This is not a standard mafia game. Read the rules.
1. If you edit a post, you die. If you quote any of my PM's to you, you die. 2. I won't penalize you for double posting, but it is against forums rules, so be aware that you might get a warning for double posting if a mod catches you doing it. 3. Each day will last exactly one week from the hour each begins. If the required majority of votes hasn't been reached by the end of a day, whoever's got the most votes will be killed. 4. Nights will last a maximum of four days. 5. Votes won't be counted if they aren't bold. Also, please unvote if you are changing your vote. 6. It takes a majority, rounded up, to lynch somebody. For example, with 14 players, it takes 8 votes to toss somebody out of the airlock. With 13 players, it takes 7. 12, 7. 11, 6. And so on. 7. You all have victory conditions based on your alignments, and described in your PMs. All players have the same type of victory condition. Basically, this game will end when no two people left alive have opposing alignments on either of the axes. That is, if there are a chaotic player and a lawful player still alive, the game is not over. If there are an evil player and a good player still alive, the game is not over. When the game ends, all those left alive are the winners. Alignments will be revealed upon death. There are no True Neutral players.
Pibbly, Neutral Good Human Sorcerer - had his head bashed in night one.
swinkee, Lawful Neutral Dwarf Fighter - lynched day one.
It is now night two! Night actions are due by Midnight EST April 15th at the latest. If you have a night ability and don't want to use it, please tell me that.
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
W – 33, L – 19, Broke Games - 9
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
X-Men Mafia Town MVP
Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
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Confirmed, and new official owner of the unbolded name award ;).
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[Delinquent ManiacS] [Former Called]
[Leader - Team BTY]
[Founder - Casual Council]
[Creator - Group 'Make A Deck']
[Implementor - 3 Card Blind]
[MUD Admin]
[Dominion of Chaos (DoC)]
Never let the future disturb you. You will meet it, if you have to, with the same weapons of reason which today arm you against the present.
You all awake the next morning to find Pibbly, a human, lying face-first outside his tent, his head split open, and gore and bile spattering the grass around him. His lizard familiar is running back and forth along his body, distraught.
Pibbly, Neutral Good Human Sorcerer, has been killed.
With 11 alive, it will take 6 to lynch. Here begins day 1.
Ew..not a good way to start out, that's for sure.
Better luck next time Pibbly! Hey, you forgot your lizard!!!
:biggrin3:
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Head bashed in... seems a good clue towards who done it. Barbarian or fighter? And if so, was this a random killing or can we assume this character is evil?
I take it we don't get to know what, if any, ability Pibbly had. If not, we must guess. Sorcerers are best-known for offensive magic (i.e. vigilante/SK), but given the breadth of the spell list, he could be almost anything.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Head bashed in... seems a good clue towards who done it. Barbarian or fighter? And if so, was this a random killing or can we assume this character is evil?
I take it we don't get to know what, if any, ability Pibbly had. If not, we must guess. Sorcerers are best-known for offensive magic (i.e. vigilante/SK), but given the breadth of the spell list, he could be almost anything.
Scry? I play too much D&D too much. The vig should be an assasin. Maybe he was a cop. That is out of order sorry.
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Scry? I play too much D&D too much. The vig should be an assasin. Maybe he was a cop. That is out of order sorry.
For some reason, scry was my knee-jerk reaction to the news. But like I said, the breadth of the spell list makes it difficult to guess.
And, due to the nature of this "specialty" game, we probably have several killing roles. Assassin's a likely one (my guess is NE, possibly LE), but it obviously wasn't an assassin who killed Pibbly, for example. At least, not a conventional assassin.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
And, due to the nature of this "specialty" game, we probably have several killing roles. Assassin's a likely one (my guess is NE, possibly LE), but it obviously wasn't an assassin who killed Pibbly, for example. At least, not a conventional assassin.
I'd say that the killer was probably some race, like a half-giant or dwarf, that tends to be strong. Half-giant is my guess. And if you wonder why I think it might be race involved, it's because Pibbly's race is specified to be human. And can anyone say something about the familiar, because it too was specified?
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Ambivalent owner of nan's soul. Proud worshipper of TFE.
I wouldn't read a terrible amount into the races - my role specifies my race, too. Also, I think it's best to assume core races until proven otherwise. My suspicion is that the killer is a half-orc barbarian, but it could easily be a dwarven fighter too.
Not sure how much we should read into the familiar.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Yeah...unfortunately, I don't know much of anything about D&D...hopefully that won't put me at too big of a disadvantage. I can sort of put together the pieces...i.e. good vs. evil...
Anyway, this does seem like a orc, or dwarf kill...some kind of brute force at least.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
My night ability redirects powers. In other words, I pick two targets, and the first target targets the second target.
Last night, I had AlphaInsiduous target Pibbly.
vote AlphaInsiduous
...Wow. That's some claim there. Are you saying that, essentially, you killed Pibbly? I think I'll hold off a vote for the moment, at least until I see something more solid than a claim that can't be proven.
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Ambivalent owner of nan's soul. Proud worshipper of TFE.
I don't think that that's the case, Billking...seeing as my night ability could not have possibly done that to Pibbly. Not gonna reveal my ability, but let's just say it is considerably not...uh...lethal, lol.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
...Wow. That's some claim there. Are you saying that, essentially, you killed Pibbly? I think I'll hold off a vote for the moment, at least until I see something more solid than a claim that can't be proven.
It would be ridiculously stupid for me to make a fake claim here. This game just started, the course of action I'm advocating, if it fails, will quickly get me lynched.
Either I'm a lucky townie or an extremely stupid mafia. Either way, the town wins.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
It would be ridiculously stupid for me to make a fake claim here. This game just started, the course of action I'm advocating, if it fails, will quickly get me lynched.
Either I'm a lucky townie or an extremely stupid mafia. Either way, the town wins.
I think it is far more likely that you are the former. Given that it is virtually never a good idea for mafia to trade off a mamber for a townie.
At this point I'm going to take Alpha at this word and procede under the assumption that the kill was the result of someone else's ability or a mafia kill.
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RELAPSED MAFIA JUNKIE
W – 33, L – 19, Broke Games - 9
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
X-Men Mafia Town MVP
Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
Just one question for billking and hawkeye7: who said that there was a mafia? The impression I got from my pm was that it was just good vs. evil & lawful vs. chaotic. There was no mafia in the way I read into the way the game will be played. Or am I wrong?
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Ambivalent owner of nan's soul. Proud worshipper of TFE.
Just one question for billking and hawkeye7: who said that there was a mafia? The impression I got from my pm was that it was just good vs. evil & lawful vs. chaotic. There was no mafia in the way I read into the way the game will be played. Or am I wrong?
Hmm, that is a good point. I supose you could consider any player not of you alignment as mafia but that cuts both ways. It also calls into question the logic that would apply in a normal game to what billking just did.
I think that this change of perspective will take a little getting used to. I also think that it is still likely that billking is as he claimed, but the possibility that he is not is more possible then I had at first thought.
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RELAPSED MAFIA JUNKIE
W – 33, L – 19, Broke Games - 9
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
X-Men Mafia Town MVP
Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
I was under the impression that lawful and chaotic are indeed pitted against each other, but that everyone who is nonevil benefits if evil is defeated.
Thus Good would represent the town, and Evil would represent Mafia.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
I was under the impression that lawful and chaotic are indeed pitted against each other, but that everyone who is nonevil benefits if evil is defeated.
Thus Good would represent the town, and Evil would represent Mafia.
That's not really what my pm implied.
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Ambivalent owner of nan's soul. Proud worshipper of TFE.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
lol, i mean the way that the alignments were explained to me were semi-confusing.
-Alpha
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Quote from TheFooFish »
Lies! -I'm Buffy Summers, town tracker. I used my ability on you and saw that you didn't use any abilities before the game started. My flavor is I was sucked through a mysterious space-time portal and I'm here to kill all the vampires, and my tracking ability is a combination of my Slayer and Native American skills.
The gist I got from mine was that good players try to eliminate the evil players, and vice versa, while something similar happens between lawful and chaotic players.
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Ambivalent owner of nan's soul. Proud worshipper of TFE.
It's a "specialty" game for a reason - everyone's town and no one is. There is probably not a group of people who get together each night and decide to kill someone; instead, we each try to accomplish our own objectives within the framework of the game. At least, that's the impression I got from my role PM and the mod's initial post.
Billking - We vote the same way we always do. How does this new arrangement prevent us from voting? We just have different motives for voting.
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Vive, vale. Siquid novisti rectius istis,
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
The interesting dynamic about Mafia is that there is a Majority and a Minority. The Majority (aka town) controls the Day, while the Minority (the Mafia) control the Night.
In this game, however, there is no Majority. At least, not as far as I can tell. Nor would anyone qualify as minority. The people that are half-neutral may have the least people gunning out for them, but they also have the least number of teammates, which means they don't have anyone rooting for them, either. (Probably either the half-neutrals or the zero-neutrals are a slight Minority but we can't tell right now.)
What does this mean? It means we're all effectively Minorities and that no faction controls the Day. There isn't any group to appeal to, no group for the Minorities to pretend to be a member of, nothing. There's no incentive to post. Without incentive to post, how can we hope to get an eventual lynch consensus? Another thing: everyone's got opposing goals. That also make consensus-building hard.
I have no idea how we're going to determine who to lynch today. This isn't a normal game at all. There isn't a "scummy" because there isn't a "town," so it's not like we're going to pick someone off because they make a mistake while posting. I guess I'll just have to wait and see.
That said, fine, if people don't want to do anything about Alpha, that's Kool and the Gang. I truly don't care. After all, I can redirect him to whomever I want. Let Alpha live and you just might be next.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
That said, fine, if people don't want to do anything about Alpha, that's Kool and the Gang. I truly don't care. After all, I can redirect him to whomever I want. Let Alpha live and you just might be next.
That's assuming that we let you live as well. And who's to say that alpha is the only one with the ability to kill? Who's to say alpha even has the ability to kill? Your argument requires a lot of assumptions, billking. You assume that alpha was the one who killed pibbly, when we don't know who targeted who the first night. Perhaps there's another killer out there, and they killed pibbly. Alpha may not even have an ability. All we know is that pibbly is dead and that you can control anyone you want. Also, you made slight error, at least in how I percieve the game dynamic, when you said this:
Quote from billking »
The people that are half-neutral may have the least people gunning out for them, but they also have the least number of teammates, which means they don't have anyone rooting for them, either.
The way I interpret the game, if someone is, say, neutral good, as pibbly was, then their enemies list consists of evil players, while their allies would be good, lawful, and chaotic. Once evil is gone, they don't really need to do much, just be able to defend themselves from lynchings and nightkills. Also, you said that
Quote from billking »
I have no idea how we're going to determine who to lynch today. This isn't a normal game at all. There isn't a "scummy" because there isn't a "town," so it's not like we're going to pick someone off because they make a mistake while posting. I guess I'll just have to wait and see.
I think I might. Vote: billking for trying to derail the game. You're right, there is no solid way to determine a lynch because everyone has their own agendas. I don't disagree with this. But this adds a level to the game! Instead of saying "So-and-so is mafia, we must lynch them", you have to be able to convince people to lynch based on different information, for example "We should all vote so-and-so because their ability is going to kill us all." This will take more skill and tact than regular mafia, besides which, you have to try and react to lynchings and nightkills in such a way that you don't give away you're alignment. For example, if you were chaotic/neutral/lawful evil, and you saw pibbly, a neutral good player, get nightkilled, you can't post and say something like "Phew, that helps my win condition" because all the good players will vote for you, as well as some of the evil and neutral players. In fact, if everyone didn't vote for you something would be wrong. You also commented that
Quote from billking »
In this game, however, there is no Majority. At least, not as far as I can tell. Nor would anyone qualify as minority. The people that are half-neutral may have the least people gunning out for them, but they also have the least number of teammates, which means they don't have anyone rooting for them, either. (Probably either the half-neutrals or the zero-neutrals are a slight Minority but we can't tell right now.)
What does this mean? It means we're all effectively Minorities and that no faction controls the Day. There isn't any group to appeal to, no group for the Minorities to pretend to be a member of, nothing. There's no incentive to post. Without incentive to post, how can we hope to get an eventual lynch consensus? Another thing: everyone's got opposing goals. That also make consensus-building hard.
True, there is no majority. But does there need to be a majority? Does everyone need to share one of two or three agendas for the game to work? The answer is simple: no. The game is more complex than that. Also, when you say that "no faction controls the Day," while being right, you are also horribly, tragically wrong. It is true that no faction controls the day, but what is implied by this statement is that nobody controls the day, which is patently absurd. It's the people who post that control the day, the people who put forth ideas and don't derail the game. Having failed to do either of those things, you don't seem to be adding much to the game. No group to appeal to, you say? Terrific, I say. Makes the whole thing more interesting. You have to impose your agenda on the group without revealing your agenda to the group. This not only makes the game more difficult, it also makes people think before posting, and construct their arguments around data that all can see and agree on. You say that alpha is a killer because you made him target pibbly on the night pibbly was killed? For all we know, you killed pibbly and are pushing your kill on him and lying about your ability. Not that alpha is beyond suspicion, just that you are a greater threat right now than he is, in my eyes.
Quote from billking »
This game is stoopid.
This comment is stupid. Just because you don't seem to understand the game, that doesn't make it stupid. It makes you a liability to all those who are accepting and willing to try something different, because with someone like you complaining about how this isnt really mafia, all the energy is sapped from the posts.
In case it was missed earlier, Vote: billking. You're the most suspicious, you're the most likely to sap the energy out of the game, and you're the most likely to make stupid mistakes. Plus which, you threatened us. Not a good move when everyone has an agenda, and you may or may not be on it as either someone to get rid of or someone to let live.
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Ambivalent owner of nan's soul. Proud worshipper of TFE.
Swinky, I think billking's point was that this isn't a mafia game, it's something else.
Voting for billking should mark you as evil. Billking didn't understand the game and clearly leaked info. HE'S GOOD. Why would you want to kill a good (as in alignment) player, because you're evil vote:swinky
If we get the rest of the good players to vote that should bring us that much closer to winning the game.
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Please abide by all rules and regulations of MTGS its parent and its affiliates. Malicious activity will result in termination of your account. Do not smoke fake weed. Refrain from trolling the staff and/or its sponsored trolls. This may result in your suspension or account termination. Do not reveal the location of Senior Staff members. Do not purchase Big Gulps outside of Manhattan to bring them there. Do not purchase Kinder Surprise eggs. Offer expires after 40 days. Cursing Annorax optional.
Just to let everyone know, I will only be online about three-four times a day now. My wife is due Friday and we have family coming in. I'm on leave, so she has me working I will get on at least three times a day. I tend to agree with musashi there, vote:swinky
That's assuming that we let you live as well. And who's to say that alpha is the only one with the ability to kill? Who's to say alpha even has the ability to kill? Your argument requires a lot of assumptions, billking.
Actually, it just has one; that there was not someone else with a lethal ability that targeted Pibbly. I think this is a fairly reasonable assumption.
Quote from swinkee »
The way I interpret the game, if someone is, say, neutral good, as pibbly was, then their enemies list consists of evil players, while their allies would be good, lawful, and chaotic.
This is very far from the truth... you're misusing the term "ally."
[b]Everyone needs to understand this:[/b] Someone who neutral good is teammates with other good players — because they share the same win condition — and is enemies with the evil players. What about the lawful and chaotic players? To a good player, "kill all Chaotic" and "kill all Lawful" are both win conditions that are not mutually exclusive to their win, so they're not opposed to them, per se. However, at the end of the day the choice is going to be between, say, going after Chaotic people or going after Evil people, and here there is going to be a major difference of opinion between the Good and Lawful individuals. Thus, Chaos and Law do not represent allies at all; they represent [b]competition[/b], teams that can misdirect lynches that they want to use themselves.
The only allies of a neutral good player are ... other good players. The primary enemies of a neutral good player are evil players, and the secondary enemies (competition) of a neutral good players are LN and CN players.
The allies of a lawful good players are other LG, LN, and NG players. The primary enemies of a lawful good player are CN, NE, and CE players, and the secondary enemies are the CG and LE players (enemies that share a goal with the LG player).
Thus in every case, each player has three alignments full of allies, three alignments full of primary enemies, and two alignments full of secondary enemies. 5 is more than 3; over half of the players in this game are your enemy, regardless of who you are.
Quote from swinkee »
Also, you said that I think I might. [b]Vote: billking[/b] for trying to derail the game. You're right, there is no solid way to determine a lynch because everyone has their own agendas. I don't disagree with this. But this adds a level to the game! Instead of saying "So-and-so is mafia, we must lynch them", you have to be able to convince people to lynch based on different information, for example "We should all vote so-and-so because their ability is going to kill us all."
This is completely ignorant. If most players in this game are your enemy, someone who kills randomly is an asset, not a liability. The only issue, really, is assuming your reasonably lucky; you want him to kill off your enemies faster than he kills you.
Now that I think about it, the only thing that's scummy in this game is trying to keep people alive, and the only thing that's townie is claiming the ability to kill people every night. In other words: during the day, scummy is good, and townie is bad. [b]This is something else everyone needs to understand.[/b] Keep me and Alpha alive, and we'll randomly pick people off. Your enemies will suffer. Keep swinkee alive, and he'll try to stop us from helping you. [v]unvote, then vote swinkee.[/b] He's the only one that's done anything scummy so far this game.
Quote from swinkee »
This will take more skill and tact than regular mafia, besides which, you have to try and react to lynchings and nightkills in such a way that you don't give away you're alignment. For example, if you were chaotic/neutral/lawful evil, and you saw pibbly, a neutral good player, get nightkilled, you can't post and say something like "Phew, that helps my win condition" because all the good players will vote for you, as well as some of the evil and neutral players. In fact, if everyone didn't vote for you something would be wrong.
As you can already tell, it's not really that this requires more "tact." You need to understand that this game is not, technically, a Mafia game at all, because there isn't a town. Instead it's Bizzarro Mafia, where over half the town is scum (albeit various competing scum) and scumminess is actually a good thing. Actually, a claim will HELP you. Before the claim, every other player in the game, logically, wants to see you dead, either as part of their win condition or to ensure that they have better control of the lynch. After the claim, at the very least the other people who share your alignment know that they don't want to kill you. You actually have less people against you, so it makes perfect sense to claim.
Of course, there might be something other than a claim that makes everyone like you... like, for example, having a killing ability. If everyone already likes you, an alignment claim is going to make three alignments hate you and the rest of the alignments have essentially no change in opinion. Thus alignment claims are only useful if your ability sucks. Mine doesn't. More tha likely I have the power to redirect a night kill to the target of my choice.
Quote from swinkee »
True, there is no majority. But does there need to be a majority? Does everyone need to share one of two or three agendas for the game to work? The answer is simple: no. The game is more complex than that. Also, when you say that "no faction controls the Day," while being right, you are also horribly, tragically wrong. It is true that no faction controls the day, but what is implied by this statement is that nobody controls the day, which is patently absurd. It's the people who post that control the day, the people who put forth ideas and don't derail the game.
That's literally circular logic. There's no difference between it's the people that post that control the day" and "it's the people that control the day that control the day." You're stating the obvious.
Although, technically, you're right. Someone does control the day. It just took me some time to figure out who. If you can kill other players, you control the day, because you have a power that no one wants to strip from you. It's just that, as I made my previous post, I was working all this out. Your general concept, however, that the "townies" still control the day, is patently absurd.
Quote from swinkee »
You say that alpha is a killer because you made him target pibbly on the night pibbly was killed? For all we know, you killed pibbly and are pushing your kill on him and lying about your ability. Not that alpha is beyond suspicion, just that you are a greater threat right now than he is, in my eyes.
Here you have an actual point. I might not have kill power. I might lack it. If I lack it, however, it would be in the best interest of the group to reveal who has it so that I could use it.
Quote from swinkee »
This comment is stupid. Just because you don't seem to understand the game, that doesn't make it stupid. It makes you a liability to all those who are accepting and willing to try something different, because with someone like you complaining about how this isnt really mafia, all the energy is sapped from the posts.
You're the one making stupid comments, sir. This is a game, and I'm doing everyone the favor of figuring out the theories behind the game to develop a strategy that makes winning possible. Understanding how this game works mechanically is in everyone best interest, and at least I was trying. You're just babbling mindlessly about a willingness to "try something different." Your analysis is nothing compared to mine.
So, in short:
- over half of the town is scum, therefore scummy is good
- townie is bad (lynchable)
- scummy claims (particularly the ability to nightkill) should protect you from lynch
- alignment claims are beneficial, but only if you don't have a useful ability
For support for these claims (which seem ridiculous at face value), actually read the above post.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
and my use of terms isn't exactly consistent; scummy and townie get switched too often. it's hard to write about scumminess and townieness when you're playing Bizarro Mafia. I hope it's still understandable.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
I can really agree with billking on this, he makes some viable evidence on thinking that swinkee is scum or what have you. I'll agree with the others. Vote: Swinky
BK, I want to know something. Why do you think that keeping you around is worthwhile? Every time you claim that killing randomly is worthwhile, you follow up by saying that you are the one we need to do the killing; but your ability doesn't kill anyone. Why is it better to have you kill randomly than to have Alpha kill randomly?
In any case, I have little doubt that you were not the only person to target Pibbly last night. He was almost certainly the best player involved in this game, and I'm sorry to see him go.
Also, Bill, I notice that now that Axel and Az aren't involved, you've reverted to much of your old play style. Are you planning on playing this aggressively throught the whole game, or are you roleplaying? I wouldn't be very surprised if you were evil with you trying to convince everyone that scummy is good. Vote BK
What?! Look at the initial post; he is dead. Deceased. Kaputt. Indefinitely horizontal. In mafia games, you see, people are occasionally "killed off," and when that sad event occurs, he or she is no longer allowed to post, on account of rigor mortis and what-have-you.
'Welcome to Mafia Salvation', it said, 'Population: 3,660.' And someone, they never figured out who, had painted on the sign in red letters: '1,831 to lynch.'
I think Billking has done a good job of laying out the sturcture of the game and his comment early on hi ability is proof enough for me that he was not trying to perform some elaborate deception. swinkee seemed to recognize the structure early on and tried to capitalize on it to get a bandwagon going on billking. I think he's either chaotic, evil or both
Therefore I will vote vote:swinky
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RELAPSED MAFIA JUNKIE
W – 33, L – 19, Broke Games - 9
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BK, I want to know something. Why do you think that keeping you around is worthwhile? Every time you claim that killing randomly is worthwhile, you follow up by saying that you are the one we need to do the killing; but your ability doesn't kill anyone. Why is it better to have you kill randomly than to have Alpha kill randomly?
Actually, a very good point. I'm not useful as a killer.
However, I am useful as someone who CONFIRMS killers. If you're a killer, I can clear you. I think that makes me worth keeping around.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
The Rules
This is not a standard mafia game. Read the rules.
1. If you edit a post, you die. If you quote any of my PM's to you, you die.
2. I won't penalize you for double posting, but it is against forums rules, so be aware that you might get a warning for double posting if a mod catches you doing it.
3. Each day will last exactly one week from the hour each begins. If the required majority of votes hasn't been reached by the end of a day, whoever's got the most votes will be killed.
4. Nights will last a maximum of four days.
5. Votes won't be counted if they aren't bold. Also, please unvote if you are changing your vote.
6. It takes a majority, rounded up, to lynch somebody. For example, with 14 players, it takes 8 votes to toss somebody out of the airlock. With 13 players, it takes 7. 12, 7. 11, 6. And so on.
7. You all have victory conditions based on your alignments, and described in your PMs. All players have the same type of victory condition. Basically, this game will end when no two people left alive have opposing alignments on either of the axes. That is, if there are a chaotic player and a lawful player still alive, the game is not over. If there are an evil player and a good player still alive, the game is not over. When the game ends, all those left alive are the winners. Alignments will be revealed upon death. There are no True Neutral players.
The Players:
AlphaInsidious
billking
Blinking Spirit
Carrion Pigeons
Crippled_Fist
Hawkeye7
Kheoinn
musashi
Navyjoe
Pibbly
Ruler of Avatar
The Dead Players:
Pibbly, Neutral Good Human Sorcerer - had his head bashed in night one.
swinkee, Lawful Neutral Dwarf Fighter - lynched day one.
It is now night two! Night actions are due by Midnight EST April 15th at the latest. If you have a night ability and don't want to use it, please tell me that.
-Alpha
edit: oh wait you mean that i got the pm? o well that hasn't happned quite yet
i'll edit this out when i get it i guess :/
edit again: confirmed, for real this time. and i won't edit anything once the game starts, obviously
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Proud worshipper of TFE.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
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Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
Gaymers
.
[Leader - Team BTY]
[Founder - Casual Council]
[Creator - Group 'Make A Deck']
[Implementor - 3 Card Blind]
[MUD Admin]
[Dominion of Chaos (DoC)]
Never let the future disturb you. You will meet it, if you have to, with the same weapons of reason which today arm you against the present.
Pibbly, Neutral Good Human Sorcerer, has been killed.
With 11 alive, it will take 6 to lynch. Here begins day 1.
Dead Edit: Was really looking forward to this game. It looks well set up.
Better luck next time Pibbly! Hey, you forgot your lizard!!!
:biggrin3:
-Alpha
Proud worshipper of TFE.
I take it we don't get to know what, if any, ability Pibbly had. If not, we must guess. Sorcerers are best-known for offensive magic (i.e. vigilante/SK), but given the breadth of the spell list, he could be almost anything.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Scry? I play too much D&D too much. The vig should be an assasin. Maybe he was a cop. That is out of order sorry.
For some reason, scry was my knee-jerk reaction to the news. But like I said, the breadth of the spell list makes it difficult to guess.
And, due to the nature of this "specialty" game, we probably have several killing roles. Assassin's a likely one (my guess is NE, possibly LE), but it obviously wasn't an assassin who killed Pibbly, for example. At least, not a conventional assassin.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Proud worshipper of TFE.
Not sure how much we should read into the familiar.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
Last night, I had AlphaInsiduous target Pibbly.
vote AlphaInsiduous
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Anyway, this does seem like a orc, or dwarf kill...some kind of brute force at least.
-Alpha
Proud worshipper of TFE.
-Alpha
Either I'm a lucky townie or an extremely stupid mafia. Either way, the town wins.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
I think it is far more likely that you are the former. Given that it is virtually never a good idea for mafia to trade off a mamber for a townie.
At this point I'm going to take Alpha at this word and procede under the assumption that the kill was the result of someone else's ability or a mafia kill.
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
X-Men Mafia Town MVP
Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
Proud worshipper of TFE.
Hmm, that is a good point. I supose you could consider any player not of you alignment as mafia but that cuts both ways. It also calls into question the logic that would apply in a normal game to what billking just did.
I think that this change of perspective will take a little getting used to. I also think that it is still likely that billking is as he claimed, but the possibility that he is not is more possible then I had at first thought.
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
X-Men Mafia Town MVP
Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
Thus Good would represent the town, and Evil would represent Mafia.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Proud worshipper of TFE.
Because then there really wouldn't even be a town.
So how would we vote?
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
-Alpha
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
-Alpha
Proud worshipper of TFE.
Billking - We vote the same way we always do. How does this new arrangement prevent us from voting? We just have different motives for voting.
candidus inperti; si nil, his utere mecum.
The interesting dynamic about Mafia is that there is a Majority and a Minority. The Majority (aka town) controls the Day, while the Minority (the Mafia) control the Night.
In this game, however, there is no Majority. At least, not as far as I can tell. Nor would anyone qualify as minority. The people that are half-neutral may have the least people gunning out for them, but they also have the least number of teammates, which means they don't have anyone rooting for them, either. (Probably either the half-neutrals or the zero-neutrals are a slight Minority but we can't tell right now.)
What does this mean? It means we're all effectively Minorities and that no faction controls the Day. There isn't any group to appeal to, no group for the Minorities to pretend to be a member of, nothing. There's no incentive to post. Without incentive to post, how can we hope to get an eventual lynch consensus? Another thing: everyone's got opposing goals. That also make consensus-building hard.
I have no idea how we're going to determine who to lynch today. This isn't a normal game at all. There isn't a "scummy" because there isn't a "town," so it's not like we're going to pick someone off because they make a mistake while posting. I guess I'll just have to wait and see.
That said, fine, if people don't want to do anything about Alpha, that's Kool and the Gang. I truly don't care. After all, I can redirect him to whomever I want. Let Alpha live and you just might be next.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
In case it was missed earlier, Vote: billking. You're the most suspicious, you're the most likely to sap the energy out of the game, and you're the most likely to make stupid mistakes. Plus which, you threatened us. Not a good move when everyone has an agenda, and you may or may not be on it as either someone to get rid of or someone to let live.
Proud worshipper of TFE.
Voting for billking should mark you as evil. Billking didn't understand the game and clearly leaked info. HE'S GOOD. Why would you want to kill a good (as in alignment) player, because you're evil
vote:swinky
If we get the rest of the good players to vote that should bring us that much closer to winning the game.
vote:swinky
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=519290
This is very far from the truth... you're misusing the term "ally."
[b]Everyone needs to understand this:[/b] Someone who neutral good is teammates with other good players — because they share the same win condition — and is enemies with the evil players. What about the lawful and chaotic players? To a good player, "kill all Chaotic" and "kill all Lawful" are both win conditions that are not mutually exclusive to their win, so they're not opposed to them, per se. However, at the end of the day the choice is going to be between, say, going after Chaotic people or going after Evil people, and here there is going to be a major difference of opinion between the Good and Lawful individuals. Thus, Chaos and Law do not represent allies at all; they represent [b]competition[/b], teams that can misdirect lynches that they want to use themselves.
The only allies of a neutral good player are ... other good players. The primary enemies of a neutral good player are evil players, and the secondary enemies (competition) of a neutral good players are LN and CN players.
The allies of a lawful good players are other LG, LN, and NG players. The primary enemies of a lawful good player are CN, NE, and CE players, and the secondary enemies are the CG and LE players (enemies that share a goal with the LG player).
Thus in every case, each player has three alignments full of allies, three alignments full of primary enemies, and two alignments full of secondary enemies. 5 is more than 3; over half of the players in this game are your enemy, regardless of who you are. This is completely ignorant. If most players in this game are your enemy, someone who kills randomly is an asset, not a liability. The only issue, really, is assuming your reasonably lucky; you want him to kill off your enemies faster than he kills you.
Now that I think about it, the only thing that's scummy in this game is trying to keep people alive, and the only thing that's townie is claiming the ability to kill people every night. In other words: during the day, scummy is good, and townie is bad. [b]This is something else everyone needs to understand.[/b] Keep me and Alpha alive, and we'll randomly pick people off. Your enemies will suffer. Keep swinkee alive, and he'll try to stop us from helping you. [v]unvote, then vote swinkee.[/b] He's the only one that's done anything scummy so far this game. As you can already tell, it's not really that this requires more "tact." You need to understand that this game is not, technically, a Mafia game at all, because there isn't a town. Instead it's Bizzarro Mafia, where over half the town is scum (albeit various competing scum) and scumminess is actually a good thing. Actually, a claim will HELP you. Before the claim, every other player in the game, logically, wants to see you dead, either as part of their win condition or to ensure that they have better control of the lynch. After the claim, at the very least the other people who share your alignment know that they don't want to kill you. You actually have less people against you, so it makes perfect sense to claim.
Of course, there might be something other than a claim that makes everyone like you... like, for example, having a killing ability. If everyone already likes you, an alignment claim is going to make three alignments hate you and the rest of the alignments have essentially no change in opinion. Thus alignment claims are only useful if your ability sucks. Mine doesn't. More tha likely I have the power to redirect a night kill to the target of my choice. That's literally circular logic. There's no difference between it's the people that post that control the day" and "it's the people that control the day that control the day." You're stating the obvious.
Although, technically, you're right. Someone does control the day. It just took me some time to figure out who. If you can kill other players, you control the day, because you have a power that no one wants to strip from you. It's just that, as I made my previous post, I was working all this out. Your general concept, however, that the "townies" still control the day, is patently absurd.
Here you have an actual point. I might not have kill power. I might lack it. If I lack it, however, it would be in the best interest of the group to reveal who has it so that I could use it. You're the one making stupid comments, sir. This is a game, and I'm doing everyone the favor of figuring out the theories behind the game to develop a strategy that makes winning possible. Understanding how this game works mechanically is in everyone best interest, and at least I was trying. You're just babbling mindlessly about a willingness to "try something different." Your analysis is nothing compared to mine.
So, in short:
- over half of the town is scum, therefore scummy is good
- townie is bad (lynchable)
- scummy claims (particularly the ability to nightkill) should protect you from lynch
- alignment claims are beneficial, but only if you don't have a useful ability
For support for these claims (which seem ridiculous at face value), actually read the above post.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.
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Go Irish!!
(Good Luck Brian Kelly, we'll miss you in Cincinnati!)
Alliance of Rogue Deckers[ARD]--Join Today!
Trading Thread
MOTL Refs
eBay Feedback
billking: 1 (swinkee)
swinkee: 4 (musashi, Navyjoe, billking, ruler of avatar)
Not Voting: AlphaInsidious, Blinkng Spirit, Carrion Pigeons, Crippled_Fist, Hawkeye7, Kheoinn
6 to lynch.
In any case, I have little doubt that you were not the only person to target Pibbly last night. He was almost certainly the best player involved in this game, and I'm sorry to see him go.
Also, Bill, I notice that now that Axel and Az aren't involved, you've reverted to much of your old play style. Are you planning on playing this aggressively throught the whole game, or are you roleplaying? I wouldn't be very surprised if you were evil with you trying to convince everyone that scummy is good. Vote BK
Mafia MVP BM Mafia
Mafia MVP Matrix Mafia
Therefore I will vote vote:swinky
Calvin & Hobbs Mafia, Mafia MVP
X-Men Mafia Town MVP
Simpson's Mafia - best use of character
Mtgnews Mafia Mafia - Town Madman
Mythos Mafia: the Dunwich Massacre Town MVP
English Literature Mafia Town MVP
Best Role-Playing Sin City Mafia
Werewolf Mafia - Mafia MVP
Doctor Mafia - Mafia MVP
Mafia: Escape from the Cylons - Town MVP
Lost Mafia - Co SK Winner with Kops
Random Mafia 3 - Town MVP
However, I am useful as someone who CONFIRMS killers. If you're a killer, I can clear you. I think that makes me worth keeping around.
Spock is not portrayed correctly. If Vulcans are above petty emotions, what motivates him to join the most elite starship crew in the galaxy? I, on the other hand, have transcended the weakness of emotion and achieved a blissful lack of caring. Apathy is my strength, our strength, which prevents us from being all-to-human. In this spirit, may Meh be with you, always.