw 7 perspective.
The deck in its current form is inconsistent as it relies on having artifacts / creatures in play just so you can go off. Battle Hymn and Kuldotha Rebirth are both dead cards unless you draw a tokenator / artifact with it.
It needs at least 4-5 mana sources in my experience to go off, that's kinda slow for me. But that's maybe because I've been playing too much ANT and TES in Legacy. =x
I'm shelving the deck for now, but I plan to develop this once again once rotation comes (and I hope it's still a deck when that comes). My favorite play style is combo, after all.
Good luck,
Razor
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I play EDH and can't afford Legacy. Therefore, I play bad decks in Standard.
Pros: You can discard it with impunity to your draw effects.
Cons: 21 Mana required to kill, 24 if flashing back.
This is usually my first pitch after a Faithless Looting.
Burn at the Stake:
Pros: 7 creatures required to kill, which is, in my theorycraft, significantly less than 21 mana.
Cons: Can't toss it at will.
Thoughts?
From just fishbowling this I'm almost always using Past in Flames to go off so I have no issue discarding Burn at the Stake. If I don't have a Past in Flames in the GY then it's a harder decision.
I'm still wondering if mono-red would work better than RW. My problem is running out of white mana when I go off, all those Gather the Townfolks just end up dead cards either in my GY or my hand.
One addition I'm thinking of making is Liquimetal Coating in place of Myco Wellspring. Liquimetal allows me to ensure I have an artifact I can sacrifice to Kuldotha Rebirth (often just the land I use to cast Kuldotha Rebirth) and a second artifact (the Liquimetal Coating itself) for a second Kuldotha. If you go off that turn sacrificing a tapped mountain isn't too much of a cost.
So I finally gave the deck a **** and yeah, super inconsistent. I'll come bal to it come M13 when white is less needed (Dragon Fodder reprint yay!). I'd say it's still worth splashing white though, for Spellbomb, sb options like Timely, and the one Increasing Devotion which was good for me. Maybe splashing blue for Ponder at a minimum will be better at that point, though? Idk, but I've found that ATM this deck is barely FNM-worthy.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard: Humanimator
Modern: Jund, Wafo-Tapa UWR
Legacy: Witch-Maw Stoneblade
EDH: Ruhan of the Fomori, Hazezon Tamar, Maga, Traitor to Mortals
^^ I don't think Grand Abolisher would play well with its WW casting cost.
How about adding Shimmering Grottos to the manabase to be able to filter R into W? This deck is really hurting for something like Chromatic Star or its equivalent. Even a 2-cost mana stone for white mana would be really welcome. The fact that you can pitch it to Kuldotha Rebirth after producing the mana is just icing.
If we keep the white mana requirement to just Gather the Townsfolk it might not be worth the white splash. If we can somehow find a way to consistently produce both W and B, we can run Gather the Townsfolk and Lingering Souls which would be an immense help. Without any mana stones, that feels like reaching though.
I still say that Sphere of the Suns is the card you are searching for. It makes your turn 3 plays much better. Target for Kuldotha Rebirth and gives all colors.
I still say that Sphere of the Suns is the card you are searching for. It makes your turn 3 plays much better. Target for Kuldotha Rebirth and gives all colors.
I wouldn't even try touching Lingering Souls. We are basically playing token generators to make Battle Hymn give more mana. Souls gives 2 guys for 3 or 4 for 5 which is just bad. Sure, it makes the token plan better, but otherwise it is just not good. I still think the best option is to play Mono Red after M13 comes out, but I'm willing to test out the RW deck as well.
I had Sphere of the suns in mind, the only issue I have with it is the fact that it comes into play tapped, Id love if we can get use out of it mid combo by casting the ones we draw into. It feels like too much effort though, and sticking to monored appears to be the best option. I'm doing some testing on the weekend, let you guys know how it goes.
Flayer Husk's germ can be Infernal Plunged then Kuldotha Rebirth the Flayer Husk itself. The order does matter but this deck could really use a 1 drop.
My friend didn't have a deck on him and I'd put this together since its so cheap so he played it in an event last night and went 2-1, beating monoblack Zombies and Flare and losing to Wolf Run. He said he actually loved playing it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard: Humanimator
Modern: Jund, Wafo-Tapa UWR
Legacy: Witch-Maw Stoneblade
EDH: Ruhan of the Fomori, Hazezon Tamar, Maga, Traitor to Mortals
I'm going to use Spellskite in this build. I can use it's ability to get my life down to 5 (or less) to cast Gather the Townsfolk at Fateful hour. Usually those 5 tokens followed by a Battle Hymn get me enough mana to go off.
He's also pretty decent at blocking until you can find the cards to go off with.
Lastly he's a decent sacrifce for Kuldotha Rebirth on that last turn.
I'm also thinking about putting more Noxious Revivals in there somehow. Noxious Revival is great with Reforge the Soul.
hey can anyone give me an example of how this deck plays out? like... choices you would make based on your hand, or a general idea of what plays you would do before others? when is the opportune moment to try to 'combo out'?
i know thats a super situational question, but im pretty interested in this deck
I'm going to use Spellskite in this build. I can use it's ability to get my life down to 5 (or less) to cast Gather the Townsfolk at Fateful hour. Usually those 5 tokens followed by a Battle Hymn get me enough mana to go off.
He's also pretty decent at blocking until you can find the cards to go off with.
Lastly he's a decent sacrifce for Kuldotha Rebirth on that last turn.
I'm also thinking about putting more Noxious Revivals in there somehow. Noxious Revival is great with Reforge the Soul.
Hey, why not rock Hex Parasite instead? It's one mana cheaper than Spellskite and can do basically the same job.
On Revival: I don't think it could be that effective. I use Reforge the Soul to get the cards I need to combo off. I really don't want to discard those to a random seven later on.
If I Reforge into a hand missing one piece, provided I have that piece in the graveyard Noxious can put it back on top. If I Reforge into a bad 7 I can put Reforge back on top, and do it all over again (sometimes even this turn if I can generate enough mana).
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Rituals
4 Battle Hymn
4 Infernal Plunge
Draw/Filter
4 Reforge the Soul
2 Past in Flames
1 Noxious Revival
2 Mycosynth Wellspring
2 Gitaxian Probe
4 Ichor Wellspring
4 Faithless Looting
4 Gather the Townsfolk
1 Increasing Devotion
1 Timely Reinforcements
4 Kuldotha Rebirth
2 Origin Spellbomb
Kill
1 Devil's Play
2 Burn at the Stake
Lands
4 Clifftop Retreat
3 Plains
11 Mountain
4 Intangible Virtue
3 Timely Reinforcements
2 Mental Misstep
2 Crush
2 Revoke Existence
2 Gut Shot
It's taken from today's AJ Kerrigan article on SCG. Looks janky but apparently he actually won some matches at FNM with it. Apparently he Devil's Played someone for 104 with 20 Tokens in play on Turn 4?! Basically you just make tons of tokens/tons of mana, and win with Burnt at the Stake/Devil's Play, or even token beatdown I suppose. Looks really cool (though I'd have thought it'd be inconsistent), just curious what people's thoughts are!
Modern: Jund, Wafo-Tapa UWR
Legacy: Witch-Maw Stoneblade
EDH: Ruhan of the Fomori, Hazezon Tamar, Maga, Traitor to Mortals
This list is pretty interesting, and I like it a lot more than the other Kuldotha Rebirth storm lists I've seen, but it still seems VERY vulnerable to board wipes. The artifacts are a really cool way to start thinning out your deck, then used as sac fodder to get more thinning and 3 1/1's. I'll definitely do some testing with this deck!
BU Lazav, Dimir Mastermind
BR Tor Wauki
BG Savra, Queen of the Golgari
BWURG Karona, False God
Standard
Currently nothing.
Modern
B 8-Rack
Casual
BW Pestilence
B Multiplayer Discard
Block Constructed
BWG Abzan Midrange
Currently Playing
UTron
Tahngarth, Talruum Hero
TRADE ME!!!
Currently, from my experience, it wins at around turn 5~7, and earlier with a really good hand or miracle reforges.
Control just folds hard to this deck if they tap out even just once. Mind you, you only need one turn with 4~5 mana open to be able to release the 1 shot combo. It's also pretty decent against aggro with a mainboard Timely.
From my experience, it's a really fun deck. Problem is it really isn't consistent. There are so many dead cards in hand (battle hymn without creatures, and kudoltha without artifacts) at all points in the game.
GWR Naya Zoo RWG
WUBRG Tribal Zoo GRBUW
Legacy:
RUG RUG Delver GUR
Commander / EDH:
G Ezuri, Renegade Leader G
RUG Animar, Soul of Elements GUR
I think I'd aim for a monored version. Need definitely x4 memnite. I think monored is simply the way to go, with all our mana generation being strcitly red but all our token generation being white in boros style, you can only generate tokens with lands.
Whereas in monored, you can get the nuts turn 3 and loot half your deck, generate dumb mana, make stupid tokens, then blow up the world. This doesnt work in WR since the need of white mana (which isn't generated by our ramp spells at all) to make tokens slows our tempo down and makes it impossible to blow out.
Increasing vengeance + past in flames makes the deck go overboard, since flames lets you flashback vengeance for RR instead of 3RR, but you still get the double copy effect proc.
Had a test turn where I had memnite in play and like 3 mana. Sacked memnite for 3 gobs, turned gob into mana, activated vengeance.
Sacked another gob adding more amna to pool, then flash backed a long long combo of revolts -> sac -> loot -> rinse and repeat until Ihad 10 tokens in play, then I cast battle hymn and double copied it with increasing vengeance, adding like 30 mana to my pool for 4 mana.
Then flashed back past in flames and basically tatcher's revolted like 8 times, and could've either swung for game or burn at the stake'd like 4 times over. Turn 3.
I propose Priest of Urabrask somewhere in the list.
I also like SteffenBlake's comment RE: Increasing Vengeance + Past in Flames.
Yo dawg, I heard you like MTG so we put a game into your game so you can play MTG while you play MTG
Not only that, you need more than two creatures to get a net positive return on Battle Hymn. In my experience, once opponents read Infernal Plunge/Battle Hymn, they would relentlessly bang away at my practically defenseless dorks, and the match was over soon after. It always seemed like I was one mana/creature short of going off.
All that being said, I think the version I had the "most" success with was a mono red list that used metalcraft plus Reforge into a Molten Psyche or two as an alternate wincon. Exaggerated air quotes over "most"!
I think that the win shouldn't be so concentrated on just burn at the stake but be able to reasonably have 2 different ways to win. Keepin in point with the whole ritual draw 7 perspective.
Tried it out. Hated it.
The deck in its current form is inconsistent as it relies on having artifacts / creatures in play just so you can go off. Battle Hymn and Kuldotha Rebirth are both dead cards unless you draw a tokenator / artifact with it.
It needs at least 4-5 mana sources in my experience to go off, that's kinda slow for me. But that's maybe because I've been playing too much ANT and TES in Legacy. =x
I'm shelving the deck for now, but I plan to develop this once again once rotation comes (and I hope it's still a deck when that comes). My favorite play style is combo, after all.
Good luck,
Razor
Standard:
RWBoros HumansRW
EDH:
WOdric, Master Tactician - Tokens and AnthemsW
BGGlissa, the Traitor - InfectGB
Filipino Podcast:
The Hour of Redemption
I like to connect with fellow players:
Twitter | Facebook
Devil's Play:
Pros: You can discard it with impunity to your draw effects.
Cons: 21 Mana required to kill, 24 if flashing back.
Burn at the Stake:
Pros: 7 creatures required to kill, which is, in my theorycraft, significantly less than 21 mana.
Cons: Can't toss it at will.
Thoughts?
Yo dawg, I heard you like MTG so we put a game into your game so you can play MTG while you play MTG
This is usually my first pitch after a Faithless Looting.
From just fishbowling this I'm almost always using Past in Flames to go off so I have no issue discarding Burn at the Stake. If I don't have a Past in Flames in the GY then it's a harder decision.
I'm still wondering if mono-red would work better than RW. My problem is running out of white mana when I go off, all those Gather the Townfolks just end up dead cards either in my GY or my hand.
One addition I'm thinking of making is Liquimetal Coating in place of Myco Wellspring. Liquimetal allows me to ensure I have an artifact I can sacrifice to Kuldotha Rebirth (often just the land I use to cast Kuldotha Rebirth) and a second artifact (the Liquimetal Coating itself) for a second Kuldotha. If you go off that turn sacrificing a tapped mountain isn't too much of a cost.
Modern: Jund, Wafo-Tapa UWR
Legacy: Witch-Maw Stoneblade
EDH: Ruhan of the Fomori, Hazezon Tamar, Maga, Traitor to Mortals
sig thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios
sales thread
How about adding Shimmering Grottos to the manabase to be able to filter R into W? This deck is really hurting for something like Chromatic Star or its equivalent. Even a 2-cost mana stone for white mana would be really welcome. The fact that you can pitch it to Kuldotha Rebirth after producing the mana is just icing.
If we keep the white mana requirement to just Gather the Townsfolk it might not be worth the white splash. If we can somehow find a way to consistently produce both W and B, we can run Gather the Townsfolk and Lingering Souls which would be an immense help. Without any mana stones, that feels like reaching though.
Yo dawg, I heard you like MTG so we put a game into your game so you can play MTG while you play MTG
Maybe worth a try 2 Mox Opal?
I had Sphere of the suns in mind, the only issue I have with it is the fact that it comes into play tapped, Id love if we can get use out of it mid combo by casting the ones we draw into. It feels like too much effort though, and sticking to monored appears to be the best option. I'm doing some testing on the weekend, let you guys know how it goes.
Yo dawg, I heard you like MTG so we put a game into your game so you can play MTG while you play MTG
RGBelcherGR
RUGRUG DelverGUR
Modern: Jund, Wafo-Tapa UWR
Legacy: Witch-Maw Stoneblade
EDH: Ruhan of the Fomori, Hazezon Tamar, Maga, Traitor to Mortals
He's also pretty decent at blocking until you can find the cards to go off with.
Lastly he's a decent sacrifce for Kuldotha Rebirth on that last turn.
I'm also thinking about putting more Noxious Revivals in there somehow. Noxious Revival is great with Reforge the Soul.
i know thats a super situational question, but im pretty interested in this deck
Hey, why not rock Hex Parasite instead? It's one mana cheaper than Spellskite and can do basically the same job.
Yo dawg, I heard you like MTG so we put a game into your game so you can play MTG while you play MTG
If I Reforge into a hand missing one piece, provided I have that piece in the graveyard Noxious can put it back on top. If I Reforge into a bad 7 I can put Reforge back on top, and do it all over again (sometimes even this turn if I can generate enough mana).