I like the lists, although the aggro MU is a concern when you're playing monoblue. Wurmcoil Engine and Repeal are the options here, I think.
Stony Silence, which is popular right now, can be a real problem, you pretty much rely on Repeal to avoid it.
I think it can do well in the current meta, with the amount of midrange decks being played. They usually won't be fast enough to beat a deck like this before a full lock. Also, with all the manabases littered with nonbasics, Sundering Titan should be an awesome option in any Tron deck.
Is Treasure Mage better than Fabricate or Gifts? What does Orboro do?
Probably, as you're rarely going to want to find anything other than one of the bombs (maybe Map, but not that often). In my limited playtesting, Oboro does almost nothing.
Yeah, I don't see the need to tutor for other artifacts. Given that, Treasure Mage is Fabricate + a 2/2 body to block something.
Gifts could work here, although Treasure Mage is more direct: if it resolves you just get exactly what you want and proceed to win. A lot of Tron builds from last year used Gifts with Mindslaver, Academy Ruins and Noxious Revival to lock the game.
Oboro is there just 'cause you can use it. It's an Island with the ability to save it's own ass in case of a Bust or something like that. It'll be rarely used, but there's not reason no to play one too.
Oh, and the guy who was streaming the Daily Event went 3-1 with, apparently, the exact same list that won the Premier (shoktroopa's). You can watch the recorded video on his page.
Tutoring for Oblivion Stone seemed like the only main deck reason I'd want Fabricate. Also to play more hate like Chalice of the Void, Torpor Orb, or Pithing Needle out of the board. Maybe Tezzeret 1.0 could work too.
While watching the stream I was moderately intrigued about trying:
-5 Island
-1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
+4 Darkslick Shores
+1 Creeping Tar Pit / Watery Grave
+1 Darksteel Citadel
-4 Talisman of Progress (they should be Dominance anyway right?)
+4 Dimir Signet
-3 Treasure Mage
+3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
Tezzeret is less direct as a tutor, but a better source of card advantage, and also can help find much needed Maps, Oblivion Stones, or turn your Signets into better than 2/2 beaters in the combo matchups.
There has got to be a way to make trading post work with this deck - right? I miss playing with that card and mimic vat so much. I'm going to try to start brewing but I'm not that great at creating decks - anyone up for the challenge with me? Or is there someone that can convince me it's not worth it?
Couldn't we make it a gifts package, but instead of noxious revival, use crucible of worlds, and run a couple quicksands MB, along with some Tolaria Wests? Another thing I was wondering about, is why the loan spell burst when you can't tutor for it, so it's only really good when you draw it late game.
Thinking about it a bit more, Gifts is probably not needed. lucashungaro said it already, but if you can just tutor for something like Sundering Titan, you probably don't need to futz around with Gifts. Just go for the kill.
Problem with Quicksand is your land drops are more valuable than x/2 non-flying removal. If you want a removal land, at least run Mouth of Ronom instead.
The overwhelming presence of DRS in the meta right now makes non-dedicated gifting complete junk.
Well, I watched some more streams yesterday and built the deck. I'll start playing tonight (in Brazil, so still some 8 hours left :P), so I really can't rule anything out.
Playing Gifts is always tempting. We tend to think that being able to tutor for "anything" is an improvement, but it's not always the case. You usually want it for two reasons:
1) Get your win conditions. This deck has Treasure Mage + Expedition Map (for Academy Ruins) already. *Probably* doesn't need more tutors.
2) "Gifts for value", meaning getting some much needed effect, like removal or discard. Since the deck is monoblue and plays only wincons + draw + counters + bounce, there's nothing much else to tutor for. You usually play this on a dedicated toolbox-style deck.
If you look at the relevant decks playing Gifts now (U/W Tron, 4CC Gifts and some Esper Teachings lists), they're doing one or both of these.
Maybe there's a chance for a build replacing Treasure Mage with Gifts, it could be good. It probably would need to splash Black/White/Red to take advantage of a toolbox approach though. My reasoning stands only if the deck stays the way it is now.
Tezzeret looks too slow. But, then again, this is just my gut feeling, we need to test all of this.
dougmtg, what are you aiming to kill with Quicksand?
Just to help against burn, killing goblin guide and what not, but I was second guessing it anyways. But my gifts list would replace thirst for knowledge and it would look like this.
x1 Crucible of Worlds
x3 Dimir Signet
x3 Expedition maps
x2 Mindslaver
x1 Oblivion Stone
x1 Academy Ruins
x1 Island
x1 Oboro, Palace in the Sky
x5 Snow-Covered Island
x1 Mouth of Ronom
x1 Tectonic Edge (maybe ghost quarter, since some decks don't run that many basics so you can lock them out with crucible)
x2 Tolaria West
x12 Urza Lands
I'm testing it, and have been for awhile now, and so far it's gone 2-0 against this weird merieke deck, 2-0 vs rb shades, and 2-1 vs UW control. I don't know where those first two decks came from, but I was like wtf?
EDIT: I swapped some cards out of the sideboard -1 Mindslaver -1 Quicksand +1 Tectonic Edge +1 Dismember. and mainboard I did swap the tect for Ghost Quarter.
This deck won a Modern Premier and went 3-1 on a recent daily event.
shoktroopa (1st Place)
Modern Premier #4965298 on 02/04/2013
8 Island
1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
1 Tectonic Edge
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
1 Platinum Angel
3 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Sundering Titan
4 Treasure Mage
2 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Expedition Map
2 Mindslaver
1 Oblivion Stone
4 Remand
3 Repeal
1 Spell Burst
3 Talisman of Progress
4 Thirst for Knowledge
3 Dismember
3 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
3 Spell Pierce
2 Spellskite
2 Trickbind
_j3n10 (3-1)
Modern Daily #4965336 on 02/05/2013
10 Island
1 Tectonic Edge
4 Urza's Mine
4 Urza's Power Plant
4 Urza's Tower
1 Platinum Angel
2 Solemn Simulacrum
2 Spellskite
1 Sundering Titan
3 Treasure Mage
2 Wurmcoil Engine
4 Expedition Map
1 Mindslaver
4 Remand
4 Repeal
4 Talisman of Progress
4 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Eye of Ugin
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Jace, Architect of Thought
2 Pithing Needle
2 Relic of Progenitus
1 Torpor Orb
2 Trinket Mage
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
1 Wurmcoil Engine
I like the lists, although the aggro MU is a concern when you're playing monoblue. Wurmcoil Engine and Repeal are the options here, I think.
Stony Silence, which is popular right now, can be a real problem, you pretty much rely on Repeal to avoid it.
I think it can do well in the current meta, with the amount of midrange decks being played. They usually won't be fast enough to beat a deck like this before a full lock. Also, with all the manabases littered with nonbasics, Sundering Titan should be an awesome option in any Tron deck.
Thoughts?
540 Peasant cube- Gold EditionSomething SpicyBut being able to play Sundering Titan in the current meta is sweet.
Probably, as you're rarely going to want to find anything other than one of the bombs (maybe Map, but not that often). In my limited playtesting, Oboro does almost nothing.
Sig by DNC/HotP Studios
Gifts could work here, although Treasure Mage is more direct: if it resolves you just get exactly what you want and proceed to win. A lot of Tron builds from last year used Gifts with Mindslaver, Academy Ruins and Noxious Revival to lock the game.
Oboro is there just 'cause you can use it. It's an Island with the ability to save it's own ass in case of a Bust or something like that. It'll be rarely used, but there's not reason no to play one too.
Oh, and the guy who was streaming the Daily Event went 3-1 with, apparently, the exact same list that won the Premier (shoktroopa's). You can watch the recorded video on his page.
-5 Island
-1 Oboro, Palace in the Clouds
+4 Darkslick Shores
+1 Creeping Tar Pit / Watery Grave
+1 Darksteel Citadel
-4 Talisman of Progress (they should be Dominance anyway right?)
+4 Dimir Signet
-3 Treasure Mage
+3 Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
Tezzeret is less direct as a tutor, but a better source of card advantage, and also can help find much needed Maps, Oblivion Stones, or turn your Signets into better than 2/2 beaters in the combo matchups.
Mostly, I just want to play with Tezzeret.
Sig by DNC/HotP Studios
The overwhelming presence of DRS in the meta right now makes non-dedicated gifting complete junk.
Playing Gifts is always tempting. We tend to think that being able to tutor for "anything" is an improvement, but it's not always the case. You usually want it for two reasons:
1) Get your win conditions. This deck has Treasure Mage + Expedition Map (for Academy Ruins) already. *Probably* doesn't need more tutors.
2) "Gifts for value", meaning getting some much needed effect, like removal or discard. Since the deck is monoblue and plays only wincons + draw + counters + bounce, there's nothing much else to tutor for. You usually play this on a dedicated toolbox-style deck.
If you look at the relevant decks playing Gifts now (U/W Tron, 4CC Gifts and some Esper Teachings lists), they're doing one or both of these.
Maybe there's a chance for a build replacing Treasure Mage with Gifts, it could be good. It probably would need to splash Black/White/Red to take advantage of a toolbox approach though. My reasoning stands only if the deck stays the way it is now.
Tezzeret looks too slow. But, then again, this is just my gut feeling, we need to test all of this.
dougmtg, what are you aiming to kill with Quicksand?
x1 Crucible of Worlds
x3 Dimir Signet
x3 Expedition maps
x2 Mindslaver
x1 Oblivion Stone
x1 Platinum Angel
x3 Solemn Simulacrum
x1 Sundering Titan
x2 Treasure Mage
x2 Wurmcoil Engine
x3 Condescend
x1 Cyclonic Rift
x1 Evacuation
x4 Gifts
x4 Remand
x3 Repeal
x1 Spell Burst
x1 Academy Ruins
x1 Island
x1 Oboro, Palace in the Sky
x5 Snow-Covered Island
x1 Mouth of Ronom
x1 Tectonic Edge (maybe ghost quarter, since some decks don't run that many basics so you can lock them out with crucible)
x2 Tolaria West
x12 Urza Lands
SB:
x1 Mindslaver
x3 Pithing Needle
x2 Relic of Progenitus
x3 Dismember
x1 Dispel
x2 Spell Pierce
x1 Negate
x1 Wipe Away
x1 Quicksand
I'm testing it, and have been for awhile now, and so far it's gone 2-0 against this weird merieke deck, 2-0 vs rb shades, and 2-1 vs UW control. I don't know where those first two decks came from, but I was like wtf?
EDIT: I swapped some cards out of the sideboard -1 Mindslaver -1 Quicksand +1 Tectonic Edge +1 Dismember. and mainboard I did swap the tect for Ghost Quarter.
I lost to Jund, beat UB Tezzerator and Eggs 2-0, and then played the mirror
This deck is real
Paper: WUR Waffle Control, RG and U Tron
MTGO: U Tron, BRG Living End, B Infect
Testing Modern on MTGO and helping to craft decks on a Budget
I stream!
Hermit Druid Combo:
Paper: WUR Waffle Control, RG and U Tron
MTGO: U Tron, BRG Living End, B Infect
Testing Modern on MTGO and helping to craft decks on a Budget
I stream!
Hermit Druid Combo:
Are either of those really better then more Wurmcoil Engine or Mindslaver?
The only Treasure Mage targets that I would consider would be realistically...
and...