Vendilion Clique is sometimes merely a small annoyance and while it takes away one key component of your opponents plan, it could give them another. It also sometimes does nothing but probe your opponent's hand.
Flickerwisp can save your dudes from removal, flick a lethal attacker on your opponent's side of the field, flick a land on your turn to effectively cost 2 mana, abuse ETB effects and many other things.
I'm not saying he's better all the time, cause sometimes he just doesn't do enough. All I'm saying is that sometimes neither does V. Clique, and she still gets played a hell of a lot.
What do you guys think? Is Flickerwisp underrated? Does it deserve more play? Is it just bad? Why?
Also, I sense incoming "he sees play in Death and Taxes".
I want this discussion to be about his viability in decks OTHER than D+T. We already know he's good there.
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There has never been a land that enters the battlefield untapped unconditionally and taps for two colors unconditionally. That would be strictly better than a basic land
While Flickerwisp is an awesome card the versatility of Clique is better. Clique can cause problems with your opponents hands or help sculpt your own.
I agree it could see some more play but people love blue and hence Clique is more played. There are alot of decks that can be built around a flicker effect (cloudshift, restoration angel, flickerwisp, etc) but nothing solid has come out yet so I guess time will tell.
EDIT: I missed it doesn't have flash...thats the difference lol
Flickerwisp doesnt have flash or am I missing something?
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This is not how bans/unbans work. Its always the enabler that gets the ban, not the card that is being abused. If you would have Yawgmoths will + whatever cards - it would be Yawgs that would be banned. If you would have Stoneforge and batterskull - it would be stone who would be banned and that is exactly how it works. Furthermore, banning a card in order to unban a different card is a thought process that was and wont be never applied in practical means.
i don't think he's really consistently good enough unless he's paired with AEther Vial (in which case he effectively does have flash). i'm a huge fan of the card though
I play Flickerwisp in D&T, and he is pretty decent. If he had flash he would be a whole lot better, but at this point I am in favor of Restoration Angel for that very reason. He probably wouldn't see play in a deck that didn't have Aether Vial, at least not on a competitive level. At worst he is getting an enemy blocker out of the way, at best he is resetting Kitchen Finks or pumping out extra tokens from Blade Splicer. Sometimes I use him to reset opposing players' Aether Vial, or other such things, but it's not often I get that kind of utility out of him.
Flickerwisp may as well have flash, as they mostly just play it off Aether Vial. I guess it technically doesn't though, which is a problem for it. He's not doing enough to actually be playable except when there's an Aether Vial in play. Bouncing something until EoT isn't doing much on your turn except letting damage go through. You can do better in terms of damage for 3 mana. If you want to bounce your own guys, Restoration Angel is miles better.
I really don't like this card, it's fine when there's 4 Aether Vials and you're likely not winning without them, but playing cads that are unplayable without others (that you have no way of getting to) is not something you want to be doing.
He's the boss in D&T, but I can't see anything other than white tempo-based decks running him.
Even without flash, he's pretty great in D&T. He can effectively cost two (untap your own land), he makes golem tokens with Blade Splicer, removes counters from Jotun Grunt, carries Mask of Memory and Rancor well, resets opposing creatures/stuff with counters (vial, ravager, etc.), gets damage through, and is a fairly agressive and evasive creature.
Just an FYI: He doesn't necessarily cost 2. You can flick one of your lands, but you don't get it back until the end step, which means you are out of luck if you wanted to use that land to play something else during your turn.
There has never been a land that enters the battlefield untapped unconditionally and taps for two colors unconditionally. That would be strictly better than a basic land
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Same cmc as Vendilion Clique, same 3/1 body, flying and flash.
Vendilion Clique is sometimes merely a small annoyance and while it takes away one key component of your opponents plan, it could give them another. It also sometimes does nothing but probe your opponent's hand.
Flickerwisp can save your dudes from removal, flick a lethal attacker on your opponent's side of the field, flick a land on your turn to effectively cost 2 mana, abuse ETB effects and many other things.
I'm not saying he's better all the time, cause sometimes he just doesn't do enough. All I'm saying is that sometimes neither does V. Clique, and she still gets played a hell of a lot.
What do you guys think? Is Flickerwisp underrated? Does it deserve more play? Is it just bad? Why?
Also, I sense incoming "he sees play in Death and Taxes".
I want this discussion to be about his viability in decks OTHER than D+T. We already know he's good there.
Set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
I agree it could see some more play but people love blue and hence Clique is more played. There are alot of decks that can be built around a flicker effect (cloudshift, restoration angel, flickerwisp, etc) but nothing solid has come out yet so I guess time will tell.
EDIT: I missed it doesn't have flash...thats the difference lol
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I really don't like this card, it's fine when there's 4 Aether Vials and you're likely not winning without them, but playing cads that are unplayable without others (that you have no way of getting to) is not something you want to be doing.
Grixis Death's Shadow, Jund, UW Tron, Jeskai Control, Storm, Counters Company, Eldrazi Tron, Affinity, Living End, Infect, Merfolk, Dredge, Ad Nauseam, Amulet, Bogles, Eldrazi Tron, Mono U Tron, Lantern, Mardu Pyromancer
Even without flash, he's pretty great in D&T. He can effectively cost two (untap your own land), he makes golem tokens with Blade Splicer, removes counters from Jotun Grunt, carries Mask of Memory and Rancor well, resets opposing creatures/stuff with counters (vial, ravager, etc.), gets damage through, and is a fairly agressive and evasive creature.
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Oh, well I feel silly.
I guess playing him with Aether Vial so much brainwashed me.
Aaaaaaaand this thread can pretty much just be closed now I guess.
Set a man on fire, he'll be warm for the rest of his life.