Brentane's thread just below, on learning and casting spells, has made me wonder a little bit. If we must channel energy (mana) to a distinct point in order to manifest it into a desired (or even undesired) effect, (in the context of the game) it comes into being unless a force is strong enough to counteract it (like with a counterspell).
The Secret, which is a book about positive thinking and how if someone wants something, all the have to do is basically wish for it and make it happen, seems right up alongside this line of thinking, in a way. Some examples:
This morning, I was craving a bowl of a certain kind of cereal. Like, I wanted it so badly that there was no way that I could have not gotten it, the craving was so fierce. Anyway, since my home usually doesn't have that kind of thing, I went to the store and lo, it was being sold 2-for-1. So, I bought two, and now, I have my cereal! I did not know of this deal offhand, mind you.
My aunt was in Puerto Rico a few years ago, and, being a proponent herself of "The Secret", she decided to test fate by imagining a bird which was not native to that part of the island. About a half hour later, a bird appeared to her which was the exact colors and patterning of that bird from her imagination.
Another one about me: I'd been wanting a relationship for the past goodness-knows-how long, from roughly a year ago onward. I have since been able to attract a whole bevy of ladies who are suddenly interested in me. So, I just decided one day that I would look at myself as a better person than I used to think I was. I have had no such luck in the past, and I don't think I have changed anything about me except my way of thinking, but be that as it might have been, I feel like I am much more sociable and attractive than I was back then.
Anyway, my point here is this: when summoning a creature by ripping them out of an alternate, identical timeline (which then diverts due to the creature not existing in it), is it possible that this is a means for wizards to be doing it? I mean, "The Secret" has a degree of channeling of energies through desire, to make manifest a result, right? So, does this make sense in Magic canon as a means to cast and summon?
Anyway, my point here is this: when summoning a creature by ripping them out of an alternate, identical timeline (which then diverts due to the creature not existing in it), is it possible that this is a means for wizards to be doing it?
The problem is that you're assuming this is the process which happens. In no explanation except that dreadful book "Test of Metal" is this viable.
There are several different possibilities that have been put forth, but none of them involve alternate timelines.
Well, with (mostly) no canon explanations, wouldn't this be more viable than other non-canon explanations (especially given Test of Metal, as bad as it was)? *Are* there other, better reasonings for how a mage summons creatures? The Time Spiral arc (excuse me for bringing up more loathed material) proves that there are alternate presents, and magic is proven to shape/warp reality (which is the truth in most explanations of magic in literature, right?), so ripping a random goblin, or even a friend of yours, from another timeline would make sense. In fact, it would kind of explain the legends who bypass the "legend rule".
I surmise that this is probably the best possible explanation for the summoning of creatures in this canon.
I surmise that this is probably the best possible explanation for the summoning of creatures in this canon.
~Lil Kalki
There are multiple other explanations that have been forwarded, most notably and prolifically the "aether copy" theory which states that you use your memories to construct an individual made of mana who exemplifies the qualities you are looking for. The fact that your memory is by nature flawed means that it will show up with only what you need and nothing more, often times in an idealized fashion.
This was originally posed in Eternal Ice and has been used multiple times since.
The other theory is that the people you are pulling across the distance are beings you have made a deal with to act in such a capacity. This has been used a lot less than the other because of the nasty moral implications you are confronted with, however, these individuals are always from the same multiverse you exist in.
NOWHERE has this "alternate timeline" theory even been suggested. You should also take into consideration that the only way the alternate timelines were available was because the very fabric of the multiverse itself was damaged. Implying that you could pull individuals from alternate multiverses is therefore... not a viable option.
And Test of Metal was absolute garbage so NOTHING should be taken away from it.
In fact, it would kind of explain the legends who bypass the "legend rule".
What do you mean by this?
I also don't understand why we have to go from "channeled energy" to ripping people from timelines. What's wrong with just shaping energy based on your memories, like we've tended to believe in the past?
There are multiple other explanations that have been forwarded, most notably and prolifically the "aether copy" theory which states that you use your memories to construct an individual made of mana who exemplifies the qualities you are looking for.
The other theory is that the people you are pulling across the distance are beings you have made a deal with to act in such a capacity.
I have always thought of it as both of these, in my head-canon. I don't think these two concepts are mutually exclusive. I would imagine the former is more prevalent, but that the latter happens as well.
Leaving my opinions on "The Secret" in the real world out of it, I think it is reasonable to roll that idea into the two theories mentioned above, if you so choose. I don't support the "alternate timelines" part, for the reason stated above about, ya know, the fabric of reality and what-not. However, "The Secret" is a good way of looking at channeling magic, both for creatures and spells. I imagine that is how spellshapers do it, as well as many red and/or green mages of various class-descriptors. Willing their desires into reality, with the aid of their homelands. Whereas wizards I imagine are more like D&D wizards, all book-learnin' and what-have-you. Then shaman are probably part-"secret", part-ritual. That is my take, anyway. You can also count this as my response to the other thread, about how spells are cast, I guess.
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The Secret, which is a book about positive thinking and how if someone wants something, all the have to do is basically wish for it and make it happen, seems right up alongside this line of thinking, in a way. Some examples:
Anyway, my point here is this: when summoning a creature by ripping them out of an alternate, identical timeline (which then diverts due to the creature not existing in it), is it possible that this is a means for wizards to be doing it? I mean, "The Secret" has a degree of channeling of energies through desire, to make manifest a result, right? So, does this make sense in Magic canon as a means to cast and summon?
~Lil Kalki
Proud Disciple of the Church of the Wary
The problem is that you're assuming this is the process which happens. In no explanation except that dreadful book "Test of Metal" is this viable.
There are several different possibilities that have been put forth, but none of them involve alternate timelines.
I surmise that this is probably the best possible explanation for the summoning of creatures in this canon.
~Lil Kalki
Proud Disciple of the Church of the Wary
There are multiple other explanations that have been forwarded, most notably and prolifically the "aether copy" theory which states that you use your memories to construct an individual made of mana who exemplifies the qualities you are looking for. The fact that your memory is by nature flawed means that it will show up with only what you need and nothing more, often times in an idealized fashion.
This was originally posed in Eternal Ice and has been used multiple times since.
The other theory is that the people you are pulling across the distance are beings you have made a deal with to act in such a capacity. This has been used a lot less than the other because of the nasty moral implications you are confronted with, however, these individuals are always from the same multiverse you exist in.
NOWHERE has this "alternate timeline" theory even been suggested. You should also take into consideration that the only way the alternate timelines were available was because the very fabric of the multiverse itself was damaged. Implying that you could pull individuals from alternate multiverses is therefore... not a viable option.
And Test of Metal was absolute garbage so NOTHING should be taken away from it.
What do you mean by this?
I also don't understand why we have to go from "channeled energy" to ripping people from timelines. What's wrong with just shaping energy based on your memories, like we've tended to believe in the past?
I have always thought of it as both of these, in my head-canon. I don't think these two concepts are mutually exclusive. I would imagine the former is more prevalent, but that the latter happens as well.
Leaving my opinions on "The Secret" in the real world out of it, I think it is reasonable to roll that idea into the two theories mentioned above, if you so choose. I don't support the "alternate timelines" part, for the reason stated above about, ya know, the fabric of reality and what-not. However, "The Secret" is a good way of looking at channeling magic, both for creatures and spells. I imagine that is how spellshapers do it, as well as many red and/or green mages of various class-descriptors. Willing their desires into reality, with the aid of their homelands. Whereas wizards I imagine are more like D&D wizards, all book-learnin' and what-have-you. Then shaman are probably part-"secret", part-ritual. That is my take, anyway. You can also count this as my response to the other thread, about how spells are cast, I guess.
:symg::symu: Infect-Old Standard that I need to update
And trying to decide what my next EDH will be.
I am a :symg::symrg::symr::symur::symu::symug: 'walker all the way.