At this point, I'm quite new to this thing. I'd cubed maybe three times ever before I started assembling a cube of my own ~2 months ago. Read some stuff (wtwlf123's guide was very helpful), talked to some people, ordered an Upheaval, and started sleeving.
Among the regulars at my shop, I am the only legacy player. EDH is a big deal but that's the only exposure most of them have to older cards. With how often we play EDH, people are more comfortable drafting midrange strategies than anything else. I still want all the other archetypes to work though.
//Basic Information Cube Size: 480 Breakdown: 60 Mono, 60 Multi, 60 Colorless, 60 Land Standard or Theme: Standard Snow Lands: No Average Number of Players: 6, though I've been trying to get more How Often Drafted: Weekly
//Card Selection Proxies: Yes (10 duals) Powered: No Portal: Yes "Un" Cards: No Banned Cards for Power-Level: Yes Banned Cards for Time Constraints: No Banned Cards for "fun" factor: I'll call it disagreements on design
//Cube Design Standard or Multiplayer: Standard Sideboards?: Yes Color Balance: Yes Gold Balance: No Hybrid/Split/Kicker as Gold: Yes Color Triggers as Gold: Yes Perfectly Balanced CMC: No
Tinker is excluded because I effectively built myself out of it. There's some respectable Tinker targets but not so many (and not so devastating) that I think it would be consistently worth the investment. It's quite possible I should fit Fabricate in here though.
Emphasis on tempo and control. Has about half the instants in the cube.
I'm finding it difficult to theorycraft how good the B cards are. With a bit more drafting a significant number of cards in this section may change. Still, I like all the cards individually and people seem to be having a lot of fun with them.
Seems like Incinerate should be in here. Still, it also seems like I'd rather draft the 1 mana sorceries and 3 mana instants over Incinerate and the next cut out of Red I want to be for Burning of Xinye.
The last refuge of Primeval Titan. Using Hornet Queen over Avenger of Zendikar because Hornet Queen cheats better. I think Scute Mob is only in there because of the awesome alter, but people seem to like drafting him so he's probably fine.
Emphasis on midrange. Secondary emphasis on midrange, ramp, and good 3-5 drops.
Took some peoples' advice and did not worry about keeping gold balance. I've also avoided any card that requires 3 colors of mana to cast, though this means no Cruel Ultimatum and that makes me a little sad.
I wanted everything in here to be reasonably castable, so no BSC or Eldrazi Titans at the moment. I also think that Chromatic Lantern was a very poorly designed card and will not be including it here. Makes things too easy.
I'm pretty happy with my land selection right now. Broke the WWK cycle of lands with Horizon Canopy because I really don't think Stirring Wildwood holds up to the others and Canopy can really help eith W/x or G/x decks. Mirrodin's Core is there to make splashing for cards more stable without causing any tempo or life loss, and it's been doing its job. For Karakas, I happen to be playing quite a few legends in the cube just on account of how powerful they inherently are. It's proven to be very relevant.
Smallpox is in the standby list (which, it suddenly occurs, should probably be on here somewhere). There is already enough support that it would be worth it. Pox requires too much support to ever be a safe pick though.
Green isn't terribly far behind on creature count (39>32) and it averages more creature per card than white does. There's been enough to go around.
What was the reasoning behind your decision to exclude the signets? They can power up the artifact archetype nicely if you wish to support it, as well as helping to facilitate the midrange and ramp desires of your group. Not to mention that wildfire looks a little on the weak side with so little artifact mana in your list.
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
On the signets, I have a number of (very possibly misguided reasons) for not including them. Most people I cube with being very into EDH, they are almost too comfortable drafting midrange strategies to begin with. At this point, I know midrange will be an archetype that is drafted. However, I do not want the majority of the players at the table defaulting to midrange. Part of this was not having many all-upside accelerants that cost <= 2 outside of green. Also, a cycle like that takes up a lot of space...
There are a few problems with Wildfire right now. One is a matter of redundancy. Without Burning of Xinye it's harder to justify building for Wildfire. Another issue is there just aren't many things in the red section that survive it, partly on account of it having no planeswalkers. Still, there's a couple good artifact creatures for that, along with most of the top-end finishers in other colors being above 4 toughness.
I do want to make Wildfire a good pick. I do plan on ordering a Burning of Xinye sometime this week (replacing Bedlam). Any other suggestions to help it along would be great. I'm currently thinking that should entail some sturdier red threats and Gilded Lotus, but I'm fuzzy on the details.
The Rack is on probation (i.e. shifted to //Standby). Stuffy Doll is out. Nobody wants to draft him, and I really can't fault that.
Priorities to fill these spots are now Sword of War and Peace, Black Vise, and Gilded Lotus. There's probably another cut that should be made so I can include all of them. Also, I have a Scroll Rack incoming, so that should be moving from //Missing to //Standby. Guess I need two more cuts...
Nyxathid is on watch. It may be that he just hasn't been in the pool enough times though. Hazard of doing mostly 6 person drafts.
Wilt-Leaf Liege is on watch. I'm of a similar mind with it as I am Nyxathid though.
Palinchron is on watch, but I really want him to stay in.
Dream Halls is out. I figured the first chance I got I would force Dream Halls to see if it actually worked. Got it in pack 2 this weekend, but I was already in an okay spot for it. Ended up with Windfall, Time Spiral, Upheaval, Regrowth, All Suns' Dawn, Griselbrand, a tutor, and decent ramp/fixing. I did not do very well and not a single one of the games I did win could be attributed to Dream Halls. I'm fairly certain that this will be the case so long as I eschew tri-colored spells (e.g. Cruel Ultimatum). Will probably replace it with Tidings. (Edit: Thinking on it, will actually be testing out Deadeye Navigator here.)
Putrid Leech is on probation. While there is some support of aggressive strategies in G and B, there's more support there for midrange. This leaves Leech in an awkward spot, and means Glissa, the Traitor may be a much more draftable pick. She's also not bad at attacking.
Life's Finale has proven to be a rather crippling play. I am quite happy with the card and would suggest it to anyone looking for a sweeper.
Honor of the Pure will be on probation and replaced by Ajani Goldmane. Goldmane is the more impactful card, but I feel HotP should still have a spot, not least because of how low its cost is. That said, pretty much every W card that's come up so far has been earning its keep and HotP is just less friendly to other colors.
On the signets, I have a number of (very possibly misguided reasons) for not including them. Most people I cube with being very into EDH, they are almost too comfortable drafting midrange strategies to begin with. At this point, I know midrange will be an archetype that is drafted. However, I do not want the majority of the players at the table defaulting to midrange. Part of this was not having many all-upside accelerants that cost <= 2 outside of green. Also, a cycle like that takes up a lot of space...
I think the key here would be to buff the straight control and aggro cards that don't play nice with midrange. For example, the aggressive 1-drops and 2-drops that aggro loves, like jackal pup, gorehouse chainwalker, and carnophage don't fit so well into true midrange.
Similarly, there are control cards that don't slot so well into midrange, moat being a good example of this.
Signets are a controversial topic, I like the full 10 for supporting artifact decks, other people say only run specific colours, and still others feel they are too good altogether and castrate green (I heartily disagree on this last one, but that's a discussion for another time). I recommend running them, and if you take a peek at my list, you'll see that I run a very large amount of signets and similar artifact mana. They power up control, ramp, and artifact decks quite nicely.
There are a few problems with Wildfire right now. One is a matter of redundancy. Without Burning of Xinye it's harder to justify building for Wildfire. Another issue is there just aren't many things in the red section that survive it, partly on account of it having no planeswalkers. Still, there's a couple good artifact creatures for that, along with most of the top-end finishers in other colors being above 4 toughness.
I think a big part of it is also that wildfire decks live and die on artifact mana. It's how they break parity, how they move it in so that it resolves on a reasonable clock. Burning of Xinye will certainly help, but in my experience wildfire is often slotted into decks that fit it without being specifically built for it.
I do want to make Wildfire a good pick. I do plan on ordering a Burning of Xinye sometime this week (replacing Bedlam). Any other suggestions to help it along would be great. I'm currently thinking that should entail some sturdier red threats and Gilded Lotus, but I'm fuzzy on the details.
I absolutely love gilded lotus, but in my experience, it's only been worth it when I've had significant other accelerants in the deck. I think until you add more artifact mana, it may have a hard time making end decks.
The Rack is on probation (i.e. shifted to //Standby).
It wasn't strong enough for us. We cut it.
Stuffy Doll is out. Nobody wants to draft him, and I really can't fault that.
Priorities to fill these spots are now Sword of War and Peace, Black Vise, and Gilded Lotus. There's probably another cut that should be made so I can include all of them. Also, I have a Scroll Rack incoming, so that should be moving from //Missing to //Standby. Guess I need two more cuts...
I think gilded needs more support but would be a fine addition down the line. All the others are fine additions
Nyxathid is on watch. It may be that he just hasn't been in the pool enough times though. Hazard of doing mostly 6 person drafts.
I think you can afford to cut him. Perhaps start to add black 1-drops?
Wilt-Leaf Liege is on watch. I'm of a similar mind with it as I am Nyxathid though.
He's actually not bad, but I think WG has so many just stacked options that you'd be better off cutting him for something else.
Palinchron is on watch, but I really want him to stay in.
I love him as a finisher for control, but you need to think of him as a beater that leaves counter mana open and protects itself, not a combo piece.
Dream Halls is out. I figured the first chance I got I would force Dream Halls to see if it actually worked. Got it in pack 2 this weekend, but I was already in an okay spot for it. Ended up with Windfall, Time Spiral, Upheaval, Regrowth, All Suns' Dawn, Griselbrand, a tutor, and decent ramp/fixing. I did not do very well and not a single one of the games I did win could be attributed to Dream Halls. I'm fairly certain that this will be the case so long as I eschew tri-colored spells (e.g. Cruel Ultimatum). Will probably replace it with Tidings. (Edit: Thinking on it, will actually be testing out Deadeye Navigator here.)
You either need to up your aggro support or cut him.
Putrid Leech is on probation. While there is some support of aggressive strategies in G and B, there's more support there for midrange. This leaves Leech in an awkward spot, and means Glissa, the Traitor may be a much more draftable pick. She's also not bad at attacking.
Leech is another card that needs either increased aggro support or to be cut.
Life's Finale has proven to be a rather crippling play. I am quite happy with the card and would suggest it to anyone looking for a sweeper.
I'll keep it in mind.
Honor of the Pure will be on probation and replaced by Ajani Goldmane. Goldmane is the more impactful card, but I feel HotP should still have a spot, not least because of how low its cost is. That said, pretty much every W card that's come up so far has been earning its keep and HotP is just less friendly to other colors.
Lastly, I think you should look at trimming your curve a bit. You're running as many or more high cost cards as my 750 is, and I consider my cube top-heavy. moving midrange out of the 6cmc slot and into the 3-5cmc bracket while dropping aggro more solidly into the 1-3cmc range would help. This leave control to have just the necessary amount of finishers at 5-7cmc.
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
I think the key here would be to buff the straight control and aggro cards that don't play nice with midrange. For example, the aggressive 1-drops and 2-drops that aggro loves, like jackal pup, gorehouse chainwalker, and carnophage don't fit so well into true midrange.
Similarly, there are control cards that don't slot so well into midrange, moat being a good example of this.
...
Lastly, I think you should look at trimming your curve a bit. You're running as many or more high cost cards as my 750 is, and I consider my cube top-heavy. moving midrange out of the 6cmc slot and into the 3-5cmc bracket while dropping aggro more solidly into the 1-3cmc range would help. This leave control to have just the necessary amount of finishers at 5-7cmc.
This sounds like a good move. Will have to spend a bit of time re-evaluating some card choices so this may play out slowly over the next few weeks. I guess this was a hazard of wanting as much multi-purpose stuff as I could (and some amount of EDH bias).
Signets are a controversial topic, I like the full 10 for supporting artifact decks, other people say only run specific colours, and still others feel they are too good altogether and castrate green (I heartily disagree on this last one, but that's a discussion for another time). I recommend running them, and if you take a peek at my list, you'll see that I run a very large amount of signets and similar artifact mana. They power up control, ramp, and artifact decks quite nicely.
I'll try to adding a few more mana rocks. Just gonna have to find spots for them.
I think a big part of it is also that wildfire decks live and die on artifact mana. It's how they break parity, how they move it in so that it resolves on a reasonable clock. Burning of Xinye will certainly help, but in my experience wildfire is often slotted into decks that fit it without being specifically built for it.
Initially I was thinking of Wildfire as 'untap with a big creature, cast Wildfire and the game is about over' but that first step is already a sign you're likely to win.
Leech is another card that needs either increased aggro support or to be cut.
Now this is something I'm very curious about.
By all accounts I've seen, Sarcomancy aggro does terribly against other aggro decks but does very well against control. Then I read Parnell's article on the matter and figured it would be good to place B as primarily a midrange color. So I designed both G and B as midrange with some support as the secondary color in an aggro deck.
A big problem with this is that good B cards tend to be very color-dense, so it's really awkward as a secondary color for aggro.
Fairly significant changes today, though it still feels like an interim update until I figure what the top end of R should look like and a good way to dissociate midrange from control.
I've never bought into the 100% desupporting of black aggro plan. Black has something like 6 two-power one-drops with very marginal drawbacks, along with decent removal and dark ritual. It's got a lot of stuff going for it. What hurts black is that it loses to other aggro in the whole aggro-midrange-control theory where essentially the deck that's a turn slower will have inevitability by having a slight edge on card quality without a serious tempo disadvantage. Black has the best card quality at the 1-drop slot, but white aggro starts overtaking it at the 2-3 slot. So white aggro ends up with an edge in that matchup, but because black is so much more aggressive, it has an even better match-up against control. Mixing black with other colours, especially splashing red for burn, makes it stronger though. The key for me was making sure as the black aggro player to pick the 1-drops over most anything else and then go for fixing aggressively in order to allow easy splashing. Use the philosophy of suicide black, and you should still have a very viable archetype.
I will add the caveat that I think my views on this are in the minority at this point, but it's still been working fairly well for me.
I'd recommend adding nezumi graverobber back, it's a pretty strong card in midrange and aggro alike. In aggro it can be seen as a leveller who swings for 4 on t3 and in midrange it's an answer to grave decks that also generates obscene advantage once it flips.
At first glance your changes look good on the whole
Just got to say, you've definitely earned distinction as an MTGS hero
Quote from Stardust »
Because he's the hero MTGS deserves, and the one it needs right now. So we'll global him. Because he can take it. Because he's not just our hero. He's a silent guardian, a watchful protector. An expired rascal.
Quote from LuckNorris »
ExpiredRascals you sir are a god-like hero.
Quote from Lanxal »
ER is a masterful god who cannot be beaten in any endeavour.
I wouldn't cut Nezumi Graverobber. He's a good 2-drop for almost any deck, being an early beater, a 'yard hater, or, in many cases, a 4/2 on turn 3. I'd cut No Mercy in stead of Graverobber because that looks like a mostly do-nothing card.
Other changes look good. I'm a huge fan of adding Burning of Xinye.
I'm going to disagree with the folks on here saying that Nezumi Graverobber is still a good card for cube. He's not a good early beater (a 2/1 for 2 is below curve); he's in a color where anti-graveyard shenanigans are least important (arguably meaningless, in fact); he's essentially impossible to flip if you draw him late; and if you somehow end up with a 4/2 on turn 3, congratulations, you've spent your first 3 turns doing nothing to affect the board except have a creature that dies to literally any burn spell or 2-power creature.
I cut him a couple of weeks ago and don't miss him at all. I'm pretty sure you'll feel the same.
I maintain that Ancestral Knowledge is a great card; you aren't going to find a scry 10 for that mana cost anywhere. Still, it's not exactly clean about it and I'm pretty sure its value will drop a bit as people get better at drafting aggro decks. Does make me consider putting Lim-Dûl's Vault on standby...
Tragic Slip is neat, but it's fairly bad at stopping the crazy stuff. On a related note, Deadeye Navigator has been fairly impressive considering how recently it was added.
I did not forget about this thread! Big update to reflect a number of changes that have happened over the past couple months. With Gatecrash here, I'm overdue to post the updates.
-Oona, Queen of the Fae (Don't know how I passed over this with my 'no mill' stance, but it wasn't impressive anyway.)
-Juniper Order Ranger (It's a poor thing to curve into and its combo applications are awkward.)
-Dreg Mangler (I don't have G/B as an aggro color so DRS is just better.)
-Snakeform (I think this is a great card. Nobody played it. Outside of exactly U/G you have access to 'real' removal and in exactly U/G SimiC Charm is a much less conditional trick.)
-Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind (In a vacuum, objectively worse than Dracogenius. Outside of a vacuum, doesn't survive Wildfire.)
-Soltari Guerillas (Good card. Slower than Boros Reckoner.)
-Gilded Lotus (Too slow.)
-Mishra's Helix (Too slow. Definitively win-more and not even great for that.)
-Bottle Cloister (Not amazing in the decks it fit, terrible in the decks it doesn't.)
-Spawning Pit (Only once was this ever picked up by a deck that wanted it and used to any significant effect.)
-Basilisk Collar (Boring. Not enough direct damage creatures.)
-Gaea's Cradle (Awkward land. Though powerful, couldn't be safely counted as a land slot.)
-Mirrodin's Core (Awkward land. Still don't like Gemstone Mine so instead of aggressive color I figured I'd try aggressive colorless.)
-Thirst for Knowledge (Draw 3>discard 2 isn't great and that's often what it has been. It's certainly not Deep Analysis. That was an oversight.)
-Withdraw (Aether Adept is easier to maindeck.)
-Talrand, Sky Summoner (Awesome. Super super fragile for his cost.)
-Deathcloud (Love the card and it's going on the standby list. It's a black Wildfire++ but I'm not sure I need that right now.)
-Betrayal of Flesh (Fun card. Legitimately costed but it's still pretty high on the curve. Swapped it for Massacre Wurm.)
-Dimir House Guard (Efficient, but very dependant on other things. Disciple of Bolas seems much cleaner and has been good so far.)
-Nyxathid (I am apparently the only one who likes this card. Fleshbag Marauder it is.)
-Guul Draz Assassin (Too slow to be good against aggro. Too small an effect for midrange/control.)
-Krosan Grip (Split second just doesn't matter enough to play it over a creature.)
-Loaming Shaman (Nobody ever wanted this card. Too slow and too low impact.)
Have a couple additional stand-ins being tried out while some cards are getting altered. Also probably need to go through and recount mana and creature balance.
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Clan RepresentativeAt this point, I'm quite new to this thing. I'd cubed maybe three times ever before I started assembling a cube of my own ~2 months ago. Read some stuff (wtwlf123's guide was very helpful), talked to some people, ordered an Upheaval, and started sleeving.
Among the regulars at my shop, I am the only legacy player. EDH is a big deal but that's the only exposure most of them have to older cards. With how often we play EDH, people are more comfortable drafting midrange strategies than anything else. I still want all the other archetypes to work though.
Cube Size: 480
Breakdown: 60 Mono, 60 Multi, 60 Colorless, 60 Land
Standard or Theme: Standard
Snow Lands: No
Average Number of Players: 6, though I've been trying to get more
How Often Drafted: Weekly
//Card Selection
Proxies: Yes (10 duals)
Powered: No
Portal: Yes
"Un" Cards: No
Banned Cards for Power-Level: Yes
Banned Cards for Time Constraints: No
Banned Cards for "fun" factor: I'll call it disagreements on design
//Banned list:
Power 8 (Timetwister is fine)
Pseudo-power (Sol Ring, Mana Vault, Mana Crypt, Mindtwist, Library of Alexandria)
Any creature with built-in protection from red
Any creature that attacks each turn if able
Any card that mills your opponent (Extract effects are fine.)
Sundering Titan (Destroying lands is fine. Its removal destroying more lands is not.)
Undecided on Channel and Yawgmoth's Bargain
//Cube Design
Standard or Multiplayer: Standard
Sideboards?: Yes
Color Balance: Yes
Gold Balance: No
Hybrid/Split/Kicker as Gold: Yes
Color Triggers as Gold: Yes
Perfectly Balanced CMC: No
Emphasis on aggro. Secondary emphasis on control. More creatures than any other portion of the cube.
1 Mikaeus, the Lunarch
1 Isamaru, Hound of Konda
1 Savannah Lions
1 Elite Vanguard
1 Steppe Lynx
1 Student of Warfare
1 Gideon's Lawkeeper
1 Weathered Wayfarer
1 Mother of Runes
1 Accorder Paladin
1 Kor Aeronaut
1 Fencing Ace
1 Precinct Captain
1 Sigiled Paladin
1 Knight of the White Orchid
1 Thalia, Guardian of Thraben
1 Stoneforge Mystic
1 Wall of Omens
1 Blade Splicer
1 Mirran Crusader
1 Silverblade Paladin
1 Stonecloaker
1 Kor Sanctifiers
1 Mangara of Corondor
1 Mentor of the Meek
1 Soltari Champion
1 Mirror Entity
1 Ranger of Eos
1 Hero of Bladehold
1 Sublime Archangel
1 Restoration Angel
1 Karmic Guide
1 Reveillark
1 Exalted Angel
1 Sun Titan
1 Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite
1 Angel of Serenity
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Path to Exile
1 Swords to Plowshares
1 Miraculous Recovery
//Sorceries (6)
1 Balance
1 Spectral Procession
1 Entreat the Angels
1 Armageddon
1 Wrath of God
1 Terminus
1 Temporal Isolation
1 Prison Term
1 Oblivion Ring
1 Aura of Silence
1 Glorious Anthem
1 Angelic Destiny
//Other (5)
1 Shrine of Loyal Legions
1 Ajani, Caller of the Pride
1 Ajani Goldmane
1 Elspeth, Knight-Errant
1 Gideon Jura
Emphasis on tempo and control. Has about half the instants in the cube.
1 Delver of Secrets
1 Enclave Cryptologist
1 Void Stalker
1 Snapcaster Mage
1 Phantasmal Image
1 Looter il-Kor
1 Trinket Mage
1 Man-o'-War
1 Vendilion Clique
1 Wake Thrasher
1 Venser, Shaper Savant
1 Phyrexian Metamorph
1 Talrand, Sky Summoner
1 Body Double
1 Meloku the Clouded Mirror
1 Mulldrifter
1 Consecrated Sphinx
1 Deadeye Navigator
1 Palinchron
1 Daze
1 Mana Leak
1 Miscalculation
1 Remand
1 Arcane Denial
1 Counterspell
1 Mana Drain
1 Exclude
1 Forbid
1 Cryptic Command
1 Force of Will
1 Desertion
1 Into the Roil
1 Withdraw
1 Cyclonic Rift
1 Capsize
1 Evacuation
1 Psionic Blast
1 Ray of Command
1 Brainstorm
1 Flash
1 Frantic Search
1 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Intuition
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Fact or Fiction
//Sorceries (6)
1 Ancestral Vision
1 Ponder
1 Preordain
1 Time Spiral
1 Bribery
1 Upheaval
1 Standstill
1 Treachery
//Other (4)
1 Vedalken Shackles
1 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
1 Jace, Architect of Thought
1 Tamiyo, the Moon Sage
Emphasis on midrange/control.
1 Guul Draz Assassin
1 Carrion Feeder
1 Pack Rat
1 Bloodghast
1 Nether Traitor
1 Vampire Hexmage
1 Oona's Prowler
1 Blood Artist
1 Dark Confidant
1 Nyxathid
1 Hypnotic Specter
1 Faerie Macabre
1 Big Game Hunter
1 Bone Shredder
1 Abyssal Persecutor
1 Bloodline Keeper
1 Dimir House Guard
1 Braids, Cabal Minion
1 Ob Nixilis, the Fallen
1 Grave Titan
1 Kokusho, the Evening Star
1 Sheoldred, Whispering One
1 Griselbrand
1 Go for the Throat
1 Ultimate Price
1 Dismember
1 Betrayal of Flesh
1 Dark Ritual
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Shred Memory
1 Hatred
//Sorceries (17)
1 Chainer's Edict
1 Consuming Vapors
1 Profane Command
1 Damnation
1 Life's Finale
1 Living Death
1 Black Sun's Zenith
1 Sinkhole
1 Thoughtseize
1 Inquisition of Kozilek
1 Despise
1 Hymn to Tourach
1 Smallpox
1 Deathcloud
1 Reanimate
1 Buried Alive
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Necropotence
1 Phyrexian Arena
1 Underworld Connections
1 Bitterblossom
1 Necromancy
1 Recurring Nightmare
1 Animate Dead
1 The Abyss
1 Nether Void
//Other (1)
1 Liliana of the Veil
Emphasis on aggro. Secondary emphasis on control.
1 Mogg Fanatic
1 Spikeshot Elder
1 Grim Lavamancer
1 Reckless Waif
1 Jackal Pup
1 Goblin Guide
1 Goblin Welder
1 Ash Zealot
1 Stormblood Berserker
1 Kiln Fiend
1 Plated Geopede
1 Lightning Mauler
1 Kargan Dragonlord
1 Hellspark Elemental
1 Manic Vandal
1 Viashino Heretic
1 Goblin Sharpshooter
1 Jaya Ballard, Task Mage
1 Squee, Goblin Nabob
1 Chandra's Phoenix
1 Oxidda Scrapmelter
1 Flametongue Kavu
1 Hellrider
1 Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker
1 Siege-Gang Commander
1 Thundermaw Hellkite
1 Inferno Titan
1 Akroma, Angel of Fury
1 Greater Gargadon
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Incinerate
1 Searing Blaze
1 Staggershock
1 Brimstone Volley
1 Char
1 Fireblast
1 Smash to Smithereens
1 Act of Aggression
1 Bonfire of the Damned
1 Demonfire
1 Red Sun's Zenith
1 Devil's Play
1 Chain Lightning
1 Firebolt
1 Flame Slash
1 Mizzium Mortars
1 Slagstorm
1 Pillage
1 Wildfire
1 Burning of Xinye
1 Reckless Charge
1 Faithless Looting
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Reforge the Soul
1 Sulfuric Vortex
1 Manabarbs
1 Sneak Attack
//Other (1)
1 Shrine of Burning Rage
Emphasis on midrange. Secondary emphasis on midrange, ramp, and good 3-5 drops.
1 Birds of Paradise
1 Noble Hierarch
1 Joraga Treespeaker
1 Scute Mob
1 Ulvenwald Tracker
1 Primordial Hydra
1 Skinshifter
1 Tarmogoyf
1 Strangleroot Geist
1 Wall of Roots
1 Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary
1 Sakura-Tribe Elder
1 Lotus Cobra
1 Fauna Shaman
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Imperious Perfect
1 Loaming Shaman
1 Eternal Witness
1 Viridian Shaman
1 Vengevine
1 Master of the Wild Hunt
1 Thrun, the Last Troll
1 Thragtusk
1 Wolfir Silverheart
1 Deranged Hermit
1 Acidic Slime
1 Protean Hulk
1 Hornet Queen
1 Pelakka Wurm
1 Woodfall Primus
1 Noxious Revival
1 Berserk
1 Squall Line
1 Crushing Vines
1 Krosan Grip
1 Beast Within
//Sorceries (16)
1 Edge of Autumn
1 Farseek
1 Cultivate
1 Green Sun's Zenith
1 Natural Order
1 Harmonize
1 Overwhelming Stampede
1 Rude Awakening
1 Tooth and Nail
1 Regrowth
1 All Suns' Dawn
1 Life from the Loam
1 Primal Command
1 Bramblecrush
1 Plow Under
1 Stunted Growth
1 Rancor
1 Sylvan Library
1 Survival of the Fittest
//Other (3)
1 Birthing Pod
1 Garruk Wildspeaker
1 Garruk, Primal Hunter
Emphasis on filling holes and being awesome.
1 Slave of Bolas
1 Crime // Punishment
//Azorius (5)
1 Dismantling Blow
1 Mirrorweave
1 Wall of Denial
1 Geist of Saint Traft
1 Venser, the Sojourner
//Dimir (5)
1 Oona, Queen of the Fae
1 Agony Warp
1 Baleful Strix
1 Psychatog
1 Shadowmage Infiltrator
//Rakdos (8)
1 Rakdos Cackler
1 Fulminator Mage
1 Murderous Redcap
1 Dreadbore
1 Terminate
1 Fire Covenant
1 Blightning
1 Falkenrath Aristocrat
1 Ancient Grudge
1 Boggart Ram-Gang
1 Hull Breach
1 Huntmaster of the Fells
1 Bloodbraid Elf
//Selesnya (8)
1 Dryad Militant
1 Kitchen Finks
1 Wilt-Leaf Liege
1 Selesnya Charm
1 Qasali Pridemage
1 Knight of the Reliquary
1 Juniper Order Ranger
1 Armada Wurm
//Orzhov (6)
1 Lingering Souls
1 Unburial Rites
1 Stillmoon Cavalier
1 Vindicate
1 Sorin, Lord of Innistrad
1 Angel of Despair
//Golgari (7)
1 Lotleth Troll
1 Glissa, the Traitor
1 Dreg Mangler
1 Putrefy
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Spiritmonger
1 Snakeform
1 Voidslime
1 Trygon Predator
1 Edric, Spymaster of Trest
1 Mystic Snake
//Izzet (4)
1 Jilt
1 Izzet Charm
1 Suffocating Blast
1 Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind
//Boros (5)
1 Orim's Thunder
1 Figure of Destiny
1 Duergar Hedge-Mage
1 Soltari Guerrillas
1 Ajani Vengeant
Emphasis on filling holes and being awesome.
1 Phyrexian Revoker
1 Palladium Myr
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Precursor Golem
1 Razormane Masticore
1 Thopter Assembly
1 Steel Hellkite
1 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Myr Battlesphere
//Equipment (12)
1 Bonesplitter
1 Skullclamp
1 Basilisk Collar
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Lightning Greaves
1 Loxodon Warhammer
1 Grafted Wargear
1 Sword of Fire and Ice
1 Sword of Light and Shadow
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
1 Sword of War and Peace
1 Batterskull
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Aether Vial
1 Spawning Pit
1 Scroll Rack
1 Isochron Scepter
1 Mimic Vat
1 Staff of Domination
1 Forcefield
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Trading Post
1 Bottled Cloister
1 Erratic Portal
1 Memory Jar
//Disruption (14)
1 Cursed Scroll
1 Black Vice
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Ratchet Bomb
1 Winter Orb
1 Ankh of Mishra
1 Oblivion Stone
1 Nevinyrral's Disk
1 Tangle Wire
1 Smokestack
1 Icy Manipulator
1 Mishra's Helix
1 Karn Liberated
1 Mox Diamond
1 Chrome Mox
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Coldsteel Heart
1 Mind Stone
1 Guardian Idol
1 Grim Monolith
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Worn Powerstone
1 Coalition Relic
1 Thran Dynamo
1 Gilded Lotus
Emphasis on helping you cast spells.
1 Mishra's Factory
1 Maze of Ith
1 Rishadan Port
1 Tectonic Edge
1 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
//Colorfixing Utility (5)
1 Celestial Colonnade
1 Creeping Tar Pit
1 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Raging Ravine
1 Horizon Canopy
//Other Utility (8)
1 Kessig Wolf Run
1 Karakas
1 Academy Ruins
1 Volrath's Stronghold
1 Yavimaya Hollow
1 Treetop Village
1 Gaea's Cradle
1 Shelldock Isle
//Poly Lands (4)
1 City of Brass
1 Grand Coliseum
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Mirrodin's Core
1 Fetid Heath
1 Twilight Mire
1 Flooded Grove
1 Cascade Bluffs
1 Rugged Prairie
//Fetches (12)
1 Evolving Wilds
1 Krosan Verge
1 Flooded Strand
1 Polluted Delta
1 Bloodstained Mire
1 Wooded Foothills
1 Windswept Heath
1 Marsh Flats
1 Verdant Catacombs
1 Misty Rainforest
1 Scalding Tarn
1 Arid Mesa
//Duals (20)
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
1 Stomping Ground
1 Temple Garden
1 Godless Shrine
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Breeding Pool
1 Steam Vents
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Tundra
1 Underground Sea
1 Badlands
1 Taiga
1 Savannah
1 Scrubland
1 Bayou
1 Tropical Island
1 Volcanic Island
1 Plateau
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Clan Representative- Serra Avenger
- Catastrophe
//Blue//Black
//Red
//Green
//Multi
Desolation Angel
//Colorless
//Land
Kor Haven
Swords to Plowshares//Blue
- Bribery
- Standstill
//Black- Demonic Tutor
- Buried Alive
//Red- Grim Lavamancer
- Squee, Goblin Nabob
//Green- Tarmogoyf
- Rofellos, Llanowar Emissary
- Sakura-Tribe Elder
- Tooth and Nail
//MultiTrygon Predator//Colorless
- Forcefield
- Tangle Wire
- Grim Monolith
//Land+Ajani Goldmane
-Windfall
-Dream Halls
+Exclude
+Deadeye Navigator
-Augur of Skulls
-Undead Gladiator
-Grave Pact
-Nezumi Graverobber
-Scion of Darkness
+Carrion Feeder
+Smallpox
+Death Cloud
+Buried Alive
+Animate Dead
-Rakka Mar
-Bedlam
+Incinerate
+Burning of Xinye
-Rakdos's Return
-Inkfathom Infiltrator
-Putrid Leech
+Murderous Redcap
+Glissa, the Trator
+Selesnya Charm
-Jester's Cap
-Hex Parasite
-Stuffy Doll
-Phyrexian Processor
-The Rack
+Scroll Rack
+Sword of War and Peace
+Gilded Lotus
+Guardian Idol
+Black Vise
+Mana Drain
-No Mercy
-Night's Whisper
-Tragic Slip
+The Abyss
+Nether Void
+Ultimate Price
Also find it funny that white has more creatures than green. How has that been working for you?
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Clan RepresentativeGreen isn't terribly far behind on creature count (39>32) and it averages more creature per card than white does. There's been enough to go around.
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Clan RepresentativeThere are a few problems with Wildfire right now. One is a matter of redundancy. Without Burning of Xinye it's harder to justify building for Wildfire. Another issue is there just aren't many things in the red section that survive it, partly on account of it having no planeswalkers. Still, there's a couple good artifact creatures for that, along with most of the top-end finishers in other colors being above 4 toughness.
I do want to make Wildfire a good pick. I do plan on ordering a Burning of Xinye sometime this week (replacing Bedlam). Any other suggestions to help it along would be great. I'm currently thinking that should entail some sturdier red threats and Gilded Lotus, but I'm fuzzy on the details.
The Rack is on probation (i.e. shifted to //Standby).
Stuffy Doll is out. Nobody wants to draft him, and I really can't fault that.
Priorities to fill these spots are now Sword of War and Peace, Black Vise, and Gilded Lotus. There's probably another cut that should be made so I can include all of them. Also, I have a Scroll Rack incoming, so that should be moving from //Missing to //Standby. Guess I need two more cuts...
Nyxathid is on watch. It may be that he just hasn't been in the pool enough times though. Hazard of doing mostly 6 person drafts.
Wilt-Leaf Liege is on watch. I'm of a similar mind with it as I am Nyxathid though.
Palinchron is on watch, but I really want him to stay in.
Dream Halls is out. I figured the first chance I got I would force Dream Halls to see if it actually worked. Got it in pack 2 this weekend, but I was already in an okay spot for it. Ended up with Windfall, Time Spiral, Upheaval, Regrowth, All Suns' Dawn, Griselbrand, a tutor, and decent ramp/fixing. I did not do very well and not a single one of the games I did win could be attributed to Dream Halls. I'm fairly certain that this will be the case so long as I eschew tri-colored spells (e.g. Cruel Ultimatum). Will probably replace it with Tidings. (Edit: Thinking on it, will actually be testing out Deadeye Navigator here.)
With Dream Halls leaving, Windfall is on watch.
Inkfathom Infiltrator is on watch.
Putrid Leech is on probation. While there is some support of aggressive strategies in G and B, there's more support there for midrange. This leaves Leech in an awkward spot, and means Glissa, the Traitor may be a much more draftable pick. She's also not bad at attacking.
Life's Finale has proven to be a rather crippling play. I am quite happy with the card and would suggest it to anyone looking for a sweeper.
Honor of the Pure will be on probation and replaced by Ajani Goldmane. Goldmane is the more impactful card, but I feel HotP should still have a spot, not least because of how low its cost is. That said, pretty much every W card that's come up so far has been earning its keep and HotP is just less friendly to other colors.
I think the key here would be to buff the straight control and aggro cards that don't play nice with midrange. For example, the aggressive 1-drops and 2-drops that aggro loves, like jackal pup, gorehouse chainwalker, and carnophage don't fit so well into true midrange.
Similarly, there are control cards that don't slot so well into midrange, moat being a good example of this.
Signets are a controversial topic, I like the full 10 for supporting artifact decks, other people say only run specific colours, and still others feel they are too good altogether and castrate green (I heartily disagree on this last one, but that's a discussion for another time). I recommend running them, and if you take a peek at my list, you'll see that I run a very large amount of signets and similar artifact mana. They power up control, ramp, and artifact decks quite nicely.
I think a big part of it is also that wildfire decks live and die on artifact mana. It's how they break parity, how they move it in so that it resolves on a reasonable clock. Burning of Xinye will certainly help, but in my experience wildfire is often slotted into decks that fit it without being specifically built for it.
I absolutely love gilded lotus, but in my experience, it's only been worth it when I've had significant other accelerants in the deck. I think until you add more artifact mana, it may have a hard time making end decks.
It wasn't strong enough for us. We cut it.
I think gilded needs more support but would be a fine addition down the line. All the others are fine additions
I think you can afford to cut him. Perhaps start to add black 1-drops?
He's actually not bad, but I think WG has so many just stacked options that you'd be better off cutting him for something else.
I love him as a finisher for control, but you need to think of him as a beater that leaves counter mana open and protects itself, not a combo piece.
I like cutting both dream halls and windfall. I think Opportunity is a bit stronger than tidings though.
For windfall's replacement, perhaps exclude?
You either need to up your aggro support or cut him.
Leech is another card that needs either increased aggro support or to be cut.
I'll keep it in mind.
Ajani Goldmane or Pianna, Nomad Captain would both be fine replacements.
Lastly, I think you should look at trimming your curve a bit. You're running as many or more high cost cards as my 750 is, and I consider my cube top-heavy. moving midrange out of the 6cmc slot and into the 3-5cmc bracket while dropping aggro more solidly into the 1-3cmc range would help. This leave control to have just the necessary amount of finishers at 5-7cmc.
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Clan RepresentativeThis sounds like a good move. Will have to spend a bit of time re-evaluating some card choices so this may play out slowly over the next few weeks. I guess this was a hazard of wanting as much multi-purpose stuff as I could (and some amount of EDH bias).
I'll try to adding a few more mana rocks. Just gonna have to find spots for them.
Initially I was thinking of Wildfire as 'untap with a big creature, cast Wildfire and the game is about over' but that first step is already a sign you're likely to win.
I do like Exclude. That sounds like a good swap.
Now this is something I'm very curious about.
By all accounts I've seen, Sarcomancy aggro does terribly against other aggro decks but does very well against control. Then I read Parnell's article on the matter and figured it would be good to place B as primarily a midrange color. So I designed both G and B as midrange with some support as the secondary color in an aggro deck.
A big problem with this is that good B cards tend to be very color-dense, so it's really awkward as a secondary color for aggro.
Also, Nezumi Graverobber is probably getting swapped for Smallpox.
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Clan Representative-Honor of the Pure
+Ajani Goldmane (Effectively a straight upgrade)
-Windfall
-Dream Halls (Doesn't work without tri-colored cards)
+Exclude
+Deadeye Navigator (Tried him out today and he was a scary finisher)
-Augur of Skulls
-Undead Gladiator (Really just a durdly version of Buried Alive)
-Grave Pact (Requires too many things to be going right already)
-Nezumi Graverobber (Nighteyes is an amazing thing to have, but a terrible thing to get to)
-Scion of Darkness
+Carrion Feeder (Gonna be watching this guy to see if his role is necessary)
+Smallpox
+Death Cloud
+Buried Alive
+Animate Dead
-Rakka Mar
-Bedlam
+Incinerate
+Burning of Xinye
-Rakdos's Return
-Inkfathom Infiltrator
-Putrid Leech
+Murderous Redcap
+Glissa, the Trator
+Selesnya Charm
-Jester's Cap (Too much mana to be worth caring about)
-Hex Parasite (Consistently the worst available answer to a problem)
-Stuffy Doll
-Phyrexian Processor (Too much mana to also require Axing yourself to be relevant)
-The Rack
+Scroll Rack
+Sword of War and Peace
+Gilded Lotus
+Guardian Idol
+Black Vise
I've never bought into the 100% desupporting of black aggro plan. Black has something like 6 two-power one-drops with very marginal drawbacks, along with decent removal and dark ritual. It's got a lot of stuff going for it. What hurts black is that it loses to other aggro in the whole aggro-midrange-control theory where essentially the deck that's a turn slower will have inevitability by having a slight edge on card quality without a serious tempo disadvantage. Black has the best card quality at the 1-drop slot, but white aggro starts overtaking it at the 2-3 slot. So white aggro ends up with an edge in that matchup, but because black is so much more aggressive, it has an even better match-up against control. Mixing black with other colours, especially splashing red for burn, makes it stronger though. The key for me was making sure as the black aggro player to pick the 1-drops over most anything else and then go for fixing aggressively in order to allow easy splashing. Use the philosophy of suicide black, and you should still have a very viable archetype.
I will add the caveat that I think my views on this are in the minority at this point, but it's still been working fairly well for me.
I'd recommend adding nezumi graverobber back, it's a pretty strong card in midrange and aggro alike. In aggro it can be seen as a leveller who swings for 4 on t3 and in midrange it's an answer to grave decks that also generates obscene advantage once it flips.
At first glance your changes look good on the whole
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Other changes look good. I'm a huge fan of adding Burning of Xinye.
Cheers,
rant
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CubeCobra: https://cubecobra.com/cube/overview/5f5d0310ed602310515d4c32
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I cut him a couple of weeks ago and don't miss him at all. I'm pretty sure you'll feel the same.
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Clan RepresentativeAncestral Knowledge > Mana Drain
I maintain that Ancestral Knowledge is a great card; you aren't going to find a scry 10 for that mana cost anywhere. Still, it's not exactly clean about it and I'm pretty sure its value will drop a bit as people get better at drafting aggro decks. Does make me consider putting Lim-Dûl's Vault on standby...
No Mercy > The Abyss
Just an upgrade.
Night's Whisper > Nether Void
I like Night's Whisper, but I'm not sure how needed it is. It'll be on standby for now as I figure out how some of the other B cards work out.
Tragic Slip > Ultimate Price
Tragic Slip is neat, but it's fairly bad at stopping the crazy stuff. On a related note, Deadeye Navigator has been fairly impressive considering how recently it was added.
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Clan RepresentativeI don't think Ancestral Knowledge is needed.
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Clan Representative-Oona, Queen of the Fae (Don't know how I passed over this with my 'no mill' stance, but it wasn't impressive anyway.)
-Juniper Order Ranger (It's a poor thing to curve into and its combo applications are awkward.)
-Dreg Mangler (I don't have G/B as an aggro color so DRS is just better.)
-Snakeform (I think this is a great card. Nobody played it. Outside of exactly U/G you have access to 'real' removal and in exactly U/G SimiC Charm is a much less conditional trick.)
-Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind (In a vacuum, objectively worse than Dracogenius. Outside of a vacuum, doesn't survive Wildfire.)
-Soltari Guerillas (Good card. Slower than Boros Reckoner.)
+Deathrite Shaman (Maindeckable graveyard hate!)
+Simic Charm
+Niv-Mizzet, Dracogenius
+Electrolyze (Couldn't find a Fire//Ice, but this should be fine.)
+Boros Charm
+Boros Reckoner
-Gilded Lotus (Too slow.)
-Mishra's Helix (Too slow. Definitively win-more and not even great for that.)
-Bottle Cloister (Not amazing in the decks it fit, terrible in the decks it doesn't.)
-Spawning Pit (Only once was this ever picked up by a deck that wanted it and used to any significant effect.)
-Basilisk Collar (Boring. Not enough direct damage creatures.)
+Ring of Gix
+Zuran Orb
+Mortarpod (Not 100% on this card, but it hasn't come up in a draft yet.)
+Masticore
+Molten-Tail Masticore
-Gaea's Cradle (Awkward land. Though powerful, couldn't be safely counted as a land slot.)
-Mirrodin's Core (Awkward land. Still don't like Gemstone Mine so instead of aggressive color I figured I'd try aggressive colorless.)
+Slayers' Stronghold
+Ancient Tomb
-Aura of Silence
-Ranger of Eos (Couldn't be safely drafted early. A lot of the one drops aren't what you want to spend time finding later.)
-Knight of the White Orchid (Boring. Unnecessary.)
+Ravages of War
+Cloudgoat Ranger
+Kor Skyfisher
-Thirst for Knowledge (Draw 3>discard 2 isn't great and that's often what it has been. It's certainly not Deep Analysis. That was an oversight.)
-Withdraw (Aether Adept is easier to maindeck.)
-Talrand, Sky Summoner (Awesome. Super super fragile for his cost.)
+Deep Analysis
+Memory Lapse
+Aether Adept
-Deathcloud (Love the card and it's going on the standby list. It's a black Wildfire++ but I'm not sure I need that right now.)
-Betrayal of Flesh (Fun card. Legitimately costed but it's still pretty high on the curve. Swapped it for Massacre Wurm.)
-Dimir House Guard (Efficient, but very dependant on other things. Disciple of Bolas seems much cleaner and has been good so far.)
-Nyxathid (I am apparently the only one who likes this card.
-Guul Draz Assassin (Too slow to be good against aggro. Too small an effect for midrange/control.)
+Entomb
+Massacre Wurm
+Disciple of Bolas
+Fleshbag Marauder
+Reassembling Skeleton
-Manabarbs (There was never a good time to cast this card. It is often a good time to cast Koth.)
-Reforge the Soul (Too expensive.)
-Viashino Heretic (Too slow.)
+Koth of the Hammer
+Flames of the Firebrand
+Torch Fiend
-Krosan Grip (Split second just doesn't matter enough to play it over a creature.)
-Loaming Shaman (Nobody ever wanted this card. Too slow and too low impact.)
+Wickerbough Elder
+Riding the Dilu Horse (Trying this out.)
Have a couple additional stand-ins being tried out while some cards are getting altered. Also probably need to go through and recount mana and creature balance.