Goal of the deck is to attempt to make a standard competitive mill deck. My thought is the reason why mill decks are bad are more or less 2 fold.
1. Mill cards tend not to do anything but mill. Therefore they are not versatile enough to build a deck around or control a game.
2. What happens if you don't get there by milling. (The most common problem with mill decks)
This deck tries to answer these problems by being aggressive with these two cards.
The plan is to start out aggressive with JP and WoPS to bring in the beats by using mill to pump them up. Later in the game we can convert our mill cards into reach with this guy.
This is exactly the deck I want to build. Similar at least I want to run 2 of the aberration. I'd probably add mind grind as a one of in your deck's proposition as a nice late game blow.
Honestly to me this seems like it could be the new "delver" in a sense. Honestly id add delver to the deck as another beater
I would give consideration to that idea. It looks like your deck will be hanging in there tooth and nail until the other player's graveyard is full enough for one of your fatties. The Wight can be unpredictable, too.
Also hands od binding would be nice in this deck and possibly curiosity wouldgive deck more draw with fliers n hands will tap down there toughest dude. If ur playing dimir take advantage of that cipher
i'm testing a mill deck as well, it's a bit different from yours, it's more UW with a plash of B, more control oriented then aggro. consuming aberration is just awesome, i use it as my 2nd win condition. if they get rid of jace, memory adept i play aberration which usually comes down as a 30/30...
i agree with you in choosing mind sculpt over mind grind, in all my tests it worked much better
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Huey, Dewey and Louie are always dressed in RUG. it is CLEARLY going to be the wedges block Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
I love this deck, been working on this idea also. Ive been thinking of making it my sideboard to make a traditional UB control into a transitional SB deck. But anyway, off topic...
Problems I see or fear are how well it can hold up against ramp and burn decks.
Vampire Nighthawk is an option for lifegain, perhaps a SB card. I am also a fan of Consuming Aberration and would love to fit him in my deck. If you test him, let us know pls.
A fun thought that combos with Consuming Aberration is Artful Dodge . Let's your nice new big boys swing straight through and will mill if he's out. With the flashback and him, thats 2 mills and 2 critters going to the face - that should be game.
I was tinkering around with a deck like this. Rest in peace is THE NUTS sideboard against this though. The wights, guildmage and phantasm's become useless, and they are most of your effective creaturebase.
I'd add a pike, just because it's great with so many instants, and if it hits you can always mill yourself a bit to make a creature bigger.
Is Mind Sculpt really a good card in this deck? A straight up mill 7 feels very much unplayable...
I also fear for the speed of this deck. Common aggro decks play like 8 removal spells compared to your 8-ish creatures that they care about (Phantasm and Wight). Another Dimir Charm would certainly be worth it to kill 2 power creatures. Augur of Bolas could also be considered... Death's Approach seems horridly variant. I'd advise against it. Plenty of midrange decks that only play 4 angel 4 tusk 4 some creature, making it totally useless. For the same reason, the Wight might also not be too amazing. Against control it's just a 1/1! Then again, getting to resolve a Jace rapes control, so...
In early testing I've found anything with an x in the cost is just too slow - Increasing Confusion, Mind Grind, etc. It's probably best to ignore them, unfortunately.
Evil Twin might be worth checking out, as well as Trepination Blade and Chronic Flooding. Chronic Flooding might be good against an aggro deck that wants to tap out every turn, but maybe that's just wishful thinking.
Instead of splashing green for something like Rancor to ensure your Consuming Aberration hits, just use Artful Dodge. That way you don't screw up your mana base, you can flash it back in case it doesn't go through the first time for whatever reason, and chances are you'll only need it to connect once and then it's gg.
Rest in peace scares me. Once it's on the board there aren't many answers for it. Green help here with golgari charm for verdict and rest in peace both. Duress and counters also can help. I also like a couple havengul lichen the 75, with deathrite mana you should be able to cast whatever and also recover from a sweep.
Vs aggro think dream twist and mind sculpt and thought scour can get you creatures online and out of burn range too fast for them to handle efficiently, like t3 phant and wop6 at 5/5 would be hard to push past without 241ing themselves.
I also worry about haveing enough draw with so many potentially do nothing cards if your in a bad spot, I think sign in blood would be good, along with maybe cremate an thought scour would keep the gas on.
If we're using the opponent's graveyard to buff up Phatasm and Aberration, exiling the yard and keeping more cards from hitting it takes away our damage potential.
While normally I would think that X spells aren't the best, I'm really wondering if a 2-of Mind Grind wouldn't be that bad? For them to have to hit X lands is going to ensure that you mill for a decent amount of cards.
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An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Thanks guys for all your comments.
Here is what i am thinking so far
1) Consuming aberration has come up alot and i am not really a fan of it. At first glance it looks really sex, big creature that goes with the deck theme and can mill, but it doesn't help this deck in any way. The 2 ways this deck kills is by beating down or by milling out. This card doesn't efficiently help either of these strategies. Its five mana without any evasion and it needs other cards to start milling. To make the Consuming aberration plan playable i would have to add evasion like many have already discussed. Don't think it is worth it. Also the card it would be replacing is Jace, the memory adept which is already an all star against control and combos well with Duskmantle guildmage.
2) Death's Approach great suggestion want to make room for it. However will need to keep instant speed removal in the deck.
3) I do agree with you guys in that the deck could use a splash color (either white or green). This can also help with the Rest in Peace problem. I really do like Orhov Charm
4) I do agree the deck needs more card draw. Cremate looks kid of bad but it cycles and it can get rid of nasty things in opponents graveyard that was going to come back.
5) I am worried that there is not enough mill to activate JP and WoPS. Currently want to try out adding Paranoid Delusions or i know it is jank but Crosstown Courier. It has already been mentioned that I am an aggro deck with only 15 creatures. CC can really kill 2 birds with one stone.
I won't be able to tinker with the deck till later tonight. So Ill post a new deck list then.
Later guys
I play very little standard. But I do keep 2 decks on me for the occasional game. With that said my decks are always on the cheap. (Not real competitive) Anyway, I use a similar deck but is U/G and it too uses JP and company as a win con as well. The G is just used for beats i.e. rancor, Strangleroot Geist, and Wolfir Silverheart. I originality wanted to go U/B but it was to slow pre Gatecrash. This build I think is much better than U/G. I agree with Vampire Nighthawk as a side board. I am not sure how well it could do main board.
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Originally posted by Rywads Having a foiled set of avacyn's pilgrims must be on the same level as a dude who puts expensive spinner hubcaps on an old Honda Civic.
Cheaper alternative to using Jace and Snappy. I figure the guild mage is a bit too slow for what it does, so I figured I'd replace him with a split of keyrunes and aberration. Honestly don't know how well the big boy will do, but the keyrune is a fantastic target for cipher. Might even toss in invisible stalkers in there as well.
Cheaper alternative to using Jace and Snappy. I figure the guild mage is a bit too slow for what it does, so I figured I'd replace him with a split of keyrunes and aberration. Honestly don't know how well the big boy will do, but the keyrune is a fantastic target for cipher. Might even toss in invisible stalkers in there as well.
As it looks now, I'm wondering if the Trepanation Blade is worth it? You're only playing 10 creatures. And only the Wight really worries about getting more cards into your opponent's graveyard after the initial "starting point". You won't be dropping Jace's Phantasm at a 1/1 and will be holding back until they hit at 5/5s. Snappy is more reactionary to the spells you play.
I'd rather play Mind Sculpts which will more than likely hit for more cards than the Blade. Plus you can Snap it back, and 2 get the Jace's Phantasm online. Just some thoughts...
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*I COLLECT EHAN106 ALTERS. GOT ANY?*
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
As it looks now, I'm wondering if the Trepanation Blade is worth it? You're only playing 10 creatures. And only the Wight really worries about getting more cards into your opponent's graveyard after the initial "starting point". You won't be dropping Jace's Phantasm at a 1/1 and will be holding back until they hit at 5/5s. Snappy is more reactionary to the spells you play.
I'd rather play Mind Sculpts which will more than likely hit for more cards than the Blade. Plus you can Snap it back, and 2 get the Jace's Phantasm online. Just some thoughts...
I think trep blade is definately worth it. It adds more mill, it's cheap, and it increases damage. All nice things. Could be fantastic if used with invisible stalkers, pretty good with dimir keyrune.
Yes Mind Sculpt will hit for more the first go through, then instead of spending tons more mana and 30 dollar cards, you could just cipher a common onto your keyrune/phantasm and constantly recur the mill threat.
As for undead alchemist, I totally forgot about him! I will definately be putting him in place of the Aberration. Constant tokens would be sick with the amount of mill available.
1. Mill cards tend not to do anything but mill. Therefore they are not versatile enough to build a deck around or control a game.
2. What happens if you don't get there by milling. (The most common problem with mill decks)
This deck tries to answer these problems by being aggressive with these two cards.
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?multiverseid=249672&type=card
The plan is to start out aggressive with JP and WoPS to bring in the beats by using mill to pump them up. Later in the game we can convert our mill cards into reach with this guy.
The Deck
4 Watery Grave
4 Drowned Catacomb
4 Dimir Guildgate
8 Island
2 Swamp
2 Nephalia Drownyard
4 Wight of Precinct Six
4 Jace's Phantasm
4 Snapcaster Mage
3 Duskmantle Guildmage
Spells-19
4 Mind Sculpt
4 Thought Scour
3 Psychic Strike
3 Dimir Charm
2 Ultimate Price
2 Tragic Slip
3 Jace, Memory Adept
This is a rough idea plz give help.:D
Leeched images removed. ~parinoid
I would give consideration to that idea. It looks like your deck will be hanging in there tooth and nail until the other player's graveyard is full enough for one of your fatties. The Wight can be unpredictable, too.
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also less gate lands
i agree with you in choosing mind sculpt over mind grind, in all my tests it worked much better
Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons
ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
Hmmmm, my brewing juices are flowing!
Thanks to Heroes of the Plane Studios for the amazing sig.
NO RUG: Primer
Tempo Thresh: Primer
Problems I see or fear are how well it can hold up against ramp and burn decks.
I like Tragic Slip and Ultimate Price, have you also considered Death's Approach ?
Vampire Nighthawk is an option for lifegain, perhaps a SB card. I am also a fan of Consuming Aberration and would love to fit him in my deck. If you test him, let us know pls.
A fun thought that combos with Consuming Aberration is Artful Dodge . Let's your nice new big boys swing straight through and will mill if he's out. With the flashback and him, thats 2 mills and 2 critters going to the face - that should be game.
Just some thoughts, let me know what you think.
I'd add a pike, just because it's great with so many instants, and if it hits you can always mill yourself a bit to make a creature bigger.
Is Mind Sculpt really a good card in this deck? A straight up mill 7 feels very much unplayable...
I also fear for the speed of this deck. Common aggro decks play like 8 removal spells compared to your 8-ish creatures that they care about (Phantasm and Wight). Another Dimir Charm would certainly be worth it to kill 2 power creatures. Augur of Bolas could also be considered... Death's Approach seems horridly variant. I'd advise against it. Plenty of midrange decks that only play 4 angel 4 tusk 4 some creature, making it totally useless. For the same reason, the Wight might also not be too amazing. Against control it's just a 1/1! Then again, getting to resolve a Jace rapes control, so...
Evil Twin might be worth checking out, as well as Trepination Blade and Chronic Flooding. Chronic Flooding might be good against an aggro deck that wants to tap out every turn, but maybe that's just wishful thinking.
Instead of splashing green for something like Rancor to ensure your Consuming Aberration hits, just use Artful Dodge. That way you don't screw up your mana base, you can flash it back in case it doesn't go through the first time for whatever reason, and chances are you'll only need it to connect once and then it's gg.
Vs aggro think dream twist and mind sculpt and thought scour can get you creatures online and out of burn range too fast for them to handle efficiently, like t3 phant and wop6 at 5/5 would be hard to push past without 241ing themselves.
I also worry about haveing enough draw with so many potentially do nothing cards if your in a bad spot, I think sign in blood would be good, along with maybe cremate an thought scour would keep the gas on.
This scares you because... we can't flashback/snappy? I don't get it myself
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
Here is what i am thinking so far
1) Consuming aberration has come up alot and i am not really a fan of it. At first glance it looks really sex, big creature that goes with the deck theme and can mill, but it doesn't help this deck in any way. The 2 ways this deck kills is by beating down or by milling out. This card doesn't efficiently help either of these strategies. Its five mana without any evasion and it needs other cards to start milling. To make the Consuming aberration plan playable i would have to add evasion like many have already discussed. Don't think it is worth it. Also the card it would be replacing is Jace, the memory adept which is already an all star against control and combos well with Duskmantle guildmage.
2) Death's Approach great suggestion want to make room for it. However will need to keep instant speed removal in the deck.
3) I do agree with you guys in that the deck could use a splash color (either white or green). This can also help with the Rest in Peace problem. I really do like Orhov Charm
4) I do agree the deck needs more card draw. Cremate looks kid of bad but it cycles and it can get rid of nasty things in opponents graveyard that was going to come back.
5) I am worried that there is not enough mill to activate JP and WoPS. Currently want to try out adding Paranoid Delusions or i know it is jank but Crosstown Courier. It has already been mentioned that I am an aggro deck with only 15 creatures. CC can really kill 2 birds with one stone.
I won't be able to tinker with the deck till later tonight. So Ill post a new deck list then.
Later guys
I believe Mind Sculpt is a must it allows for a turn 3 Jace's Phantasm at a 5/5.
Anyway
I play very little standard. But I do keep 2 decks on me for the occasional game. With that said my decks are always on the cheap. (Not real competitive) Anyway, I use a similar deck but is U/G and it too uses JP and company as a win con as well. The G is just used for beats i.e. rancor, Strangleroot Geist, and Wolfir Silverheart. I originality wanted to go U/B but it was to slow pre Gatecrash. This build I think is much better than U/G. I agree with Vampire Nighthawk as a side board. I am not sure how well it could do main board.
EDH-
Shattergang BothersGBR Kaalia the Vast RBW Pillowpants the Blackblade, Troll of the PillowfortBUW Jarad Golgari Lich Lord's Pet CemeteryGB (Retired)
Ghave Guru of SporesGBW (Retired)
Jenara, Asura of WarGWU Norin the WayR Rhys the RedeemedGW Oloro, Ageless AsceticBUW
Ezuri, Renegade LeaderG
2x Trepanation Blade
3x Dimir Keyrune
4x Jace's Phantasm
4x Wight of Precinct Six
2x Consuming Aberration
4x Thought Scour
2x Tragic Slip
2x Hands of Binding
4x Paranoid Delusions
3x Dimir Charm
2x Ultimate Price
3x Psychic Strike
4x Drowned Catacomb
4x Watery Grave
2x Dimir Guildgate
6x Island
6x Swamp
Cheaper alternative to using Jace and Snappy. I figure the guild mage is a bit too slow for what it does, so I figured I'd replace him with a split of keyrunes and aberration. Honestly don't know how well the big boy will do, but the keyrune is a fantastic target for cipher. Might even toss in invisible stalkers in there as well.
As it looks now, I'm wondering if the Trepanation Blade is worth it? You're only playing 10 creatures. And only the Wight really worries about getting more cards into your opponent's graveyard after the initial "starting point". You won't be dropping Jace's Phantasm at a 1/1 and will be holding back until they hit at 5/5s. Snappy is more reactionary to the spells you play.
I'd rather play Mind Sculpts which will more than likely hit for more cards than the Blade. Plus you can Snap it back, and 2 get the Jace's Phantasm online. Just some thoughts...
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
I think trep blade is definately worth it. It adds more mill, it's cheap, and it increases damage. All nice things. Could be fantastic if used with invisible stalkers, pretty good with dimir keyrune.
Yes Mind Sculpt will hit for more the first go through, then instead of spending tons more mana and 30 dollar cards, you could just cipher a common onto your keyrune/phantasm and constantly recur the mill threat.
As for undead alchemist, I totally forgot about him! I will definately be putting him in place of the Aberration. Constant tokens would be sick with the amount of mill available.