Affinity in Legacy

[Kaimera]

The old thread is a bit out of date so I decided to start a new one. First, let me start with my build:

Lands:
4 Seat of the Synod
4 Vault of Whispers
4 Darksteel Citadel
4 Great Furnace
2 Glimmervoid
Creatures
2 Atog
4 Arcbound Ravager
4 Frogmite
4 Disciple of the Vault
4 Ornithopter
2 Arcbound Worker
Non-Creatures
4 Thoughtcast
4 Tangle Wire
4 Aether Vial
4 Shrapnel Blast
4 Cranial Plating
2 Chromatic Star
Sideboard (Based on Metagame Mostly, This is Rough)
4 Engineered Plague
4 Tormod's Crypt
4 Terror
3 Stifle
We need to look at some card choices first. The most obvious choice is to cut Myr Enforcer in favor of Tangle Wire. I have found Tangle Wire to be very helpful in many of Affinity’s matches. Against Goblins (Are they still relevant?) it can hurt a lot if you hit it turn three on the play, as long as they don’t have vial active, even if they do it can still slow them down that crucial half turn that you need to pull ahead. Against landstill it is basically a Time Walk for Three, and can help your match up against them a lot. Also against Goyf.dec It forces your opponent to make the decision to attack with Goyf and not play spells or tap him. Tangle Wire also gives you little negatives as you can easily tap it for its own abilities as well as tap Cranial Plating or Disciple to it. I feel that Tangle Wire is the stronger choice.

The next major card choice is the old debate between Shrapnel Blast,Berserk, and Fling. In my current metagame, there is a lot of control; therefore Shrapnel Blast is the better option. However if your meta were very agro or very combo oriented I would highly recommend Fling. Both cards are good however Fling has the potential to win you games you have no business winning, however in my area, it will most likely get Forced or Counterspelled in some form.

The only other potential card choices are whether or not to include Atog. Since I cut Fling I have not been to excited with Atog. He is really weak against Goyf because he needs to add artifacts to the yard to grow big. He is however a sacrifice engine for Disciple, however I have considered cutting them for more Chromatic Stars or even a more relevant card against Goyf. For now they stay though.

We also need to take a look at Affinity’s Match Ups against other decks.

Against Reset/High Tide: 60/40 in Affinity’s Favor

You have 4ish turns to win the game. It is basically a race. They have limited counter magic and Tangle Wire can shut them down. Play as aggressively as possible and race them to zero. Normally you should be able to race them effectively. This deck has lost popularity lately, however you should be able to beat them both pre and post board.

Against Goblins: 45/55 in Goblin’s Favor depending on Board Tech.

This is a hardcore race. If they resolve Goblin Lackey on first turn, and you don’t have anything to stop it will be bad for you. On the other hand, if you can get plating active then you stand a good chance of winning. Games two and Three E-Plague is good however they have a lot of sideboard outs normally. Everything from Null Rod to Ancient Grudge is devastating for you. Whether or not you win these games depends on how much hate they have for you.

Against CRET Belcher/Tendrils Combo/ Any Non-Reset Combo 20/80 in Combo’s Favor

All the combos are lumped together for analysis. Affinity has a hard time in this match up. You run zero counter spells and zero anti-combo tools main deck. They are really fast and you only have a slim chance. Your best hope is that they make like, 8 1/1’s and you can just stall and block for the win. Combo has been declining in popularity lately however, you still loose to it.

Against UG/w/r (whatever color combination) Goyf: ~60/40 if Affinity Player is Competent.

This match can be very swingy. If you resolve an Aether Vial on turn one, followed by a Tangle Wire turn three, it is very hard for you to loose. This game normally comes down to who makes less mistakes. If you play aggressively, but not stupidly (ex. Running your Ravager into a Daze) you should be fine. You are faster and your creatures are better. This game generally comes down to a final attack phase that involves jumping modular counters around like crazy. If you were serious about building Affinity, I would highly recommend that you test this match up thoroughly. Post board, I have found Terror to be all right however I have been exploring other options. Anyone who has suggestions, please let me know.

Overall I believe Affinity is a strong deck that is not always given much thought. This testing has come from myself, my teammates, (Woot! Team LuckSack) and against randoms on workshop (those results not taken to be entirely accurate). I have been playing this deck for about a year with mixed results. I top eighted at Grand Prix Trial Columbus-Columbus and only lost due to a play error on my part with this deck, I also top eighted at the Soldiery Legacy tournament about a month before the Grand Prix.

This deck can put up results, however it does need more work. That is where Salvation comes in. What would you all do to improve this deck? Do you have any suggestions for the main deck or sideboard?

Thanks for your help!

@ MODS: If this needs to be moved to a different sub-topic please do so.

Moved to Developing Competitive - YuanTi

[ThatGuyThere]

Two words: Null Rod.

Either you have to take away artifact lands to be able to cast spells after a Null Rod hits - in which case, your Affinity isn't doing as much for you - or you need a way to deal with The Rod that costs 0 mana.

Those are tough to come by, though.

Until you solve the Null Rod problem, your Game 1 had better be freakin' fantastic, because their Games 2 & 3 end when Null Rod hits.

I've been chewing the gristle on this bone for some time - a solution to Null Rod. If you come up with one, let me know.

Edit: Well hey! Mogg Salvage! Hmm...

Edit 2: Other options - Abolish (but we'd need white / Plains), Crash, which requires mountains in play, and Pulverize - man, wouldn't THAT suck.

[Fayf]

How often is Null Rod played anyway? I don't see it in many mainstream lists - it might be worrying about too much, especially since Affinity isn't exactly the deck to beat in Legacy, and Null Rod isn't too useful against most other decks.

[ThatGuyThere]

Originally Posted by Fayf

How often is Null Rod played anyway? I don't see it in many mainstream lists - it might be worrying about too much, especially since Affinity isn't exactly the deck to beat in Legacy, and Null Rod isn't too useful against most other decks.

In my meta, quite a bit - because 3 sideboarded Null Rods handle all sorts of problems.

And it will limit the ability of Affinity to be competitive, until it can win against Null Rod. If Affinity waxes strong, in comes the hate - if the metagame isn't ready, Affinity might be fast enough to punch through and score some unlikely wins.

[Complete_Jank]

Originally Posted by Kaimera

The next major card choice is the old debate between Shrapnel Blast,Berserk, and Fling. In my current metagame, there is a lot of control; therefore Shrapnel Blast is the better option. However if your meta were very agro or very combo oriented I would highly recommend Fling. Both cards are good however Fling has the potential to win you games you have no business winning, however in my area, it will most likely get Forced or Counterspelled in some form.

That is not a valid reason to run Shrapnel Blast over Fling. They will have counterspells no matter which card you are running. The fact that you are running the most retarded card legal for Affinity, that being Cranial Plating, means that you should run Fling. However, multiple people running Divert, Misdirection, and Honorable Passage in their main deck is. Fling should almost always be run over Shrapnel Blast, except in the face of those and a rare few other cards.


On the Null Rod argument; Null Rod does not see much play in most metas, but usually most Affinity decks have answers for it in their sideboard anyways. Cards like Shattering Spree, Oxidize, Overload, and Krosan Grip are good. Grip only being good if you have it with 3 mana available before the rod hits, or seeing 3 Glimmervoids.

[ThatGuyThere]

Originally Posted by Complete_Jank

On the Null Rod argument; Null Rod does not see much play in most metas, but usually most Affinity decks have answers for it in their sideboard anyways. Cards like Shattering Spree, Oxidize, Overload, and Krosan Grip are good. Grip only being good if you have it with 3 mana available before the rod hits, or seeing 3 Glimmervoids.

I'm not disagreeing - I don't travel much. But Affinity, every forum I look at for Legacy, gets a serious drubbing. I've always assumed it was Null Rod, because that's what it is in our / my meta.

...what is it, elsewhere?

[Complete_Jank]

Energy Flux and Kataki, War's Wage are the best hosers, but control decks like BHWC Landstill and others that run Pernicious Deed main are the big reason why so many people say Affinity is so bad.

[ThatGuyThere]

Originally Posted by Complete_Jank

Energy Flux and Kataki, War's Wage are the best hosers, but control decks like BHWC Landstill and others that run Pernicious Deed main are the big reason why so many people say Affinity is so bad.

It seems the majority of the Affinity countermeasures are based on one thing: Artifact Lands.

Can the deck work with fewer / no artifact lands? Can we use 0-cost artifacts - Mox Diamond, Chrome Moxes, Phyrexian Walker ... ... others I can't think of... - to get around the problem?

[sorrel]

0-cost artifacts are just as bad as artifact lands. They are like the lands, but require card disadvantage, or don't tap for mana. They also die to Pernicious Deed.

[mondu_the_fat]

It seems the majority of the Affinity countermeasures are based on one thing: Artifact Lands.

Null rod also nukes cranial plating and ravager (and, by extension, disciple of the vault), not just artifact lands, robbing affinity of most of its offensive punch, not just speed.

The countermeasures only seem like to target artifact lands, simply because they're the most numerous artifacts in the deck and the countermeasures are very, very effective against mass numbers (pernicious deed acts like geddon, kataki and energy flux eats everything, etc). I mean, why run specific solutions against creatures when you can hit creatures _and_ land with a single rather low cc card?

[emidln]

Originally Posted by Complete_Jank

That is not a valid reason to run Shrapnel Blast over Fling. They will have counterspells no matter which card you are running. The fact that you are running the most retarded card legal for Affinity, that being Cranial Plating, means that you should run Fling. However, multiple people running Divert, Misdirection, and Honorable Passage in their main deck is. Fling should almost always be run over Shrapnel Blast, except in the face of those and a rare few other cards.

Wrong. Fling is an awful topdeck mid-to-late game after board sweepers or combat. Shrapnel Blast is a guaranteed 5. Fling is a sometimes win more, sometimes nothing.

[cartman_1337]

I disassembled and effectively destroyed my Affinity deck (traded away ravagers ), and do not regret it. Needle wrecked me. I think needle is fine to stop it. The argument against this would be that there's too much stuff to name. First to be named is the aforementioned screwup called Cranial Plating. Then Ravager or Atog. Depending on what deck you are running, you will have other defenses as well, so it's not like you are dependent upon 4 cards to stop Affinity. I've not really ever had a problem against it with Stax...But that's to be expected.

Affinity seems to be the weakest deck in legacy.

[kicks_422]

Not really. There's no "weakest" deck as there is no "best" deck in the format.

Legacy Affinity still has speed, which means it always has a chance to steal games. There's also a lot of builds for Affinity, so each one has their own strengths and weaknesses:

1. UBR - ordinary Affinity with Thoughtcasts and Enforcers
2. BR - Eschews Thoughtcasts and Enforcers for Dark Confidants and more space for disruption (e.g. Cabal Therapy) -- this is my personal favorite among the builds I know
3. AfFoWnity - aggro-control in an affinity shell

Affinity will never die because in a field as diverse as Legacy, you can't always expect to run into hosers all the time. It will never be able to grab a chokehold on Legacy like it did in its Standard days, but it's still pretty viable.

[r_x_]

Originally Posted by cartman_1337

Affinity seems to be the weakest deck in legacy.

Affinity is like Dragon in Vintage. Will win easily if there is no hate against it, but there are several easy ways to hate it out of the metagame.

[JunioRcmf]

Well here in Finland someone won a Legacy tournament with this, the deck is called Affowinity:

Deck
Artifact land - 8 4 Darksteel Citadel 4 Seat of Synod Nonartifact Land - 7 3 Wasteland 4 Ancient Tomb Artifact - 13 4 Chrome Mox 4 Chalice of the Void 4 Cranial Plating 1 Umezawa's Jitte Artifact Creature - 16 4 Ornithopter 4 Arcbound Ravager 4 Frogmite 4 Myr Enforcer	Blue Creature - 8 4 Cloud of Faeries 4 Somber Hovergaurd Instant - 8 4 Thoughtcast 4 Force of Will

I'm not sure what he was using in sideboard but the original deck (he netdecked the deck) was using this kind of sideboard:

Deck
	Sideboard 2 Tormods Crypt 3 Pithing Needle 2 Powder Keg 2 Umezawa's Jitte 3 Echoing Truth 3 Mana Leak

Match-ups he listed:
Welder.dec
Burn
IGGy Pop
Affinity
Pox
and if I'm correct he won all of those.
More about the deck you can find here (that is where he netdecked the deck).